Vox Populi – 6-7-2013

KillgoreTrout : Have a wonderful weekend.

KillgoreTrout : CL, I love conversations about theology, metaphysics and existentialism. I would gladly take this up in the near future. I have to do the music thing before my brain shuts down for the night.

choicelady : KT – delighted to be with you, delightful conversation. Have a good sleep. See you on the Music thread tomorrow. Be well!

KillgoreTrout : I too must say goodnight. I have to start working on the music thread before I run out of steam. Thanks for the great discourse and hosting CL.

choicelady : KT – no. He wasn’t even gargling when we spoke. I had to call him – he was the only one who could fix it all. He sounded fine!

choicelady : KT – yes, but not ‘ageless’ discussants! How are you for more talk? If you wish to pack it in, we can. I don’t see Sabreen even though she’s apparently logged in. Feel free to head off to dreamland even if it’s a bit early.

KillgoreTrout : Gee, I hope Ad didn’t drown, with all that water boarding going on.

KillgoreTrout : Ha, very true CL. These are ageless subjects.

choicelady : Murph – the main thing is for you to rest and keep up your strength. These discussions have gone on for 2000 years. I think they’ll be around next week! Be well – sweet dreams!

KillgoreTrout : Sleep well Murph.

choicelady : Murph – Jesus’ thoughts are certainly pre-figured in many of the OT books. Justice runs through all the wisdom of the prophets. I am horrified though at how little that seems to impact conservatives today. Witness that self styled ‘christian’ representative from TN who misreads “the poor ye shall always have with you” to justify cutting food stamp funding. Yikes!

MurphTheSurf3 : Well….we introduced an intriguing topic in the late session of Vox….wish I had the wakefulness to continue it but I am off to bed. Thanks one and all.

KillgoreTrout : Murph, it actually doesn’t matter to me. As I said, it’s the awareness and wisdom that counts, no matter where it comes from. There is a definite objective/subjec tive split between Eastern religions and Western religions. I think a precise melding of the two is probably a good thing.

choicelady : Murph – that’s why Jesus’ teachings are so amazing. They are truly universal. I am simply fascinated by the possibility. And more to the point – he lived in an entrepot where if he did not travel widely, others passed by him. We know how much cultures and ideas have impacted one another, it would not strain credulity to think he learned and listened as scholars, traders, travelers,all came his way even if he never left his own land. His evolution from a fairly bratty youth to this amazing visionary is powerful no matter WHO influenced his thought.

MurphTheSurf3 : KT and Choice…yes I know about the efforts to give Issa some farther eastern roots….it’s just not very convincing….Hi s teachings are an expression of and an expansion of the wisdom tradition of the late Old Testament (i.e. the Book of Sirach for ex.), the teachings of the Essenic and Pharisaical community, and the common life of the Jews not bound to the temple.

KillgoreTrout : Have a great weekend funk.

choicelady : funk – good night! I missed your departure!

KillgoreTrout : Not really Murph. Spirituality is actually quite simple. Love thy neighbor as you love yourself. The Tao says love the world as you love yourself and you can be trusted to care for all things. To me, spirituality is an awareness that we are all just tiny parts of a much larger whole. The one true god theory is an actual denunciation of spirituality.

choicelady : Murph – that is the problem, isn’t it? But if we can learn from one another, then our own coming together even in tradition – Episcopal, Methodist, UCC – can be open to other people’s sense of oneness in Tao, in indigenous traditions, etc. More and more churches here are incorporating Native ideas, Buddhist teachings, etc. Spirituality can be flighty or it can be a means to grow larger even within a traditional framework. And one does not HAVE to do that to be whole and open and loving.

choicelady : Murph – there is a small theological/hist orical group looking at the Eastern stories of Issa (the later Muslim name for Jesus) whose legacy in Tibet etc. is documented. It is an inquiry that all churches rejected as heresy for centuries, but now it’s being revived, and people are trying to see if maybe during those 18 missing years, he did actually travel, learned, grew in very different ways. His vision is SO radical compared to the times, it is at least intriguing.

KillgoreTrout : Murph, I see no problem with that, but the eastern travel thing has been speculated by more than a few. It doesn’t matter where wisdon comes from, as long as people become aware of such wisdom. Religious people who have humility and genuine faith are great people. It’s the assholes that try to use religion to manipulate others that I have a problem with, and heaven knows, there are far too many of that sort around these days.

MurphTheSurf3 : By funk- thanks for the tip about our nuclear fighter.

MurphTheSurf3 : Choice- “spirituality” is so loose a term that it is almost impossible to frame in a meaningful way that interacts with church formation and community life experiences.

funksands : I really really hate to leave this thread when you three get going, but my son has a friend over for a sleep-over and my wife is expecting me to “help” or something. Have a great weekend and don’t solve all of the world’s problems until next week okay?

choicelady : KT – my work is grounded in that – spirituality. While I know only ONE Bible verse by heart (Jesus wept), I am moved by ALL the spiritual reading everywhere. The search for truth is not bounded. Anyone who thinks it is, loses out. For some people rules are essential since they screwed up their lives. So be it. But they have GOT to stop putting those rules on everyone else.

MurphTheSurf3 : KT- a word about Jesus. I know of no indication that he traveled into the Eastern World. Most of those who have really studied this say that was a carpenter whose mother was in his care (and thus he was unmarried) and that he had an awakening in midlife. Almost everything we think we know is a guess so I narrow in on his teachings as a worthwhile guide to living a worthwhile life.

KillgoreTrout : CL, I noticed that. Pretty cool, and quite true.

choicelady : funk – there is a growing movement to embrace quantum physics as a way of getting to “the meaning of it all”, and yes, I think this is the MOST exciting thing in the history of religion, spirituality, science all in one.

funksands : KT, very very true.

KillgoreTrout : It’s definitely on my list.

choicelady : KT – we both said almost exactly the same thing!

funksands : I would highly recommend a book I just finished “Why Does the World Exist?- An Existential Detective Story” by Jim Holt. It mixes theology, advanced science and math and very abstract philosophy. Very interesting read.

choicelady : Murph – I agree, but I think overall people are looking for spirituality and declining denominational rigidity. What comes of that is anybody’s guess. I do know churches with a real sense of purpose grow, and those that just go through the motions die. Those spewing hate are dwindling, too. The young folks are just NOT as rigid as the older generations. Less interested in proving their superiority!

KillgoreTrout : People, especially younger people are moving more toward spirituality and away from orthodox religion. Spirituality and religion are not always the same thing. I actually believe that the belief in “one true god,” is antithetical to genuine spirituality.

MurphTheSurf3 : Choice- your experience is like mine. The Anglican Movement by the traditionalists has strengthened the middle of the road Episcopal communities.

choicelady : KT – you will like it. It’s very wonderful both irreverant and mystical. Beautiful wonderful funny book.

choicelady : Murph – she totally ROCKS,doesn’t she! I have met Gene Robinson several times, and he’s amazing. It’s all growing in spirit and some in people. When the ultra righties left our central valley in protest, the churches started to GROW not shrink as those sick of the hate came BACK to the San Joaquin Diocese. We are almost back to full count! People want to belong to something based on love and inclusion, not hate and bigotry.

MurphTheSurf3 : Funk-+- the issue of growing is complex…I think in general church affiliation is declining. And, frankly, so is faith orientation.

KillgoreTrout : I believe the tougher the road, the more wisdom is gained. A bit Spartan of me, but I do believe that.

funksands : Choice, I’m with KT, that sounds like a great read.

MurphTheSurf3 : Choice- and who is our leader? The Most Rev. Dr. Katharine Jefferts Schori,a scientist and a mom, the modern woman.

choicelady : funk – I can only imagine her hardships. Being a ‘walkaway’ today is THE largest faith movement. It is eroding the religious right a lot. Our mainline Protestant churches ARE growing but slowly, but they are doing so in some part by merging. In a century there probably won’t be denominations but spiritual affinities. That could be all encompassing, no rules and directives – wow.

KillgoreTrout : I really must read that, sometime soon.

funksands : Choice/Murph are the rolls of these churches expanding or contracting? Is there a long-term future with some of the organization you belong to/affiliate with?

funksands : CL, very hard. Being a lefty agnostic atheist in the middle of that environment is a tough road to travel alone.

choicelady : KT – that’s the subject of the hilarious book, “Lamb” by Christopher Moore. Alpha Bitch read it and loves it as do I. It tells the story of those ‘missing gospels’ and it’s bawdy, irreverant, and amazingly wonderful. It sets down Jesus’ trip and his inclusion of Tao, Buddhism, etc. and how those opened his eyes to something wonderful. That the religous right is trying to shut down!

MurphTheSurf3 : CL- 75 percent of all scout units are in churches and 60 percent of those are from the LDS, the RC and the Methodists. The evangelical, pentecostal, fundamentalist crowd tend to already have church based “scout like” groups.

KillgoreTrout : Murph, I think that’s great. All religions are simply different paths to the same understanding. Think how much more peaceful this world would be if everyone had the same attitude.

choicelady : funk – that’s amazing. Her journey must have been both wonderful and very hard. Good for her!

choicelady : Murph – that’s very close to where I land, too. I’m going to an ordination tomorrow of a man who is a leader in Integrity, the GLBT Episcopal group. He’s being ordained as a Deacon. Around America it has now become noteworthy to mention when an Episcopal bishop is NOT gay. The church is vibrant in its inclusiveness! And they have GREAT music!

KillgoreTrout : I know there are 18 years of Jesus’s life that are “missing,” from the bible and history books. It is believed that during that time, he was in the orient and India. I wouldn’t be surprised.

choicelady : KT – I totally agree with Ghandi.

funksands : Choice, not sure. She took the really hard path of finding her own way and own thoughts in the middle of Utah and Idaho and the church. She recently became an apostate. I’m so proud of her!

MurphTheSurf3 : CL and KT…I refer to myself as a Christian Humanist associated with the Episcopal Church because of its worship style, social justice positions, recognition of women and gays in leadership, and its comfortable with my religious/philos ophical stance.

KillgoreTrout : CL, like Ghandi once famously said, I like your Jesus, but am not too crazy about his fans.”

choicelady : Murph – the Methodists increasingly thumb their noses at the Southern Methodists. But lots of evangelical and Pentecostals are breaking with BSA. How stupid.

choicelady : KT – there are serious scholars who believe Tao influenced Jesus had only two “rules” one of which is love thy neighbor. VERY radical in his time. And ours for that matter. Otherwise it’s all about being open, kind, loving, and promoting justice. All the religious rules are entirely manmade and derived from LOUSY interpretations of the Old Testament that was written in tribal times. it’s a history of moral evolution if only people would SEE that, and I’d not doubt that Tao entered Jesus’ consciousness and views. It’s his followers who crap it up.

MurphTheSurf3 : Funk- The Methodists, the Latter Day Saints and the RC’s have all said- at the national policy making level- that they are ok with the BSA position on gay scouts. I was surprised. The Southern Baptists are probably going to leave BSA as a body.

KillgoreTrout : CL, that’s exactly why I am a Taoist. No rules, no promise of heaven or threat of hell. The Tao is just 81 ideograms of pure wisdom. Very moral and spiritual though. Written 500 years BEFORE the birth of Christ.

choicelady : funk – but your younger in-laws got it about the BSA decision. THAT means they’ve moved beyond Gohmert. How’d your wife turn out so cool?

funksands : CL, alas my in-laws are not. They are Gohmert-Type RWNJ’s. Very disturbing.

choicelady : funk – WOW – that’s pretty dramatic indication over generational differences. Most of the Mormons I know here are very liberal. Seems contradictory, but it’s not. Times they are a-changing.

choicelady : Good night Sue – I will come down soon with the book and the beads. Thanks for helping! Hugs!

KillgoreTrout : Very cool Sue. Have a great weekend.

choicelady : KT – you’re not a traditional Roman Catholic who goes to mass daily and lives for other people’s expectations of you. That is the part of religion that infuriates me – it’s all about rules, rigidity, and it lacks the core of Jesus’ principle about unbounded love. I cannot see how parents could reject a child for any reason. Well- maybe if they became a Limbaugh Republican…

KillgoreTrout : Thanks CL. She really deserves to be happy.

funksands : Night Sue!

funksands : You know, there is hope. My Mormon right-wing nut job in-laws got into a knock-down drag out over gays in the Boy Scouts. Father-in-law started ranting about it and his RWNJ kids took him to task over it. Pretty sweet.

SueInCa : Well it has been a slice tonight but I am getting ready to get back to orders I have piled up. It is nice to have the business but I have to produce and I like to just design. Does not work that way alas…..good night everyone. Will be by later in the afternoon for the weekend music KT

KillgoreTrout : That’s too bad about the contrary family. We can’t help who are children are at heart. I would NEVER do that to my daughter.

choicelady : funk – I no longer can drink beer. It’s wheat, and I’m wheat intolerant to a fare-thee-well. So I live vicariously through you and Sue! Yum!

KillgoreTrout : That’s great Sue.

choicelady : KT – yes, having it legal where you live is very important. I hope it happens soon for her!

SueInCa : I am not a beer experimenter Funk. I have my old standby, Corona Light and nothing else

KillgoreTrout : CL, no, not yet. I think it’s just a matter of time now. They could get married in Washington, but it wouldn’t be recognized in Oregon yet.

choicelady : KT – damn,that must have been awful for her. Used and abused. I’m doubly happy for her now! The wedding I’m attending in WA is two women. I’m very happy for them after six years together. One’s family refuses to come though, so we are standing in for them, dammit to hell. I get traditional views, I really do, but…

funksands : :beer:

SueInCa : Oh I see KT she is fine, we are helping out as she finally found a job int he medical field – medical billing so she will move out soon enough. She lived in San Diego for many years so we are happy to have her

KillgoreTrout : Sue, is that good, or not so good?

funksands : India Pale Ale. Extra bitter. YUM!

KillgoreTrout : CL, yeah, she’s been burned a few times by girls that were just “experimenting. ” She is absolutely in love and it’s reciprocated. They plan on marriage some day.

choicelady : KT – I forget – is marriage equality legal in Oregon now? I can’t keep up it’s all changing so fast!

SueInCa : what is an IPA?

funksands : It doesn’t take much to make me really happy….

funksands : KT, so not married? No kids? Not yet anyway?

choicelady : funk – oh, how lovely of her to do that for you! Dry your tears and enjoy.

SueInCa : KT She lives WITH me lol

choicelady : KT – that is so wonderful! Not even knowing her, I’m happy for her. Lovely!

funksands : I opened my fridge and saw my wife bought me a lovely IPA. I had no idea it was there. I’m weeping.

KillgoreTrout : Sue, does your daughter live near you?

choicelady : Sue – I saw that!!!! I am chortling over the fact that we were asked by Catholic Charities to support their ‘freedom of religion’ over NOT having contraceptive coverage for their employees – and now they have one of the Covered CA grants to promote ACA health care. Seems principles bow to money every time…

KillgoreTrout : Funk, she is gay and has met the love of her life, two years ago. I am so happy for her. She’s been through some romantic disappointments in her life.

funksands : Sue, I count them every…..single …..day…. That said, I’m headed back there for a week at the end of the month to see family.

SueInCa : KT she is a year younger than my daughter

SueInCa : I can think of a lot of reasons to leave Idaho

choicelady : funk – that’s what they say. A/C helps, but it’s just sometimes to the point where it’s unbreathable. I am NOT a fan of hot weather, and I miss the thunderstorms of the Midewest and the real seasonal changes. Sigh.

funksands : KT, does she have kids? Married?

SueInCa : You all might like this link, it is about the Repigs asking for ACA money behind people’s backs lol. «link»

KillgoreTrout : Funk, she’ll be 39 in November. My how time flies, eh?

choicelady : Sue – and that makes total sense to me. It’s horrid.

funksands : 109 Already? Ack! That’s why I left Boise.

SueInCa : THAT is why I got out of Rocklin CL

choicelady : funk – I really appreciate that. Whatever one lives with 24/7, the change is wonderful. We are 105 today, projected 109 tomorrow. And it’s only June. Ugh. When it gets those long, hot stretches, the sky turns milky, and it’s disgusting.

funksands : KT how old is your daughter, if I may ask?

KillgoreTrout : Pretty funny funk.

choicelady : KT – I am seriously going to try. I usually am in Y’town, so it’s not REALLY near, but I will see if I can get your way.

funksands : CL, August is 80 and sunny every damn day. It’s pretty dull for you Sacro types. It’s heaven for us.

SueInCa : I love the fog too CL

KillgoreTrout : CL, if you ever make it to Columbus, it would be great to have a meet and greet.

choicelady : funk – well, we will keep that in mind should you disappear in August. I’ve been up there in April and it was lovely, in July, smashing, and fall – OK. Never in August before. I will look forward to it though I DO like rain and fog. Miss that here. I have reverse seasonal affective disorder – too much sun makes me crazy.

funksands : Sue, its awesome. On June 21st we nearly always have a bbq. You can read a book outside until almost 10. I love it.

SueInCa : Funk I was there a few times and was shocked at how light it stays for so long in the day. We got out of dinner about 9 and it was just starting to turn to dusk

choicelady : KT – I know, but I have NO time since I’m flying from a conference in LA right to Seattle. So Ohio is our best bet. I should be there later in Fall if all goes well.

funksands : If I ever left Seattle in August it would mean i am on the run from the law

SueInCa : Not at all Funk. I hate to read that stuff and I got through it all with no problem, you broke it down just right

KillgoreTrout : CL, how cool would that be if we were there at the same time, at least for a day.

choicelady : KT – enjoy! I will be back on Lummi in Sept. briefly for a wedding, but we’re flying – right over you in Portland. Damn. Well, next time I’m in Ohio…

funksands : Thanks Sue, I appreciate it. I’m thinking I should have broken it up into two separate pieces though. It was a lot to digest in retrospect.

SueInCa : Hqa Ha Funk we are still Cool and have a town by that name to prove it, Weed too

choicelady : funk – oh, touch YOU on the figuratively cooler… But you’re right. Sigh.

funksands : Choice, we NEVER leave town in August. We wait all year for it.

KillgoreTrout : CL, only for 5 days. But those five days are long overdue. It will be in early September. It’s absolutely beautiful there that time of year.

SueInCa : Funk that was an excellent write up on SS you did. I hate getting down in the weeds with that kind of stuff, it was a big help

funksands : Sue the Northwest is way cooler than California, literally and figuratively.

choicelady : funk – if at ALL possible I hope to meet you. Will you be around in early August? I will be on Lummi I think with trips to Bellingham now and then.

funksands : I get down to Portland a few times a year, I need to look her up.

choicelady : KT – I hope I have some time this summer to stop and meet her, too. I just am swamped with work, so my trip time is very limited – AGAIN.

SueInCa : I wish I lived up there. Me and Sally are going to get together one of these days. I want to do a beading supplier trip up that way

choicelady : Sue – yes, Patsy is off. She might come back, but I guess everyone basically though their computer was the problem. It wasn’t.

KillgoreTrout : CL, I plan to. I hope she and her hubby can have a nice dinner with me and my daughter. It would be a great time.

SueInCa : Have a great time KT Portland is so beautiful. Did Patsy leave?

choicelady : KT – lovely opportunity. Enjoy! How long will you be in Portland?

funksands : KT, couldn’t pick a better time to come as you well know.

choicelady : Sue – they’ll never take you alive. We’ll defend you!

KillgoreTrout : funk, I need to visit my daughter. It’s been too long since I’ve been able to get back out there and spend some quality time with her.

SueInCa : Yes KT she lives near where you are going. Oh shit CL they saw my comment on my Berkeley student babysitting adventures today lol

choicelady : Murph – save the rubber duckies!!!

MurphTheSurf3 : Sue- black submarines in my bathtub…..OMG!

choicelady : Sue – that’s just the typical drug sweep. Nothing about you.

choicelady : KT – awesome trip! See Sally while your there!

SueInCa : Um hmmm there are black helicopters flying over my house right now

funksands : KT, that’s awesome that you are headed back out here. How come?

choicelady : Sue – I just talked with AdLib. He’s almost dry, but he SWEARS he never ratted us out.

MurphTheSurf3 : Funk-thanks for the info. I hope Patsy writes something to share the venture. I need to look up the plant in the news.

choicelady : funk – I was at back to back conferences last week, and the trip home was very dicey. The car wheezed, too. I just sunk a wad into it, and it runs like a top. But this computer is on its last legs. It’s always something to suck money out of your wallet, isn’t it?

KillgoreTrout : funk, I’m planning a trip to Portland Oregon and am hoping my computer will hold out for another couple of months. The trip will be rather expensive.

SueInCa : Ok Adlib I know you were really with the NSA and you turned us all in. I put on my tin foil rabbit ears and am waiting to be picked up

choicelady : Any computer sounds as bad as my car – time for a new one.

funksands : Choice, yeah it was pretty bad. I held out as long as i could and was finally forced to get a new computer.

choicelady : Murph – Patsy shut down the nuke in So. CA!!!!

funksands : Murph, San Onofre got permanently shut down today.

choicelady : Mruph – please tell bourne we’re back on if she wants to join in, and howdy to her, too if she can’t.

MurphTheSurf3 : Funk- Patsy….she did what?

choicelady : funk – gasping and wheezing? I sure hope you’re talking about your computer. That sounds horrible.

funksands : So the utility was really losing 30 million a MONTH idling that plant? No wonder they shut it down…

MurphTheSurf3 : Choice- Bourne just e mailed – passes along a hello…

choicelady : Murph – Patsy was one of the driving forces shutting down San Onofre nuclear power plant in Southern CA. That’s why we’ve not heard from her for a long time – her entire life has been doing that, and today it was success!!!

choicelady : funk – and yes, kudos all night to Patsy!

choicelady : Hey funk – your timing is great. We were knocked off the internet for several very long minutes. AdLib is away for the moment, but he reset it via his phone, so we’re good to go.

MurphTheSurf3 : Sue- if you are here….I have read your articles here and like them a lot. Just no time to respond as I want to. Bourne also says hello.

funksands : KT, I finally had to retire mine. The gasping and wheezing just got too distracting.

KillgoreTrout : funk is in da widget! What’s up funk?

choicelady : KT – this was a ‘system error’ that AdLib was able to reset from his phone. So I don’t think it’s your computer or mine or even NSA.

MurphTheSurf3 : Funk…Patsy did what?

funksands : Howdy! How about Patsy single-handedly shutting down a nuclear reactor????? Woo hoo!

choicelady : Murph – well the damage was small, the WORK was NOT. I hope you got through it OK? Did not overtax YOU I hope?

KillgoreTrout : Well, it’s good to be back. I thought it was my computer, it’s been acting up lately. Time for a new one I think.

MurphTheSurf3 : Choice- back to the farm. The building repairs were not bad. No roofs to be replaced just fixed. The drainage system got overwhelmed and I some collapsed pipe sections and two breached “lakes” (actually reservoirs). The gardens took the most work.

choicelady : Murph – someone had a photo of Michelle Bachmann’s hatrack – with a roll of tinfoil lying on it. You are right to invest.

KillgoreTrout : LOL Murph.

choicelady : So – what were we saying about the NSA????

MurphTheSurf3 : KT- Aluminum stocks….yes, that would have been the ticket…I wonder how many are being are being used to supply the tin foil hat crowd….oops, sorry KT.

MurphTheSurf3 : Choice- and I e mailed Ad Lib….

choicelady : I took care of this the old fashioned way – I CALLED AdLib, and he reset it.

MurphTheSurf3 : Hi Patsy

choicelady : We are BACK!!! Hope some are still on board?

KillgoreTrout : Murph, Reynolds Aluminum stock is sky rocketing. I should have invested before Obama got elected. I’d be rich man now!

PatsyT : Sue my hubby wants to move up to your area.. we have to talk about your thoughts on the area some time soon

choicelady : Sue – we are getting pieces of mail for several different people. I send them back with a ‘doesn’t live here’ note because I worry I’m being set up. It’s always good to fight back!

SueInCa : I did it to a collection agency who keeps calling for Katie Bell today

choicelady : Sue – your telephone rejoinder cracked us all up!

MurphTheSurf3 : KT- Aluminum foil….darn…. .we never think of bringing along a pair of sharp scissors!

choicelady : Murph – well thank goodness for THAT. You have had waaaay too much water. Glad the crops are taking hold! Glad you can scrape the mushrooms off your boots. Wow – you’ve been inundated and then some! How’d the repairs on your outbuildings go?

SueInCa : actually like the instructions said, I whispered it

SueInCa : yep I will CL. My husband said, you did not just say that? I said yeah I did

PatsyT : Hi Murph!

KillgoreTrout : That’s funny Sue, I’ll have to try that!

MurphTheSurf3 : Hey there choice-+– yes we have had some rain but overall dry enough. The gardens are recovering and the crops seem to be maturing nicely. Thanks for asking.

choicelady : Sue – I think I have your address where I fully intend to bring the book, but it’s at the office. Can you send to choicelady? Then I can have it both places. AND come give you the book!

SueInCa : Hey Murph, I hope they got my good side. CL I did that thing on the phone I told you and Adlib yesterdAY my husband was sitting there with his jaw hanging down lol

KillgoreTrout : Not mine Murph. I am well supplied with aluminum foil! How goes it?

choicelady : Murph – hardee har – we said at the beginning that AdLib was out for his waterboarding appointment. He will be in when he dries off. Speaking of drying off – are YOU?

SueInCa : I do repairs. I will send you my new address CL

MurphTheSurf3 : Hi everyone…..OH- by the way- all of your communications are being recorded (written, oral, electronic, telepathic) for use in our never ending effort to keep the HOMELAND secure……

choicelady : Sue – do you do repairs? I’d hire you. I got two gorgeous necklaces at Mikey’s fund raiser. Both broke the first moment I tried to wear them. I don’t trust anyone else, but if you don’t do that, say so, and I’ll keep looking.

SueInCa : I have been buying for about 13 years now KT

KillgoreTrout : That’s a nice inventory Sue. I’ve seen some glass blowers who have been at it for years make a beautiful vase in just 15 minutes. They are amazing to watch.

SueInCa : CL i love that it pissses them off. You can see the disdain on their faces and I relish that look. Eff em all. Whenever you get around to it. I am stocking up now and am thinking of selling beads I no longer want or need

choicelady : Sue – I have been seriously NOT buying jewelry lately, but I am definitely going to your site. I can defer gratification NO LONGER!

SueInCa : No KT they are mostly just for the artist who owns them. I would like to take a class to try it out but would not invest without trying for the reasons you said

KillgoreTrout : Sue, do they offer classes? Think of the money you could save making your own beads.

choicelady : Sue – they will NEVER EVER admit the Black guy is better than they are. This is THE test of desegregation. They cannot get past it.I keep telling young racially charged kids – the only function of skin is to keep your guts from falling on the ground. They still think, ignorant drop outs, that they’re superior because they’re white. WTF?

SueInCa : My craft was not that expensive to get into KT but I would bet I have around 4 tyo 5 thousand dollars worth of stuff now

KillgoreTrout : That’s exactly right Patsy.

KillgoreTrout : Thanks Sue, financially, it would be a bit of strain, at first.

SueInCa : CL everything is metered on the black guy doing it, those southern ignorants must just cringe everytime they see he is above them lol I like it

choicelady : KT – I have a friend who makes quilts and wall hangings. Same problem. She can sell for $1000 per, but they take forever. Tough way to make a living. Or even extra money.

KillgoreTrout : CL, it would be worth it if I was faster at making articles. I used to sell my vases for 200 to 300 bucks a pop, but they took a long time to perfect.

choicelady : Patsy – that is what it comes down to. When the Black guy does it.

SueInCa : No worries CL craft people are surprisingly generous

choicelady : Patsy – I seriously doubt – SERIOUSLY – that you represent a national threat to this administration. I KNOW you would have under Bush and other conservative pro-nuke administrations. I think you’re OK now. REALLY.

SueInCa : We have a few glass studios around here but I am not that good

PatsyT : KT ain’t it the truth.. when the black guy does it …

choicelady : KT and Sue – did not mean to put either of you in an awkward spot there. It might NOT be a good marketing way to proceed.

SueInCa : No kidding Kt? That is great. Maybe you can find someone who will mentor you if only for the use of the equipment. I prefer off the cuff design because I have tried clay and I am not very good at it. Absolutely I would welcome KT to my site

choicelady : KT – maybe you and Sue could team up on her site and sell both jewelry AND vases?

KillgoreTrout : Thanks for the kind words CL.

PatsyT : They can read anything I write sometimes I say – hi, are you bored yet?

choicelady : KT – oh gosh – I hope you can! That’s pricey though!

choicelady : Patsy – that was my feeling even in the 70s. It was the PRO nuke folks who hid info. WE were totally transparent!

KillgoreTrout : CL, i am a glass blower, or used to be before studio time became financially unreachable for me. Studio time is 30 to 35 bucks an hour. I did sell some very nice vases though. I want to get back into it.

choicelady : KT – I am impressed that the FISA warrants were secured, that this intrudes in NO way into our communication, and that it is radically different from the 2003 phone call I got from a total stranger repeating BACK to me a private conversation our Board had had that morning. Obama is not hacking any of us or ID’ing any of us – and the faux outrage is over the top. Glenn Greenwald who loved Bush’s wars, surveillance, torture is now hair on fire liberty spewing about THIS? And fund raising, too, BTW.

PatsyT : Choice I have learned so much from the anti nuke folks all over the country and the world.. one in Canada thinks one of their best weapons and protections is transparency so they put it all out there on blogs twitter facebook whatever. Its the other side that has to hide

KillgoreTrout : CL, that whole nonsense is simply more fodder for the RWers. They never seemed to have a problem when Bush did it (without warrants).

choicelady : Patsy – thanks, I voted YES on the last one.

choicelady : KT – how do you know so much about glass beads? You are a man of rich depth I must say!

KillgoreTrout : Sue, is there a glass blowing studio anywhere near you? They would surely have annealing ovens.

PatsyT : No worries Sue, I will get my daughter to call in her tumblr pals, we did that with the San Diego Poll last month and took over the lead and then some On this Poll VOTE YES! «link»

choicelady : So, everyone, with AdLib off being waterboarded, and the whole movement in So.Cal against San Onofre being coordinated via Facebook – is anyone feeling threatened by the news about the metadata dump of Verizon calls? I am NOT.

SueInCa : I also have a friend who makes them. BRB gotta take a call

choicelady : Sue – I think I’m glad if the vote recognizes ‘cookies’ and won’t let people jam the vote even if that blocks all of US,too.

SueInCa : No KT it requires a kiln but I do admire from afar. Check out Magma Beads in Australia. She makes gorgeous glass beads

choicelady : Sue – your work gets better and better!

KillgoreTrout : Sue, do you get into glass bead making?

SueInCa : Patsy would not let me vote, I think it is the one I voted on this afternoon

choicelady : PAtsy – back in the day I dealt with a UPI reporter who refused to believe that info on the hazards of nukes was shut up. Then he misreported something I’d told him, so… It’s good to see reporters do this story WELL.

PatsyT : Michael Blood at the AP has been doing a great job «link»

SueInCa : Thanks Patsy, I do try and I am becoming much more particular about what I make and looking at design in a whole new light.

choicelady : Patsy – I did vote NO.

PatsyT : Sue you stuff look so beautiful.. I have to go back to work so I can indulge

choicelady : Patsy – your sister in the Coast Guard lived in landlocked Lakewood? Well it WAS cheaper…

choicelady : Sue – sounds gorgeous!

PatsyT : Choice my sister lived there for a while whne she was in the coast guard

SueInCa : I am makin a woven bracelet and I just started with a bronze color and when I went to put the finishings on it, the blue I picked is outstanding on it. I am pleased

choicelady : Patsy – I lived in an apartment complex on Del Amo. Not lovely. Across from what is now probably gone – a very smelly but interesting dairy farm. OK til the wind shifted…

PatsyT : Here is one more good one and this one has a new poll Please Vote NO «link»

choicelady : Thanks Patsy – GREAT stories. Your work has been awesomely successful. We cannot thank you enough.

choicelady : Sue! I never felt so useful! Glow in the dark, shine light for hope, BBQ – it’s all good.

PatsyT : I love those post war ranch houses in that area

KillgoreTrout : LOL!

SueInCa : we can bbq on cl

choicelady : Patsy – used to live in Lakewood. Small world!

KillgoreTrout : Well, if Ad is being water boarded, I hope he has gills!

PatsyT : At least he will be clean…

choicelady : KT – my aura was never that good before Davis Bessie. I have to think I’ve been ‘enhanced’.

SueInCa : lol poor adlib

PatsyT : OK here is an excellent view on this «link»

choicelady : Sue – AdLib is late. He told us he’s doing his waterboarding appointment with NSA and will be in when he dries out.

KillgoreTrout : CL, are you sure that’s not just your positive aura?

PatsyT : Long

PatsyT : Yes Lakewood near Lon Beach

SueInCa : I am good hope every1 else is too

choicelady : KT – yes, indeed. I’m my own happy spot of glowing light.

choicelady : Patsy – oh, I am sorry you missed the big celebration! But some things only YOU can do, and that’s one of them. Was that Lakewood north of Long Beach? Long trip!

KillgoreTrout : What’s up Sue?

KillgoreTrout : Davis Bessie? Well, you’ll never need a night light!

choicelady : Hi Sue – lovely to have you here!

PatsyT : I could not make the press conference because I was picking up my daughter violin in Lakewood.

SueInCa : Good evening everyone and Congrats to Patsy and her gang of anti nuke folks

choicelady : Patsy – thank you!!!

PatsyT : OK I post a few stories «link»

choicelady : KT – is there any rumbling (so to speak) about Davis Bessie? I used to ride Amtrak through that area, and one day we went by during a NUCLEAR EMERGENCY. I’m still glowing…

choicelady : Patsy – how many groups have been pressing for this shutdown? Have you all been working toward this same goal?

choicelady : Patsy! That’s Rochelle!!!

PatsyT : Rochelle is like the stop sign for ratepayer money, she held the line on the CPUC

KillgoreTrout : Patsy, who decided to keep the plant shut down, the NRC?

choicelady : Patsy – is there an ‘exit strategy’ for San Onofre?

KillgoreTrout : Will the plant be torn down now?

choicelady : Patsy – brilliant strategy! Was Rochelle helpful I hope? You ALL deserve major kudos! But we know this was a full court press for you, and we thank you for it!

choicelady : PAtsy – I did not know you were on Facebook all these many months! Could have kept up far better that way.

choicelady : Patsy – we’d put you on our shoulders and carry you through the streets, but that seems impractical somehow. The THOUGHT is there, however!

PatsyT : Yes I have been queen of facebook

choicelady : Patsy – LOVELY having you here again. We’ve missed you while you were focused on your amazing work. Welcome home!

KillgoreTrout : Big CONGRATS Patsy! A major accomplishment.

choicelady : KT – Oh, probably the same one that put the Stanford U. linear accelerator across the San Andreas fault up here in Palo Alto. Great minds…

PatsyT : OK I am back

KillgoreTrout : I don’t know what genius decided to build a nuke plant on one the world’s major fault lines.

choicelady : KT – they absolutely DO. She accomplished great things that make all of Southern CA much more safe.

KillgoreTrout : I think the people of southern Cal owe her their gratitude.

choicelady : KT – I had tried back in the 70s to close San Onofre, and to see her success is so GREAT. She worked tirelessly on it, and she won!

KillgoreTrout : Doing well CL. Patsy definitely deserves a hardy round of applause. Definitely a major victory.

choicelady : KT – When AdLib asked me to pinch hit til he gets here, I suggested he say he was being interrogated, and it went on from there. So “rumble” seemed appropriate.

choicelady : KT – how are YOU tonight?

choicelady : Hey KT – yes, I am here, and I think Patsy is, too. She’s accomplished a miracle closing San Onofre, so I hope she can talk with us about it. She ROCKS!

KillgoreTrout : What’s the rumble Planet folks?

KillgoreTrout : Hello, is anybody there?

choicelady : PAtsy!!! You must be over the moon at what you’ve accomplished. We are so honored to have you with us after the Big Announcement! Wheeee!

PatsyT : Hey Choice, How are you?

choicelady : Welcome everyone – be sure to say “rumble” when you check in. There’s no logic in it, it sounded good.

AdLib : Vox Populi, our live chat about the week’s events begins tonight at 7 pm PST. My waterboarding appointment with the NSA will no doubt run over so the brilliant Choicelady will graciously host Vox until I dry out and arrive a little late but not dehydrated. See you later!