As part of the Keith Olbermann legacy (along with some left over anger management handbooks and mirrors), MSNBC has become positioned and recognized as the news channel for Progressives and Democrats. Prior to Olbermann’s success at the station through his openly expressed partisan views, MSNBC leaned rightward (they fired Phil Donahue for opposing the Iraq War), following in the footsteps of CNN at the time, trying to play the role of a conservative-tinged impartial journalistic outlet…often by providing Democratic responses to manufactured Republican propaganda which they echoed using the Fox News trick, “Some Republicans are saying that President Obama wants to eat our children…”. Though this tradition continues on at CNN and MSNBC , MSNBC looked at Olbermann’s explosive ratings and made the business decision to bring on more hosts that would appeal to and attract that same Progressive audience that caused the surge in Olbermann’s ratings so they hired Rachel Maddow, Ed Schultz, Lawrence O’Donnell and others (Chris Matthews was already hosting) to host shows.
So MSNBC is the Progressives’ alternative to Fox News, right?
While Fox News has unbroken, wall to wall broadcasting of right wing propaganda, from its talk shows to its “news” shows, MSNBC spends the morning veering to the right, the afternoon bouncing back and forth from right to center then in the afternoon and evening, it takes a hard left…until Lockup begins of course.
This is not apples and apples between what the Right Wing has in Fox News and what Progressives have to settle for in MSNBC. It is an apple and an orange that has some apple stuffed into it.
Like Fox News and CNN, MSNBC is a corporately owned news network. It’s principal owners are the very conservative Comcast Corporation and the very conservative GE Corporation (which also owns NBC). GE has paid no net federal income taxes since 2008. Comcast is based in Pennsylvania but has dodged paying state income tax through a slippery trick of claiming to be a Delaware company. And it is these two ethical, socially responsible companies that principally own and operate the respected news station known as MSNBC.
Many Progressives watch MSNBC later in the day when their Progressive-hosted shows are on but what is often overlooked is the first half of MSNBC’s programming day. Here is the daily MSNBC schedule for Monday through Friday (excluding repeats other than Hardball’s primetime repeat):
I was reading an article the other day of the 10 companies you won’t see next year and one of them was Current TV. It hasn’t been able to compete and Al Gore doesn’t have the kind of money to keep it going for much longer. Regardless of whether you agree with all the shows that Current has, it was a channel not owned by the Corporate Media. Corporate money has the power to control the news whether it is liberal or conservative or anything in between.
I liked the potential that Current had but as with Air America, there are many obstacles to getting Progressives to pull together in the same direction, unlike the authoritarian mentality of the GOP and Fox News.
I had hoped that when Olbermann went over there, Current could be positioned to become that major independent tv news channel that’s so desperately needed but between the cable and satellite corporations keeping Current marginalized and Olbermann’s ego-madness, they may have been undone.
If you ask me, Current has little to lose by getting more provocative than they are. They’re playing it far too safe I think and with the forces and factors arrayed against them, they should be looking to really hit that populist nerve about the corruption of our democracy and country.
Just a suggestion…
Issa, Mrs. Greenspan and President Nixon!
For some stupid reason I flipped on Mute the Press for the first time in many months to hear Darrell Issa droning on about the “Fast and Furious” and all of it’s monumental consequences and harm it has done to democracy as we know it. Oddly he did not bring up the conspiracy that the whole episode was concocted by the President and his AG to overturn the second amendment and take everyone’s firearms. He must save that crazy talk for Fox audiences exclusively know that they will actually believe such bullshit.
No, what I heard was him comparing the non compliance by AG Holder to turn over certain records and the President using Executive Privilege with Nixon and insinuating “Watergate.” And who should chime in with her own Nixon line but Andrea Mitchell! UnFuckingBelievable!
Nixon who illegally burgled offices, wiretapped, used the FBI, IRS, CIA along with laundering hush money, just for starters, is compared to President Obama for Fast and Furious?
Now Issa I could excuse, he’s a grade A+ megalomaniac drunk with his chairmanship but for Mrs. Greenspan to chime in with her Nixon remark was plainly ignorant. She is old enough to remember the whole Watergate/Nixon episode and for her to chime in was completely irresponsible. She should have scolded and mocked Issa for making any comparison!
Back to my Sunday morning routine of making sure I Mute The Press
Mrs. Greenspan really does annoy me. Not only is she plainly part of the ruling class and use her show to promote it but she is surprisingly inept and not very sharp.
As to the RW’s pumping out the Watergate comparisons, Jon Stewart skewered them on that last night:
We all know how I feel about Mr and Mrs Greenspan. Sometimes I wonder if people don’t realize just how close we are to total propaganda in our National Network News. When you have host after host propagating the same lies you, at some time, have to admit it is propaganda. Which makes us no better than USSR, Nazi Germany, Japan(in relation to the tsunami and aftermath and their actions post and prior to WWII)
The only way to deal with it that seems practical is what you’re doing, tune out the MSM and seek out real news on the web.
Only when the MSM is seen by a majority as nothing more than a propaganda delivery system, can its domination be broken and irrelevant.
Now I know it is just not me! I do watch/listen to a lot of MSNBC, and I praise the inventor of the “mute” button everyday…throughout the day until Martin, the Rev, Ed, Rachel and Lawrence come on. My family is usually very understanding of my uncontrollable rants and outbursts at some host who fails to ask a follow up question, or dispute an outright lie. Of course one expects that of Joe, at least he makes no bones about where he stands, but those like Andrea, Luke (Grrr!) Chuck have a different tone when talking to liberals. Sorta condescending like..LOL! That is my impression, especially when the liberal guest is not allowed to respond – “Sorry, we’ve run out of time.” It just seems that the last word always goes to the Republican. Anyhow, just sounding off.
Ad Lib, you have done an excellent analysis of MSNBC on all fronts. I agree totally with all you have said. Re the Oil Company ads, you are right on the mark. One has to admit they are extremely well done piece of propaganda. I wonder. Do they ask for their time slots i.e. Rachel’s shows or are their ads assigned by MSNBC?
Thanks for this, Ad Lib. It just goes to confirm, in my mind, that Progressives are losing the battle. I hope I am wrong
goleafsgo, You captured my experience with MSNBC almost perfectly! Do you have a camera in my house! 😆
Hey goleafsgo! Thanks for the kind words.
I completely agree about that tone of condescension that comes from hacks like Chuck Todd and Luke Russert on MSNBC, I almost immediately switch them off when they come on.
Just caught up on my Bill Moyers episodes and this is one I highly recommend and that I think you’ll really appreciate. In the vein of this article, this conversation provides a clear and insightful explanation of how all the news stations are complicit in trying to pacify and entertain the public, even encourage “amnesia” about recent events, all in the pursuit of corporate profits.
News is actually and intentionally shunned in favor of the pitting of two sides against each other and avoiding calling a lie, a lie.
We know all of this but Moyers’ discussion with Marty Kaplan, director of USC’s Norman Lear Center, really crystallizes it all:
Excellent job AdLib and it reminds me of when CBS was sold in the midst of the huge story on tobacco and the end of independent news. A major loss for the American people. What was the second, perhaps the exception made for NewsCorp, I don’t know, there may have been others. The bad thing about Murdoch is that the Aussie’s warned the Brits, the Brits warned the US and we ended up with FOX.
What to do, what to do? Now that most media is corporate controlled how can it possibly be rolled back when they have the final say on what passes or not in the FCC and Congress?
Wonder why so many Oil and Gas commercials? Gotta soften all those die-hard libs up for the #1 issue for them this election cycle: Completely unregulated fracking
AdLib, I didn’t bring my notepad and every paragraph as a response, so I won’t make a comment on the entirety, but David Frum and David Brooks were conservatives who seem to be—–what? reasonable? learned a thing or two since Bush? How do we even judge rational speech from a GOP? That being said those two, and Steve Schmidt possibly (haven’t heard enough) are potentials.
But the bigger issue, which you +addressed, is that MSNBC is playing a ratings game (and I think Phil Griffen is a piss ant, small brained kinda guy)so truth doesn’t matter, balance is only to develop a viewer base, not to develop a balance of opinion. Imus, as a self-proclaimed GOP let Joe Scarborough in the am spot with his “napppy ho” idiocy. And it worked. I don’t think they care about truth or balance or the voter, the news, or the country. Perhaps some of the hosts do, but the station is business first.
Foodchain, excellent list and I would agree with you on those three, Frum, Brooks and Schmidt. Though I disagree with most of their views and sometimes even their way of reasoning, I think if MSNBC had a program co-hosted by one of those three and a Progressive, you’d really have substantive and civil discussions about issues.
Part of the problem about our politics and our news is that discussions always seem to be about winning as opposed to issues. It’s all about the smack down and the skewer but that advances nothing in our society.
Substantive discussions and understanding why people with opposing views feel so strongly convinced of their views would be both enlightening and constructive.
The only way out of the hyper-partisan gridlock and descent into futility is for the public to start turning away from the concept of political discussions being a boxing match where all that matters is if our guy wins and instead see it once again as a pursuit to seek consensus about addressing things that affect us all.
It’s the best we have at this point. I think Thomas Roberts sneaks in some good points for my team periodically. Chris Hayes although a weekend anchor is good as are Alex Wagner, MHP, Tamron Hall and I’m surprisingly happy with Martin Bashir.
Heck I like MSNBC better than the rest so it’s the one we watch most.
Life isn’t fair so we’ve got to make the most of what we’ve got.
Good point, GirlOutWest! MSNBC is better than the rest. They all could be better but for now that how it is. 🙂
Hi GirlOutWest!
Agreed that we can appreciate what we have but I think it’s important that people do so with their eyes open.
As Bito’s timely post addresses, MSNBC also undermines Progressivism by filling their broadcast day with manufactured issues created by the GOP, such as Obama’s saying that the private sector is doing fine is some major outrage.
Most if not all of the Progressive hosts made this a top discussion issue as did MSNBC’s news broadcasts and there is no question that their running with the Repub spin on this, even if it was to say, “is this fair?”, was detrimental to Obama.
The news media is like a snake eating its tail. They need stories so they happily accept the manipulated stories that are manufactured by political operatives yet think they’re being responsible by just adding a question mark at the end of them.
What I would like to see is more viewers of MSNBC contacting them to ask them to stop participating in this game of distributing propaganda just because it’s juicy. If Obama’s or anyone else’s words are taken out of context and twisted, they shouldn’t add their megaphone to promote twisted and dishonest propaganda.
As I would guess happened with letting Ratigan go, viewers can have an impact on what a network broadcasts by not tuning into what they don’t support and by making their voices heard by the broadcaster.
What we have is okay but we can and should demand better.
Stephanie Miller on Current TV is an unwavering supporter of President Obama. Bill Press is a supporter as well, although he can be wishy washy.
Sabreen, So is Jennifer Granholm/The War Room With Jennifer Granholm on Current is a die-hard for the President, as well.
I just have to say RATigan is really no big loss at least to me. I don’t deal in hypocrites and he is one of the biggest order.
He made his bones on WALL STREET and I am sure he left there with tons of money. Then he pretends he had some epiphany and Wall Street are all now greedy bastards. If that is so, why does he not make a few big contributions to charity? I am sure those people could use his “greedy bastard” funds. Then he uses the unemployed to run around the country on a “jobs tour” that is really to promote his book. How much lower on the human scale can he get? I will not miss Ratigan and I pity the people in the District or State that he ultimately runs for office in.
Sue, despite Ratigan’s blather of phony populism, he made clear that what he really supports is only wealthy people running for office and running the country.
His “get the money out of politics” proposition was, don’t allow candidates to accept any contributions from anyone. So who are the only people who could afford to spend millions to run for President or Senate except millionaires?
And he repeatedly had the same “libertarian” guests on whose prescription for saving our economy was getting rid of Medicare and Social Security…and Ratagain agreed with them.
He kowtowed to and brown nosed Swift Boater and pro-monopolist T. Boone Pickens again and again and repeatedly had on the frauds and hedge fund backers of Americans Elect, touting them as the saviors of American Democracy.
He was such a transparent 1%er, bullshitting viewers with populism and many bought into it. He used that populist facade to hide behind as he endlessly attacked Obama and the Dems in Congress while making the occasional criticism of Repubs to appear “independent”.
He is a total opportunist and fraud and the airwaves are well rid of him.
Adlib
You certainly don;t have to prove that to me. Personally I despise the man. He did all of what you speak of and more. The airwaves are better off without him for sure. For supposedly being a progressive network MSNBC is pulling the wool over many people’s eyes.
Sometimes I want to slap MSNBC would have her on the air after her failure of a husband is mind boggling. If she had some principles it would be different but she has none and is an airhead to boot. She is an embarrassment to them just like the bimbos at Fake News
Did I just hear Dylan Ratigan is leaving the line up? Yes I did!
Patsy, yes indeed, we won’t have to see that Ratagain.
BTW, nice to see you and great work with San Onofre and the nuke issue!
Hey my nuclear friend. Hope you are doing well and the info I sent to you was worthwhile
With MSNBC, it’s really hard to say that it’s “mixed” in terms of political viewpoint. Their primetime lineup is 100% progressive, starting with Matthews. And in fairness, you can’t weigh primetime vs the rest of the day.
Another glaring take-away is that all of the primetime “pundits” share the exact same opinion and cover the exact same stories. Whether you’re watching Rachel, Lawrence, Ed, or Al Sharpton, they are all going to give you the exact same opinion. Al’s opinion is going to the the same as Rachel’s two hours later.
From that perspective, MSNBC is significantly different than FoxNews.
Hi kevrob!
Of course, I do disagree with discounting half of MSNBC’s programming day because it’s not in prime time.
Check out these June 6th ratings numbers during the Morning Joe time slot:
[img]http://planetpov.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/Cable-News-Ratings-for-Wednesday-June-6-2012-Ratings-TVbytheNumbers.png[/img]
Morning Joe’s P2+ numbers are lower but hardly negligible when compared to the first primetime show on MSNBC, Hardball and check out Morning Joe’s 25-54 numbers, he beats out Hardball on that demo:
[img]http://planetpov.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/Cable-News-Ratings-for-Wednesday-June-6-2012-Ratings-TVbytheNumbers2.png[/img]
Morning Joe’s total audience is nearly 60% of the Hardball audience, that is a meaningful number. Now add to that the Mitchell and Ratigan audiences (though Ratigan is leaving) and you have a profound amount of people, surpassing the viewership of Hardball, being fed the RW propaganda via MSNBC.
One point I was trying to make is that we should not try to rationalize away the amount of RW agenda MSNBC promotes just because they also promote Progressive hosts and agendas. I do feel that ignoring all but primetime programming is doing just that.
And even looking only at their primetime broadcasts, it includes the oil industry propaganda sandwiched between segments of Progressive programs. Would you agree or disagree that there’s something ethically wrong about that?
As for the other point you make, you’re absolutely correct that the primetime lineup does for the most part, run the same stories repeatedly. I’m not sure that’s a good thing though, there’s so much going on out there that it does get terribly redundant as each host addresses the same issues with maybe a slightly different perspective…or not.
This is indeed exactly what Fox News does. They construct a meme in the morning and hammer it home in every program throughout the day, adding in new memes that continue in following shows when something new happens that day.
I would prefer there to be a bit more diversity in the topics each MSNBC show addresses. There is some and I recognize that they want to keep taking a bite of the day’s juiciest apples but for those watching consecutive programs, it can feel like beating a dead horse.
In any case, I hope it’s clear that I am not suggesting that MSNBC’s Progressive hosts aren’t sincere nor that there is any reason not to tune into them, I do think though that the perception of MSNBC as a Progressive network isn’t really accurate and that folks should recognize them for exactly what they are.
AdLib, I can see that maybe a certain story may be repeated on consecutive shows but not everyone watches all the shows. Some people, like me, only turn into a couple of them. So, I don’t hear it over and over. But, I agree that they need to cover more territory of the news. You would think that they could choice a subject topic among each other and that be their show. However, if you didn’t watch them all you might miss a topic but I would only be turning into the topics I was interested in at that. PBS still covers the most in the news.
Hey Sally are you upset with me?
NEVER! Hey, did you find any of those links I gave you on IHOP helpful? Did you like the YouTube of the girl that was at one of those camps?
Yes, thank you. The only thing with Stephanie was she did not get into detail on those re-education camps and I have been searching for something ever since. I am going to write something up for Gods Own Party this week so I will repost it here in the OT section probably Sunday. Thanks for finding them
Okay, Sherlock, just trying to help. How about this one?
http://www.goddiscussion.com/94724/6-12-year-olds-to-be-trained-to-perform-signs-and-wonders/
OM word Sally 6to12 year old kids? thanks for that too. I have alot to get working. The re-education camps Stephanie was talking about were for problem people like her so they can be re-culted again. When she was being followed around and counseled they told her she could go to a camp in Canada or Tx and get right again but she never went in to any detail. She did mention one school she went to but I have not been able to track it down either.