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The real problem is trolls that seem to be posting something innocuous, but are actually laying traps for the unwary.
I recently saw a poster referring to Obama as “soetoro” [sic].
This was a rather dishonest way of referring to the birther scam in 2009 that claimed that Obama, under the name Barry Soetoro, had received financial aid as a citizen of Indonesia.
The whole thing has been debunked by Snopes, but still they keep it up.
Remember, the main reason trolls post is to waste your time. The more time you are dealing with their usual unethical tricks, the less time you have for educating others, complementing others, asking questions, and exchanging tips with other progressives. The less time you have for what you came here for, the more time the trolls have to let their cohorts do their dirty work.
It’s not my job to educate a troll. I will refute the troll for the education of others. I will flag the troll for his or her unethical garbage. I will notify moderators and site admin that the troll is spamming or violating terms of service.
My job is to help others. The trolls do not want to be helped. For some, it would mean a loss of income (we all know it, and they know we know it). For others, it would be a loss of opportunity to degrade and control us.
Do the minimum needed to refute them and move on. There are more independents and undecideds out there, who have questions or who have been misinformed. They need our help.
My early experience with trolls at HP was to simply follow their link and see the trash they were spewing. Once I learned the major sites, including finding who was funding the various “polls” they cited, I got to where I could simply read the link and know whether it was going to factual or just trash. Toward the end I didn’t bother, they no longer posted any opinions really, mostly just one liner attacks. Still I am amused at the infrequent attempts to cite some outrageous lie.
“Got a link”?
I haven’t see that here yet, and doubt I will,
Thank goodness
Hi jdmn, that’s right – they don’t have links – but we could stock our ant- troll- library well in advance before the elections… i just thought it a pity to let all that wonderful material just go by. There’s a lot of work in there and it could be useful for us for future reference. Have you seen up there the troll library?
In any case, I just noticed you received another answer on PWs business series part 1, it might be of interest for you, something with a site for your work. Now I’m really off to part 2!
SueInCa says:
04/26/2010 at 9:17 PMhttp://www.realmegwhitman.com/2010/04/26/meg-a-spin/
For all in CA here is a website to point out all of Meg Whitman
NELLIE !! Oh my god, what an amazing feat !
I can’t wait to be able to fully dig into this ….I’ll have to be cautious though, a P/T blogger could become an addict 😉
GREAT post !!
Need some info on “Enhanced Interrogation” and it NOT working?
this post from the Wonk room is large. This could also go in the reference section, I think.
Why Bush
Meet The Tea Partiers: Male, Rich and College Educated
Evan McMorris-Santoro | February 17, 2010, 1:27PM
http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2010/02/meet-the-tea-partiers-male-rich-and-college-educated.php
http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2010/images/02/17/rel4b.pdf
11%? WOW! that a majority isn’t it? To watch the MSM one would think.
Some interesting numbers here.
I just wanted to get something off my chest as it has been bothering me for almost 24 hours. Last night, I had a run-in with the sort of thin-lipped spittle fueled tea bagger anger in person. I went to my local watering hole to get a bite to eat and to say hi to friends. The person who turned into a tea bag harpy on me is not a friend, but someone I have seen there and have had friendly conversations with. She and another local, who I know too, were yammering about Obama being weak with Iran. I asked
Wow, just wow. My first thought is the louder someone like that gets, the more calm I get. Nothing infuriates them more for the object of their diatribe to remain calm, with lucid intellectual facts. Sooner or later it will freeze them because they run out of talking points, while I never run out of knowledge.
Yeah, but that light went off in her head and she was on automatic pilot with those talking points. And apparently, asking for evidence means I don’t love my country.
LAB, what is the line about “if you argue with an idiot, What does that make you?” Some people are just that: Idiots. “Idiotlouges”
LOL!! Thank you for that chuckle!
I think a lot of teabagger types are like this — angry, unstable people who connect with anger and instability. It’s the Max Blumenthal Culture of Crisis theory up close and personal.
I’m sorry you had to deal with such negative energy. But at least you had friends with you and sports to distract you. And the good news — out of a bar full of people, there was only one teabagger who chose to stand out. Maybe she was the only one there….
Yeah, that is true – I did feel like I was just a middle of road schmoe as opposed to being Che Guevara’s woman….
LABC, What a bummer. Those rants do seem like neurotic spewing to me — they are not political discussions. Unfortunately I had a similar experience a few months ago over the phone with my brother. He listens to Rush Limbaugh. I was not able to hold my temper and I ended up screaming at him to shut the eff up. (I think it was the ranting about Rachel “Madcow” that finally sent me off the deep end — I find that “nickname” to be misogynistic and vicious).
Somehow, we have managed to get past this horrible fight (I’ve never been that angry at him). We don’t talk politics now — which is fine with me. I used to have to listen to that vile poison at every family gathering. Now he tempers it. The thing is, he drinks and that often leads to his ranting. If I see he’s getting loaded, I keep our conversations to an absolute minimum. I have no time or patience whatsoever for drunken spewing.
My girlfriend goes through that with her brother, who, sober, is a spewing machine. It is exhausting sometimes.
LABC, I’ll weigh in on this, but it probably won’t be helpful. I just never get into conversations with these people because I do not believe they listen or are interested in a real conversation. I am not talking about people who simply have a different opinion than I do, but about Dittoheads. It’s like talking about religion– you can’t change peoples’ beliefs if that are not based on facts. And most ideologues are totally opposed to facts, in the same way fundamentalists can deny dinosaurs. Whatta ya gonna do? (BTW– take a look at AdLib’s hilarious and right-on dramatization of arguing with idiots!)
That said, if you find yourself in that position again and want to mix it up, I think this particular post that Nellie put together will really help once it is more complete. It’s going to be a Talking Points Factory! You can come here and load up on talking points before you head out into the Twilight Zone.
Thank you both – I feel better writing this out and I appreciate your sympathy and information. I think I will try crowd surfing at a Anthrax concert next time, much safer than this was – are the youngsters still doing that?
LABC, I think you have brought up a great issue-
The live and in person troll on auto pilot that is drinking!
Ughh what a combo
It sounds like you came off as the adult there and you know that can’t be bad.
I say big points go to the person who is in control of themselves and respectful.
Next time maybe, get them to do shots,
lots of shots (dump yours under the table)
and let them show off their stuff
in fine style.
I often wonder
What is the right wing doing with their money?
Where do all those profits go?
Remember the old days of the Philanthropist?
Rockefeller Carnegie, Peabody
I think they felt guilty
and they did things with their money to help build up education and the arts ect.
Todays big money people ?
Most do not feel guilty at all.
The big money of today is . . . . where ?
Limbat & company what is their contribution ?
It’s interesting that CArnegie, who for years subscribed to Social Darwinism, changed 180 degrees after the Johnstown flood. He was a member of the millionaire’s club at the top of the mountain the dam of which club was not maintained and gave way causing the horrific devastation in Johnstown. It may not be a coincidence that he built precisely the number of libraries as totaled the final death count from that horror. (This is official National Park Service info.)
The philanthropy of yore was partly to stop the anger from working people about the numbers of their own that were killed and maimed and impoverished by corporate capitalism.
The “liberal” corporate rich formed the National Civic Federation in 1901 to promote policies that would ease some of the harm they themselves caused with GOVERNMENT programs such as workers’ compensation. Cynically one can see that this was to stop lawsuits for harm done, but it did have an impact that was good. People were no longer forced to sue for compensation but got it as a matter of right. Other similar reforms were instituted state by state because people such as Gary, Carnegie, and others saw Debs as a real threat to their economic hegemony. One can say workers were bought off, but justice that works is still justice. Later more enlightened corporate capitalists such as Ford paid decent wages to stabilize his consumer base.
The way we were.
The joke about Carnegie, among some Union people, is he turned 180 when he married a woman half his age. She knew how to pull the strings on his social conscience. 🙂
I once wrote something similar to that on HP, not about Carnegie but for the women of this country to use their “skills” and availability to massage the men in their lives to see how their anti-women actions were going to have local consequences. Hey, it gets the lawn mowed at home. The post stayed up about an hour! I’m guessing every dude there flagged it.
This calculator figures out how much you will pay for health insurance under the House and Senate bills:
http://healthreform.kff.org/SubsidyCalculator.aspx
I’m not quite savvy to how this works yet. I don’t know where to put this; but I got a kick out of it:
http://www.juancole.com/2010/02/corporate-media-hype-tea-partiers-way.html
And what is really fascinating is that the 20% number, who say they prefer socialism, is from Rasmeussen! That said, the way they asked the question is a little suspect, and the way they explain it is confusing to me. But the fact remains
I don’t know. The media also says that Britney Spears and Paris Hilton are important forces.
And the media made them rich by saying so. The media also dictates when they are over. But the difference between teabaggers and Britney is that Britney has to actually SELL records or concert tickets to prove her importance. Not so much with Paris though. And certainly not so with the baggers.
My point is that when the media declares something or someone important, they make it a self-fulfilling prophesy.
I think we disagree on that. Paris Hilton was already rich. The teabaggers have had no impact on politics. They’re just a side show. At least that’s my take.
Nellie, yes we disagree about this, but that’s 😎 !
Anyway, did you get a chance to see the posts I put in the Troll Busters comments? I just want to be sure it’s OK to combine them. And if not, that’s 😎 too!
Yes, I saw them!
It’s fine. I have to set up a kind of library, so it won’t be a problem. I just didn’t want to lose anything. You’re really giving us a great start, Cher! And that’s very 😎 !
Yeah, that was my take away, too. It’s definitely not a “hard” link and Juan tends to have nerd humor when it comes to domestic politics. It was the larger point about media attention and bias.
Bravo, Nellie!!!
I love how simple and intuitive it is to use. As the number of posts grow, it will become a popular, one-of-a-kind resource for people at many different blogs.
This is a huge asset to The Planet, big thanks and kudos to you and Cher!
Post this to get people to sign their name to the “Save the Public Option” campaign.
http://savethepublicoption.com/
I signed it already.
Hot off the press link from kos, tracking the senators who sign on to passing the PO through reconciliation. (The link will probably break when the number of signers increments though. Maybe)
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2010/2/17/838118/-Breaking:-Public-Option-Through-Reconciliation-Scoreboard:-13
Awesome Nellie !
Excellent work – everyone who contributed !
The way you have it phrased is so inviting and user friendly.
The Planet Rocks Again with the Best stuff on the web!
Hi everyone!
This is the BETA version of our Troll Busters! feature.
Suggestions are welcome. This is just what I came up with intially as a way for us to add posts and links to our library.
I just checked back to see what’s been happening and BOY! This is outstanding. I know of no other site that provides this kind of resource. Damn, we are our own little PAC, better by FAR than the DLC and David Plouff should see this!
This is exceptional work, Nellie. Talk about making a difference!!
EDIT: I will add more resources I found tomorrow, as well as a few of the comments I wrote for yonder. This is just perfection!
Thanks Cher. Or should I say, Chief Resource Maven.
This is great. I’ve been scanning down the list and plucking juicy tidbits out and posting them. It’s wonderful.
Nellie, You are awesome. Not to mention smart and funny and efficient. And some other really good stuff.
Careful — my head still needs to get through the door!
Thanks e’cat….
Are we supposed to post in the comments section? Our links and saved info?
Yes. Please post each comment separately. And each link separately. That will make it easier to file them where they belong.
Thanks, I figured it out from perusing the article again. I mean it was only in bright red print.
Never mind, I just answered my own question, duh.