In the heaven of Indra, there is said to be a network of pearls, so arranged that if you look at one you see all the others reflected in it. In the same way, each object in the world is not merely itself but involves every other object and in fact is everything else.

Here’s an idea.  The universe is contained in our consciousness.  That is to say, the relationship between one’s physical brain and one’s mental brain is a model for how the universe relates to itself.  The interface between the physical brain and non-physical mind is the universe’s mirror it uses to “see” itself.

Still too vague?

The physical brain is also made up of the very particles which obey the  laws of quantum physics.  The subatomic particles all have their anti-matter “dancing partners” with whom they dance so well they appear to be contained within one another.   May it not be then said that the physical brain also has a corresponding dancing partner in the form of consciousness?  “Units of consciousness” like thoughts, memories, feelings, perceptions (called  “psychons”) also have their corresponding units of the material brain (called “dendrons). These elements are not separate and discrete from one another.  They, too, dance in a matrix of instantaneous nuclear  dance reactions; in  a matrix which extends throughout the universe.

What that means is:  Each seemingly spatially separate part of the universe is instantaneously correlated with every other part of the universe.  Like Indra pearls.

Of course, there is this world we actually DO see.  We  measure it all the time when we quantify most anything in the concrete world.  We can do that because there are spatial differences between the concrete objects in the everyday world.  They can be related to one another linearly.  The apple that fell on Newton’s head is an example of this.  It fell down.  The apple had a beginning location (tree)  and an end location (Newton’s peruke).  Most all of the advances in technology exist grace to Newton and the giants that both preceded him and succeeded him.  But there is a hidden world as well, a dimension which is implied and not exposed or “implicate” and not “explicate”.

The physicist David Bohm came up with an excellent analogy of what he called the visible world which may represent the physical brain (explicate) and the hidden world of consciousness (implicate).  Here it is paraphrased:

Consider a large cylindrical glass container of glycerin mounted on a turntable. One places a spot of black ink in the glycerine.  The  container is slowly rotated, and the ink gradually disperses throughout the glycerin. If one then slowly rotates the cylinder in the opposite direction the spot of ink gradually re-forms. When the ink is dispersed it is in an implicate state: it exists throughout the glycerine. When the ink is a spot it is explicate: it exists in one part of the glycerine but not in the other parts. If one continues rotating the cylinder in this opposite direction the spot disperses again.

One can expand upon this.  One  places the spot of ink as before and slowly rotates the cylinder one revolution, and the ink again has begun to disperse. Then one places a second spot of ink just beside where the first spot was, and rotates for one more revolution. A third spot is placed beside where the second was, one more revolution, and one continues this for a few spots. Then one continues slowly rotating the cylinder until all the ink is fully dispersed throughout the glycerin. When one reverses the direction of rotation one sees the last spot coalesce, then the next to last one right beside the last one, and so on. One could interpret what one is really seeing is a single spot of ink that appears to be moving. So in the implicate fully dispersed state,  the appearance of motion is enveloped  in the space and time of an object as it exists throughout the glycerin.

In classical physics, humans mirror the objects of the every day world.  They observe it. They are able to do so since they are spatially separated from those objects.   In biological systems this classical interpretation prevails as  quantum principles are not largely accepted.  Most scientists still operate in the explicate and linear  Newtonian world when it comes to things like the brain and consciousness.  Indeed in the whole of the rest of the body as well.  Consciousness in this model is seen as merely a “byproduct” of the spatially distinct elements of the functioning brain.  Consciousness is only an epiphenomenon, an accidental companion.  It is odd that although there are quantum physics and quantum chemistry, quantum biology which is a constellation of physics and chemistry  is not seen as possessing quantum behaviors.

Old notions of “God” are based on that linear, reductionistic, deterministic model that if one were to tease out all the minute particulars it will lead somehow to an understanding of the bigger picture (my personal belief is that most scientists have a degree of obsessiveness and that attention to detail gets them lost in the minutae) and that there is a mechanical, spatially separated God behind some cosmic curtain making things move in locations, making judgments, admitting people to heaven, casting people into hell or the junk drawer that is purgatory.   A newer notion would be:  It’s not mechanical at all but much more magical and miraculous in that “God” exists in all places at all times, i.e. “non-local”,  reflecting all places at all times through the mirror of quantum physics.

It is the mirror of quantum physics that one is able to see the self both as a physical entity with all the attributes therein  and mentally- consciously  in the larger setting of the universe as a whole… instantaneously.

Just a thought.

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AdLib
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Wonderful post, Q, makes the spots of ink spin in my glycerin.

I find this area of exploration fascinating, the convergence of thought and the material universe.

Several thoughts this brings to mind, ones which I often enjoy pondering.

How does the physical makeup of our brains (chemical balances, its ongoing actions controlling the body’s functions, etc.) influence thought and perception? Going in one direction, are the lives that people live, the choices that they make, possibly dominated by the physical state of the brain and not free will as much as it may feel like it? And if so, will my brain be pissed off at me for spilling the beans?

In other words, are human beings truly exercising free will in their lives or does the physiology of their brain predetermine the life and choices one is likely to make for oneself?

Self determinism vs. fatalism and all that.

The concept of the physiological invisibly influencing thought and vice versa is scientific and at the same time, kind of magical. We know that certain chemical imbalances can cause all kinds of mental conditions and personality issues. We also know that thoughts can cause changes to our physiological condition (i.e., worrying can cause ulcers, high blood pressure, etc.).

Add to that the proposition that the mere perception of something can change it and we again explore the fascinating aspects of thought and the material universe colliding. Can that affect our brains, if we become more aware of what it is doing, would that change it and thus change who we are?

And if so, would we need to get a new driver’s license?

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KQµårk 死神
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Now this is my kind of post. Excellent topic to ponder. I don’t have anything clever to say. I guess I’m just “talked” out.

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choicelady
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Hi KQ – good to hear from you! Hope things are OK? We’ve missed you. And therein lies the beauty of Ques’s deep and beautiful post. What there is about missing someone you don’t even know in person, the capacity to care about someone unseen, the capacity to care at ALL, is elusive, indeterminate, and NOT capable of reductionism. So yes, KQ – all my synapses lit up when I saw your name and knew you were back in discussion with us – happy and eager to read what you say – but how does that get explained, any of it?

Love, compassion, caring, humor – these are “useless” aspects of purely physical life. Animals can and do have young about which they care not at all, just tend, sometimes kill and even eat, but for which they do not feel the same things we do. Reductio ad absurdum to say that friendship, fellowship, common purpose, shared ideas and the joy from that are merely some kind of bio chemistry.

God IS in our minds. I’ve never liked the cranky Santa figure at all because it’s so limited. When the Bible says it is a “jealous God” – what a pissant that would make GOD! God lives in the details of emotions, caring, and that boundry we inhabit between the rationality of Newton and the chaos of quantum mechanics.

Anger, fear, etc. MAY be biochemical survival mechanisms for fight or flight. But how does one explain the human drive for the positive emotions that add cultural but NOT survival dimensions. Therein, IMHO, lies God. The best we are, can be, can project, can perfect and what we SHARE. Art, beauty, intentional kindness, civilization at its best. All of us when we work in concert toward something good – there is God.

The dominionist and fundamentalist views of God are shameful – it’s so base and demeaning to think God is nothing more than our animal instincts. Why do we pray and give thanks? Because it’s good to do so even if our language and image skills become antropomorphic. Hard to pray to a wisp, but thanks itself – gratitude for what we’re given – there is God.

Someday we will break the yoke of narrow reality, of God created in our own image, of holiness that is just a list of rules. We will be one with the world around us and with one another, not all the same but all honoring our differences, and being joyful in our varied contributions. First Nations people may be closer to the truth than we. Too bad we listened too little, learned too little, paid attention perhaps too late.

At the boundaries of everything that merges, of infinity and eternity and great human emotions – where all of that intersects, there is God.

So welcome back KQ – my happiness to see you is a tip of my and God’s hat to you. Welcome back!

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KQµårk 死神
Member

Oh ChoiceLady it’s always lovely reading your commentary and I miss you and all the folks.

I’m doing fine just consider me on summer holiday. My body, brain and spirit simply needs some rest.

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dildenusa
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I love your Fractals. And an excellent post also.

and that there is a mechanical, spatially separated God behind some cosmic curtain making things move in locations, making judgments, admitting people to heaven, casting people into hell or the junk drawer that is purgatory.

We’re off to see the wizard, the wonderful wizard of …

So then I looked up L Frank Baum on wikipedia – http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L._Frank_Baum
and it said he was born to a Methodist family but then turned to Theosophy in 1897. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theosophy
A little too much dogma for me. It’s interesting that Baum was a dedicated republican and supported McKinley in the 1896 election.

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whatsthatsound
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One of Pete Townshend’s more profound lyrical statements, from “Tommy”, and relevant to this article, I feel.

If I told you what it takes to reach the highest high, you’d laugh and say nothing’s that simple;
but you’ve been told many times before, messiahs pointed to the door,
no one had the guts to leave the temple.

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kesmarn
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Much more than “Just a Thought,” Q!

I’ve always suspected that physics, mathematics, biology and theology might have a big happy reunion one day.

I used to love the concept that was put forward in theology classes of God as a Being both “immanent and transcendent.” His presence being as intimate as the very electrons of our bodies and as vast and “other” as the furthest reaches of the universe.

Paul Tillich, the Lutheran theologian, used the wonderful term: “Ground of all Being”. He rejected what he termed “theological theism,” which implied that God was the highest of all beings. He intuited that this was a fundamentally false notion, which contained within itself the seeds of atheism. He stated that the concept of God in theological theism….

deprives me of my subjectivity because he is all-powerful and all-knowing. I revolt and make him into an object, but the revolt fails and becomes desperate. God appears as the invincible tyrant, the being in contrast with whom all other beings are without freedom and subjectivity. He is equated with recent tyrants with the help of terror try to transform everything into a mere object, a thing among things, a cog in a machine they control. He becomes the model of everything against which Existentialism revolted. This is the God Nietzsche said had to be killed because nobody can tolerate being made into a mere object of absolute knowledge and absolute control. This is the deepest root of atheism. It is an atheism which is justified as the reaction against theological theism and its disturbing implications.

My understanding of the meaning of the name “Yahweh” (which I’m told is a word not meant to be pronounced or translated, really) is that the closest approximation might be “I am Who (or What) am.” Whatever human initially figured that one out was really on to something, don’t you think?

P.S. Your graphics are perfect.

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whatsthatsound
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I have also heard it translated as “I am that I am”, which can sound like nonsense, but on the other hand it can reveal something profound. It’s like God is saying, I need to exist (as many, as physical matter, as separated identities, etc.) so that I can exist AT ALL! In other words, only by exploring the physical experience can God have awareness about Itself. I like that interpretation, because it jibes perfectly with what the ancient Indian spiritualists taught in the Vedas.

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bito
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Also translated to “Skydaddy.”

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whatsthatsound
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by Bill Maher.

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bito
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Never heard that from Bill Maher, heard /read that from these guys:

Thomas Cathcart and Daniel Klein, co-authors of “Heidegger and a Hippo Walk Through Those Pearly Gates.”

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bito
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k’es, tonight on “All Things Considered” there is a segment being previewed on a secret code in Plato’s writing. It proports that math and religion are intertwined. Blasphemy then and now. 😉
http://www.npr.org/

Now, will I remember to listen to it?

Or is it all in your head?

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=110997741

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kesmarn
Admin

B’ito, I hope that segment will be archived, so I can listen to it later, because — irony of ironies — I’ll be at church when it’s on here! (Although there IS the option of headphones — teehee… :lol:)

Gonna hafta run for the moment, but hope to check back in later! Wish I could stay home all day today!

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bito
Member

k’es it is.

“Plato’s philosophy shows us one way to combine science and religion,” Kennedy says. “The culture wars we’re having today

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whatsthatsound
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Very nice, very interesting, Q! I completely agree with you that the Newtonian, mechanistic predilection of science forces it into an unnecessary battle of sorts with what we NOW consider paranormal. For example, because the Newtonian, Darwinian mindset is dead set against crediting what it considers “woo woo” with any type of authenticity, it has to make all these unnecessary rationalizations and excuses for things that DID, in fact happen. Like Fatima. Fatima happened. We don’t know what, exactly, happened there. Nor do we have to concede that, since something happened there, therefore the Bible is “true” and Christianity must be the only true religion. Baloney! We don’t have to believe anything like that. Neither do we have to glibly assert, as Richard Dawkins does, that people all looked up in the sky for a while, which they shouldn’t have, so they all experienced some kind of optical malfunction.
Um…they ALL did? And saw the same thing? And a thing that is not usually associated with looking at the sun too long?
So Dawkins and people like him throw out the whole event, because they are only capable of seeing it one of two ways:
A. ) The Christian religion is completely accurate, and the Christian God made a miracle happen that day.
Or
B.) Nothing out of the ordinary happened, certainly nothing that current science is incapable of explaining.
In fact, those two options should be more like A and Z! There are lots of other possibilities to be considered when considering Fatima, “haunted” houses, instances of partial xenoglossy, reincarnation memories, near death and out of body reportage, etc. etc.
That “B to Y” can be found in the type of universe you are writing about, I feel.

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