Are you an intellectual snob, and turn your nose up and close your mind and ears when it comes to Sarah Palin?
Do you think that we, us Democrats and Liberals, should not give her the time of day, because that somehow justifies her existence?
She’s had her five minutes of fame, you say, and don’t give her credence by continually talking about her and making her relevant.
NEWSFLASH
Sarah Palin is relevant, with her thousands of followers lining up and even spending the night for her arrival at bookstores or Costco’s for her book signings.
Democrats and Liberals, and yes, even Republicans laugh at her, but she has thousands of followers and believers and we should not brush her off as fluff.
Yes, she is fluff, but not to her followers, and her followers are the teabaggers.
Teabaggers are folks, young and mainly old, that are disenfranchised by the system that gives our money to Wall Street instead of Main Street.
Teabaggers are the gun toting, right-to-lifers, but more, they are regular, middle class Americans that are angry.
Aren’t we all angry?
Is it fair for the entitled, the elite to reap such benefits from the government, while the rest of us suffer and struggle?
Yes, Sarah is one of them, but like Ronald Reagan, she has folks fooled in thinking that she is a maverick, and more in line with common Americans that are just trying to get by when it comes to our government.
She portrays the anti-thesis of our elected officials and Supreme Court that are on the side of the rich and corporations.
Are we so much different than the teabaggers when it comes to everyday life?
Yes, they are racists, or so the media makes it appear.
Yes, they are anti-choice, or so the media makes it appear.
Yes, they hate homosexuals, or so the media makes it appear.
Yes, they are against powerful women, yet they support Sarah Palin, who is a wife and mother and powerful in her own right.
We’re not that far apart when it comes to the things Sarah Palin appears to stand for when it comes to her followers.
We have more in common than differences, and that’s a hard pill to swallow.
We Democrats and Liberals do have an elitist attitude, whereby we shun those who follow and admire Sarah, and urge Sarah to ‘Run, Sarah, Run.’
But when it comes down to the basics, we have more in common with her followers than we like to admit.
Oh, yes, she’s a liar, and has her followers fooled, but we should listen to those who follow her, not for their love of Sarah, but for what they are saying.
We all agree that the rich among us are getting the government handouts, while we pay.
We, the working class, have seen our wages stagnate, while corporations have never seen such profits.
We, the working class, see our benefits fly out the window due to greed, while we struggle to pay for health insurance.
We, the working class, see our country’s deficits grow for wars, while we slave away to make ends meet.
We really have no differences of opinion when it comes to the teabaggers and Sarah Palin followers.
That’s what people are angry about – it’s the disconnect between Washington DC and we the people.
We, who are Democrats and Liberals and we know the MSM sucks big time and favors the corporations, but we are not as smart as we think.
They are playing us, too, with the divisiveness, in leading us Democrats and Liberals to believe it’s all about race or a woman’s choice, or gay marriage.
We are all being played.
Stop and take a minute to listen to the people.
We are not as divided as the government or the MSM makes us out to be.
We have more in common with the teabaggers than is portrayed, and it’s time for us all to unite and stand against the corporations.
I thank you all more than you will ever know for your replies.
But remember that a house divided will never stand.
http://showcase.netins.net/web/creative/lincoln/speeches/house.htm
I must submit this as well:
Before there were Democrats and Republicans…
Before there were Socialists and Fascists and Communists…
There were people…trying to make there way in life.
The things we ALL rail against are:
Injustice
Poverty
Inequality
Selfishness
Hubris, greed, corruption, etc.
Betrayal
…and the like…
These things have nothing to do with political affiliation or even education…Yet we’ve been taught that. Divide and conquer…still at work today….
I think that, at end of the day, most of us realize there is a serious problem growing in our Republic. Most of us feel as though there is nothing one person can do to stem the tide of corruption, hubris and cannibalistic capitalism; not to mention the political chaos. We Libs feel that education somehow insulates us and our opinions from the great unwashed and that is what creates this class-gulf. Many without higher education see US as THEM, typically because it’s the educated peoples that take advantage of and harm, them. I’m not suggesting this is factual where WE are concerned, yet the even HIGHER educated than WE need to create this gulf as a buffer. And they have perfected and perpetuate this strategy. For any of us to start pointing fingers at this president or that president (or Representative) is simply playground behavior of ignorant children. We all know this, but revert to this ideology because it’s easy. Until all of us can agree that the common enemy is the enemy of ALL of us, there will be no real change….only generation after generation fearing and loathing fellow Americans (Dems,Repubs,Indeps, etc, etc) and not the true enemy of the people. The government knows that as long as they keep us all at each other’s throats…we won’t all march for them.
I don’t think “the people” have a common enemy. And I’m not really sure who “the people” are in your scenario.
Teabaggers, to me, are an angry group of people who are being very dishonest about why they’re angry. It’s difficult to address grievances when we don’t know what they really are. If they were able to articulate clearly what they see as the problem, then maybe there would be room for a conversation. Until then, it’s useless to try to deal with their “issues.”
As far as education goes, I don’t see it as the divider that you describe. Education gives people understanding of the way their world works — when it’s done correctly. I agree that people who are well educated are able to take advantage of the system for their own selfish purposes — and selfish people will do that. The well educated also take advantage of the system to provide for others who have not been as fortunate. In the form of public schools, safety nets, grants, scholarships, food banks — any number of services that help people get on the road to being better educated and doing a better job of providing for themselves. Well educated people have been making this country better since it started. Along with people who have no education. Good people tend to do good things — whether they are well educated or have no education.
Well Nellie, the ‘people’ I refer to are us. We the people….citizens of the Republic. Sadly, you were able to simplify and demonstrate my point perfectly by including descriptive qualifiers such as ‘they’ and ‘they’re’, etc….If a citizen is unable to attend college, decides not to attend college or thinks that there is a national/global conspiracy to create a Socialistic America, doesn’t make them a ‘they’, it simply means these citizens have differing ideas than other citizens. Feelings cannot…ever…be ‘wrong’. No more than Liberal feelings are ‘correct’. Or educated people’s opinions hold more value. I assure you that the very poor in this nations can teach ALL of us a thing or two about survival and hard times. You see, hard times rarely effect the very poor because they are perpetually poor. My point was that until we drop this culture-snobbery…nothing is accomplished. I am not defending ignorance, nor am I elevating degree holders to prophet level. (as I know plenty of college attenders that have a difficult time remembering basic algebra) We are a nation of humans with dreams, aspirations and needs. We are a collective force. We should not be a divided citizenry. We DO have more in common than most of us will ever know.
I totally get what you’re saying. And, what I notice on HP alot, is people (including me – but usually for ulterior reasons) attack people who haven’t gone to college, or are sincer but not wel-informed. Granted, I’ve been burned by some sneaky, disingenuous trolls taking advantage of my good nature, but I still hold that we need more Democrats – and this is what Clinton was so great at, Biden to a lesser extent – that can speak their language. What really irks me about the Teabag movement is the way they’ve usurped this message, and how ass-backwards they get their positions (No socialized medicine – don’t take away my Medicare). And how they’ve taken an anxiety and resentments we all feel, hijacked it, and woven it in with Birther and abolish taxes hogwash.
Planet Talk is beginning now, please join us!
Click here to go there now:
http://planetpov.com/live-events/vox-populi/
Just for the record, I can’t post a comment there, so see you later.
I’ve met the teabaggers. They are deranged hate mongering racist assholes.
keven, I gotta say, I love your unabashed talk — especially when I agree with it.
Thank you. They are thugs.
Javez,
I’m glad you put this out there. Progressives should not be afraid to look at the mechanics of that “bagger movement”.
The baggers are getting the wrong buttons pushed by the wrong people.
Progressives see the hate and fear being ginned up on that side and can get dismissive about some of these issues like banking/CEO pay etc
Could this discord be helping out the banking lobbyist?
When they put away the signs showing our president with a bone through his nose… maybe then I’ll pay attention to them.
I posted a link that photo one time for a troll who insisted there was no racism going on at the teabagger parties and they continued to insist that that image was not racist. I was incredulous. I said, “If you genuinely don’t see the racism in that image than it is a complete and utter waste of my time to talk to you.”
You know, that might have been true whether he saw racism in the photo or not. 🙂
The bottom line with Sarah Palin and teabaggers is that they are trying to divide America even more. Obama has been reaching his hand out since he’s been president and for his efforts he’s been called a terrorist, Hitler and a Socialist. Sure I want to get the country back together but it’s the teabaggers that want to maintain the cold civil war. When you talk about joining with these people and finding common ground they have to be willing to join you which I just don’t see right now.
I believe the true “Teabaggers” are the now visible element of the worst of America, they have a sizeable racist attitude, which of course they deny, they don’t like any religion other than “regular” Christianity, they certainly have no belief that anyone different than themselves is acceptable, especially in sexual orientation, and they have no concept of how the government works or what it is doing for them, nor do they want to know.
I know both “ordinary” conservatives and Teabaggers, and the Teabaggers make me want to sleep lightly and mantain my 2nd Amendment rights in order to feel safe from them.
Hey – watch that “regular” Christianity stuff! In fact they are newbies – their point of view is quite recent. However, they are absolutely NO different form the people who accused men and women of witchcraft in Salem in the 1960s. Why? Same reason – the independent province of MA had suddenly become a colony under an alien governor. The autonomy they had cherished was gone. How to explain, since British sailors brought STDs, gambling, prostitutes, etc., how their lives had deteriorated? Well, witchcraft was a serious belief of the time. Today it’s feminists, abortion rights people, pro-GLBTQ equality. As the colonists could not bring themselves to blame the King, so today’s people cannot bring themselves to blame the free market. So in both cases – scapegoats. Fill in the blank on who that should be.
I find Sarah, in her best Mom and Wife mode, quite charming and pretty. I think she’s a beast of a human being, but she DOES make people think, as W did, that she’d be a public leader you could sit down and have a drink with. Of course, the people you CAN do that with you really don’t want running the country, but it’s important to think you’re heard. I do think Obama has that capacity – to hear us – but when scapegoating gets in the way, we can’t see our best salvation might come from someone different from us rather than identical to us, at least superficially. Sarah would sell out each and every supporter. Obama won’t. But we’re not yet intelligent enough in this crowd to understand that.
Maybe time will reveal the truth. We will have to see. But we do need to understand not Sarah – but the angst among those who love her. That’s important.
Great historical analogy with the Salem witch trials. Most people don’t realize that another thing that spawned the Salem witch trials were bad harvests just like the bad economy is spurring on these teabaggers.
I have been around politics awhile. My first national campaign was for JFK. I have never seen governing this uncivil. It has always been adversarial, which it should be.
But now it is very uncivil!
Edit: during the civil rights fights, yes, it did get bad.
I’m the same vintage, bitohistory. I agree. I think to understand where we are, we all do need to read Jeff Sharlet’s “The Family” because I believe in my bones that they were behind JFK, MLK,Jr., and RFK to name but a few. That’s certainly not IN the book – but it would explain a whole lot of things. These people want the Sarah’s of the world because they can manipulate her, because by focusing on the small ideological hot button issues she keeps us OFF the big ones such as the imperialist raping and pillaging of developing nations – and our own. She’s their perfect foil.
We do need to understand what people who are on the thin edge see IN her, too. It’s the hope that government would be your friend. She is not the answer, but she appears to be. Read “It Can’t Happen Here” by Sinclair Lewis. Demogogues have always been the working person’s best buddy. At the start…
She’s a dangerous person, but I do think she’s venal enough that most people get her selfishness pretty quickly. She cares nothing for her citizens, only for herself, and you can’t keep that hidden forever.
I hope.
Exactly it’s the volume of incivility that is the problem. You can’t solve problems with both sides shouting each other down.
Also you have to separate what was going on with the very uncivil reaction to the civil rights movement in segments of the country and the large scale incivility we are dealing with today.
How many times did Sarah451 say she was happy to be speaking in “real America”?
Fuck her.
I loved Sarah Vowell’s comment about that when she noted, as one living in NY City, that if NY was America enough for bin Laden, it should be America enough for Palin.
Can’t say it better.
Damn straight.
Javaz: Thank you for composing such a provocative article, but I must insist that my Universe is very different than that of SP and her minions. As for the teabaggers, they stand only for their particular brand of selfishness.
You’ve got to set aside what you hear about them from the MSM.
I live with them as neighbors and friends.
me too. I have a dear friend who is white, 80 years old, fit as a fiddle and is 100% for McCain/Palin, Insannity and obviously Republican. The thing is, when you meet her, she is such a delight, a gracious, intelligent woman who has astounded me with this revelation (which was months ago). I don’t love her less but it is difficult for me because when I like someone, I assume they and I should be on the same page about most important matters. We have dinner every Wednesday nite with several other friend and guess what? They too are republicans. We tease quite a bit but I have enjoyed their company for so long, and respect them that I would never wish to end our friendship. I have had to come to terms with agreeing to disagree and respecting opposing opinions, and moving along.
I know many fine racists as well that are perfectly amicable…unless you happen to be black or a jew.
The truth is that one can find commonality with just about anybody. I draw the line on principle. I find these teabaggers to be vile, vicious racists. That do nothing to engender me to their cause.
The MSM did not make up the racist banners and the anti-healthcare reform meme the crowds are reciting.
I’m glad you have people as neighbors and friends with different views so do I but it does not make me change my principles.
Do you believe in healthcare reform? I’m just asking because I don’t know.
javaz, I understand what you are saying but believe the level of “anger” you describe has been manufactured by a load of nutters who know that they are slipping and have no new ideas or policies to run on.
They remind me of a crowd at a lynching who find power in others screaming for blood. Take them aside and ask them why and they don’t have the answer, they only gain their strength when they scream in a group. Remember that “Empty vessels make the most sound” when they see that they can’t win, they will run out of steam and turn their endless hate to something else. People will tire of their hate.
Since the beginning of time there have been the rich, the very rich and the poor and unless the increase in taxes is upheld, I can’t see this changing any time soon. Bush made a whole lot of fat, rich cats, richer. I hope that soon they will feel a dent in their pocket books, for some it won’t hurt them too much. Need to cut the loopholes and make them pay what they owe to the rest of you.
I live with neighbors and very good friends and we’ve traveled, and trust me, people piss me off, too, when they quote O’Reilly, Hannity, Beck and Coulter. but when push comes to shove, we care about survival, and we love our families.
YIKES
I guess this was a provocative thing, and now I’m going log off and play guitar with my husband, and if we drink enough beer, I’ll play piano, and if it gets to that point, he’ll think I’m a virtuoso!
I’m pretty sure that your neighbours didn’t travel to Washington to join in the Becky protests there. Yes javaz we all care about our families and friends wherever we live but there is a right way and a wrong way to make people listen and the teabaggers are way off the charts in my opinion.
LOL, have fun, you might even end up forming a group/duo. 🙂
G’nite J’avaz
First, bravo javaz for such a challenging article and POV!
I would go as far as to say superficially there may be similarities between Progressives and Teabaggers but they are not sincere similarities.
There are clear racist tones and images behind much of the hatred they have for Obama and “government”. The “birther” and “Nigerian” and “Muslim” labels most seem to apply to Obama are obvious in what they mean.
I notice that when a white Republican was president, they had no problem with the President’s power or government.
Their distrust of the MSM is in fact a narrow-minded lockstep allegiance to Fox News/Rush Limbaugh and the right wing propaganda machine, anything else is hated “left-wing” media.
They despise science and intellectuals, thus their celebration of Bush and Palin.
They bring guns to town hall meetings and scream in them to disrupt the political process.
Yes. most seem to be poorly educated, low income people who are older and believe that the “American Dream” society promised them was a lie. However, unlike progressives, they don’t blame the real culprits, the corporations who have gamed the system against all of us, they blame black people, minorities, liberals and other scapegoats as programmed by their sources of right winged brain washing. But if they’re so ignorant they really think gays getting married is why their marriage is bad, they are incapable of reasoning their way out of their ignorance.
The vicious circle here is that if they were smart enough not to believe the bullshit, they wouldn’t believe such things in the first place and would be aligned with us.
Many of them are indeed bitter and hateful because their party and those they follow in the media like Beck and Hannity and Rush, whip them into blind hatred of those trying to improve this society.
They vote against their best interests, they are often homophobes too.
They are nothing like Progressives, if you dig beneath the surface of their so-called “issues”, so I have to disagree that there are any substantial amount of principles we share.
As for whether Palin is relevant, she is relevant in the inner struggle of the GOP and to their potential to swing much farther right. She and teabaggers do have an effect on social issues but mainly to polarize the majority against themselves.
So I do agree on her being relevant in a number of ways but she is irrelevant to moving this nation forward and the interests of the majority of Americans.
She is a birther, a teabagger, a racist, opposes women (she forced raped women to pay for their own police rape kits), is a war monger who wants to bomb Iraq, is poorly educated, believes in exorcism and demons possessing people, I could go on and on.
Such people are to be rejected and decimated in public opinion so they will never have the power they crave. They are beneath contempt and need to be exposed for the greedy, egocentric opportunists they are.
Such cynical people, like Bush, run patronizingly as populists then once in office, carve up the treasure of the nation amongst themselves and their cronies.
I will do my best to always be an adversary of Palin and the Teabaggers who offer nothing to this nation but division, hatred and intolerance.
Simply because there are lots of ignorant people following her or Bush or L. Ron Hubbard, I don’t see that alone as justification to embrace them.
WELL SAID ADLIB! Gosh I wish I had your brains!! She is a boil on life and there is NO tolerating her in ANY circumstance.
You should read the entire thing before you comment.
I am on your side.
Jeepers, that’s good to know. I NEVER seem to have enough folks on my side. It be lonely out here javaz!! 🙂
Reading entire article now.
The thought provoking nature of the article is not lost on me either. I appreciate the new ideas even if I don’t agree with them. I think the problem with teabaggers is you can’t take old conservative ideas even if you intentions are populist and make them work.
I get it.
I’ve read all that and see it on the MSM.
But when you break it down, and actually meet real people, people who watch Fox and quote their pundits, we have more in common than not.
We all care about our families and feeding them and housing.
We all love our families, and we all hate to see the government handouts, using our tax dollars, while they reap the benefits and screw us all.
We truly do have more in common with middle class Republicans, because all we want is a better life for our children.
We’ve got to stop fighting each other, and work together for the greater good.
What a mission I am on, because as you can see from this article the hatred from Liberals and Democrat
I know allot of conservatives too and I don’t demonize them at all but most of them don’t care about anyone but themselves and their families. They don’t care about the uninsured or the unemployed when they got theirs.
What I think you are failing to acknowledge is President Obama reached out to these people just like you are saying now and for his effort they called him a Nazi and put Hitler mustaches on him. I wanted Obama to bring this country together more than anyone but these fine Faux News people decided they wanted no such reconciliation.
Here are the issues I have with your proposition (though I remain very pleased by your presenting it and creating this discussion!).
First, you make a sizable assumption that everyone who has strong feelings against teabaggers only get their impressions from the MSM. This is not the case with me nor many others here. I have personal experience, not just reading their posts at right wing sites (including HuffPo 😉 ) but in personal conversations.
They are not as you describe and as I wish they were, available to reason.
Yes, we all care about jobs, having a home and food for our families. But they blame blacks, minorities and liberals for it. And for the most part, nothing will change their minds.
It’s like the difference between our being able to have a respectful debate with you on your proposition here vs. HuffPo.
If you tried it there, I would bet a lot of money that the teabaggers and trolls there would ridicule and attack you.
You can’t collaborate with people who are hateful and small minded, no matter how much there is in common. If that was true, these same poor, out of work white people would be embracing poor out of work minorities instead of being further prejudiced against them.
I am 100% behind your plea for folks on both sides to come together over issues and work for the greater good.
But the proof is in the pudding. We have a health care reform bill that would help all of these teabaggers and middle class Republicans and yet instead of supporting their own interests, they follow their politically cynical leadership to flatly oppose it.
That is the sad reality and no amount of olive branches from the left will change that, we’ve seen that proven through Obama’s attempts to be bipartisan since he took office.
I don’t like it either but that is how things are.
The good thing is that the GOP is shrinking and many of those you refer to, middle class Republicans have already left the GOP to support the Dem agenda.
So in a way, what you seek has already happened. The dregs that are left in the GOP are the most extremist, hateful, ignorant and close-minded they had…or they too would have had the brains a rat has to leave a sinking ship.
Very well said. Thank you.
There is a problem with the left. One is the left is in leadership. That makes a much easier target. Leadership includes making proposals that become targets. It is so much easier to say “you are wrong” than actually doing the heavy lifting.
Second, the right has much more enthusiasm. Again yelling “you lie”, is so much easier than trying to find solutions.
Third, Fear. The rights’ trump card! People want what they have known. Not what may be better for them but they have their comfort zone.
Fourth. the left can be lazy. The right gets out and demonstrates. Lefties blog. The right Gets Out The Vote! GOTV!!!
Examples are the contests in Virgina and New Jersey.
And what is it with the RC Bishops
Good post j’avaz
I like you. b’ito, and we should meet in real life,
My husband downloaded updates all day, and I was in PPOV withdrawal, so I wrote this thing, and thought it not bad, and neither did my husband.
Did you get what I was trying to say?
I think I do. Read an article in “The Nation” today warning of populism of SP. And saying “Beware.” I also understand your frustration of whether it is Dems or repugs, they powers that be get the prime cuts and we get hot dogs. There is always work to do!
You both missed the point.
Sigh
We as Americans care about family, and taking care of family, and we’re angry that the rich are bailed out, while we pay increased taxes.
We are angry that our wages have stagnated while the rich just keep getting richer.
But has the GOP ever done anything about these, j’avaz? We have a party that has at least attempted to make some effort for the working class. Us stiff. They aren’t out trying to bust Unions.
Who’s paying increased federal taxes?
Federal taxes have only been going down. That’s one of the absurdities of the teabag movement that the Fed is making you pay more taxes.
AZ is getting hit hard by state and local taxes, while our legislature is cutting corp. an income taxes on the top tier.
Bito: Just think where AZ would be if it wasn’t for the federal funds back to the state. And you didn’t mention the continueing removal of more and more services in order to allow the legislature to have another tax cut even in this economic emergency. There are things I love about AZ, and then again, there are other things…
Ok, I didn’t read it all, I apologize in all sincerity. Once you suggested she WAS relevant, I could go no further. You may be accurate, but in MY WORLD, she is not only irrelevant, but undesired. I am a snob I readily admit. I would NEVAH EVAH vote for a presidential candidate who had nothing but a BA degree? Fuggedaboutit. I wanna see Juris Doctorate at the very least. And her voice alone makes my skin get creepy. She MAY have thousands of supporters, I don’t doubt you. But there are MILLIONS and MILLIONS of Americans who are still asking the question of McCain, WTF? I’d bet serious loot on that.
How unfair that you didn’t read the entire article before commenting.
Do you remember me from HP, vegasbabe?
I remember you and how you attacked me and it was about Michael Jackson and btw, tainoboy fanned me as I did him.
What happens at HP should stay at HP.
If what happens at HP should stay at HP, then why are u bringing it up now? There were quite a few posters who were quite insensitive to how folks were feeling including me following MJ’s death. Were you one?
Of course not.
I loved him, too.
Then I suggest and encourage you to honor your original statement of leaving HP where it belongs, at HP, and ACCEPT my initial apology for not having read the entire article (which I didn’t have to offer) and understand that for some folks, certainly me, relevance and Palin just don’t belong in the same sentence. Friends?
Just popping in on this to say that it’s absolutely right, what happens at HP needs to stay there.
It is an insanity machine there that creates conflicts between good people.
Seems like the truth is that you both share an affection for MJ so let’s let it end there.
Be happy to.