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boomer1949 On December - 13 - 2009

roseI ask myself this question almost everyday.    Why?  Because it was the way I was raised.  I can still hear the echo of my mother’s voice “…if you don’t behave, you’re going to suffer the consequences…”  However, Mother being Mother, she rarely told me (or my siblings) what “the consequences” would be.

So when I read about celebrities, sports figures, politicians, and the like doing stupid things and still come out smelling like a Queen Anne Rose, it makes me wonder.  Were their mothers just as vague as mine?

Joe Blundo, a columnist for The Columbus (OH) Dispatch, recently pondered celebrity reputations in “Despite affair, Tiger is already out of the woods,” (December 6, 2009).  Although Mr. Blundo’s article focuses on reputations, I believe society has become lax when it comes to consequences and responsibility. A slap on the wrist and million dollar endorsements have become the rule, and consequences the exception to it.

What do you think?

BTW – Anyone read Mr. Blundo’s piece?

Categories: News & Politics

Written by boomer1949

...do the right thing because it is the right thing to do... Political Views: neutral...lean toward humanity

169 Responses so far.

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  1. boomer1949 says:


    I am totally tired and need to go to sleep. However, just caught this
    “across the street” — Eyore is at it again. What IS this man’s agenda anyway? I am stunned.

    Take a look see and let all of us know in the morning?



    • choicelady says:

      I have to say, since this is HP, that this may or may not be true. Reid has only to say to Lieberman that all he needs to do is vote for cloture, that the Senate has enough votes for a public option and a good plan. BUT if Lieberman tries to go against the caucus on cloture, he will find himself the lowest-ranking member on Tourism to Bora Bora. Lieberman already made it clear he’d not give up his chairmanship of Homeland Security for anything.

      HP is given lately to false headlines and hyper-ventillating. So I’d not give their stories much weight. We shall see. This does not mean L. is a nice guy because he is NOT, but I’m not trusting this source anymore.

      • bitohistory says:

        Wait a minute Joe! Did you not say the opposite just 3 months ago? I am having a hard time between his flips and flops. McCain says Joe is sticking up for his principles? What principles? Today’s? Yesterdays? Tomorrow’s?


      • boomer1949 says:


        Everything you just said crossed my mind last night, and I even went to Face the Nation to see what they had there; I must confess I didn’t watch the video.

        On the other hand, I still wasn’t sure. It was 1:30 AM EST and I never stay up like that — when I saw the HP headline — I started to hyperventilate 🙂 I did send JL a note through his Senate website, and then sent it on to my Senator.

        Given the hour, I’m sure I overreacted. I certainly hope so, the man is such a, a, a, wimp and troublemaker.

      • bitohistory says:

        C’Lady, I caught most of the WH daily briefing this morning and Robert Gibbs denied the story.
        Think Progress also has a post up on it.


        Did Sam Stein miss the briefing or use the “an unnamed source said” trick? Or just something he heard that somebody heard by somebody in the bathroom said?

      • PepeLepew says:

        Agreed. HuffPost consistently has the most inflammatory and sensationalistic headlines of any online news source. They’re turning into the New York Post of the Internet.

    • Kalima says:

      Why do they insist on calling this man an Independent, he has betrayed his constituents by not following up on his promise to promote healthcare reforms. The man is a Repub slug, ready to fall on his knees to the highest bidder. His chairmanship should be revoked, he is nothing but a traitor.

      Good night boomer, rest well.

  2. kesmarn says:

    Good Lord! I just looked at the clock and it’s almost 1 a.m. WHAT HAVE I BEEN THINKING?

    I guess I’ve been thinking that I’m having too much fun to go to bed.

    But now I must…or tomorrow (later today) will not be pretty.

    Good night, Planet Friends!

  3. choicelady says:

    OK -- being three hours behind a lot of you and still awake, more or less, I hope y’all go back and read ALL the comments here.

    You are the most amazing people I’ve encountered in many years. There is such maturity, thoughtfulness, and outright kindness in these posts! I am part of many commentaries on blogs, but I have NEVER read so many outstanding and wise statements from anyone, anywhere.

    As one of the fairly “newbie” commentators, I took to your collective and individual presence within HOURS. Every single one of you embodies the essence of human decency, thoughtful reflection, and compassion. And you all have that rare gift -- a sense of humor! WOW!

    I am SO grateful to you all for just being who you ARE! Thank you for letting me move to the Planet. It’s the best place I’ve been in years.

    • Kalima says:

      We certainly are richer for your comments here.

    • kesmarn says:

      I think people have a tendency to see in others the qualities they possess themselves…… 😮 😮 😮

    • boomer1949 says:


      I am EST and still awake. Have to be at work in less than seven hours. Probably older than you, and this is the second time in three days I’ve been up waaaaaay past my snooze time. Haven’t done this in forever. If I could stay up for Kalima’s day, I would. Pretty scary. Only one other thing would, could get me to stay up this late on a “school night.” But we won’t go there, ‘kay?

  4. Kalima says:

    I have just spent a bewildering 30 minute with a neighbour I organize the shopping for twice a week. He is an 81 years old former professor in European history, a Japanese man, married to a wonderful German woman who died 2 years ago. He speaks 3 languages and is usually fun to talk to, but he has just knocked the wind out of my sails twice.

    While waiting for the door to be answered, I couldn’t help but notice the pile of broken mirror in front of the gate which leads to the back of his house, I didn’t have to ask why the glass was there as one of my outside cats returned with a bleeding paw last week.

    Armed with my camera, I followed him up the steep and winding staircase to view the reason for my visit, his nativity statues displayed as a nativity scene on his living room floor, they are Catholics, the whole family. As I was there taking pictures of what really was a beautiful display, I started thinking about just how Catholic or Christian it was to intend to hurt living creatures and I felt a slight chill.

    We talked for a short time and just as I was leaving, he said that he had just been reading about someone saying that Obama was a radical Marxist. I laughed and told him just how ridiculous these statements from the RW machine were but he continued. He said that Obama had been active as a student with a group of radicals protesting the Vietnam war. When I pointed out that the President was 8 when the war started and 13 when the war ended and that maybe he would be better off checking these facts for himself before falling for the propaganda, he was silent. I was going to ask if he had read this in Japanese or English but to tell you the truth, it left a bitter taste in my mouth and made me wonder and think about how far flung the RW machine has cast it’s web of deceit and lies.

    I’m happy to be home, where things are calm and I know that I decide for myself what is right and what is true.

    • PatsyT says:

      I hear Twilight Zone music. Hope this works out well for you and your kittys.

      • Kalima says:

        I was just talking to a friend about it saying that I’m very tempted to sneak out in the dead of night, in disguise if need be, to start collecting it and dispose of it when the stuff which doesn’t burn trash collection is due. It’s a thought spinning in my head as I type.

    • escribacat says:

      Kalima, Are you saying he put a pile of broken mirror there so the cats would step in it and get injured?

      • Kalima says:

        That’s the only reason I can think of, yes.

        • boomer1949 says:

          Kalima and/or E’cat

          I really need to hit the hay. However, I absolutely had to let you know that Lieberman is up to his antics once again.

          I forwarded my online comments to Senator Lieberman to Senator Sherrod Brown (D-OH). The following is the exact message I shot off to Joey. What in the world is wrong with this guy?

          Dear Senator (Lieberman):

          What in the world is YOUR problem? You Sir, are playing both sides against the middle and completely destroying the fabric of my country. You don’t want to be a Republican and you don’t want to be a Democrat. Okay fine, your choice. However Sir, you are messing with the lives of many — men, women, children, infants, the elderly.

          Please Senator Lieberman, please tell me WHO died and made you God? Please explain — sorry I just want to wreak havoc doesn’t count.

          What is your problem? Why are you so hateful? Why do you want people to suffer? Who is paying you under the table?

          Sorry Senator, but you are as fake as the silk flowers on my grandmother’s dining room table, and you sir are playing Russian Roulette with the lives of millions of people. Ooops…but that doesn’t bother you — right? Why? Because you will never have to worry about health care — the taxpayers are PAYING YOUR PREMIUMS.

    • Bernard Marx says:

      How ridiculous. He’s either suffering from dementia or he’s a poor excuse for a professor. Either way he has no critical thinking skills.

      • Kalima says:

        Yes I’m afraid the “critical” thinking is something many Japanese still have to learn. It exists where people have lived some time abroad but is sorely missing in the majority of others, a failure in the education system here. You learn what is taught, questions are not that welcomed.

        • Khirad says:

          It’s amazing they do as well as they do. Rote education has left many a Middle Eastern country behind.

          And, oh yeah, in my generational parlance, really X-Files there.

    • choicelady says:

      Wow Kalima -- that is frightening, isn’t it? Does he not remember the lies and hate directed at his people in the US during WW II? What does one do with all that?

      I would counsel you to be his calm and quiet guide if you can, but I must say I’m put off by the cruelty to animals, too. But I also know that at the end of days, even my liberal-to-the-core mother became suspicious, angry, distrustful of people whose very rights she had championed at some cost to herself. You may be dealing with early stage dementia. If so, that’s terribly sad.

      Life isn’t easy, is it? Thank you for your kindnesses to him, even as he grows more difficult probably by the day. Turn to us if it grows worse -- we’re here for you.

      • Kalima says:

        Yes that is it exactly, it was frightening an quite unexpected. He has a brother next door, they are not very close, but the brother confronted me years ago about “my” cats using his garden for a toilet. I spent almost 6 months going there every morning to check and clean up to keep the peace. When I later found out it wasn’t any of my cats and was sickened by his daily messages in German left on the soil for me to find, I lost my temper and refused to go there again. His brother and his wife were on my side and now he seems to be doing the same thing.

        I have a toilet for my outsiders, they use it, so what I’ve just witnessed was a total shock.

        I help him out because I was fond of his wife and will continue to do it, however my personal feelings have changed in just the space of 30 minutes and I hope he comes to his senses, I have a feeling he won’t.

        • kesmarn says:

          Kalima, I agree with choicelady that your neighbor might be in the early stages of dementia. The increasing level of paranoia and hostility are very common. I see this so often in my work. People become convinced, for example, that others are entering their homes and stealing items or simply moving them around as a form of harassment. They think others are “plotting to ‘put me away’ or to ‘get my money.'” Even family members become suspect. It’s very painful. Hard to see a person who once had nothing but friendly feelings suddenly eye you with wary--even slightly hostile--caution.

          You’re kind to want to continue to help him. He needs it, whether he recognizes it or not.

          • Kalima says:

            You both could be right, I call him Tuesday and Saturday mornings to get his shopping list and sometimes he has forgotten what day it is, nothing strange, I forget myself sometimes.

            One evening this summer, I received a late night call from him asking if he could come to collect his shopping now, it was Sunday and his shopping had been delivered on Saturday afternoon. I was worried but it had slipped my mind.

            He has a nephew living close by, the son of another brother who died about 5 years ago, I am not family, don’t know the nephew, so don’t think it’s my place to voice my fears, they see him much more than I do.

            In the meantime, I hope that my little outsiders have enough sense to stay away from this imminent danger, it’s his property, can’t do very much about it.

            • kesmarn says:

              Cats are so clever, Kalima, it usually doesn’t take more than one time for them to sense which areas to avoid. And they certainly know where the “softies” live. I put food out tonight for a crafty neighborhood cat who may or may not have an owner. But he certainly knows how to get fed. He is absolutely HUGE. He must be hitting twenty different houses, giving them all the same pitiful looks and meows. He couldn’t be under 25 pounds! A real American cat.

            • Kalima says:

              Yes, St. Francis is a busy man, but I’m sure he has time for 10 more kitties.

            • kesmarn says:

              Sucker is my middle name.

              We’ll commend those little guys of yours to the protective care of St. Francis over night! 😮

            • Kalima says:

              Yes they are clever kesmarn, it’s just that once the last feeding is over, they are on their own until the next morning and a lot can happen when I’m sleeping.

              LOL he sounds huge and you don’t have to tell me about those pitiful, feed me looks and meows, I’ve seen them all and still fall for them every time. Once a sucker always a sucker. 🙂

  5. TheRarestPatriot says:

    Oh…one more thing before I drift off.

    I wanted to share a great website of FREE downloadable eBooks. You won’t believe the selection. It’s a massive resource if you have a Kindle or similar ebook reader. There is a limit of 5 books every 2 weeks, but hey…it’s free. Hope some of you might be able to snag some great reads…


  6. TheRarestPatriot says:

    ~Whew~…whatta day. I’m out for the night everyone. See you tomorrow.

  7. PatsyT says:

    I am just stopping by for a quick Hi,
    About to watch “The People Speak”
    on the History Channel
    It is about to start here on the West Coast….


    • choicelady says:

      Hi- I started to watch some time after it began, and I wound up starting with the John Brown segment. I have come to loathe him because he’s the icon for the ‘justifiable homicide’ anti-abortion murderers. They think he made shooting doctors an OK thing to do. So, I had to turn it off. Otherwise I’d have watched indeed.

      • PatsyT says:

        Hi Choice,
        yes, that was one part,
        but there were many, very worthwhile and powerful moments.
        The Sojourner Truth segment was a stand out

        In her words..
        ~Sojourner pointed to one of the ministers. “That man over there says that women need to be helped into carriages, and lifted over ditches, and to have the best place everywhere. Nobody helps me any best place. And ain’t I a woman?”

        Sojourner raised herself to her full height. “Look at me! Look at my arm.” She bared her right arm and flexed her powerful muscles. “I have plowed, I have planted and I have gathered into barns. And no man could head me. And ain’t I a woman?”

        “I could work as much, and eat as much as man -- when I could get it -- and bear the lash as well! And ain’t I a woman? I have borne children and seen most of them sold into slavery, and when I cried out with a mother’s grief, none but Jesus heard me. And ain’t I a woman?”

        The women in the audience began to cheer wildly.

        She pointed to another minister. “He talks about this thing in the head. What’s that they call it?”

        “Intellect,” whispered a woman nearby.

        “That’s it, honey. What’s intellect got to do with women’s rights or black folks’ rights? If my cup won’t hold but a pint and yours holds a quart, wouldn’t you be mean not to let me have my little half-measure full?”

        “That little man in black there! He says women can’t have as much rights as men.

    • kesmarn says:

      Hi Patsy! Hope your weekend went well.

  8. TheRarestPatriot says:

    Holy crap, …I posted that link to my poetry and everybody evaporated here! OMG,..they hate it and don’t know what to say!…LIE, LIE!….LMAO~

    • kesmarn says:

      Hey, TRP, I finally just got a chance to take a look at the book.

      You are a brave one…put your real name out there along with your work!

      I have to take note of one poem in particular: it’s called “Blind.” Am I right that this is yours, not your partners? I think it’s very good. There’s a lot of talent and even more potential in those lines.

      • TheRarestPatriot says:

        Well, real face, real name….I have had enough of hiding behind anonymity.
        Thanks for the review. Glad you took a look. Yes, Blind is mine. Frankly, I thought that particular piece was a bit contrived, but I’m glad you saw the potential there.

      • PatsyT says:

        The book looks great, I will have to check it out.
        Good for you TRP!

    • boomer1949 says:

      Fine by me…anything to up the comments and boost the old (and I mean old, very old) Ego. 🙂


  9. TheRarestPatriot says:

    Great people here. I think I’ll stay awhile..~smile~

    • Kalima says:

      Thanks, I took a look and with these poor eyes of mine was unable to read the print, sorry.

      I did something similar with my hubby, as a coffee table, limited edition book in 88′ and we gave it away to friends as gifts.

      • TheRarestPatriot says:

        Yes, that text is difficult to read on that black background. Definitely don’t strain your eyes! But thank you for going anyway.
        Blurb is a great resource for publishing one or just a few copies at a good price. Did my studio book there as well.

        • Kalima says:

          Last year I was working on a little cat photo book with comments, an option on my IPhoto on Mac, I had just one page left before sending it off, when something knotted inside my old Mac. Off to to the doctor at the local Apple shop, they informed me that a lot of my stored data, including the unfinished book was damaged. I know little about what goes on under the hood of my computer and always had help, this time, too many cooks had spoiled the broth and the desire to start again was lost. Shame really.

          • TheRarestPatriot says:

            Oh I hate when that happens! I have a history in IT and work with both PCs and Macs, so I know what you went through.
            As long as you still have the photos on your phone it should be really easy to just plug ’em back into BookSmart, right?

            • Kalima says:

              The photos all went poof too and they were stored in my IPhoto album. From that day I muddle through by myself and frantically email a friend who worked as a computer programmer to walk me through it, but he gets so mad sometimes when I don’t understand what he’s explaining, he disappears for hours.

              I always say that I am and will remain a total technofart, I do just fine with only an on and off switch.

            • TheRarestPatriot says:

              LOL….too funny!..

  10. TheRarestPatriot says:

    Boy, we DO seem to drag out the threads in here, huh? LOL~

    I wanted to share something with all of you that I did as a collaborative effort with another artist. We are both members of OvationTV (I don’t know who gets this channel, but it’s an artist community channel on cable)…and anyway, they asked if John, the other artist, would provide some of his works for me to write interpretive poetry for. He did. I did. And if you have the time, please read it over. It’s best if you open the FULL SCREEN option and flip through our new book. It’s only 14 pages and you don’t have to buy anything. I make nothing from it so don’t feel obligated. I just thought I’d share and see what you all thought of my work. Lie if you must….LOL.
    I feel like it is some of my best work in poetry. I know, I know…but just this once…


    • choicelady says:

      TRP -- beautiful “book” with wonderful meld of word and image! I like Impermanence and Blind very much. Wow. Be not afraid -- your work is wonderful!

      I know Rochester, or used to. Good town, solid people, but not given to the rise of such as thee very often. It is a place of permanence, not flights of imagination. You are both of it and without it. Says volumes about your creativity to write without disdaining where you came from. That’s a gift.

      Good night. Thank you for sharing!

  11. javaz says:

    I love poetry.
    I wish I could write that.
    My poetry is limited to stupid limericks that I fudge from songs --

    Have a Holly Jolly Christmas,
    It’s that time of year,
    Say hello to friends you know,
    And have another beer.

    Have a Holly Jolly Christmas,
    And when you walk down the street,
    Pull your pants down low
    And say hello
    To everyone you meet!


    And then there’s the Nantucket ones.

  12. javaz says:

    I’ve written that story and in most of my stories, I write that story over and over, because I have lived it.
    Fortunately for me, I hit the rock bottom when much younger, and younger people, imho, are more resilient.

    I also believe in Karma, and believe in lots of things, like the power of positive thinking, which seems to be under fire if you read Daily KOS or alternet.

    I’m also very spiritual and I guess religious, even though I do not go to church any longer and do not believe in what church people believe.

    I try to be positive in life, even during the dark hours, I try to find the meaning and the lesson and the good.

    Don’t get me wrong.
    I’ve sunken to the depths of despair, but fortunately I was able to crawl out of it.

    Once you hit rock bottom, there is nowhere to go but up.

    • TheRarestPatriot says:

      I can say with absolute certainty that I am at the bottom. This will be the lowest point in my life. I’m middle aged, but I feel I have a lot to bring to the world. Hell, I may even lead the revolution, who knows? I feel I can be strong again…I know I have the strength to pull myself back up…I just have to find that one opportunity…that one…open door. Right now I am lost.
      I was booted from the church so I have no support there and would rather live on the streets I think than to have them watch me squirm. But that’s just me.
      I believe I am a good man. I believe I have worth on some level. I certainly don’t think I deserve to be thrown away. And I won’t stop blogging and posting until they turn off the internet here. And until my voice fades away here online…I have to keep trying to find that opportunity. I know it’s sad, but my online friends ARE my ONLY friends. I have to keep believing…it’s all I have.

      • choicelady says:

        TRP -- any church that would boot you out is a fraud as far as faith goes. I’m horrified! And so sorry that has happened to you. Everyone needs community -- depending on your desire, look to other churches. I now know why we resonate -- I lived those great years in Buffalo! As much as people there and Rochester are salt of the earth, they can be closed minded and very cruel. I am so sorry. I refuse to let people dictate to me about how I live my life which is, by all measures, incredibly BORINGLY ordinary! Save for my politics, or course. But NO one can tell you that you are unworthy of the embrace of faith, so find others who share your views and be with them. They will love YOU, that is for sure. Whoever judged you? It’s their loss, for sure.

        PS -bet I’m a LOT older than you, and I am living energetically and even sexily in my middle age -- it really IS a state of mind these days. With your poetry and art you have an energetic vision. Therefore, you are NOT old!

      • boomer1949 says:

        trust me, my dear. you are far from middle age.

        • TheRarestPatriot says:

          I am?

          Ok, …well…I feel very elderly….LOL~

          • boomer1949 says:


            My oldest is only 4 yrs younger than you. So, you are far, very far from middle age. Must be because I still see myself as middle age…not…not in a million years!

            Scary, I’m 60 and still love Dave Matthews:


      • Kalima says:

        You have a very positive attitude that will serve you well. It’s never too late to start a new life or to learn something new. We have all been there at one time or another and somehow have found the strength to go on to more rewarding things, you will too I think and don’t ever give up trying.

  13. choicelady says:

    I’m exhausted by it all. Quite a number of years ago, Rober Coles, the noted psycholgist who wrote about children in many different circumstances, did an article, “Children of Entitlement”. It focused on the rich and privileged, but I think it extends to even those raised poor who become wealthy and, in their own way,powerful. Americans don’t seem to respect their neighbors (they might be making $5 more than we) but do love the Rich and Famous. Why? This adulation all folds into the race to have 4000-square-foot homes and what I call “kitchen envy”.

    Karl Marx once discussed the ‘feteshism of commodities’ so this is not new. We have so few personal relationships anymore that we have to have things -- ever-changing, more and more -- to feel good. I have a young relative who is a millionaire -- young, hip, with it, spending lavishly on what he admits are toys but who has no real relationship with anyone, friend or love. He got it from his mother who always embodied the saying “she knows the price of everything and the value of nothing”. I feel sorry for him -- deeply, worriedly sorry for his hollowness. He is very lonely.

    And is that not what this is all about? The happiest people I’ve ever known have been cops and union families, people with a tight, loyal circle of friends and supportive relatives. Too many of the rest of us have no support, no security, no nothing. So we move on to successive lovers, things, experiences, all the while seeking what we can’t find in work that no longer matters, people who no longer care, relationships that are no longer reciprocal.

    I lived for several years in a working-class integrated neighborhood where we had block parties, spent summer nights doing gardening and conversing together, exchanged help when we needed it, shoveled sidwalks in winter. I babysat my neighbors’ kids who, when older, came and sat with me and my husband on our front porch and just talked. Young Black kids talking with middle aged, white adults! Cool! We had such a wonderful life! I now live in a similar area where I know fewer neighbors, but I still sit on the front porch to say hi to those going by. Someone has to make this a real neighborhood!

    I wonder who talks with Tiger. No one talks with my relative unless they want something from him. Bet it’s the same with Tiger.

    How sad.

    • AlphaBitch says:

      I was lucky enough this week to go visit my “adopted” Afghan son at work, whose family just bought a little store/gas station of their own (they have lived here for 3 years -came as refugees). Since buying the store about 2 months ago, they have transformed it from a filthy dirty, scary place to a nice little store.

      I got to meet -- at last -- the family’s father. I had expected to be very formal, strictly adhering to THEIR cultural norms. Instead, I was greeted with smiles, handshakes, hugs and LOTS of laughter.

      What my friend and I left with -- and what we just finished discussing a few minutes ago -was how WONDERFUL it was in this day and age to get a dose of real, old fashioned “American” enthusiasm and “American” dream! These people work seven days a week, in 10 hour shifts. No days off, no vacations. But they are living their dream and over the moon excited to share it with me. No griping, no whining, no complaining. Sigh. It’s a Wonderful Life for the Hamidis, and God bless them, everyone. It was truly a life lesson, and one I wanted to share with you. Maybe it can give us all a little more hope.

      • choicelady says:

        Oh indeed! I have a great deal of interaction with Muslims from quite conservative to very progressive, and I adore them! You are SO right -- they embody all the “American” virtues! They are who we once were -- hard working, close-knit families and community, all the things we SAY we believe but leave on the doorstep once we finally do make it. My only problem with Muslims is my tendency to forget NOT to hug the men! (My problem, not theirs!) But I’m getting good at it. I’ve rarely met warmer or kinder people. Once I was a guest speaker at an interfaith women’s iftar (the evening meal breaking the daily fast of Ramadan) where total strangers offered to have me to their home that night! Wow. They were amazing, funny, warm, kind women. I’ve never met anyone, save one Shiite cleric, who was not outstandingly warm to me, and he was new to the country and just nervous around an American woman with no hijab. (His problem, not mine.) Indeed -- they have renewed my faith in humanity! Wonderful people!

        • kesmarn says:

          Yes, c’lady, that’s been my experience, too. Lovely, gracious people.

          One of the Muslim doctors at our hospital explained to me that there are “modesty rules” for men as well as women. And one of them (he was struggling with this, as he was making a real effort to “assimilate”) was that it was considered immodest for a man to look directly into the eyes of a woman who was not his wife. Needless to say, communicating with a nursing staff that’s 90% female while not exactly looking at them was a toughie for him…and the staff! I appreciated the fact that he took time to explain this.

          I understand that bright colors in clothing are discouraged for men as well. Wonder how those great looking Hamid Karzai rock star outfits fit in to that aspect the dress code!

          • choicelady says:

            I am struggling with Muslim customs too. I get In Focus, the periodical, and it has some fascinating ads. One was for NON silk ties that were “halal”. Well, I associate that entirely with food -- like kosher is. So I wrote a friend, a US woman convert to Islam, and said, “how can ties be halal? We don’t EAT them?” She about died laughing since halal is yes, codes of conduct. Silk is reserved for women since men are not supposed to adorn themselves, but -- women CAN. So I learned something -- and gave my friend a good laugh.

            • kesmarn says:

              Went to a Muslim sponsored unity dinner not long ago and in walked a woman in the most gorgeous head to toe silk outfit I have ever seen in my life. Beautiful pastel pinks and blue-greens with gold threads and spangles top to bottom. She paused for a moment at the top of the stairway, standing beside her husband, and every eye in the room was on her. I thought to myself: “Anyone who thinks you can’t be ‘covered up’ and still look drop-dead fabulous has never seen this woman!” It was enough to make me want to convert on the spot…just to get to wear clothes like that! 😮

      • escribacat says:

        Wonderful story, Alpha. You are so right. We are spoiled and it’s often the newcomers to our country that appreciate the opportunities here.

      • kesmarn says:

        What an encouraging story, AlphaBitch! My son teaches high school math at a local Islamic Academy and does a lot of private tutoring on the side. He is SO impressed with the way the Muslim community in America is just determined to overcome any and all obstacles: everything from mastering the language, to financial issues, to acceptance by the larger community, to getting an education…you name it. The work ethic is unbelievable. One of his high school kids just got a perfect 800 on the math section of the SATs. These kids will stay after school, study extra hours on weekends--whatever it takes--to succeed. (Of course the parents are right behind ’em, pushing all the way! But in a pretty constructive manner.) My son has been welcomed into homes, had dinner with families and is generally regarded, now, as a “brother.” It’s been a really positive experience all the way around. Do these people “get” the American Dream better than we do?

    • escribacat says:

      What a beautiful post, choicelady.

    • boomer1949 says:


      The absolute best party I was EVER invited to, attended. or felt the most accepted at was given by a custodian for my company. My fiance and I were the only, let me repeat, the only white couple in attendance. This was in the early 70’s. No one looked at us weird, the food was phenomenal, I put salt in my coffee, everyone laughed and no one called me out.

      I will never forget Mr. & Mrs. Griffith. They, their family, and friends were way ahead of the curve. I feel sorry for those who have been snookered.

      • choicelady says:

        Oh boomer -- I so understand! I have spent much of my life as the “polka dot” -- the only white person in the group. I worked with a city official, one of the greatest men EVER, and was taken in by all of his supporters and made part and parcel of every gathering. When the book, “The Secret Life of Bees” came out, I cried at the descriptions of the little girl (I was an adult, but it did not change this) feeling the warmth and inclusion of the Black women who’d taken HER in. I love August Wilson’s plays because they are so much about the men and women I’ve come to know and love. There is so much pain in the lives of the courageous people who have fought discrimination -- and there is so much love and laughter, too! I am so blessed to have had these years of their friendship and warmth and support and inclusion. It has enriched my life, and yes -- those WERE the best parties I EVER went to! I’m so glad you had that experience and cherish it.

    • Hopeington says:

      One of the reasons I can forget I don’t have a lot of money, is that I am wealthy in the things that really matter to me,
      the love of my friends and family.

    • javaz says:

      Very true, choicelady.

      I think my husband and myself are not the norm and have never been.
      We’ve never had the desire to keep up with the Jones’s.
      We were like that before we met, so we’re lucky or as I like to believe that it was FATE that we met.
      I’m a romantic.

      Way back years ago, I lost my job and was living on my own.
      I always strove for independence, and refused to move back home, even though my parents urged it.

      I lived such a simple life of sleeping on a mattress on the floor, having one chair and a small black and white TV, and a clock radio for music.
      I had old dishes and pots and pans that my mom gave me when I moved out at 18, and a car that was a broken down rust-bucket that I had to always carry a jug of water for when the radiator overflowed.

      I was very lucky and won’t go into it all, but even when I found gainful employment, and started making the BIG bucks, I’ve never shopped, shopped, shopped.

      My husband and I do not own a flat screen TV, but we do have a very nice stereo system since music is an important part of our lives.
      Oh, and we use a converter box to get TV.

      Heck, we’re still on dial up for the Internet, and do not have cable or satellite.
      We did finally get a cellphone last year, but it’s one of them that you buy the monthly minutes and they do roll over.
      I think we pay 20 bucks for 3 months.

      The furniture in our house is old and most of it belonged to my parents as do my dishes and flatware and pots and pans.

      When we visited with my in-laws at Thanksgiving, my sister-in-law is quite wealthy since she married a man who is a developer, as was his father, her and their sons were shocked that we didn’t have cable TV and laughed at us, in a good way, when we were so impressed with their cell phones.
      I mean, they can flip a thing and get a tiny keyboard on their phones and instantly log into the Internet.
      We were mightily impressed.

    • Kalima says:

      Well said choicelady. I too have met a number of wealthy people, some even well known but the thing they all had in common apart from wealth is their visible loneliness, their ruins of failed marriages and relationship on the way.

      We all need friends and I remember something that my mother said years ago, if you reach middle age and can count your real friends on one hand, the ones who would rush to your side from anywhere in the world when you are in need, then you should consider yourself lucky.

      I have seen my friends when they were generous, buying drinks for everyone, paying for everyone at the whole table after dinner and I have seen then fall and be rejected.
      You can buy “friendship” as long as you are paying and as long as you can entertain the fickle people around you but you can’t buy genuine love, no matter how rich you may be, if they believe this then they should accept the consequences.

    • TheRarestPatriot says:

      Well versed and written, Lady.
      I, too, grew up in a similar community. Working class, but mixed and we all watched out for one another. Friday night beer and sausage parties, fireworks until the cops came, and neighbors that WERE your parent if your parent wasn’t around for some reason. And if you screwed up, you knew your folks would find out, so it was best to confess right away…LOL They were also the same people that watched over me the night my mom had her 1st heart attack and I couldn’t go in the ambulance so a neighbor had to watch me. There wasn’t a question or second thought…tight knit community.

      We are all so…disconnected anymore. Distracted, displeased, and disloyal, too. Or is it that this is the new world coming and we, older folks, are just the grannies and gramps that shout at kids to get outta’ our yards? I wonder sometimes whether time has passed US by and the new, cold, impersonal society is the way of tomorrow. I certainly hope not.

      • Hopeington says:

        Ditto about the growing up part, and everyone had kids, we had 6, lots of folks had 10 or more, 4 was small. There was always someone there.
        My grandkids have to really struggle just to find kids to play with and they certainly don’t live in the neighborhood.
        When I was my son’s age, all my friends had kids, very few of his friends do.
        Civics isn’t being taught in schools any longer and I think that contributes to people not understanding the community effort it takes to be a healthy society, nor the responsibility of big business to lend a hand to the community they do business in.

      • choicelady says:

        Oh RarestPatriot -- I share your fear and I hope we’re both wrong! Impersonality is so scary. I know, as a trained historian (and you CAN try this at home) that we’ve gone through this and worse before. A century ago many of our cities watched kids starve under their noses and walked on by. Right after WW II life was golden for some, a nightmare for many -- riddled with corruption, brutality, etc. If you were Black or other minority, that’s the whole history of your experience. So some things have changed for the good, but so much has not.

        We do have choices. I choose to be a center for my friends. I choose to reach out. I still bring food to people in times of trouble. I will say that is NOT reciprocated. But I keep on doing it. I bet you do, too! (OK -- maybe not the casserole thing -but whatever you CAN do.) I still wave thank you to other drivers when they let me move over. Rarely does someone wave when I do it for them. I still do it because I keep thinking it will restore civility, so I don’t stop. We of antique values do have something to offer. I’m glad you grew up as you did. Keep on keeping on!

        • TheRarestPatriot says:

          Thank you, Lady. You’re a wise woman with a considerate and compassionate soul. I may be ‘rare’ but you, my friend, are even more rare for certain.
          Happy to count you amongst my favorite posters. I happen to think being intelligent and compassionate is a helluva’ sexy combo….LOL~

          • TheRarestPatriot says:

            Oooh…I went a little, “tiger” there…when I said ‘sexy’, I, of course, meant ‘attractive’….LOL~

            • choicelady says:

              Thank you on ANY level, TRP! Tha’t so kind of you to say! I love your posts, too, and I do now know we’ve shared similar experiences. The true comfort of growing older is to see the good and bad of life can co-exist in the same place, same time. It’s exasperating as hell, but it sure makes for an interesting ride!

  14. Kalima says:

    What happens in a marriage should remain private unless the parties choose to make it public knowledge that is. This whole Tiger thing has made me mad and then sad. The “vulture” press care more about how many women Tiger is alleged to have slept with than how many people have died this week due to lack of healthcare, how many children have died of starvation, the poverty in your own country and issues that face millions every day.

    By pursuing this man’s private life, they forgot about his wife and two small children and the impact of what they wrote, true or not, will carry consequences, and have more than likely ruined the life of this family by not allowing them the privacy to work through it by themselves.

    The women who target married men instead of finding their own are the ones I blame the most, they have always ranked on the lowest possible scale of tackiness in my opinion.

    • boomer1949 says:

      Good Day Kalima,

      Our pea brain society (at least in the US) lives and breathes this garbage. I was going to say CRAP, but was concerned AdLib would put me in “pending.” lol!

      I have a dear friend who won’t watch the nightly news (none of it) simply because it’s too depressing. Is my friend wrong? Of course not, but she is also intelligent enough to see the real world as “it turns.” She just chooses not to be sucked in to the day in and day out.

      On the other hand, there are those who live, breathe, and exist via the lives of others. By doing so, they avoid their own miserable circumstances.

      Me, on the other hand, can’t stand all the celebrity garbage. What a total waste of time. All the Entertainment Tonight, TMZ, HP (oops, did I really say that?), and any other tabloid-ish name one chooses to invent, are an insult to our intelligence. Most of us should be embarrassed, much less insulted.

    • choicelady says:

      The lonely pursing the lonelier? I think pursuing rich men for the baubles they bestow is indeed disgusting; holding out the baubles to GET the women is equally sordid. Would anyone look at Hugh Hefner if he wasn’t rich? He’s kind of creepy and always was. But underneath it all, is it not simply so pathetic? Where is the heart and fulfillment? We seem to be willing to settle for the superficial. What scares me is how attractive this seems to our youth. Ugh.

    • javaz says:

      I agree with almost everything you say, Kalima.
      This isn’t the first time the MSM focus more on celebrity and their lives -- Brittany Spears, Mel Gibson, Jon and Kate, the Octomom, etc.

      It also makes me very angry that the news opens with headlines, and touch on the Afghanistan War, the health care reform debate, the economy and then Tiger Woods.
      They go to commercial and then come back and briefly discuss one issue, such as the war and troop escalation, and then they bring in psychologists and lawyers and gossip columnists to discuss in depth Tiger Woods.

      The only point I disagree with you, even though I do find women or men who purposely pursue married people vile creatures, is that ultimately no one is to blame but the cheating spouse.

      Have you ever noticed in society that when a man strays, it’s always the other woman that’s blamed or the wife?

      Yet if a woman strays, no one ever blames the other man and no one ever accuses the husband of not seeing to his wife’s needs, but rather disparages the woman?

      It’s a double standard.

      For instance, when Mark Sanford’s wife refused to stand by her man when he tearfully admitted to being in love with another woman, and apologizing to her, his constituents and finally his wife, that there were those who were angry that his wife deserted him in his time of need?

      There were those who blamed his wife for not satisfying her man at home, so naturally he strayed.

      I’m one of the women that praised Mrs. Sanford for skipping the humiliating televised confession and apology, and am cheering her for filing for divorce.

      Yet do not doubt for a minute that there are those, the religious right wing and Limbaugh accusing Sanford’s wife of being a bitch and not a good wife, so no wonder the man cheated.

      One more thing -there are people out there, including golfers, accusing Tiger’s wife of being a gold-digger.
      They are saying she had to know what was going on, but turned a blind eye because of his money.

      Tiger is the only person responsible for this situation, even though it is none of my business, but he took the vows and make the promises and he broke them.

      • Kalima says:

        Yes the spouse is to blame javez but many men are weak when it comes to sexual attraction. We think about the consequences an affair would have on our families, they think that as long as it’s only once or a few times, it doesn’t count. I still blame the women and their total lack of compassion for the wives and often the children involved.

        Women are from Venus. Men are from Mars.

        • javaz says:

          Sorry, but that’s like the religious right, and men of any or no religion, blaming Eve for Adam’s downfall.

          Adam knew better.

          It took the devil to tempt Eve, but a mere woman to tempt Adam.

          It’s not an excuse.

          • Kalima says:

            Ok javaz, I was talking about my personal experience, I could write a book but of course I won’t.

            • javaz says:

              Oh, you should write a book!
              I’ve done it and still do it.
              I think I’ve written 32 or so stories, but not for publishing but more as a diary.
              I do it with a twist, in that I make up characters and story lines, but every character is a person that I’ve known, or know, and then I write a character that is me!
              It’s quite cathartic.

              I’ve written murder/mysteries whereby I can kill off those who have irritated me to no end and some are famous people but I change the names, and have written stories about my time in France and how hard that was, but also so enlightening and renewing for belief in mankind.

              I started writing during the OJ trial and had a football character similar and then in my story, justice was served in the end.
              When someone or something hurts me, it may take awhile before I can write about it, but it helps.

              I also include a character that is wise and gives the greatest advice, so it’s like me talking to me, but I cannot tell you how much it helps.

              It’s a hobby and I think a healthy one.

              BTW, I wrote about this exact thing years ago -- that men are weak and the Adam and Eve thing.

            • Kalima says:

              I do write and keep a diary, I’m running out of space to store them in.

              Over the years since about 15, I wrote poems but recently life got in the way. One of these days I’ll start again I’m sure but personal things are still much too painful for me, I’ll just keep them in my head.

            • TheRarestPatriot says:

              Hey, do me a personal favor, okay?
              Write a book set in the not so distant future where a real patriot gets a shot at redemption and recovers from horrible odds to find his true meaning, purpose and path in life. A great income would help as well. LOL~
              (no seriously….I believe in Karma)…LOL

        • TheRarestPatriot says:


          It’s funny you say that. I am an Aries so Mars does play a huge role in men, especially me. Yes, many men ARE weak…we are after all, visual creatures where women are intellectual creatures. I often wonder why we all get along SO well all things considered. Men were built to hunt and protect. Women were created for maternity, compassion and nation building…LOL~

          To men, an act of infidelity is a conquest of sorts. It IS easy for a man to consider it ‘nothing’, whereas a woman takes the issue much more to heart. Very few species of animals on earth practice monogamy. I sometimes think humans should just have a revolving door policy for relationships….well…maybe they do already…
          Yet, I…for reasons I haven’t figured out yet, prefer the company of another human being. I care about feelings and compassion and sharing. Many men do not. It’s a sad, but all too real weakness.

          • Kalima says:

            That is funny. I’m a Taurean with Venus as my rising star.

            When people used to ask about my relationship with my husband, I always answered that he was the bright, balloon floating towards the cosmos and I was the one on the ground holding the string to make sure that he remained out of danger of being lost forever. That was then but it still holds true after 30 years, I never tire of my job.

            • TheRarestPatriot says:

              Yeah, well…my wife decided to quit that job. Not sure I’ll ever recover from the loss. Hold onto that relationship, Kalima. Love is the only thing on earth or in our lives that matters at all.
              I’ve learned that the hardest way…

            • Kalima says:

              Sorry about your loss.

              Yes,I hold on and it becomes easier than when we were in our headstrong 20’s and 30’s. You realize that there is no way that one partner can ever change the other, you either accept that or move on.

              My husband is a Scorpio, they said we were doomed, funny how we are the only married couple left from our friends in London who married around the same time. We give each other space when needed and I really have been out of the dating game for so long, I don’t ever want to start again.

  15. boomer1949 says:

    Poor Mr. Woods Sr. — I’m sure he is spinning, spinning in his grave.

  16. TheRarestPatriot says:

    Okay, okay…If men can call older women that stalk younger guys Cougars and Pumas..

    …then it’s now only fair and appropriate to call all older men that prey on younger women…


    You heard it here 1st ! Coined and owned by ME…..LMAO~

  17. TheRarestPatriot says:

    With regards to the Tiger…thing.

    I am and have been saddened for years over the glorification of ‘Gladiators’ (athletes) and other celebrity figures that are treated like royalty and paid even more. We venerate these people, tell our kids to emulate them and then wait for the train-wreck. Firstly, there is a massive amount of people that wouldn’t EVER have even thought about golf in any way, had Tiger not come along. I mean, it’s golf, ferchrissakes~ (all my life I thought an ‘athlete’ was a player that actually broke a sweat in their sport…golf, NASCAR, beer pong…NOT SPORTS) Haha~ sorry…..

    Anyway, my point is this: When you make $100million a year JUST in endorsements…I think you’re going to be OK when your consequences demand you lose $40million of your income. (sickeningly unfathomable) Tiger isn’t upset that’s he’s losing sponsors (ooops, Accenture just dropped him, too) it’s that he got CAUGHT breaking his wedding vows and now feels like a heel. I feel bad for his kid that will grow up reliving its father’s fall from the top, over and over again. That’s not a contract you can renew.

    • javaz says:

      I’ve never understood golfers or race drivers being considered athletes either and I’ve never heard of beer-pong.

      And you are correct.
      I’ve never followed golf and only know about the famous players because they appear on TV shows, and also remember Payne Stewart -- was that his name? -- and that tragic incident.

      I hate to admit this, but I read an article the other day about what other golfers are saying about Tiger, and jeepers, some of them men are very catty.
      See, it’s not only women!
      But some say that Tiger and his bevy of babes was the best known secret in the circuit and they wonder how his wife didn’t know.

      I suppose he is paying a price concerning his reputation.
      I do believe the foreign press, especially in the UK, are even more disparaging and nasty with their articles and cartoons.

      (why do the San Diego Chargers have lightning bolts on their helmets? aren’t chargers horses?)

      • boomer1949 says:

        A friend told me this morning that his handlers “were aware” and kept it covered up — sort of.

        My friend also said the pro-golfer (from Norway I think) who actually introduced TW to his wife had no clue. He said if he had known, the introduction never would have happened.

        Maybe the foreign press is going for the jugular, but not as pointedly as Rush Limbaugh. Of course, it only shows Mr. Limbaugh’s true colors; he is, has been, and always will be a bigoted, RW Neo-Con…laughing all the way to the bank.

        And…far from making excuses…these women new exactly what they were doing…and it wasn’t for the sex.

        As I said before, Stupid is a Pre-Existing Condition.

        • javaz says:

          I think the women coming out and speaking publicly, or releasing emails and voice mail are disgusting.
          Have they no shame or dignity?

          5 minutes of fame that has destroyed a man’s life is vulgar.

          • Hopeington says:

            I found them quite disgusting, I happened to see one interview, one of them was asked if she knew he was married and if she thought that was wrong, she said yes, she wasn’t raised that way!!!
            But she did it anyway.
            I think the ease and availability of getting sex is a large contributing factor to the high divorce rates.
            It used to be women respected other women’s marriages. It was much harder to have an affair, so if you wanted sex, you better stay with your partner. Now, it’s not something that can hold a marriage together. There’s always another one some where else.

          • boomer1949 says:


            Agreed. Moreover, it reflects our society’s values. Not only did these “women” (gold-diggers) make a mint in “oh, I promise to keep quiet money,” they’re now double dipping by selling their stories to the tabloids.

      • TheRarestPatriot says:

        Yeah, I remember that Paine Stewart thing….barely. Oh god yes, men can be catty! See when you have ‘knowledge’ of another’s transgressions, it sort of elevates you to keeper of the secret and fellow manly-man. Also makes you instantly more pious and ‘better than him’ sort of thing…cause golly, YOU’D never (admit) do that sort of behavior! But like a pack of dogs when one is hurt, they just attack the wounded dog. SOMEBODY has to be Alpha dog!

        Oh,and I am not a sports guy, but I think the Chargers Bolt is a lightening (charge) kinda reference.

  18. TheRarestPatriot says:

    Holy Crap, Berlusconi just got popped in the face by an attacker! Talk about consequences!..LOL~

    • javaz says:

      Oh my gosh, that is horrible.


      I don’t like that type of behavior.
      I didn’t like the guy throwing his shoes at Bush Jr. and actually have to admit that Bush handled that incident with class.

      Also, didn’t like the guy throwing tomatoes at Palin, or the footage from Fahrenheit 9/11 showing people egging the limousine Bush was in, if that footage was real.

      • Hopeington says:

        Yikesy!! that was unpleasant. I can really relate, to say the least!!
        There is a definite unrest that needs to be addressed.
        Idleness is the devil’s playground, whether it’s the idleness from lack of jobs or the idleness of the politicians not doing enough for the people and too much for big business I don’t know, but I am concerned with this direction it seems so many are headed.

      • TheRarestPatriot says:

        Boy, ya’ know…There was time when I would have cringed at violent behavior towards these people. And I am not a person of pent up rage and violence. I just think it needs to be said that there is a growing number of people just getting fed up with not being heard or being discounted out of hand if they are heard by world leaders and the like.
        There is a growing dis-ease especially in this country that I fear is going to reach a tipping point, maybe even in our lifetime.
        I do not want violence. I just want my America back and many have learned that even voting (our only and greatest power) is subject to hijacking. A part of me wonders what, short of a revolution, is going to straighten this whole mess out.

        • javaz says:

          I understand what you’re saying, and sadly, there has always been violence in the world.

          I’ve always been a pacifist, except I’ve learned that I can get violent if it is to protect someone, or my dog, and am fairly certain now that if I were attacked and had a gun, and yes I can shoot, that I wouldn’t hesitate.

          The violence we are seeing in our country is very disturbing because it seems people are killing their families, coworkers, fellow students, guards at museums, well, they’re killing people that are innocent and had nothing to do with those who are guilty.

          (did that make sense?)

          Added note -- a very good example of the people taking their country back is the French Revolution.
          And that entire thing was brutal and savage and very unfair.

          • TheRarestPatriot says:

            Right. Well I did understand what you were getting at.
            And I have to say that it irks me to no end to see the media outlets and others simply label these killers as insane or mentally imbalanced, etc and then that’s that. We as a nation never hear the story behind the actions and I think if we did we would all have a little more compassion. Don’t get me wrong, I am not condoning or validating what they’ve done, I just think there is probably a lot of people that THINK about doing what these people did and never act on it or talk to anyone about it. Just sayin’…

            And I have referenced the French Revolt many times. And it wasn’t THAT big a of a mob at first either! I just think that Libs simply will not fight…and that disappoints me. I can tell you the Right will organize and fight ’till their ALL dead…even for the wrong reasons! If we ever did start a fight, I have the sneaking suspicion that it would end up the Right fighting the Left and not simply for the…right.

  19. KevenSeven says:

    I’m sorry. But what infraction has Tiger committed that warrants any consequences that you or I should care about?

    I’m pretty sure it is not my problem.

    • javaz says:

      We shouldn’t care, you are correct about that, but face it, if it were you or me, or another person such as a teacher, or maybe a librarian or principal, or maybe a police officer, we would pay a price.
      We might not be forced to resign by supervisors, but we might be forced to resign from the stigma.
      Heck, even Michael Phelps suffered briefly for smoking pot when Kellogg dropped him.

      You know as well as I do that there are 2 sets of standards in this country.
      The rich can and do get away with murder, whereby the average person gets thrown in prison for possession of pot, or shoplifting.

      And the article is about reputation, and not so much salary.

      If your neighbor was caught cheating on his sweet wife with multiple partners, would you forgive him so easily?
      You might say yes, because it’s none of your business, but the point is, deep down, most of us would judge that person and the average person would not have the defenders of celebrities, such as Tiger.
      We wouldn’t overlook discrepancies in the average person as we do the famous personalities and that includes politicians.

      • KevenSeven says:

        I am not convinced that he is not experiencing consequences.

        He is losing sponsorship and his wife is making him miserable.

        I think that would be about the right set of consequences, yes?

        Not that I much care.

        • javaz says:

          Oh my gosh!
          Thanks for bringing on a chuckle about his wife making him miserable.
          I’d say his wife should make him miserable.

          The thing is, when Tiger returns to the course, and he will, people will, for the most part, applaud him.

          But he’s not paying the price that you and I would, or say a teacher would.
          If a teacher were caught having numerous affairs, people would be outraged and odds are the teacher would be asked to resign.

          I suppose one could argue that Tiger Woods is his own corporation, or the boss to himself.

          You know, you are 100% correct.
          I really don’t want to know anymore about him.
          I mean, it’s not like he’s Sarah Palin.

          🙂 -- leaving you a smiley face because I know how much you like them!
          Next, I’ll be sharing stories about my dog!

          • KevenSeven says:

            Did I say I objected to his wife giving him a hard time?

            Not that I have much sympathy. He was a multi-millionaire athlete when she married him. I don’t know where she got the idea that he was going to be monogamous from.

            Insert annoying smilie face here.

          • boomer1949 says:

            Re: teachers Probably lose his/her license as well.

        • Hopeington says:

          I’ve got to agree that the consequences of losing your family and their love is a far worse consequence than losing your sponsorship.
          But…this is the only place I’ve read or commented on this Tiger situation, the news coverage has been OVER the top.
          If he’s had only one or two, he might have survived, but 13 or more??!!!
          He blew it, he’s a ho.

    • escribacat says:

      I don’t care about Tiger’s problems either but millions if not billions of dollars are made from his “squeaky clean image.” Tiger actually is paying for his infidelities now…I personally do have a problem with Michael Vick’s rehabilitated image. That jerk should still be in prison.

      • boomer1949 says:


        Ahhh…and I didn’t even attempt to toss character into the fray.

        And yes, “squeaky clean” and then some. What bothers me even more is many of those residing on top of a pedestal shirk the responsibility of their influence — especially when it comes to kids.

    • PepeLepew says:

      I think our culture’s obsession with celebrity is somehow a sign of the Apocalypse.

      When I was in California, my nieces were just fixated on TMZ and Entertainment Tonite and who was dating whom and who had broken up with whom. Half of these people I had never even heard of, and the other half I couldn’t care less who they were sleeping with.

  20. TheRarestPatriot says:

    In our society, so many are feeling so underpaid, under valued, under pressure, under educated and over worked, over burdened, over our heads in debt and far too many more are using religion to justify our own insecurities that morals are just an echo of the past.
    Boomer, what you said about Sunday chicken dinner? Similar story here,…my father once called me arrogant and ambitious, because of the way I sitting in a CHAIR! I had proper posture and he thought it was arrogant….Wow. And yes, Oddly, I have always had issues with authority. I am a renegade. In the 80s I was painfully non-conformist and much of my personality has been eroded and molded into what society tells me is ‘proper’. I am still a boat rocker to this day,..just not so much as I probably need to be.
    I once told my father that even though I was a pious, malcontent, I still led a more ethical life than most Catholics that we knew. I have been an outcast since. Now I am the last living member of my family and literally when I die, the family name ends with me.
    Not really a last laugh as it is a very non-conformist place to be…LOL~

  21. AdLib says:

    That is the price of a society that has had its democracy overrun by capitalism, there are no morals to capitalism.

    If something or someone is seen as valuable or superior from a capitalistic POV, it is.
    Celebrities are seen as superior to us mere mortals, they can do terribly unprincipled things but as long as they go on Oprah and squeeze out a few tears, showing that they have emotions just like us common folks, they are warmly embraced and forgiven.

    Now, if it was your spouse having a dozen affairs on you, or your friend’s or relative’s spouse, would you be as quick to rationalize it away?

    Americans condone a Class society, where some people are superior and expected and permitted to exhibit selfish behavior.

    Maybe they believe, “One day I’ll be rich and famous and I’d like to be able to do whatever I want to do then”.

    Add to that the media’s dependency on celebrities for revenue and the money they make in the cycle of condemnation and resurrection of them and one sees the capitalistic pressure to eventually make most any transgression something other than absolute.

    • escribacat says:

      “…there are no morals to capitalism.” That says it all.

    • boomer1949 says:


      That’s just it. Personally, I don’t rationalize any of it away. Right, wrong, indifferent or otherwise, it’s stupid.

      Our society has been trained to be stupid or at least intimidated into being stupid.

      I’ll never forget the day my mother told me she believed I thought I was better than the rest of the family. Why? Because I went to college; big deal. So what?

      Somewhere in her pea brain, she saw an emerging nonconformist; someone who asked questions; someone who didn’t show up for fried chicken every Sunday because that’s what the rest of the family had done for 100 years.

      To all of them, I was a traitor and the black sheep. To this day I don’t get it. Okay, yes I do. My change made them uneasy, made them wonder about themselves. It was too much to handle so they opted out…opted me out.

      • PepeLepew says:

        Don’t get me going on my dad….

        • escribacat says:

          I’m interested (being the incorrigibly nosy person that I am).

          • PepeLepew says:

            It’s a very, very long story. 🙂 Essentially dad just couldn’t stand the idea of his kids actually having minds of their own.

            • boomer1949 says:

              OMG — me too! Man, they screwed up an entire generation.

              Of course I suppose my kids will be telling me the same thing in 20 years — probably while I’m on my deathbed 🙂

            • escribacat says:

              Pepe, your dad could be my oldest brother (the one who listens to Limbaugh). That’s EXACTLY what he has been ranting at my niece and nephew (his kids) their entire lives.

            • PepeLepew says:

              My parents weren’t anti-education, but they sent contradictory messages that schools were somehow brainwashing up. Dad would rail at the dinner table that the schools were turning kids into a bunch of bleeding heart liberals and teaching them lies about Martin Luther King, the civil rights movement, racial equality, etc. He was obsessed with the idea of liberal schools and teachers ruining his kids … and I continue to see that same mentality on Internet forums to this day.

        • boomer1949 says:

          Oh my goodness…I feel your pain 😉

      • escribacat says:

        Boomer, what you said about your mother really hit home with me. I will never forget the day I was wearing a sweatshirt from my grad school and my mother accused me of “showing off.”

        • boomer1949 says:

          What is it with that? Not with the specific incident, but with the preconceived notion?

          • escribacat says:

            Boomer, I was floored when my mother said that to me. I had always assumed she was proud of me that I managed to get two degrees without any help from them. At that moment I realized she was jealous. It was horrible.

            • boomer1949 says:


              you’ve got mail 🙂

            • kesmarn says:

              Did we all have the same childhood?
              The message I got was: be smart; but not smarter than I am!

            • escribacat says:

              Kes — YEP!!! “Do not evolve beyond me!”

            • PepeLepew says:

              I try to always maintain the attitude of “what can my kid teach me?” Kids can teach you a lot if you just listen to them.

            • kesmarn says:

              LOL! My kids are a lot smarter than I am, and my reaction is: Thank God!

              This is a helluva world in which to be dumb.

              Unless you’re from Wasilla.

            • boomer1949 says:

              I think so my dear, I think so.

  22. kesmarn says:

    Boomer, this is an interesting question.

    I think American culture is bipolar on this. There are some groups that are presumed okay for public ridicule: Octomom, the Pope, and any celebrity who has gained weight come to mind.

    But I also believe that--for better or worse-- there’s a lot of covert admiration for Tiger Woods. (“Eleven mistresses and counting! Whatta guy!”) Of course nobody wants to come out publicly and admit this. Which says even more about American culture.

    As in, for starters: How much is enough?

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