• AdLib : Night all, have a great weekend!

  • AdLib : Murph, so true. The RW nutjobs have so overcommitted to this strategy of demonizing Obama that they have nowhere to go but this insanity. They are so over now.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Well….good night…closing up tonight.

  • AdLib : Murph – so tr

  • MurphTheSurf3 : I wanted to make one more point. Look at the NewTown Truthers who are saying that Obama is either behind the shootings or behind the fiction of the shootings ALL in order to defeat the 2nd Amendment. Is there any low to which the O Haters will not go…I do not think so.

  • SallyT : And, I am done Murph.

  • SallyT : I took a potty break!

  • MurphTheSurf3 : I got bounced off the site 10 minutes ago. Are we done?

  • AdLib : Sorry all, a bit of a server issue there!

  • SallyT : And conspiracy theories were born!

  • choicelady : AdLib – I think I mentioned that a friend has a friend who is SS. He told my friend that the death threats are SO AWFUL the Obamas finally said for them NOT to tell them what has been said. Tell them what to do and not do – but never why. They couldn’t bear it. Remember how the Obamas had “date night”? They never do that anymore. They can’t. How incredibly sad.

  • AdLib : CL – I don’t think Obama could be more hated by the RW nutjobs than he already has been. Yes, the gun control thing could push a little bit more on these loons but from the beginning, Obama has been getting death threats each day and we’ll never hear about the kooks the SS have scared off or arrested along the way. They know there’s a real threat out there against him, I think the SS will be up to the task of keeping him safe.

  • SallyT : Those are the people I worry about CL. The Religious Right.

  • choicelady : Sally – the reason people don’t trust their government began on the Grassy Knoll. All the lies. All the things that followed – Gulf of Tonkin, WMD. It’s weird that the hype is MOSTLY on the Right, but the fact of distrust is real.

  • SallyT : And, Vietnam followed. More mistrust.

  • choicelady : AdLib – if you want a major creep out, the mystery stories written by Margaret Truman actually talk about the hidden, shadowy figures on the Religous Right behind major plots. She was well enough placed to have heard things we never will. Her last book before her death dealt with that very issue. It was written exactly as I’d imagined a plot would unfold. VERY scary.

  • SallyT : I do believe that we lost our innocence that day. It lead to doubt and mistrust.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Choice- yes, your observation about Reagan and Bush being personally influential after leaving office has not been great but I think that is as much a function of how they were created (as in the case of Bush) or recreated (for Reagain) by those who are the standard bearers of a certain ideology/philoso phy. Obama will be seen as the author of a new approach….or the leader in the resurgence of older one

  • choicelady : AdLib – And I grow MORE worried every day. His strength is EXACTLY what goads the zealots into acting. And it’s not the people you see. It’s the ones you do NOT see who scared the bejeezus out of me. I will always think that “The Family” was behind JFK, MLK, RFK. Always.

  • choicelady : Sally – I was walking home from high school- we had half days – and heard from another student. I remember asking myself if this was the end of America. I think it was. Now, all these years later, we have a chance at renewal. I pray it does not get shattered again.

  • SallyT : rifle

  • AdLib : CL – I am actually growing less and less concerned for Obama’s safety as he grows stronger with each success. For some reason, it seems to make him appear less vulnerable.

  • SallyT : CL, I have those same fears. I remember a warm day and a handsome President with a beautiful wife in an open convertible. The country changed with a rife.

  • choicelady : BTW – Rachel’s coverage of abortion providers tonight brough it all back to me. I could barely watch. I know some of those folks she mentioned – and others unseen. So many people hurt, killed, maimed. It was very hard to watch.

  • choicelady : I think we are all in agreement about him and his ability to be transformational . Given my own sordid history though, I wake up every morning, turn on the news, and pray for happy talk, idiocy, and no bad news. I will never stop being afraid for him and his family.

  • AdLib : As I believe Obama will be seen as a great and transformational President as more time goes by, his keeping OFA rolling could be a living legacy with a lot of influence, something we really haven’t seen before in this way.

  • choicelady : I saw some montage around OFA today that had sign after sign ‘FIRED UP!’ and ‘READY TO GO!’ I thought that was wonderful. That one woman from NC he talked about has created a new energy for us ALL. And he has embraced her chant as his own – marvelous. Cannot remember any president taking something from a constituent that way before. He is the LEAST elitest person in the WH in my lifetime. And we understand that and love him for it. He makes this be about us, the people. Marvelous!

  • SallyT : And, I believe that those same people will make sure that he keeps hearing them. He goes out to them and they will come to him. They will hold him and push him and he will succeed because of that.

  • SallyT : I believe that the President spent so much time out on the campaign trail this last time among the people. He saw them stand in line for hours to vote for him. The emotions that he has shown of late leads me to believe that he wants to give back to them as much if not more than they gave to him. He shows his feelings more now because they are closer to the surface and he wants all to know he is on a mission. He wants them to know he heard them.

  • AdLib : Murph – Yes, Obama does seem to envision an ongoing influence and contribution to this nation which is very cool!

  • choicelady : Murph – I agree about Clinton as a person, but I think Reagan and Bush W. had a different kind of endurance. The presence of the Religious Right that was fixated on corporate power has left a structural presence we have to destroy. OFA as a system to create enduring change is both far more transparent AND transformative than what now lingers from the long, sordid past of the GOP. These long waves – 1980-2012 – of RW politics are beginning to change. Obama as a very public figure coupled with OFA will be a major force for change as FDR and the New Deal were.

  • AdLib : CL – The pundits just recycle their “conventional thinking”, as you say, because something happened a couple of times in the past, of course it will always happen that way (remember Chris Matthews stating as a fact that Obama could not win unless unemployment was under 7%?). Obama can indeed continue to achieve remarkable gains for Americans and his legacy despite the pundits BS.

  • SallyT : Reagan at the end of his term didn’t know where he was or did he care.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Choice and CL….add to your assessment of the Obama 2nd term is his apparent intention to create a more lasting presence in the politics of the nation. OFA. It is as if Obama is seeing himself as one of those figures who can transform political philosophy (much as Clinton has emerged as a dominant figure in ways that neither of the Bush’s or Reagan did)

  • choicelady : Sally – LOL!!!

  • SallyT : I don’t know if Clinton dropped the ball but there were balls involved. However, Bush exploded all the balloons!

  • choicelady : Sally – It occurs to me that people miss the point about the second term. It’s not ‘lame duck’ as much as it is freedom to do what one wants. Bush and Clinton dropped the ball (Clinton’s was self inflicted over Monica) but Obama will run with it!

  • SallyT : That should have been any not and but you got it, CL.

  • choicelady : Sally – BEAUTIFULLY said!

  • SallyT : He is not running for office and more. He is now running the office.

  • choicelady : Sally – And what an inaugural present this gives him!