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SueInCa On July - 9 - 2012

I started this as an exercise on my own to determine exactly what values and beliefs the right have adopted over the past few years that would actually threaten the existence of the true conservative Republican party and perhaps this nation.  I know there is plenty of talk in the blogoshphere and between people about how they feel the right has gone off the rails and I started this exercise to try to pinpoint not only what is dangerous for them but also what could be dangerous for our nation as a whole.  I believe I have come up with a pretty complete list although there is probably room for many more.  I have always wanted to come up with a list that would explain their behavior and now I have.

It is confusing to many as to how this party has so alienated itself and chosen to disregard the truths that many of us hold and have for probably our entire lifetimes.  I don’t want to say their movement to the far right is because of President Obama but I do believe his election to the highest office in our land has contributed to their movement.   Losing control of that high office has also contributed to their discontent and discontent can lead to radical change.  In coming up with this list I tried to be as honest as I could but I am sure some will say my own prejudice against them exaggerated my findings.  To them I would say, I did not compose this list with a prejudice mind but rather an open mind that sees things as they are with no sugar coating.  I hope that people will see it that way and not be shocked at my conclusions.

I took a really hard look at what I see and I think you will agree I put together a pretty complete list but only by reading it yourself will you be able to make that judgment so here goes:

They promote an economic system that supports a stratified economy with classes based on merit and talent but reject universal egalitarianism. They favour private property, freedom of contract, and promote the creation of their version of national solidarity.  (Cultural theory of risk holds egalitarianism as defined by (1) a negative attitude towards rules and principles, and (2) a positive attitude towards group decision-making, with “Fatalism”  termed as its opposite)

 They outlaw strikes by employees because these are regarded as a threat to national unity.

They would seek to declare “asocial” or “heretic” groups that do not fit their requirements of acceptable behavior or beliefs.

They will attack both left-wing and right-wing politics and they will claim the far right as the only correct ideology.

Far right themes include the argument that superior people have a right to dominate over others and purge society of supposed inferior elements.

They will scoff at any and all treaties that would appear to make a nation look weak(in their opinion, anyone who compromises whether appropriate or not is worthy of condemnation)

They would dismantle the republic to create a new radical and strong state based upon a martial ruling ethic that could revive national unity(in their power crazed minds anyway)

A major inspiration are paramilitary organizations that engage in political violence or the threat of such.

They would describe themselves as an anti-bourgeois party.

There are factions in the Party, both conservative and radical.

They advocate both a social and economic revolution upon the party who is in power and the country itself unless it is their party.

They also push “second revolution” (the “first revolution” being seizure of power) that would entrench the party’s official.

They would also desire, and work toward, absorbing the Armed forces into their ranks and under their leadership.

In an earlier time period they very well could have lived Bohemian lifestyles (US circa 1960)

Anyone who resists the goals of the party they will seek to destroy.

Individuals are not allowed to take unilateral action as that is considered violating or threatening their leadership.

Although they oppose communist ideology, they will use those tactics in order to crush liberals.

One of the most significant ideological influences calls for a national revolution against the elite left and the need of action by the nation to free itself of these influences.

They denounce soulless individualism, and secularized society, while advocating a “superior” society based on ethnic people of their own  “blood” or “beliefs”.

They also denounce foreigners, foreign ideas and declare that national minorities, or people of other religious persuasions are “traitors to the nation” and unworthy of inclusion.

They extoll the virtues of rural life, condemn the neglect of tradition and decay of morals and condemn “cosmopolitan” cultures.

They will declare they are only interested in a unified country

The concept of their racial theories draws a distinction between what they deemed “high and noble” culture versus that of “parasitic” culture

Notions of white supremecy and racial superiority infiltrate their organization and they maintain that white people are members of a race that is superior to all other races and blame the fall of the country on socio-economic degeneracy caused by those “parasites” mentioned above.

They claim that Christianity is the origin of their nation’s beginnings and that anyone who claims different are usurpers and that they are was threatened by a spirit of selfishness

Their history will include racist themes and radical right political movements.

They have no shortage of conspiracy theories about internationals and people within their own country.

They will accuse their opponents of being a “bacillus, the carrier of decay…who pollute every national culture…and destroy all faith with their materialistic liberalism”

Their policies are published and distributed to Armed Forces in order to instruct them and the enemy that they are sent by GOD to fulfill his wishes.

They accuse their opponents of being a threat to national unity.

They have an option to address this threat by violence against others not of their belief system, which should not contain a single opponents idea.

They will claim that they are unable to complete national unification because of infiltration of “others” in the political process.  They will suggest abolition in an effort to obtain national unification.  They will go so far as to accuse their fellow citizens of possessing extra-national loyalties, thereby exacerbating dissatisfaction with the opposite party.

They DO believe in a national socialism that will connect the individual to the state through corporatist organization.

Their ideology advocates confining women to the spheres of Children, Kitchen, Church.

They support people and organizations that suppress gays and that will wipe out abortion.  They will set up organizations to that end.

Several people of the organization will, at some time, have been connected with racists organizations.

They will declare that their version of conflict is necessary to save the country from suffering because of it’s “sins”.

They excuse any actions they may take by claiming they are saving the country.

Their actions are, so they claim, all in the name of purifying the nation and taking it back to it’s original roots.

They guarantee freedom for all religious denominations not inimical to their own and endorse Christianity to combat the “non-believer spirit”.

They are not above using other religions’ history as propaganda that fits their beliefs.

They use Christianity for political purposes.  They will not tolerate anyone in their ranks who attack Christianity, whether they truly practice the true tenants or not.

They are advocates of privatizing public properties and public services while at the same time cannot entirely disregard business competition and private property as economic engines.

In order to control operations of agriculture they will grant business/banks monopoly rights to marketing boards/commodity exchanges to control production and prices.

They claim that communism is dangerous to the well-being of nations because of its intention to dissolve private property, its support of class conflict, its aggression against the middle class, its hostility to small businessmen, and its atheism.  They also agree their liberal counterparts are guilty of these beliefs when it is they who are separating the classes.

I am sure there are many more that I may have missed but I have to tell you the truth now.  I DID NOT COME UP WITH THIS LIST.  All of these beliefs and tenants were taken directly from the platform of the Nazi Party of Germany.  Where there were beliefs that I did not think fit, I did not list them and I did have to change some of the wording because I wanted to show just how close in ideology they are to the former Nazi Party without giving away that the list was actual Nazi doctrine.  I also felt that adding the Nazi name or people affiliated with the party would take away from the experience that the person reading would be thinking Nazi and not the far right.  I tried to be as honest as I could be but I am also open to constructive criticism where I may have missed the boat, so feel free to let me know.

I apologize for not being entirely truthful in this posting but I felt approaching it this way would clear the mind of the reader.  When I look at the picture at the top of this post, I am glad I wrote this post though.  I hope I have succeeded in clarifying what I believe to be their endgame.

Written by SueInCa

I am a soon to be 59 Nana to Anthony who is 11. I live in Benicia CA with my husband and Shih Tsu. I worked in Banking and the Financial Industry for 24 years in Fraud, Risk Management, Account Management, Program Management, Project Management and Customer Service. I was a Fraud Investigator for Credit Card and Merchant Business and investigated internal fraud and responded to Bank robberies. I was also management in most of these positions. Now I am content to find a part time job where I am just a worker bee, no more corporate BS for this gal. I also make jewelry. I can spend hours in a bead shop just touching all the fine baubles. Only another beader would understand that one.

95 Responses so far.

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  1. Nirek says:

    After Ike the republican party has been on a steady downhill slide. The morality, honesty, and patriotism has gone from good under Ike to poor under Nixon ,poorer under Raygun, and in the dumps under “w”!

    Sorry to say the democrats are not up to standard in my opinion, but they are much better than the alternative.

    • bito says:

      Nirek, I do understand your after Ike sentiment, but even under Nixon he signed the EPA and clean air and water acts, Dirkson (R-IL) helped push Medicare for LBJ and even Raygun realized he had to raise taxes and index the SS income cap.

      All of those would be high crimes to the GOP today, they seem to want to go back to the turn of the century, the “Gay 90’s.”

    • Today’s GOP would call Barry Goldwater a liberal! Goldwater was considered to be the “father of American conservatism.” Wow have things changed. Goldwater also warned us about the religious right and how they would damage the GOP.

      • SueInCa says:

        My faith in the future rests squarely on the belief that man, if he doesn’t first destroy himself, will find new answers in the universe, new technologies, new disciplines, which will contribute to a vastly different and better world in the twenty-first century

        On religious issues there can be little or no compromise. There is no position on which people are so immovable as their religious beliefs. There is no more powerful ally one can claim in a debate than Jesus Christ, or God, or Allah, or whatever one calls this supreme being. But like any powerful weapon, the use of God’s name on one’s behalf should be used sparingly. The religious factions that are growing throughout our land are not using their religious clout with wisdom. They are trying to force government leaders into following their position 100 percent. If you disagree with these religious groups on a particular moral issue, they complain, they threaten you with a loss of money or votes or both.
        I’m frankly sick and tired of the political preachers across this country telling me as a citizen that if I want to be a moral person, I must believe in “A,” “B,” “C” and “D.” Just who do they think they are? And from where do they presume to claim the right to dictate their moral beliefs to me?
        And I am even more angry as a legislator who must endure the threats of every religious group who thinks it has some God-granted right to control my vote on every roll call in the Senate. I am warning them today: I will fight them every step of the way if they try to dictate their moral convictions to all Americans in the name of “conservatism.”

        Goldwater KT. People must have been very narrow minded back then not to be able to see his worth to this country.

        • I never find it odd when the phrase “narrow minded,” and “conservative appear in the same sentence. I think conservatism, by it’s very nature must include narrow mindedness. They think in boxes and cling to old ideas. Inflexibility is rarely a good thing.

      • They call GWB a big government conservative which is like saying he’s too liberal. The GOPTEA party of today only liked his social conservatism.

        Goldwater was probably the first Libertarian pres candidate among the GOP. But once Nixon via Atwater employed the ‘Southern Strategy’ GOP politics has been guided solely by white identity politics. Atwater before he died admitted the ‘Southern Strategy’ was a huge mistake because it permanently damaged American society.

      • bito says:

        Actually KT the AZ GOP sate committee said that Goldwater had gone senile when he made his statements about gays and religion, they also really dislike McCain--He’s too librul.

        You are so right, the GOP today is not the GOP of just 10 years ago, like very conservative Federal Judge Posner said the other day, “they have gone ‘goofy'”

        • In reality Goldwater was a true Libertarian especially in his late years because he was more socially liberal.

          Unlike Ron Paul who is right wing on most key social issues.

          • bito says:

            Yep, you’re right KT and the AZ state GOP used to be but they got this righteous RWNJ takeover, lost the libertarian and decided that it was easier to say he went senile, which was complete BS. Whether you agreed with him or not, he was honest and stuck to his libertarian values on social issues. He could also read the constitution and probably scolded AZ on the immigration thing. Right there in the enumerated powers, it says naturalization (immigration) is a power of congress right along with bankruptcies, same sentence in article I, sec.8. But real patriots don’t need to read the constitution.

          • KQ, I agree, but he was referred to, at one time, as the father of modern conservatism. But then, that was before the word conservatism became a guise for radical right wing fanaticism.

        • It’s Obama Derangement Syndrome! He makes the GOP crazy. Actually, the GOP makes themselves crazy, if they weren’t already crazy. 😉

  2. “Many even of those who desire to form aristocratic governments make a mistake, not only in giving too much power to the rich, but in attempting to overreach the people. There comes a time when out of a false good, there arises a true evil, since the encroachments of the rich are more destructive to the constitution than those of the people.”

    • AdLib says:

      Very nice, Killgore! What this quote and others are very helpful in doing is informing us that this struggle between the few who want to dominate and the many is an intrinsic part of human society.

      It has always been the way of things and will always be. As disappointing as it may be to some, this is not a battle that ever has a conclusion, a healthy society requires eternal vigilance and activism to push back against those who are always trying to dominate and pillage it.

      • Sadly, greed and the lust for power will always be with us. I think, in part, it’s just a negative side of human nature.

        One day, many years ago, my 6 year old daughter and I went to the beach together. She was fascinated by all the cool looking pebbles lying around and she was trying to gather all she could in her little hand. The more she tried to get in her hand, the more those pebbles would fall out of her hand. I thought to myself, wow, what a perfect demonstration of human nature.

    • SueInCa says:

      As was said by Lopes in Scarface

      “Never underestimate the other man’s greed”

      • MurphTheSurf3 says:

        Sue…wanted to be sure you saw my comment since it is several days after your excellent article. I have to confess that I spotted the origins of your list as a rundown of NSDAP thinking. Still it backs up my understanding of the contemporary GOP as a “fascist” party. One of the key elements of fascism in both Italy and Germany is the symbiotic relationship between corporate business and the corporate state. While preaching small and local government, what the GOP is endorsing is a highly invasive and universal governing ideal where the national and state governments are so intertwined that they move together. Look at the reaction to the Supreme Court Decision last week by the GOP governors. Lockstep with the GOP in the House and Senate. Just wanted to offer my kudos. A strong think piece.

        • SueInCa says:

          Thanks Murph. I have been wanting to write if for the longest time but I think I had to get to a point where I could write it without harsh language. I know the GOP is not killing people but the one thing that truly does bother me is their actions in Uganda and some of the extremism here with abortion clinics and such. How easy would it be to step over that precipice when they have already done so on a smaller scale? That is what truly makes me leary of their actions and their plans.

    • SueInCa says:

      Great quote KT

  3. SueInCa says:

    “Gingrich argued there’s value in having an administration “get rid of” these public servants if he disapproves of their liberal political ideology. This isn’t just crazy; it’s illegal.”

    “Newt Gingrich declared war against the nation’s courts on Thursday during the GOP debate in Sioux City, Iowa. After host Megyn Kelly asked him about the viability of his proposed plan to gut the judiciary branch, Gingrich said that as President he would abolish any court and get rid of any judge that makes a decision that he disagrees with.”

    “Stolle and his Republican colleagues object to terms like “global warming,” “climate change,” and “sea level rise,” because he says they are terms that liberals use. Forget the fact that the scientific community uses these terms all the time, because liberals use them, they must be bad. So in place of these harmless terms, Stolle has replaced them with terms like “recurrent flooding” and “coastal resiliency.”

    Stolle says these scientific terms are “liberal code words” that inflame conservatives so his solution is to use words conservatives don’t associate with liberals, hence the new language. The legislation then sailed through the general assembly and was signed into law.”

    “I am much more concerned with the direction Obama and his merry band of liberal radicals are taking our country. If we “let” him have another four years in charge, well, America may no longer be recognizable to any of us”


    “This entire episode confirms what many of us have known all along. Liberals make lousy parents. Study after study have shown conslusively that the only way to properly raise children is in a conservative values based household. Children raised in liberal households are doomed to lives of hate, poverty and misery. Conservative children, on the other hand, grow up to be honest, hard working, independent pillars of society. Don’t take my word for this, just look it up the studies themselves. It’s all there in black and white.
    When you look at all the drug addicts on the streets. When you look at rapists and murderers in prison. When you look at the beggars and homeless people on the streets. What do they all have in common? There were all raised in liberal households. That’s right we can end murder, poverty, famine, and homelessness in our life times and it all starts with throwing the Sunderlands in jail. And then throwing away the key.”

    These are just a few examples of how conservatives are thinking. How many times must we hear it and not admit they are out of control?


    • There are those in the GOP, amplified by the RW talking heads, that use propaganda against liberals, in the same fashion as the Third Reich’s propaganda against the Jews. Not to the same extent, but their ideology is pretty much the same.

      Occasionally I post on Yahoo threads ( I must have a masochistic streak in me) and many of the comments about liberals are really, really nasty. We are all communists, Marxist, queers, who have no value as human beings and should be gotten rid of. We are baby killers and Muslim lovers and Obama likes it that way. I am not exaggerating in the least here. These people actually believe this shit, and where do they get these beliefs from? The RW and their talking minions. If there were ever a “final solution to the liberal question,” these people would be the first to volunteer to run the camps and joyfully participate in our extermination. I have no trouble believing that, in the least.

      • MurphTheSurf3 says:

        KT- I know the “moderators” at three sites and they would agree with you completely. The vitriol from the right is truly frightening. Yesterday Biden told LaRaza that the great motivator for the right wing now is the fear of the demographic shift taking place in the nation. I think Obama symbolizes that for them and liberals are seen as the ones who are bringing the change on.

    • AdLib says:

      If “stupid” could be measured with a speed gun, the people on the RW would be competing for the record in everything they say.

      Yes, everyone who believes like them are wonderful and everyone who doesn’t is horrible. We all remember that reasoning from when we were three years old.


      • BourneID says:


        It might of fun to follow through on yur comment re RW race to the finish in stupdity. Why not start our own “Most Stupic RW” Olympics? Could be the first time in history there were multiple ties. Might be kind of fun to keep track -- see if any new ideas come up.

        • AdLib says:

          In a Stupid RW Olympics, all contestants tie for the gold medal and records are broken constantly.

          I bet we could find a connection between graphs of people becoming less educated and their joining the GOP.

          • SueInCa says:


            We used to do a similar thing with a group I managed at Visa. I had staff on the east and west coast and they were a lively bunch but get them in a meeting and sometimes they would clam up so I found an ice breaker. The Darwin Award given to an employee(including me) for something silly they might have done. It was an ice breaker and worked on many occassions in fact I think some went out of their way to perform so their names would be mentioned as the person mentioned got to do the next one. It was great fun and this idea might help to lighten the mood about our gop

          • AlphaBitch says:

            AdLib: is the gold from the Franklin Mint collectible series? Should be. Maybe rimming some collectible plates……

      • MurphTheSurf3 says:

        Ad Lib…One of my correspondents is calling the elections in November “The Great American IQ Test”. If the GOP wins, we failed.

      • SueInCa says:

        Oh one other thing………


        • This is what really gets me. These yokels actually believe they could win an armed insurrection against the federal government. When you remind them of the incredible fire power of the US military, they never fail to assume that those in the military would join them in their “fight.” It’s almost laughable if it weren’t so disgusting to think of.

          • MurphTheSurf3 says:

            KT One battalion of rangers with a little attack helicopter support and they are smoked meat. Such Hubris. And, if they want to be afraid, they should fear the party that wants control of the lives of its citizens in ways that the Dems never dreamed of.

      • SueInCa says:


        “then I am not going to be your friend anymore”

        They grew up republican

  4. AdLib says:

    Sue, a very clever and incisive article!

    Why would the GOP have so much in common with the NAZI Party? I would suggest it is because those who are mercenary in pursuit of power and satisfying their greed walk the same path throughout history. So the GOP shares many of the same positions as many other greedy and oppressive regimes, current and past.

    There’s no longer any pretense about this, the Repubs announced that their primary raison d’etre is to take power away from Obama. Not increase jobs, help the economy or protect Americans…just taking power for themselves.

    Since they only represent the 1%, in order for it to be viable for them to win national elections, they’ve needed to pander to the gullible to support them. So, they promise to serve the religious right on their issues, the racists on theirs, the homophobes on theirs, etc..

    When you think about it, the GOP is actually a coalition…a coalition of the selfish and hateful. It’s almost cartoonish, like an evil group from a comic book that wants to take over the world, The Injustice League of America.

    It wasn’t always like that but it sure is hard to fill up one hand with counting Republicans who earnestly want to help the majority of Americans.

    So, like an evil posse, the GOP will continue to use its ill gotten gains to finance and expand its criminal operation.

    It’s just a good thing for us we’ve got someone on our side:


    • SueInCa says:

      See my comment above yours Adlib. I did not include actual examples in my original post but one page google on the intertubes and I found all these examples. How can people be so stupid not to listen to them? They want to get rid of us plain and simple.

      • AdLib says:

        Sue, the main obstacle to the elite having power over the majority…is the power of the majority. Take away the power of Americans to vote, to get the truth, to know who’s doing what and why…and the elite become more and more powerful.

        The narrow-minded and hateful who are such fools and easily manipulated into serving those who would turn around and oppress them, have become emboldened. Our MSM has a lot to do with that, they have validated the acceptability of raving with hatred and publicizing racist and vicious lies.

        If I’m a hateful person and I see that the MSM allowed racists to push the Birther garbage, I’m only encouraged to openly express my hatreds and prejudices.

        And add to that there is NO ONE on the right who has the principles or balls to stand up to the increasing extremism and hatred out of fear it will be aimed at them for not going along with it.

        The mob mentality, that’s what it means to be a Republican today. And we all know how constructive mobs can be with their nooses, torches and crosses.

        • MurphTheSurf3 says:

          Ad Lib…have you notice a trend in the print media especially to challenge the GOP in ways that are far more aggressive and penetrating. The stories re. the Romney off shore accounts, comparisons with his father, the block the vote efforts, the govs not accepting the medicaid expansion, the unethical practices in the investment sector are all getting a lot more push with investigative journalism leading the way which in turn stokes the MSM fire, primes the pump.

          I’ve noticed it. I e-mailed a former student who writes for one of the magazines that has been rocking the boat asking if I was a victim of my own wishful thinking…Here is his reply:

          “…Nope, not rose colored glasses (something I do not associate with you). The talk in the newsrooms is that we had better get our act together. The GOP has been so bold, so aggressive there is a growing fear that the curtailing of the press, control of the internet, and violation of privacy rights (which for us undermines our ability to get info) are likely targets for GOP action IF they get control of the government. I would add that some of the old hands have been pushing hard against the news as entertainment (and a means of profit) culture…”

          Your thoughts?

          • AdLib says:

            Murph, I agree, the print journalists do seem to be doing a much more professional job than most of the MSM on investigating and reporting on Romney.

            We’ve discussed here before, print and tv have two separate sets of motivations.

            The news channels are all owned by conservative corporations which know that a tight race means greater viewership and profits. They have been and continue to do what they can to prop up Romney through their passive or active support of attacks on Obama (check out my TOOT comment today about that RW hack Andrea Mitchell) or by allowing Romney to escape responsibility for what he’s done, the lies he tells and his hiding of the truth about him.

            Print on the other hand has been doing some very good work on exposing Romney on many things he’s tried to cover up.

            As you say, I do have a feeling that those in print, who are typically more journalists than “host”, as in 24 hour tv news, realize that they do have an important responsibility not to allow Bush II to happen again, allowing someone to grab the reigns of power who poses a real and probable threat to the majority of Americans and the economic future of the nation.

            It does seem so obvious. The US sits on the precipice of long term plutocracy and there is little doubt that Romney will cement that in place.

            This is a critical and urgent time, some in the print media get it and are doing their job to uncover the truth…yet simultaneously, the MSM tv networks try to cover it up by not covering it or through distraction.

            I think there is a lot more nasty stuff out there surrounding Romney and I am encouraged that some in the press are fulfilling their duty to the citizens of this country by trying to seek out the truth and inform the people.

            • MurphTheSurf3 says:

              Agree with all of this in general but I think the press is really stepping up and the tv media is being forced to report on their stories. Tonights newest: the Nation’s report on the top Romney contributors who are overwhelming off shore account keepers, in the billions.

          • BourneID says:

            Hey Murph

            I’m particularly attracted to your observation re print media’s more aggressive involvement now because, as AdLib said above, the power still rests in the majority. We all consider our own interests in decision-making, and I suspect the press now realizes that if Citizens United and other billionaires can purchase the Supreme Court there is no room anywhere for them to shout “freedom of the press.” Should the GOP succeed, then in 2013, the press as they themselves and we now it will no longer be. The power managers will quash every story even remotely critical of the new “regime.” I’m quite sure the gestalt light suddenly flashed on somewhere in a major news room and many saw the end of careers.

            I had not considered that. After reading AL’s comment I jotted down a few of the powers that might be used. but your reference to the recent and, OMG finally! wakeup call jells everythng for me.

            Thank you gentlemen.

            • MurphTheSurf3 says:

              Yes. I think you are correct in this. The gestalt light! Yeah! Newest- the Nation’s report on the top Romney contributors- off shore account keepers all of them, and in the billions.

  5. A good article for thought, Sue. When I first glanced at the headline, I took it to mean that you were asking WHY the far right are the way they are, but that is basically substance for a different article.
    I often wonder, if anybody in the GOP is NOT far right. The group think and demand for solidarity among them would lead me to (logically) conclude that anything done or espoused by the party is done or espoused by all members of that party. It is rare to see dissent among the members of the GOP. It does happen from time to time, but it is rare, IMO.
    In comparison to the downfall of democracy in 1930s Germany, I think America’s far right views the election of Obama as a major defeat, similar to the way many Germans looked at their own defeat in WWI. They saw it as not only embarrassing, but downright fatal if not corrected. The terms of their surrender were harsh and the country was failing economically. The GOP today blames Obama for the economic mess we are in. I’m pretty sure that’s the way they see it AND believe it, no matter that it is not true. The fear generated hatred towards Obama is justified, in their eyes, not to mention their racial disgust at having an Afro-American in the Whitehouse. I think it is logical to conclude that they have adopted some of the same views and tactics as the Nazis did in the 1930s. They feel they have to borrow from a regime that used totalitarian tactics in order to bring back what they once had. They fail to see that what they once had has no resemblance to what they now are. They romanticize the past and are blinded to what they have truly become through their hatred and bigotry and hopes for an oligarchy. They no longer care about country, before political party, or the average American. There is some definite Randian philosophy behind the way they view the middle class and poor. Like Romney and the candidates that lost in the primary, they see the middle class, and especially the poor as being victims of their own actions, or inactions. They say, if you are poor, it’s your own fault, and they turn a blind eye to circumstance and the failed policies that make people poor and keep them poor. That is almost straight out of any Rand novel.
    The GOP resents Obama for his accomplishments despite their own blatant obstructionism.
    The right is absolutely frightened by the growth of minorities in this nation and their vision of a white, Christian America is in grave danger, as they see it. This is why they work so hard to keep minorities away from the polls. This is why they see voter fraud as something perfectly acceptable. Their “great white way,” is fading and they just cannot accept that. They constantly fail to realize that the world only spins forward and not backward.

    • BourneID says:

      Well said KT. Fear is the enemy of both sides. Unfortunately, the Repubs are tapping into it and we’re losing our way. If we don’t self-correct soon, it won’t matter.

      Let me ask you this, KT. Have you heard anyone in the leadership of the Congress express concern over 14 or 15 states (30% of the total number) and the millions who have suffered loss of life, electricity, water, and God knows what else from this cruel, unrelentng heat? Sixty (60) potential voters have died. Have you heard any Democrat or Independent demand help for them? I haven’t. Have you heard any Dem or Independent running for office, either federal, state or local, say, “Okay folks. This is what you can expect if the Repubs win because nothing is more important than lowering that damn deficit and there’s just not enough money for entitlements right now.”

      I haven’t.

      • Thanks Bourne, and it’s good to see you here again. My answer, is no, not really. The most warnings against the GOP returning to power come in either political ads, or from we the people. We dems, that is. There seems to be this false front of bipartisanship that Congress, as a whole, is trying to maintain. It’s bullshit, especially after all the GOP obstructionism and their very public decree that they want Obama to fail, at nearly any cost. If that is not a form of “soft treason,” I don’t know what is, and the dems just let it happen.

    • SueInCa says:

      Actually KT the background people in the GOP have studied Nazi policy and while I would not call them fascist, they are definitely taking pages out of the party platform.

      C Street has an unusual history with fascist policies
      The Dominionists also have a fascination with it as well
      Scheaffer(Francis) was totally enamored with Fascism
      And it is hard to deny when you take the party platform and compare it to the far right of the GOP it matches. I would even go so far as to say PNAC had the nazi party platform in regard to warfare in their heads when they wrote the plan to attack Iraq. I would also mention I worked really hard not to mention the mass killing of anyone however in my private thoughts I know the religious right would sacrifice Jews in Israel in order to usher in their Rapture scenario. In fact a Rabbi once said:

      “the religious right? they don’t realize that many Jewish people know what they are about and we also know in their play Act V does not turn out well for us”. I think Bibi is well aware as well but he is using them as they are using him. He to get the backing he needs against Iran and they to get their hands on the The Dome of the Rock to build the Temple. I have heard of people planning attacks on the dome of the rock to blow it up. Can you imagine the outcry if that happens?

      The ME would erupt and the RWNJ would get their Rapture but not in the way they think. These people don’t have the brains god gave them to blow themselves up so blinded by religion they are.

      • MurphTheSurf3 says:

        Sue- the Dominionist Link is very important. I have used the White Horse Prophecy material a number of times as well.

      • “Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of their leaders. This is easy. Tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists as being unpatriotic. This works in any country.” Hermann Goering

        This is exactly what the GOP did in the lead up and course of the invasion of Iraq. They denounced dems for being “terrorist,” sympathizers. I have no doubt that you remember this well.

        • SueInCa says:

          I am right there with you. That is why I finally completed this excercise. I remember people calling me unpatriotic when I questioned the war with Iraq. It was not a very good time for me and others like me. And I am not saying they will turn this country to facism but it sure feels like that is their intent with the bashing and comments to “get rid” of the secular humaninsts ie. Libruls

  6. kesmarn says:

    BFF, as I was reading your article I kept thinking about the book I’m currently reading: “The Rise of Hitler,” by Theodore Abel. As point after point was made in your piece, I thought: “This is almost word for word what Abel was describing in the period between about 1920 to the late thirties. As soon as I get done reading Sue’s article, I’m going to get that book and draw all those parallels!”

    Well, by the time I reached the end of your excellent article I realized that I didn’t have to. You were way ahead of me.

    I know it’s almost a cliche to say this, but this next election really does feel like the election of our lifetimes. And I know I’m not alone when I say that if Romney is elected we may find ourselves moving rapidly toward a point of no return. It was barely possible for the president to pull us back from the Bush brink. Romney would very likely push us right over the edge.

    That feeling of foreboding that you mentioned, BFF… I think it’s quite justified.

    • bito says:

      k’es, Election of a lifetime? Just think Romney and a Supreme Court Appointment.

      • kesmarn says:

        Oh, b’ito, indeed, how can he hurt us? Let me count the ways!

        Supreme Court nominations. Other judicial appointments. Utter failure to regulate banking practices again. Gutting programs for the poor, the elderly, the unemployed.

        Pushing for the privatization of education, allowing interest rates on student loans to skyrocket. Union-busting.
        Attacking Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security.

        Damaging our foreign relations with countries who are only just beginning to have some confidence that we’re not all crazy. A possible “pre-emptive” war on Iran — financed by MORE borrowing. Then the plaintive cry that “we’re broke” when it comes to crumbling infrastructure.

        Pandering to religious extremists, denial of women’s right to chose — under almost any circumstances. Drill, baby, drill. No enforcement of environmental regulations. The Keystone XL pipeline right through a 9-state aquifer. High speed train projects abandoned.

        Lax food safety regulations again — back to the days of filthy chicken, egg and meat production practices. Support for Mega-Agri-business and Monsanto over family farmers. Debtor’s prisons. Harassment of immigrants.

        The list goes on and on. I don’t want to be a doom-and-gloomer, but I seriously wonder if the country can survive another Bush-type presidency (or worse). I don’t say that in the sense of giving up, but only to stay motivated to fight hard for an Obama win in November. The stakes are incredibly high, to state the obvious!

    • SueInCa says:


      I am glad you read it and like you I am reading some WWII history and have been for the past 6 months. I am sure that has had a hand in this post but I also have read in many books about the RR their infatuation with Fascism. Doug Coe, Francis Schaeffer et.al. This election is why Tony and I decided to buy again. We want a house that no one can take from us and we will have it in this one. Of course we would not be hurt by any discontinuation of SS but changes to medicare would hurt us. And those people do not care. There will be a cry so loud from the seniors should this happen but the one question I would always ask them, Who did you vote for? You get what you vote for.

      I keep trying to tell myself that money does not mean anything, people can see through that but now I am not so sure. My husband once had a hat that said: Money talks Bullshit walks. I sincerely hope we are not headed in that direction.

      But if you have read any of Howard Zinn’s history books you can see the rewind over and over in history. The poor get ahead for awhile but the powers that be always come out on top. Then a tragedy happens and the populace rears it’s head again. I personaly believe as do many others that the distractions are tools of the rich to keep people pre-occupied be it with worthless shit or wondering where their next meal is coming. While the rich continue to pillage and destroy the country. But like I said it is a revolving door and one day again the people of this country will rise up. I just hope it does not take another tragedy.

      • kesmarn says:

        Sue, I hear what you’re saying about the cyclical patterns in history, in which the greed of the few at the top gets more and more out of control until finally the people at the bottom rise up and put things back in balance again. (I wish I could think of an instance in which this was done without violence, but I’m afraid I can’t. That’s a subject for another post, though.)

        What worries me is the increasing imbalance in the weaponry that is available to the wealthy as opposed to the poor. When clubs and swords were available to both sides it was one thing. But now — as we saw in the Occupy movement — police forces (who seem more and more to be security for the 1%) have a dazzling array of tasers, pepper spray, teargas, and worse (along with full body armor) to use against people who basically have the power of words alone. I’m not saying our side should “weapon up,” but their side certainly has no problem using everything up to and including lethal force to squelch dissent.

      • I think there are those in the GOP, especially the PNACers, that would like nothing better than America being hit with another major terrorist attack. They milked 9/11 for all that they could get out of it. It’s why Bush won a second term. Their favorite method of keeping power or gaining it back is fear mongering. The average, middle class and poor republicans live in fear of so much that it is literally a modern day phenomena. They fear secularists, they fear their guns will be taken away, they fear gays, they fear minorities, they fear intellectuals, they STILL fear communism, they fear education, especially college education, they fear Obama, and there are most likely things they fear that I haven’t thought of here. They fear whatever the right wing tells them to fear, through the RW talking heads and leaders of the party. It must be a miserable existence to live in such fear, day in and day out.

  7. funksands says:

    Jeez Sue, what a list. I’m going to have to shower after reading it. You totally nailed it. The conservative GOP exists merely as a conduit of money and power to the top .00005%. Seen in that light, their actions make sense.

    The radical faction of the GOP (good distinction) have motives that are murkier, harder to pin down, and far more troubling. The only advantage to fighting this faction is they seem to broken up into many many more splinter groups. Am I wrong? Great piece.

    • SueInCa says:

      No I don’t think you are wrong. Even in the various tea parties they are in disagreemnt with each other and the Koch-suckers are not paying the way anymore so they all sit at home and fume. Or as Bourne commented below they come to his house and make fools of themselves with their total lack of knowledge.

  8. BourneID says:


    Everything that concerns you is the same everything that concerns all of us. It is blatant ignorance. Knowledge is power but somehow the powerful (us) are losing it -- or are we giving it away?

    The operative phrase in your reply to me might be, “The hate and viotriol….has brought me down.” We cannot afford to let anything bring us down. There are a lot of blind people out there now. I et one last week, a technician who works on mu A/C when it needs attention. I’ve known a few years. He’s a retired State employee who worked in the HVAC unit (is that what A/C is called? I never know) and now operates his few clients from his home. He told me he’s in his early 70’s which surprised me because of the things he believes. Of course, since I’m a political animal, we talked about the election. I said I have a serious problem with the disrespect and disgraceful things that some say about the Preiident. He said, “You know why don’t you?” I replied no then he said, “Because he’s a socialist.” I asked him to define “socialist” and he really could not. He also brought up Muslim, affirative action, hs “birth place” Kenya. I then said it sounds that he is perhaps more racist than he might realize. He denied that he holds any form of prjudice. Of course he doesn’t…but he doesn’t know that. I know this is short-sighted of me, Sue, but I don’t expect something like that from a native born Califorian, which he is. But he’s angry and believes everythng that he hears on Fox. In his opinion, the healthcare bill is illegal, should be stricken down, why he pay for someone else’s health care;h he already pays $800 a month for his wife’s and his Kaiser and supplemental Medicare. I suggested that the figure may be reduced closer to zero. He doesn’t believe it. It is fear, unwillingness to learn more, broaden perspectives, and see what is happening.

    Murph has brought up the danger of massive amounts of money being used by Citizens United and others in their unrelenting pursuit of buying the most valuable real estate in the world. He has brought this up several times on VP, but no one seems willing to dissect it and include all our thoughts in the whole picture. I’ve noticed we take positions and rather than blending our ideas, weaving them into a whole tapestry that we design together, we repeat our defend our own viewpoints instead. POV has the smartest people I’ve communicated with in years; it’s a pleasure to speak but also to learn. I find no value in any conversation if I can’t learn something from it.

    My personal feeling abour your fear is that we want to believe this won’t happen; we want to think that there will be some miraculous clap of thunder that brings people to their senses. I don’t know that will happen, but I think we still have time. Murph invited to come to POV and expressed the highest respect for all of you. I agree with him. I don’t know if you post on HP or visit it, but in my view it is one of the most important resources available, not only to post what we want (with some irritating restrictions that surface now and then) but to see how many people are falling into the trap that is being laid by the money people. Some are being paid to post on HP; they are evident; extremely right wing, new members, few fans, and they are surrounding Murph and other pundits with his reputation level. I am currently making links and archiving their comments to ID them. It’s blatant and left unchallenged can be successful. There are a respectable number of POV members but HP has hundreds of thousands. I had problems with my account a few months ago and Murph contacted his management sources who helped fix it. One of them emailed me to let me now the problem was solved and said HP manages more than one million posts or more. The politics section is heavy with activity. I would also like for you to know that Rachel Maddow posts on HP and has periodically entered conersations that Murph has stared. The Firt Lady also posts; she’s responded to one or two of my comments. What better way for the WH to guage the temperature of the voting public?

    I’ve sensed that there is some resistance to HP here but I consider that a personal choice.

    Sue, I would love to see your article discussed on Friday with a serious look at how we can start moving things forward. I think many are worn out by the incessant in fighting among Cable news networks. You’ve given us a great starting point for discussion, if not on VP then here.

    I look forward to meeting you and CL.

    • MurphTheSurf3 says:

      Bourne, my reply to Sue addresses some of your concerns here. Your HP comments are right on the mark. I like them so much I would like to copy them and send them to my management friend. He needs to hear thoughts like yours as you focus on things I do not- you have a “feel” for the site that I lack and have the gift to strike up conversations with almost anyone…remarkable.

      • kalie says:

        I post on HP also, on the politics site mostly. I have noticed that there is so much anger and hatred, whenever i post about GUNS or Hispanics. Most of my views are liberal, as i am anti gun and would like to see a reasonable type of immigration enacted that doesn’t leave us middle classers paying the bill. Anything that disagrees with the NRA or Hispanic talking points is given a pretty angry and sometimes violent response. I tend to avoid those areas now since i don’t need that in my life. Just thought you might want to know.

      • BourneID says:

        Thank you Murph,

        i appreciate your describing my comments on the site as a “gift to strike up conversations with almost anyone…” My mother used to call that gift…”your big mouth!”

    • AdLib says:

      Hey Bourne!

      As is no secret around here, I would disagree with you about HP being an important or worthwhile resource just because it has a lot of readers.

      Did you know that most of their readers only read the celebrity and personal interest type articles? This comes from Arianna herself, explaining that most readers don’t read the news and political articles.

      I think part of the attraction for people about HP is the assumption that what they write is being read by many people. That would seem to be a misapprehension. On a main article, the average comment is lucky to stay visible on the front page for a minute. Most people don’t go back to previous pages so realistically, how many people actually read any particular comment? I don’t think it’s that many. And extended conversations of any substance or length are impossible due to that, the 250 word limit and the constant censorship/moderation.

      Another misapprehension is that undecided voters come to the site and are convinced by those commenting. Studies have shown that most people who visit blogs have very cemented political beliefs. Some may claim to have their opinions changed, in some cases, maybe so but if I believed everything I read on an HP blog, I’d have some pretty interesting views about Obama’s heritage, agenda and “master plan”.

      My take on HP is that it is a brightly colored bug zapper, it attracts lots of people but only to kill their time and energy for profit.

      I don’t know what constructive things come out of HP for the Progressive community. They are a corporate site owned by a very conservative corporation and help promote hatred and propaganda on a daily basis.

      The only initiative I’m aware of that HP and Arianna were involved in was their hijacking of the “Move Your Money” movement, encouraging people to move their money from corporate banks to local ones. When that didn’t become a big movement, they just bailed on it.

      Personally, I think that HP is an adversary of the Progressive movement (Arianna has declared that she is not a Progressive and her affection for Newt Gingrich).

      Though there are some very brilliant and genuine Progressives posting over there and some Progressives do connect there, blogging at HP comes off to me kind of like participating in a staged battle but thinking it is an actual one. The conflict that goes on at HP is manufactured and irrelevant to most undecided voters who are turned off by such things.

      Whereas, at the PragProg blogs like The Planet and many of those you’ll find on our Blogroll, Progressives come together to have substantive conversations, develop ideas and initiatives and have actually made a difference out there.

      Just to be clear, this is just my personal opinion about HP but I’m not criticizing those who disagree and like blogging there. Many Planeteers blog there so there is no wall up between those who blog here and there.

      Murph can tell you, I’ve shared my criticism of HP on a number of occasions but it’s just that, one issue we respectfully disagree on while we agree on many others.

      • MurphTheSurf3 says:

        Ad Lib…Just want to acknowledge your mention of our understanding to agree to disagree. Clearly we have very different viewpoints re. HP and that is ok. What we do agree on is a set of progressive principles and the value of the Planet in promoting them while seriously analyzing the give and take in any political-economic-social process.

        • AdLib says:

          Murph, exactly. What is Progressive is focusing on what people agree on and trying to make a positive difference instead of focusing on and personalizing disagreements with others.

          Disagreements are reflective of an open, honest and healthy environment so no one should ever hesitate to disagree with someone else around here. Regarding disagreements as personal attacks however is neither productive or enlightened.

          That’s why The Planet is the way it is and why our prime directive is that everyone here deserves a modicum of respect, especially when there is a disagreement.

          In this way, encouraging a civil discourse between people with different points of view, allows for enlightenment for all parties.

          • MurphTheSurf3 says:

            Yep…the Planet is where I go for these kinds of conversations. It is the place where my blogging batteries get recharged. Disagreeing without being disagreeable. Agreeing based on sound thinking, strong evidence, and logical argument.

    • SueInCa says:


      I have tried going back to HP but their moderating is so frustrating it is hard to follow a conversation thread. I guess if I was able to id familiars it would be easier but I have been gone so long I don’t really know the regulars. When I do go there I always pick up a few more fans so they are either shallow and will follow anyone or they really like what I have to say.

      Is that why Murph did not stay long on Friday? I admit sometimes I am just silly by friday night so I miss the inferences. I agree we need to hold open conversations so I am with you on that. Being a former republican you can add a lot to the conversation or should I say current? It does not matter to me because you have shown your open mind. To tell the truth Republicans used to be like that on the norm rather than the abnorm like today. People like Newt and the evangelicals have driven the party on a one way street but like you say it is always possible to turn a corner and find a two way street. All you have to do is turn that corner.

      Thanks for your input and HVAC is the proper term.

      • MurphTheSurf3 says:

        Sue…regarding Friday night. I was actually on site for much of the evening but worn out. The politics here is Missouri are miserable right now. There is a real struggle going on in the Dem Party between those who see our Blue Dog reality as all we can hope for and those who say we should devote our efforts to support the party in other states and let the Blue Dogs drown since they really do not help our side and give the GOP “cover” when they want to claim bipartisan support. Lots of meetings and on-line, by phone exchanges. Additionally, I have a very large truck garden and given our extreme weather keeping it going has proven to be a part time job by itself. SO…I was tuckered out.

        Having said that, I tend to like serious conversations and substantial debate. I can be silly but it is rare (thus my mojito night two weeks ago). I could not get into the repartee last Friday, so rather than pushing my desire for what I enjoy, I just watched from the sideline which is fine.

        Love the Planet for very different reasons that I love HP. Vox is a big reason for this, but so are meaty articles and the discussion that follows like this one.

      • MurphTheSurf3 says:

        Into the valley of death…..

        i.e. a discussion about HP at PPOV….danger, will robinson, danger.

        HP is like a huge convention hall. I find it useful to focus on a few conversations at a time. Frankly, if I were not a “political pundit” and had most of my posts put in a top of the comment page box (along with 10 to 20 others) and had the chance to really interact with others, I would find my time at HP far less satisfying than I do now.

        HP is working at a number of ways to create more conversation but its size and moderation issues are roadblocks. A word about moderation…I have had my problems but have seen things change for the better in the last year. I can say more about this if you are interested but that is my experience.

      • I blogged on HP for about three years. In the beginning, it wasn’t that bad, or didn’t seem to be. It really started to change with the buyout by AOL. It seemed like the moderation became worse and worse. That is what finally drove me away. I realized that I was wasting a large percentage of my time. I would take the time to write well thought out comments only to see them vanish in the ether. It finally dawned on me that reasoned debate was not really that important there.
        I consider it no small blessing to have been directed to the Planet by an ex Hper. I sometimes visit HP, to see what is happening there, but I completely gave up on posting there. I lost all patience with it.

        • SueInCa says:


          That moderation drives me crazy. I don’t post ignorant comments, I don’t cuss(there -- here sometimes), I don’t namecall etc yet all of my posts go into the ether like you said too. I have gone back a few times here and there but the moderation drives me away very quickly. There are too many good sites to waste my time being moderated.

          • Oh, it is highly annoying. It’s like talking to someone who is clearly not listening to you. It’s being ignored. I never understood how they could want you to comment, then restrict you from doing so. I didn’t name call, or threaten people or use heavy profanity either, but far too many of my comments just disappeared. AdLib makes a good point about the comments being relegated to the back pages after only being on the front page for mere moments. How could a good dialogue have a chance in such an atmosphere?

      • BourneID says:

        Hey sue

        I didn’t know you had been on HP at one time. The moderation process is annoying at times, but my complaint is the 250 word allowance. I can’t say good morning in 250 words. It took a long time for me to find my legs, but I’m now at my comfort level. It’s not for everyone, of course, but my personal learning style needs the challenge that comes from respectful disagreement. I don’t even mind a shouting match now and then.

        There’s a lot to talk about in coming months. I see huge weaknesses in the Dem/Independent dialogue. The Repubs, who have never directed my thinking, have somehow zeroed in on everything that has made and keeps people angry. They listened to the TP message and they’ve used it well and successfully. It’s possible the Repub leadership itself doesnt agree with the message, but they’re using it and using it successfully. When do we like our President best? When he becomes angry and says what’s on his mind. The media I watch and read frequently have comments from his supporters that say, “Why doesn’t he say somehing?” Many criticisms are leveled at his “caving in” on the deficit or walking away from confrontation. I don’t care what side of the table we sit on, we want someone to fight for us. As dull and uninteresting as Romney is, he sounds like he’s fighting and he has enough voices speaking for him that we’re being drowned out.

        I have a different vantage point of the world. I’ve lived in Africa, the Middle East, Asia where poverty is alive and thriving and the word “self” is not in the vocabulary.

        Have I gone beyong POV’s “be nice” mantra? The world is not nice. You wrote an important article Sue. It doesn’t need defending. Everything I’ve read that you write has a strong message. Keep writing.

        • SueInCa says:


          thank you for your kind words. There are many people who do not understand poor. They have never been in a neighborhood that is really poor. They don’t see the encampments on the side of the freeway in Sacramento and other places. They just don’t see.

          I am not so sure most people see Mitt as fighting I see him as more the same old same old from the RW. I think most people see him as caving to the far right of the party. There is no moderate Mitt out there now. And people need to think about just who he will be beholden to if he wins and it is not the base of the party. This weekend in NY sealed the deal. Had he truly been middle of the road Mitt I think at this point he would have been ahead. In that sense I think he has blown it. The only way not is if this voter suppression really does work and that is no way to win. They will carry that baggage through his entire administration.

          I don’t mind jousting with you here and I hope others do not as well. That is what communication is all about.

  9. BourneID says:

    Good morning Sue

    I read your article carefully and see the emotion that drives you to write. It becomes more clear as I personally engage in conversations and research that most of us are anxious about the direction of our country -- even most of the Republican party members share your concerns except they’ve named the enemy -- US. I am a registered Republican; I voted for President Bush because I did not think Al Gore would be effective in the WH. I supported Preident Bush’s decision to invade Iraq and now know it was an emotional, angry reaction to 9/11; how dare anyone attack my country…the world’s First Responder to any disaster that occurs anywhere in the world. I now know it was a huge mistake. Some mother in Brooklyn didn’t raise her son to die in another country to “protect our freedoms.” Interesting, isn’t it, that we now must protect those freedoms from the party that made the decision to send that son there.

    There is a mindless element that has invaded the repubs, contaminated by greed, self-serving interests, and disregard for those whose lives it has destroyed. My view from the bridge, is that the party has taken a detour not yet on any GPS. They’ve entered the neverland of the uneducated, narrow-visioned who stuff their ignorance down our throats and the price they pay is loss of dignity and forced tolerance of those who came to DC to fix things but are now mesmerized by the privilege of elected office. Power is an aphrodisiac. But it is also a weakness when it reveals its true purpose, as did the representative who said yesterday that voter ID will assure Republican sucess in November.

    If we move away from our angst and acknowledge the value in what this experience is teaching us, we can confront and destroy the ugly beast. We just need to find the right dragon slayer. A starting place might be to demand the media that does support the President is to keep the camera and mic on what HE is saying rather than focusing on Mitt and his dpzen gaffes a day. But make no mistake, we can learn from them. The Repubs are better at the “art of war” than we are. That was proven several decades ago in a memo Roger Aieles wrote when he was an advisor to President Nixon; Murph published that memo. Everyone should read it -- is was spot-on about the psyche of the American electorate. Study the patterns; they always lead to the solution.

    I agree with most of your list and I pray that all of it is not our future. The agency I worked for in Germay had a small library and in it was a full transcript of the Neuremberg trials. I read it. Hitler’s party was one of the most evil in history. Are we going to be there one day? Maybe not in our lifetimes but just maybe… In it is the conversation between the 2 judges, one American, one German, which was included in the great Spencer Tracy movie. He, the American judge, said to the German judge, Burt Lancaster, “You sentenced innocent people to die. You knew what was happening and you did nothing to stop it.” Sound like our Supreme Court future?

    How many voters understand that once/if Citizens United completes its purchase of America in November, it will not matter what party we belong to. They’ve already made the down payment in the Supreme Court. We are losing justice;. Without justice there is no America.

    Sue, this reveals much about you and the depth of your love for our country. It is an important post. There are too many good people still in the Republican party who would agree with you…let’s appeal to the better instincts of those who do.

    • MurphTheSurf3 says:

      Bourne…just left a comment for Sue that is also for you as your comment and hers spurred the thought.Take a look.

    • SueInCa says:


      Wow I think you nailed it. I am deeply disturbed by what I see. I don’t want to see it but my mind is open and it cannot stop the pictures. I hope, as you do, that the Republican party wakes up from it’s slumber and takes control of all the crazies as well. One thing that does disturb me is the religious faction. I saw what they did in Uganda and they did their dirty work with no cares or prescient thought about what a “superstitious” African country would do with the info. The sentenced Gays to death all in the name of their lord and savior. THAT I can never accept.

      I never learned to dislike Republicans until the last 6 years. All of the Republicans I knew were conservative(as am I in some ways) and their politics I just wrote off to our differences -- no big deal we all have our own beliefs. However the hate and vitriol I have seen in this past 6 years(for me only) has brought me down. Never in my life did I think we would see such disparity in the parties and such hateful language. Perhaps I was not paying attention and I take responsibility for that but I am now and I also take responsibility and will act on that.

      I just have this constant uneasy feeling that something is going to happen and there is nothing I can do to stop it. Something that is going to hurt this country in a very profound way. The anger will come to a boiling point and I am very fearful of how it will present itself.

      I will go on day to day and project as much truth and positive nature as I can but it is always in the back of my mind.

      • MurphTheSurf3 says:

        Sue…I was (and still largely am) an Eisenhower Republican. I can stay a lot more about that, but bit by bit the GOP has changed and not at all for the better.

        Ike’s warning to beware the military industrial comples was just one of his many caveats about the dangers of corporate power. He, and the party and its platforms, in both of his runs for office, were strongly, strongly pro labor, small farm, public infrastructure development AND high taxes for those who benefited the most from the services provided by the public sector- oddly, for IKE and that generation of post-depression, post-WW II, patriotic GOP, that meant the rich and powerful THAT is why George Romney chose to NOT take all of the work-arounds in his tax returns and why he released 12 years of returns and said he would release any he was asked to release. He was one of the Greatest Generation and like many of that era, he, sadly, raised a very different son and very spoiled son.

  10. Put bluntly you nailed it. You’ve covered virtually all the motivations of the right wing. The right wingers fall under these categories to various degrees. Some are more social conservatives and others are ‘fiscal’ conservatives but what they all have in common is they are reactionary and motivated by fear and division. They hate change and are motivated by the fear that white folk will lose their grip on the country.

    The only reason they are more divisive under Obama is because of the color of his skin. They literally ignore what he’s actually done with policies like lowering taxes instead of raising them like the GOP believes. The GOP is more like a racial identity club now than a political party, especially among older white men.

    I do cringe a bit when I see direct comparisons to the Nazis because it just invokes such intense emotions. The Nazis where the Nazis and few groups in history matched their crimes. Even if the motivations of the right wing today are similar to the Nazis the actually acts the Nazis carried out were far far more horrendous. Of course the exception are right wingers that are card carrying members of know hate groups.

    • BourneID says:

      Hi KQ

      I’m not sure that we’ve had any conversations on VP yet, but I hold myself accountable for that. I’m so busy trying to figure out where I am and where I should be during the rapid fire chats that I barely remember what we’re talking about. It’s nice meeting you finally.

      You bring insight into your response and it’s important to the broader conversation that I hope will continue. I agree with your observation that we should not compare the motivations of the extreme right wing to Hitler’s Germany, but I do see strong parallels in their methodology. They lull the senses with fear and convince the uninformed that everything will continue to be fine, then launch the assault. Hitler had the Jews; Romney has the Dems. This concerns me more than the blatant lieing. How can we convince them that once they have given their minds -- that which differrentiates us from one another -- they have given up their identity and it will be used as the bad guys see fit. The answer lies in knowledge and in understanding our own deficiency in finding solutions.

      we need to address the Republican agenda directly and honestly with Republicans, not among ourselves. We already agree, but we just keep preachng to the choir. To succeed in sending our message, I truly believe we must not succumb to our own anger which then denies us the chance for the type of discourse that might lead to the occasional “ah ha!” moment that’s rare but not impssible. If each of us can change 3 minds, think of the numbers exponentially.

      See you at VP.

      • I hope we cross paths more in future as well. I’ve got a few personal situations going on so I haven’t been on the Planet as much as usual. But when things settle down I’ll be back more for sure.

    • SueInCa says:

      That is why I mentioned nothing about their mass murdering. I know that has not happened what I was referring to was party platform. I even toned down the pieces about their hatred of gays and abortion for the same reason.

      My point was the party platform in general. But you are right there are some factions that are facist and they have not been afraid to fly their colors so there is no reason not to talk about them.

      • BourneID says:


        My compliments to you for starting an inspiring, interesting, important conversation. This is one of the best I’ve seen either here or in the other place I wont mention.

        Even if you had suggesed or inferred that mass murder could follow, you are not that far off base. Man’s inhumanity to man is has been recorded in history for millenia. Sue, when I lived in Germany, I visited Dachqu, and nothing you read can describe the terror that still lives in that place. On one of the pathways to the gas chanbers there a huge rock and it it is inscribed, “here lie the remains of 700 Jews.” It’s chilling. Inside of the museum area, where all the pictures of the dead are, there’s a signs printed in 7 languages that translate to ‘NVEVER AGAIN” -- I would add, “until next time.”

        These things may not happen to us but who can guarantee they will not happen ever? It’s the generations of the children of the new powerful who will use the power of privilege to whatever purpose suits them.

        One day, history books written about American will begin with, “Once upon a time…”

        BTW, that other place Murph i refer to above is one led = an incredible conversation re abortion that was so good I printed it it was 15 pages long. I attracted so many comments from pro and con views; it changed minds when a nurse/attorney stepped in to discuss times when it’s medically necessary to abort; it brought others, one of whom was Rachel Maddow, and then one woman came on and described that she had been anti-abortion until was raped and nearly beaten to death; dhe now works with rape victims. Another woman, one of Murph’s close friends, came on and said the same thing happened to her when she was a child. These women brought to the table the human story -- I wonder how a Congressional committee would receive that? Would that change their minds?

        Note for Murph: it was I-lass.

      • I know what you meant and know you don’t have any ill intentions. It’s just when most people read anything about comparisons to Nazis all nuance is lost. I’m just saying some people may not get your point because of the emotions the term Nazi’s invoke.

        My other problem with using the Nazis in any part of arguments is that the right wing uses the compares Obama and Dems far far too much to Nazis even though those comparisons are totally false even when compared to the methodology of the right wing today.

        Bottom line invoking Nazis in any way just breaks my personal rule on developing arguments. Reductio ad nazium.

        It’s no problem we can agree to disagree because it’s more a point of personal preference than substance anyway.

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