Displaying 18,181 To 18,210 Of 19,504 Comments 100% in agreement! » Posted By AdLib On December 16, 2009 @ 5:10 pm I know you’re being facetious, of course it will never end. But when good people stand together to do the right thing, defeating Hitler, ending slavery, ending child labor, establishing civil rights, the selfish can be beaten back. And the first step in winning a fight…is recognizing that you’re in one. » Posted By AdLib On December 16, 2009 @ 5:08 pm First, I totally agree with you that a strong third party is desperately needed in the U.S. that reflects the popular views and vision of the citizens. However, I disagree with your description of those attacking Obama. I have seen little if any reference by Dems attacking Obama to wanting a 3rd party and frequent reference to not voting in 2012 and simply not supporting Obama and the Dem party. Just because people attack or voice their pulling support of Obama does not mean the inverse is true, that they are supporting any other party or candidate. I’m sure there are some who might feel that way but I ask you, what party are they supporting today as an alternative to Obama? What potential candidate are they supporting today instead of Obama? I don’t think you will find an affirmative response, only a negative one, as to whom they are not supporting. As for the impact of 3rd parties, George Bush was able to steal the FL election because of a 3rd party draining away just enough from Gore to allow Bush to steal the election. On the other hand, Ross Perot started up his 3rd party (you do kind of need a billionaire to make this happen) and for a while did very well…though never was in the lead in any poll at any time. You have a lot of unintended consequences and infrastructure challenges to start and have a competitive 3rd party. Will a 3rd party always act as a spoiler and hand a minority in the nation and right wing wackjobs the presidency? Imagine a populist 3rd party candidate running in 2008. Obama was the populist candidate so if a 3rd party populist candidate drew at least 8% from Obama, we would have President McCain right now presiding over The Great Depression, The Sequel. That is the Catch 22 of starting up a 3rd party that would attract progressives and independents, it would necessarily hobble the Dem party and hand elections to the GOP, until or unless it supplanted the Dems which I doubt it could ever do. Actually, we would need to have at least 4 parties, 2 new parties would need to be started at the same time, each appealing to a constituency or with some crossover from the Dems and GOP so as to diminish each somewhat equally. It would take many years for either party to overtake its parents but in that way maybe a true party of the people could emerge. » Posted By AdLib On December 16, 2009 @ 5:03 pm Thanks for the correction. It translates to around $14 billion. Still the U.S. gives Citibank a gift of $14 billion to get back $20 billion? I’d sure like a deal like that. You give me $20 bucks, I only have to pay you back $6 of it and we’re square. » Posted By AdLib On December 16, 2009 @ 4:10 pm escribacat, your sentiment is the only solution. We have to strive to be people who aren’t so selfish and spread the gospel through deed and word. That’s all we can do. BTW, seeing things for how they are doesn’t require us to come up with a huge solution to fix it all. We Americans think that way, that evil can be defeated, democracy can be spread, etc. I totally agree with you, there is no big solution to this but as you describe, we can make our contribution in our own ways. » Posted By AdLib On December 16, 2009 @ 4:01 pm Try this for an experiment, watch a channel tonight that has commercials and see how many commercials promote selfishness or self-gratification. Then consider what the net result is at the end of your viewing session, how much has self-gratification been sold to you and how much has conscience, compassion or ethics been sold to you? I have been teaching my daughter that commercials, for the most part, lie. It’s gratifying to hear her say sometimes during a commercial, “That’s not true!”. It’s tough to fight the programming our corporate plutocracy employs on us and our children but we must. BTW, in Michael Moore’s “Capitalism, A Love Story” he mentions a leaked Citicorp memo to its top investors that is chilling. It declares that fortunately, we are actually living in a plutocracy now, not a democracy, so continued progress in the concentration of wealth into the hands of the wealthiest should be able to proceed without interruption…aside from the possibility that the majority could revolt. FYI, here’s a definition, then let me know if you think we’re living in a democracy or a plutocracy. plutocracy 1 : government by the wealthy » Posted By AdLib On December 16, 2009 @ 12:56 pm Absolutely. The ability to rationalize away one’s conscience because what one gets in return is so desirable, is a severe problem. Now that the cynicism of the selfish has corrupted so much, how is conscience given anywhere near the attention that materialism is? » Posted By AdLib On December 16, 2009 @ 12:46 pm When you go to other countries, it’s very different, not so many people who seem so hollowed out. You go on a train in France and an absolute stranger is comfortable looking you in the eyes, even offering a smile or a nod. You do that in the U.S. and you’re likely to see a person quickly avert their eyes. They’re afraid of connecting with other human beings. The emailing, texting, Twittering, etc. builds walls between us as human beings. People we might see our talk to we instead email or text because it’s easier. At the same time, the human connection of hearing a voice or seeing a face is lost. It’s a balance. Technology allows us to create a thoughtful, caring community here among far flung people. That’s using it to our advantage. But allowing it to come between people who would otherwise connect in a more personal way is a problem. » Posted By AdLib On December 16, 2009 @ 12:43 pm Thanks nellie. And your views make an enormous amount of sense. Indeed, the majority of people are followers. How they choose who to follow is not necessarily the result of critical thinking, as you mention. I would say this about too many leaders, I don’t agree that it would make things unmanageable…as long as egos were checked at the door. Thoughtful leaders can collaborate on goals, as at least some Dems in Congress have shown and international initiatives in the past have proven. I don’t see followers getting smarter in the future so what could help is for those who think for themselves to collaborate on supporting smarter leaders, as we did with Obama. Sure, many followers followed us in supporting Obama but that’s perfectly fine, we got the ball rolling and once they saw it desirable to jump on, they did. This is how we should pursue things, coming together as “leaders” to launch things and leaders that the followers could follow. » Posted By AdLib On December 16, 2009 @ 12:36 pm Wow, nailed it! I am right with you on all of this. The affirmation by the real world that cheaters prosper, that bad guys win and that good guys get screwed can indeed convince people that they would be a sucker not to ditch their principles and grab for what they can get with both hands. And capitalist society’s pat on the back to those that do so, seals the deal. Indeed, as you say, our being distracted by the bread and circuses of consumerism keeps power in the hands of the corrupt Caesars who hold the true power in this country. And as for the pharma industry promoting its happy pills so people won’t be depressed…being drugged into states of comfort are another form of control. Yes, there are those who need medication for severe depression but these meds are being over prescribed to people who are just feeling bad with good reason. Depression for most people is part of a natural cycle, it can dissipate or evolve into resolve to positively change something about one’s life or society. Having that evened out by a pill, removes the insight and motivation that can come from it. What is a bit “depressing” is that even in the midst of things being as bad as they are right now for most Americans…no one is out in the street marching on the banks or the insurance companies or the other corporations oppressing the people and their democracy. They are the root of this evil, even Lieberman would not be an issue today if he wasn’t in the pockets of CT insurance companies. I think there needs to be more of a focused revolt against all of these corporations, they are financing the lobbyists, they are buying the politicians, they are creating the financial inequity in pay and income. The collapse on the Health Care Reform bill tells us that the majority can’t get what it wants through its representatives. Then we need to stop looking to others to represent our interests and represent them ourselves. » Posted By AdLib On December 16, 2009 @ 12:28 pm Cheers boomer! When we get into the saboteur mentality, that is a very selfish and destructive thing. Arsonists are motivated by the desire to feel powerful, that they can affect the lives of so many people, even if it is doing something horrible. I think that describes Lieberman fully. » Posted By AdLib On December 16, 2009 @ 12:10 pm Thanks so much Cher! Looking forward to it! » Posted By AdLib On December 16, 2009 @ 12:06 pm choicelady, cheers to you for your ongoing generosity to those around you. You and others here affirm what is best about human beings, compassion for others. You are so right about “the enemy being us” as well when it comes to being narrow minded and self-centered. Solipsists aren’t limited to one party or the other. That’s a huge disappointment, when you realize that people you have felt so attuned with suddenly step out of line and declare something that exposes how self-centered they are…through prejudice, greed, emotional gratification, etc.. There are those who seek the truth, even if it proves they were wrong about an assumption or belief. Then there are those who are convicted and refuse to see truths that are incompatible with their conviction. I don’t understand the mindset of being intentionally ignorant because one wants to feel righteous. As for how big The Planet is, we’ve only been officially open about four months but get thousands of visits from members and readers in 55 countries. We have been growing each week too. PlanetPOV was set up with this very sentiment as a guiding force, encouraging the sense of community, respect for everyone else no matter their POV and expressing our concerns about what’s going on in the world and society around us. I not so humbly hope what we write about and discuss here can make a difference in the life of at least one member/reader and ultimately, we can use this as a think tank to actively advance positive agendas and initiatives. » Posted By AdLib On December 16, 2009 @ 12:04 pm That’s how Obama won. People power, it does work. » Posted By AdLib On December 16, 2009 @ 5:54 pm On one hand, I can’t imagine the Congress or the current Supreme Court curbing lobbying or corporate “buying” of Congress so I think efforts to stop lobbying would be futile. My suggestion is to accept that this game will continue and try to compete and win at it. Just as The Planet represents the voices of real people, it would make a lot of sense to create an online organization that gathers contributions from citizens throughout the country to contribute to and lobby politicians to represent us, the people of the United States. In the same model as Obama’s online contributions, if enough Americans donated to create a lobby for itself, we could compete with and “buy back” our politicians to work in our interest. I know it sucks, our representatives are just that and should be working for us anyway but we all know that it doesn’t work that way in reality. So, we either play the game or sit on the sidelines booing those who play it (and win). Such a venture would need to start small and grow grass roots style…though it would need to be actively marketed to potential contributors. It should be a non-profit and couldn’t have any huge investors since that could undermine, at a minimum, the appearance of the independence of such a fund. You can’t win if you don’t play. » Posted By AdLib On December 16, 2009 @ 11:04 am Excellent points. It is a joke, the excuses Pharma gives for not importing drugs. How many people have died from taking pharms in Canada? Shouldn’t even ask the question, it’s validating the obvious bullshit excuses. How could the Repubs pass so many horrible bills and the Dems can’t pass anything without it being hugely corrupted? » Posted By AdLib On December 15, 2009 @ 8:02 pm A very dark and depressing day in Montana Not at all, glad you shared it. You’ve shared how things have been tough, really pleased to hear when something cool happens too! » Posted By AdLib On December 15, 2009 @ 8:07 pm A big fat congrats!!! Nice to hear some good news tonight! Cheers! » Posted By AdLib On December 15, 2009 @ 7:58 pm Very sorry to hear this. And 417 jobs is a huge amount for a community of that size. Yet, in our news widget, the top story is: Evidence that the economic rebound could eventually raise inflationary pressures emerged in a report Tuesday that wholesale prices surged last month. Most economists aren’t worried, though. They think the economy remains too weak for the price increases to last. So…the prices on things are going up even though people are more and more out of work? Inflation??? The scary thing is, if this alleged recovery is just PR and not real, it could send inflation up on perception alone while people remain unemployed. » Posted By AdLib On December 15, 2009 @ 10:30 am It is a slow process but legalization is becoming de facto here in CA. The medical marijuana bill did help push it along and the Obama Admin declaring they won’t continue Bush era interference and persecutions on marijuana possession all pushes it forward. As you say, if it was formally legal and taxed, it would mean at least between $1 and $2 billion in revenue for CA and many jobs. Yet, thanks to the right wing wackos, it’s still seen as opening oneself up to being “pro-drugs-for-pre-schoolers on up” by politicians. » Posted By AdLib On December 15, 2009 @ 10:24 am Sleep well, get stronger and feel better my friend! » Posted By AdLib On December 15, 2009 @ 7:39 pm KQ, according to this bill, anyone who is seen as a higher risk, especially older people, can be charged a premium 3 times higher than anyone else. Even if the gov’t is subsidizing, how much of that huge premium will it cover and why should insurance companies have a free hand to grab as much tax money as they want, by raising their premiums whenever they want? Also, there are loopholes to the pre-existing conditions provision. I think the political game aspect of this is not reliable. Obama may initially get some credit but as I say, when the rubber hits the road, when many find that even with some government subsidy they’re not much better off, reality will intrude. » Posted By AdLib On December 15, 2009 @ 7:35 pm If you didn’t see Howard Dean on KO today, explaining his call to kill the bill, check it out: Visit msnbc.com for breaking news, world news, and news about the economy » Posted By AdLib On December 15, 2009 @ 7:23 pm bito, yep! Have to say “if” because I can’t say I’m 100% positive that this will be the case…but I am 97% sure. Everyone, even Obama, have stopped referring to a public option or affordable health care for all. It makes me angry and a bit sad. » Posted By AdLib On December 15, 2009 @ 6:49 pm First, hope you’re feeling better! Second, you may be right. Third, it may not matter. If reform changes little for many progressives, their premiums remain expensive and their rates keep going up to where they can’t really afford it, no amount of MSM happy talk will alter reality. I am afraid Obama may be too optimistic about the public’s reaction to passing the shards of health care reform. Some will indeed be grateful, those who get government support (and that’s a good thing). However, those still under the heavy thumb of insurance companies who wanted a public option, like me, will still be pissed off. Not really at Obama, though I think he blew it by stepping back and allowing Congress to do it all (I know he was behind the scenes but we could’ve used him publicly riding Dems to get them on board). I’m pissed off at Harry Reid and I am furious at Lieberman. I saw 81% of Dems want his chairmanship pulled. Does anyone here think Harry Reid will do that? Not me. In 2010 and 2012 I will be a powerful supporter for those Dems who fought hard to get a strong reform bill but I will do everything I can to attack and defeat the campaigns of all Dems (and Lieberman) who smothered the soul of this bill. » Posted By AdLib On December 15, 2009 @ 6:42 pm I’m usually an optimist but I have to say, it’s all spin now. Here’s the problem with that, if the bill forces all Americans to pay insurance companies premiums that have no cost controls, and this bill provides none, the middle class could be decimated if not gone well before any further reform could ever be passed. And many will die in the meantime because they still can’t afford health insurance. Yes, some will be helped and that’s good but others will be prisoners of insurance companies with the U.S. gov’t and the IRS as their enforcers. This situation so sucks. » Posted By AdLib On December 15, 2009 @ 6:32 pm Welcome back. I ate your cookie though. Sorry, I thought you were gone. URP! » Posted By AdLib On December 15, 2009 @ 10:14 am See ya later, have a great day! » Posted By AdLib On December 15, 2009 @ 10:07 am The fines were around $4,000 originally. They were reduced to around $2,000. » Posted By AdLib On December 15, 2009 @ 9:59 am Welcome to The Planet, Mightywoof! Thanks for the encouragement. Even if our Senate gives up on affordable health care for all and single payer, we won’t. » Posted By AdLib On December 15, 2009 @ 9:58 amComments Posted By AdLib
2 : a controlling class of the wealthy
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