Vox Populi, our weekly live chat about the week’s events begins tonight at 7:00pm PST. Hope to see you then!

AdLiba day ago

That you, TW?

AdLiba day ago

You’re not signed in yet.

AdLiba day ago

Hey Murph!

AdLiba day ago

Nope….it’s me…early for a change.

MurphTheSurf3

a day ago

Heh!

AdLiba day ago

You get the hors d’oeurves when they’re fresh.

AdLiba day ago

Not to mention the top shelf liquor

MurphTheSurf3

a day ago

TW is here but not signed on, guess there’s an issue.

AdLiba day ago

Can someone do that…be here and not be signed in?

MurphTheSurf3

a day ago

Yep, if you’re not signed into your account, you can read Vox but appear as a “Guest”.

AdLiba day ago

Hey TW! There you are!

AdLiba day ago

Good evening everyone.

twilson117

a day ago

Ah…there is TW…the phantom.

MurphTheSurf3

a day ago

Ad….I did not know that…

MurphTheSurf3

a day ago

Yep, anyone’s welcome just to drop in and read along, don’t even need an account at The Planet.

AdLiba day ago

Ad…..how welcoming!

MurphTheSurf3

a day ago

So…I’d guess you’ve both seen the video?

AdLiba day ago

Murph The Phatom was one of my favorite comics in the newspaper

twilson117

a day ago

TW….really? Why?

MurphTheSurf3

a day ago

Ad…yes, I have seen the videos.

MurphTheSurf3

a day ago

Ad yes I’ve seen it.

twilson117

a day ago

Notice, so far there is no rioting because the sharp police chief and DA acted quickly to fire and charge the murderers?

AdLiba day ago

ad…..good observation.

MurphTheSurf3

a day ago

Murph I just thought it was so cool that the someone could do what he did.

twilson117

a day ago

TW…can you say more about that…..

MurphTheSurf3

a day ago

It’s the fruustration that killers usually seem to get away with killing young black men and women just because they wear a badge. This swift action defuses that justifiable anger and frustration.

AdLiba day ago

Murph and there was great back story as to how he came about.

twilson117

a day ago

Ad I saw the video and it was hard to process regardless of how quickly action was taken.

twilson117

a day ago

I saw a very pissed off BLM rep on MSNBC laying down truth that all those talking about “training” are full of BS, saying to just wait until training changes things. Wait, how long? That was a clear point she made.

AdLiba day ago

TW….the Phantom has been branded as jingoistic, imperialistic and racist……I take it that is not your take.

MurphTheSurf3

a day ago

It’s not at all about police training, it’s about police feeling free of consequence to throw around their power and brutality.

AdLiba day ago

TW – Did you see The Phantom movie?

AdLiba day ago

Ad, no it’s not, it was just a damn comic strip written at a time that type of story was popular. Hell, they could say that about Superman and Sgt Rock of Easy Company, granted they were Comic books but very ,much along the lines of what you just said.

twilson117

a day ago

I have been a witness to heated debates between fire fighters and police officers about the differences in philosophy, and culture that shape them.

MurphTheSurf3

a day ago

Ad yes I saw the movie they need to do a remake in my opinion.

twilson117

a day ago

I think a federal law should be passed that strips police of qualified immunity AND forces the police department, police union and individuals who are guilty of paying all judgements for wrongful death and abuse. I guarantee, the rampant killings would stop quickly.

AdLiba day ago

Why should police be granted immunity? What is the principle that those granted great power should be free from responsibility of abusing it?

AdLiba day ago

A fire fighter friend frequently points out that the police make a point of emphasizing how important it is for their officers to be safe, sound, and well at the end of their shifts (which then become their primary motivation) while firefighters regularly say that the first duty of a fire fighter is to be willing to give his life.

MurphTheSurf3

a day ago

Ad I heard what she was saying and 98% of what she was saying was spot on the 2% that I have a problem with is something folks don’t realize and that has to do with the budgets of small town police departments.

twilson117

a day ago

That’s just crazy. And police unions are just plain evil and sociopathic, they express disdain for the lives of everyone other than cops. They need to be reigned in hard.

AdLiba day ago

Murph – So true, firefighters knowingly put their lives on the line to save people. Cops excuse their brutality and murders of innocents on, “I had to protect myself, I felt threatened.” Completely opposite motivations as you said.

AdLiba day ago

Ad not disagreeing with you but is that the job of unions, there members first management last?

twilson117

a day ago

I learned a lot about the dichotomy when I lived in New York….9/11. Firefighters regularly pointed out that as the police were charging out of the towers, their people were charging in.

MurphTheSurf3

a day ago

TW – Good point, nobody’s 100% right, especially aggressive activists but 98% is pretty good. She did put her finger on the real problem, the problem of mindless fury, ego, and lack of self-restraint as well as there being no incentive for one of them to intervene and prevent a raging cop or multiple ones, as in this case, from assaulting citizens.

AdLiba day ago

TW – Not exactly, unions are definitely about protecting and improving the lives of their members…but not at the sacrifice of the lives of others. Police unions are mercenary, they justify the most brutal and unwarranted attacks by out-of-control cops against innocent people. Can’t name any other union in the country that does that.

AdLiba day ago

Ad I will say this, I will be thinking about this situation and video for some time.

twilson117

a day ago

And police unions are a one-of-a-kind union. No other union represents people who have extraordinary power over the majority. The reason for unions is just the opposite, to band together those who are otherwise powerless to stand against the powerful corporations and bosses.

AdLiba day ago

Ad I agree police unions are a different breed.

twilson117

a day ago

Side note- one of the very sore points between the police and firefighters in NY is that the police had up to date communications system while the firefighters were using much outdated ones. Why? The mayor needed the budget money and thought the police needed them more (not to mention that the police union was far more fervent in its support than the firefighers. And, did you know that the reason that mayor was roaming the streets in the aftermath (and acting the hero for doing it) was because the emergency command center was in the Towers in space that the mayor wanted filled so he filled it with city monies for the command center. That mayor- Giuliani.

MurphTheSurf3

a day ago

TW – Same here. Those who haven’t had to live with institutionalized racism threatening them as a potential any day they walk out their door have to really think about the lives of their neighbors and friends who’ve had to have “the talk” from their parents and as parents.

AdLiba day ago

Murph you hit on a major point. Budgets for Firefighters and Unions especially in big cities. It’s always a fight who will get what, and it seems it comes down to which union showed up more at rallies in support of the mayor.

twilson117

a day ago

TW- that makes sense as well…..

MurphTheSurf3

a day ago

Murph – Yes, I knew that and it made me furious that people praised Giuliani and called him America’s Mayor when he was personally responsible for the communications going out in the Twin Towers and the deaths of so many of those police and firefighters were on his hands.

AdLiba day ago

Ad….I suspected you knew this…..G was and is a snake.

MurphTheSurf3

a day ago

CL is in the house

twilson117

a day ago

Hello choice….

MurphTheSurf3

a day ago

Very simply, it’s the power dynamic. Police have power and firefighters don’t. Police can kill and harass, they can have a sickout and let people be harmed and killed, mayors also depend heavily on them to reduce crime to support their re-elections. Firefighters just save people’s lives and homes, that’s all.

AdLiba day ago

Hey CL!

AdLiba day ago

Hi ya’ll! Hope you’re well! Sorry I’m late. The salmon was awkward. Good though!

choicelady

a day ago

Ad….it is a culture of real, unselfish service, vs. a culture that plays at power.

MurphTheSurf3

a day ago

“Waiter, I’ll have the Awkward Salmon, please.”

AdLiba day ago

Ad the police do have more power than the FF that’s for sure.

twilson117

a day ago

“Can I have my Salmon ala Awk-Ward with Hollandaise, please?”

MurphTheSurf3

a day ago

Murph – Exactly, I think firefighters are almost the opposite of cops.

AdLiba day ago

Ad – Joyce Reid said there are three versions of policing – guardian, protect and serve, warrior. It’s this last dynamic that kills people.

choicelady

a day ago

Ad – you have a new entree! Sweeping the nation with it!

choicelady

a day ago

CL – The incentives and the ego-satisfying choice for too many cops is “warrior”. I’ve heard that before and I think it is spot on. Cops should not be warriors, they should be guardians.

AdLiba day ago

They do not speak of this often…..but there is a deep divide between those who fight fires (and make up nearly all of the EMTs and Ambulance Services) do not find the police admirable by and large.

MurphTheSurf3

a day ago

“And my friend here will have the Bumbling Burger.”

AdLiba day ago

OK – how do we stop this? Dunno if I told you about the time I got racially profiled. Long story that was sort of funny AND pissed me off. Mistaken identity – I’m so WASP I buzz. But I was leaving the funeral of a Mexian American woman whose son I knew. And I got followed for MILES by a Sac PD cruiser. I can ONLY imagine the thrill he got when my VERY WASP name and my husband’s French one came back clearn.

choicelady

a day ago

Murph – The motivation for many who become cops is the desire for power. The motivation for many who become firefighters is to be heroes. Huge difference.

AdLiba day ago

Ad…agreed.

MurphTheSurf3

a day ago