kevin-jordan-1

Kevin Jordan, a police officer in Georgia and ex-Marine, who was working a second job as a security guard, was trying to arrest a drunken woman in the parking lot of a Waffle House. The woman’s boyfriend who doubtless had been drinking with her, shot the officer/security guard five times in the back and killed him. The boyfriend was then shot and wounded by Jordan’s brother who was with Jordan at the time.

By all that seems apparent, Kevin Jordan was “A Good Guy With a Gun”. He was murdered and the “Bad Guy With A Gun” is alive.

The myth that the NRA has successfully perpetrated on the public is such a simplistic and frankly, dumb assertion that flies completely in the face of reality…but those passionate about guns and paranoid about them being taken away instantly clung to it like a life preserver in the middle of the Pacific Ocean.

“The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun, is a good guy with a gun.”

Complete bullshit.

Why? Because it is an inescapable fact that when everyone has a gun, the instigator of violence is always “a bad guy with a gun” and it is usually too late for good guys with guns to prevent a shooting.

The completion of this circle of lunacy is that the Right Wing gun nuts also say there is no use in gun control legislation because mass murders and killings will happen anyway, with knives if not with guns.

How many mass killings with knives have you ever heard of? And that aside, might the odds be better of people escaping a guy with a knife instead of a guy with a gun?

The Right Wing somehow can make sense of these conflicting messages, that we should have everyone armed because only good guys with guns can stop bad guys with guns from killing AND even good guys with guns can’t stop mass murders because they’re going to happen anyway.

No they”re not. Other democracies with gun control laws don’t have the amount of mass murders and frequency of killings that the U.S. has (“We’re number 1!”). In fact, The American Journal of Medicine did a study that shows that greater gun ownership leads to greater danger for innocent people.

So it’s just a flat out, bald faced lie by the NRA (“I’m shocked to hear that there’s lying going on in the NRA!” “Here are your campaign contributions, Senator.”) who are de facto pushing the murders of innocent people on America because Americans killing Americans is a profitable venture for their gun manufacturer backers. They are the true Death Lobby and they directly support the killings of innocent people through their actions.

Bad guys with guns are always on offense and can kill anyone at any time. Good guys with guns are necessarily on defense and rarely in the vicinity of bad guys with guns…and they could only act AFTER the bad guy has pulled out his gun and shot someone. So no, they don’t stop the bad guy from killing.

This is an era of unchecked extremes. Aggressive and open racism, shutting down government to extort political gains, taking the right to vote away, taking the rights of women to control their own bodies away, clamoring for an overthrow of the U.S. government, demonizing the poor and trying to leave them without medical help, a place to live and food to eat, and of course, rabid gun proliferation and making murder of innocent people legal through “Stand Your Ground” laws.

This extremism has to be stopped and the lies from those who are pushing to make extremism mainstream have to be exposed and destroyed. So what needs to be shot down is the “good guy with a gun” myth (along with people claiming to be Pro-Life while supporting gun policies that kill children and adults).

Maybe, the only thing that stops bad guys with destructive agendas, are good guys with constructive agendas.

http://news.yahoo.com/georgia-police-officer-shot-death-making-arrest-waffle-193312140.html

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pinkpantheroz
Member

I’ve already posted this in Kalima’s marvellous Morning Blog, but I feel it needs repeating here in this thread:
“The situation in Australia is very restrictive on gun ownership. Note I say ownership as opposed to gun control.

In Australia, only LICENCED gunowners may lawfully acquire, possess or transfer a firearm or ammunition.
Applicants for a gun owners licence are required to prove a genuine reason to possess a firearm, for example, hunting, target shooting, collection, pest control and narrow occupational uses. The biggest point of all, IMO, is that
“IN LAW, PERSONAL PROTECTION IS NOT A GENUINE REASON”!

Here is the link to this information:

http://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/region/australia

Maybe something can begin from this rather commonsensical beginning.”

I also agree where someone wrote that ‘Guns don’t kill people, bullets do!” So why not severely restrict access to bullets. The Second Amendment doesn’t mention ammo! Firearms without ammunition are expensive knuckledusters!

Nirek
Member

PPO, I have often thought that restricting Ammo is the way to go.

JumpingJackFlash
Member
JumpingJackFlash

If good guys with guns don’t stop bad guys with guns, why do people call the Police when there’s a problem?

S-Man
Member
S-Man

More people being armed is not the answer.

Kalima
Admin

Do you think it’s because it’s their job to protect the public?

Mojave Green
Guest
Mojave Green

Sorry to burst your balloon, but numerous Supreme Court and other Federal and State courts have ruled repeatedly that the police have no duty to ‘protect’ you, or any individual. There’s lots of information with the specifics if you’re interested in details, but it’s not an issue even up for debate, in case you think I’m arguing with you. I’m not, and it’s an assumption that you should rid yourself of, since out here in the world beyond the borders of the U.S. the reality is that the U.S. is not in danger of becoming a Police State, it’s already one, and only becoming more so, and more rapidly every day. I’m a born and raised gringo, but haven’t been in the States in more than a decade, and my country of birth looks very different from out here in the real world. Pura vida.

Kalima
Admin

I’m not American and live a long way outside the U.S. borders, so where I live owning firearms is illegal, and the police certainly are there to protect the public.

My “balloon” as you called it, doesn’t exist, and I share your views on the lack of stricter gun control but stop short of calling it a “police state”. You have more freedoms than too many countries around the globe, it’s about time that Americans realised it. You would know if you had one. Ask the Iranians, the Egyptians, the Saudis, the people of Turkey and Burma, or closer to home Venezuela ,Russia and Belarus. How about Pakistan and most of the rest of the stans, and now Thailand. No, America is not a police state and it’s many of your politicians who are the crooks and thieves and the evil.

Welcome to The Planet.

Btw, my comment was tongue-in-cheek.

funksands
Member

I would call them because they are my city’s legal crime-prevention and response unit.

monicaangela
Member

I continue to wonder how long the citizens of this nation will wait before they actually demand congressional action. We can as citizens of this nation do something about this, if we demand action. Maybe we won’t stop every case, but with laws that restrict ownership by those who should not be owners, with better mental health provision and with better record keeping, much of this insanity can be better controlled if not completely eliminated.

funksands
Member

Monica, my sad theory about the nature of Americans is that we shine when things break. Until they are broken we seem not to care very much.

Kalima
Admin
Nirek
Member

Kalima, now the guy who was shot had a gun but didn’t know the woman was armed and she shot the “good guy with the gun”.
More proof that the NRA is wrong.

Nirek
Member

Another shooting in Vegas two cops killed by “white supremacists” husband and wife! They killed themselves later.

Senseless.

Nirek
Member

I just saw that they think the two shooters in Vegas have a connection with Cliven Bundy.

SearingTruth
Member

“An ocean of bullets.

They had to wash up somewhere.”
SearingTruth

A Future of the Brave

Shutzy62
Member
Shutzy62

Back in the day the NRA was like “Ducks Unlimited”! It was primarily for those who loved to go duck or deer hunting and loved the outdoors. What is has morphed into today is scary — unrecognizable — kinda like the GOP and it’s scary offspring, the GOTP! If it were up to me, I would get rid of the 2nd Amendment altogether. It was clearly written in a time that made sense at that time — not now. But, like it has been pointed out here, we have so many guns in this country that we now need to reign things in and pass some reasonable and sensible gun laws.

Nirek
Member

So true, the NRA used to represent gun safety. They even taught people to use guns properly. Now like you said they encourage people to buy more guns and ammo. Lunacy!

Knockemstiff
Member
Knockemstiff

I own more guns than I can count, I am a collector, investor and gun aficionado so to speak. Many of my friends collect guns as I do. I am a white collar small business owner with an MBA. Most of my friends are professionals, attorneys, doctors and small business owners. I do not belong to the NRA and neither do any of my friends. It is not that I dislike the NRA necessarily, I just don’t belong. All that being said the NRA does not influence me to purchase or not purchase guns and I suspect that is the case with many other gun owners. To somehow think that doing away with the NRA will solve some problem is really quite laughable to me. The collective strength of gun owners and their passion to own weapons is much stronger than any organization.

twopennygal
Member
twopennygal

As you so clearly demonstrate, the NRA is not controlled by gun owners. It is controlled by gun makers. If there are reasonable gun controls, then certain people will not be able to buy guns or will think it’s too much trouble to qualify to own a gun. Instead, the gun makers want everyone to be able to buy a gun (they’d probably be happy if children could buy guns) to increase their corporate profits.

Nirek
Member

Knockemstiff, my problem is not with folks like you. The NRA is against any regulation. The criminals who can buy a gun (especially an auto or semi-auto) either at a gun show or a personal sale without a background check is the problem. The existing laws have too many loopholes.

That is why many of us are against the NRA.

Dimbulb2
Member
Dimbulb2

It appears that SPU won the mass shooting of the day lottery
and, like tucson, the shooter was taken down while reloading

yet the 2nd amendment crowd will continue to fight against limited clip size
and expanded background checks to try to keep these things out of the hands of lunatics

kesmarn
Admin

AdLib, recently I saw a comment that seemed so fitting for what you’ve written here. One of those comments that seem so simple once you’ve heard it that you wonder why you didn’t think of it yourself.

The comment was: If good guys with guns can stop bad guys with guns, how did Jim Brady and Ronald Reagan get shot? They were surrounded by Secret Service people and still it happened.

You’re so right. Bad guys are always on offense. When the bad guy gets to choose the time, the place, the method and the angle of an attack, good guys don’t have much control. I think that’s one of the most powerful delusions that NRA people have.

That when they’re armed, they’re in control.

funksands
Member

Kes kes kes, you know that the simple solution to this is more good guys with more guns. If EVERYONE has a gun, then the bad guys will be too scared to do anything!

Dimbulb2
Member
Dimbulb2

A tank on every corner
its the only way

funksands
Member

See? You get it.

SearingTruth
Member

“Our well regulated militia is killing our children, at will.”
SearingTruth

A Future of the Brave

limathree
Member
limathree

everyone is a good guy with a gun — until they aren’t.

registration of a gun and licensing for a person needs to occur. licensing would require proof that you have passed a class. the class would include safety, proficiency and knowledge of the latest laws/regulations (local and national). CE classes should be mandatory. licensing should be renewed periodically. Much like a vehicle, except more onerous.

you would not be able to buy ammo or accessories w/o your registration and then only for that weapon registered.

registration and licensing fees would only be high enough to cover the administrative and overhead costs – no profit. part of those fees should be for the establishment and maintenance of a national mental health data base.

if you can’t afford these fees, then maybe you could start cutting back on your living expenses. lets start with your membership to the NRA.

TParrish
Member

While reading your post I was reminded of discussions I have had with former military personnel who were stationed in Germany. What they had to say about the German gun laws sounded very much like what you proposed.

Have a look:
http://www.loc.gov/law/help/firearms-control/germany.php#Current

Oh, I absolutely agree with your point about “good guys with guns”. On HP I ticked off many a right-wing raider by pointing out that most mass shooters would have been described by the NRA as good guys with guns *the day before they committed their mass shootings*.

KillgoreTrout
Member

Can the evil genie actually be put back in the bottle? I think that’s the larger problem, besides getting real common sense legislation passed. There are as many guns in this country now as there are citizens. How do we get those off the streets?

I would outlaw all semi-automatics. I would make the sentences for being caught with one very severe. In Mass, it is an automatic 1 year in prison for being convicted of owning or carrying an unlicensed handgun. I would enact similar laws regarding semi-autos of any sort.

Nobody needs an AR15 or AK for home defense. A good, reliable revolver or pump shotgun will do just fine. Hunters do not need AR15s or AKs to down their prey. A bolt action rifle or double barrel shotgun works just fine.

Of course these assault rifle and pistol whackos think they’re going to overthrow the most powerful military in the world with small arms fire. They also think that “when the revolution comes,” half the armed forces will desert their post and join in to wage war against their own Commander-In-Chief.

We need to kick the NRA lobbyists out of the Capital and regain our sanity in regards to responsible gun ownership. Those in Congress that take NRA money are criminals, plain and simple, regardless of the loopholes in laws that protect them. They are moral cowards.

Shutzy62
Member
Shutzy62

I very much agree with your assessment. Especially the part about the “militia” groups at the ready to take on the government by force. It is ludicrous. And, I for one, am NOT comfortable with people who insist on open carry. I’ll take my chances eating at a restaurant that is gun-free — thank you very much!

Dimbulb2
Member
Dimbulb2

I am a firm supporter of the 2nd amendment……

I believe that any member of a well regulated militia has the right to own a musket

Mojave Green
Guest
Mojave Green

I’m an even firmer supporter of the First Amendment. And believe that anyone and everyone should be able to own a quill and a moderate sized bottle of ink. And no ‘high capacity’ quills either! Only ones from smallish birds are all anyone could possibly need.

kesmarn
Admin

And all the nerf balls he can fit into it! 😉

funksands
Member

Ad, the good news is that once a state passes a law mandating that good guys wear white hats and bad guys wear black ones, all of this will be a thing of the past.