choicelady : Thank you Sally – sleep well. Let the meds work their wonders. Another really good conversation on The Planet with wonderful people, excellent ideas. It was great seeing you. Be well!
SallyT : You did a great job, too!
SallyT : Sure, CL, we can turn off the lights. See you on the other side.
SallyT : Its just when I have to up the douse for pain, weather caused.
choicelady : Oh bummer, Sally! Well you sure don’t usually show ANY effects. I’m sorry tonight is rugged. What say ye – since it’s really just the two of us, are you ready to wrap up? I think everyone took their bottles and cookie wrappers. No cigarette burns under the table.
SallyT : ah 8 years……….. ..
SallyT : I think you are right.
choicelady : Sally – how long are you taking these things? Hope not long?
SallyT : Yep, CL, its like you can’t control it. You know it is getting away from you but you can pull it back.
choicelady : Sally – I think she’s on doing the Daily Planet stuff and not actually here. It’s her doppelganger. Anyone with a cookie who is on the Planet anywhere I suspect shows up even if not linked to Vox?
choicelady : Sally – oh, that’s no fun! I was like that on Percocet I took for my herniated discs. Got off that ASAP – made me a basked case. I do feel for you!
SallyT : How come Cher won’t come down and play with us?
SallyT : Okay but I have been a crybaby today…..blame the meds!
choicelady : Sally – your punctuation reminds me – whatever happened to the “interrobang”? It was the combined exclamation and question mark. It never caught on but was SO useful!
choicelady : Sally – KQ hung in since I was moderating and kept it going until others arrived. You are definitely NOT chopped liver!
SallyT : What am I? Chopped liver!!??
choicelady : KQ – your gal pal VERY much appreciated your presence! You are adored!
SallyT : Good night KQ! Not staying up any later with me? Okay. See you tomorrow??
KQµårk 死神 : Well I could let my gal pal on her own could I?
choicelady : KQ – rest easily, dear friend. Hope things get better. We ahve loved having you here for so long! Be well!
KQµårk 死神 : Gotta say hi to Cher though.
KQµårk 死神 : I’m gonna turn in too. I’m surprised I lasted this long. It was real fun.
choicelady : Hey – Cher! Come on down from the balcony! There are lots of chairs for you!
KQµårk 死神 : Yup and Repugs hate it. They got played.
choicelady : KQ – unless I miss my guess, the defense cuts are pretty much a done deal because DOD wants them.
SallyT : Conservatives drive me to drink and then I can’t drive!
choicelady : Murph – a liberal man who can drink easily with conservative ones is a gift. Good for you! That is true neighborliness.
KQµårk 死神 : It was a crazy time the Repugs almost literally had the good credit of the US held to Obama’s head. There was not much he could do. The funniest part is Obama in the long run won because they never got to really slash any entitlements like they wanted and now are backtracking on defense cuts.
MurphTheSurf3 : Sally…every bar here is conservative…t hat is where a big clutch of my friends are…
choicelady : Murph – that is a GREAT line! Thank you for calling him – that is how people DO change and get focused. You did a great service for HIM and for us all! MUCH appreciated!
KQµårk 死神 : TC surf.
choicelady : KQ – absolutely. He is a master strategist who has held many things safe for us all, and he gets scant credit from both Right and Left. I think he’s amazing.
SallyT : Good night, Murph. Now don’t go hanging out at the conservative bar too much this weekend. They will make you drink too much!
MurphTheSurf3 : CL…yeah that was uncalled for. I actually called him and we spoke for 20 minutes or so….I think he has realigned now….one of Alan’s problems, like Newt he thinks he is always the smartest person in the room (and usually is….unless Obama is there.)
KQµårk 死神 : CL it was your typical group think on the left. I forget what amendment it is now but invoking it would have not solved the problem. He had to make a deal or the consequences would have been far worse.
choicelady : Good night, Murph – sleep well. I won’t be on next week but will the week after. Have a great weekend!
KQµårk 死神 : CL you and I know bottom line Obama got the best bill he could through that congress at that time. Anyone who says he was bought are just flat out wrong.
choicelady : Murph – I don’t dislike Grayson. I’ve sent him money. He just teed off on Obama without substantive reasons over the debt ceiling, and it seemed self serving and pointless. I give lots of people a pass even when I’m annoyed with them.
MurphTheSurf3 : Well, dear friends, time to pack it in…coming up on Midnight here. Good job Choice….leader of the pack….
SallyT : I don’t know enough about Grayson to dislike him and not enough to really say I do like him. But, I watch him when he is on because he is interesting to hear the few times I have seen him.
choicelady : KQ – I agree about Obama’s diverse funding base! Here the attack on the five Dems who abstained from single payer all raised the ‘they’re bought by the insurance industry!’ I pointed out that the former author took money every time from PayDay lenders. She never sold out on that or anythng else.
KQµårk 死神 : reelected
KQµårk 死神 : About Feingold he really did not want to be elected because he bought into the whole ‘disappointment ‘ syndrome on the left in 2010. It shows he really did not care about his constituents.
MurphTheSurf3 : CL-we will have to talk about Alan Grayson…clearl y we differ here. I actually know the man and like him a lot- annoying, a gadfly but really puts himself out there.
choicelady : Goodnight Chris!
SallyT : Chris, good night. Enjoy!
choicelady : Murph – that’s GREAT! He also voted for a lot of not-so-progressi ve things and then pretended he did not do that. He and Grayson irk me a lot!
KQµårk 死神 : Sleep well Chris.
KQµårk 死神 : I don’t care what some on the lost left say. Obama is truly one of the few unbought politicians in office because he gets money from so many sources.
SallyT : If Obama wins using his SuperPac and the Rebugs lose using theirs, well, maybe then the Repugs will be more for doing away with SuperPacs because they didn’t help them.
ChrisR266 : To everyone, Good evening. Got an early call to run a high school district meet tomorrow, so must hit the bed. Enjoy your weekend, and see you in a week, I suspect.
MurphTheSurf3 : CL….Do you know what Feingold got for his high minded stance? He gets to call himself “the former Senator from Wisconsin.”
KQµårk 死神 : Of course hypocrisy is a misdemeanor in politics compared to other things.
ChrisR266 : KQ: It is also frightening that they were demanding fealty from other wealthy conservatives before they’d let them in to the more protected circles.
KQµårk 死神 : Sure it’s a bit of hypocrisy but no worse then Obama not limiting himself to government funds in 2008. I really think the reports of what the Koch bros were going to spend sent a chill down their campaign’s spines.
MurphTheSurf3 : KQ…Priorities USA is run by some of the finest folks from his 2008 campaign. They are first class. Obama is doing what he must do to compete but he has made sure that those who know him very well are running the show over there. Surrogates of the first order. So, I am all for it and LOVING that Citizens United is biting the GOP in the Ass so fast and hard now…Many of the wealthy are getting pissed fast right now.
ChrisR266 : KQ: I say go ahead and “abide by the law.” The GOPTEA wished for it, well they got it. Now look at what it can and has become. We can deal with legislating this away for good after the election.
choicelady : KQ – who likes that he needs to do it? But SuperPACs are here, and I want Obama to win, so GO for it. The idea that he should rise “above” it as Feingold claims, is just so bogus. Get RID of these PACs and then tell Obama not to do it. But he has little choice.
KQµårk 死神 : Ditto Surf.
SallyT : KQ, I think he has to. Too damn much money on the other side. But, I don’t like it on either.
ChrisR266 : Murph: Thanks. Got it bookmarked.
choicelady : KQ – Really bothers me that Common Cause has him on their Board. I’m close to the national CEO Bob Edgar, and I hate the idea Bob got taken in my him. Their former national president was a Hollywood producer – I went to his house for a CC dinner, and that guy was an even BIGGER asshole. They need to clean up their act board-wise although they really do great work. They are leading the Constitutional Amendment work against Citizens United. Whoo hah! Good stuff!
MurphTheSurf3 : Chris….story on Walsh running for another term but in another district so he is not facing a Repub in the bid. «link»
KQµårk 死神 : What do people think of Obama’s decision to court money for his Superpacs?
ChrisR266 : Murph: no call back on the truth, ‘eh? that’s the M.O.
KQµårk 死神 : Surf like most Repugs he’s a coward too.
KQµårk 死神 : I believe you and love it.
MurphTheSurf3 : KQ…I wrote a piece on Walsh’s history as a failed businessman, husband and ex-husband for another blog. Lots of research….it got passed around and ended up being seen by him and he wrote a piece in his district newsletter about “the communist conspiracy’s efforts to libel him….” I got hold of that and contacted his office saying I was willing to prove all that I wrote….no call back.
KQµårk 死神 : Yeah we have our share of pomposity on the left for sure.
ChrisR266 : KQ: Last I saw (I think a week ago) he was on the serious outs approval wise.
KQµårk 死神 : Honestly I have not seen them lately Chris so I hope you’re right.
choicelady : KQ – GO Tammy!
ChrisR266 : KQ: Haven’t Walsh’s numbers been dropping like concrete in a river? How could she not beat him?
choicelady : KQ – That IS why I hate Reich! That is precisely the reason! It’s so – BUSH of him!
choicelady : Chris – well, they hired John Yoo also. Standards are falling all around.
KQµårk 死神 : That’s one issue I wish would come to the forefront. Not paying child support is economic abuse.
choicelady : Murph – LOL!!! I have a friend who is good friends with Reich’s wife – and likes the wife and can’t stand the man. Popinjay comes to mind whenever I see him. He’s pompous AND empty and that’s a lousy combo.
KQµårk 死神 : I’m so glad Tammy Duckworth is running again. I would love to see her beat that ahole child abuser Walsh.
ChrisR266 : BRB
choicelady : Chris – LOL!!! OK – you’re weak and narrow and that’s not a problem in his case!!!!! It means you have good judgement!
KQµårk 死神 : CL I’m still ticked that he did nothing for labor in the trade agreements and then claims Obama who is doing more for labor in them is not doing enough.
ChrisR266 : Choice: Reich is proof that ever Berkeley is fallible.
choicelady : KQ – I liked him until, under Clinton, he did a special on jobs. His ENTIRE message was, “We have to roll up our sleeves and get to work” without every ONCE saying HOW. It was pathetic, and all the lefties LOVED it. He’s STILL saying shit, and he’s a guru. He’s an empty suit and yes, condescending. And he has nothing whatsoever to show for his fame.
ChrisR266 : Murph: Ok, I feel better now.
KQµårk 死神 : But I do really think the next nominee for the Dems is a woman.
MurphTheSurf3 : About Reich….quote from a CLinton insider. “Only Bob’s Mom really likes him and that’s only twice a week.” LOL
KQµårk 死神 : No CL I just wonder if you knew for sure. I think I heard she could not run for POTUS for that reason one time.
ChrisR266 : Choice: Robert Reich is a very small asshole, too. Ok, call me weak and narrow, I just can’t get past that, LOL.
KQµårk 死神 : CL I have major major problems with Reich. He is so friggin’ condescending.
MurphTheSurf3 : Chris and ALL….We need to keep the Senate, take back the House and, of course, keep O in the WH….a lot to be done and only those majorities will do it. BTW, I do not want a filibuster proof senate….some split in the government is always good…and it will give the GOP some share in the responsibility.
choicelady : KQ – did I say something that made it sound as if she was not? I have no idea.
ChrisR266 : I don’t get Current because I’m a stubbron broad who doesn’t want another “box” attached to the TVs in my home. I wish I did get it. I keep up via streaming.
SallyT : She sure likes her Chevy Volt. She can’t say enough about it.
choicelady : Murph – I should not judge from the ONLY time I’ve seen her. It just put me off. I have her book, but have not yet read it. That probably will change me back to liking her. She is really a good speaker and funny and energetic, and she WAS a good governor. I need to back off my edginess. It’s just that I got majorly burned with Robert Reich who was, is, and always will be a major asshole.
KQµårk 死神 : I can be abrasive sometimes but I’m always real.
KQµårk 死神 : CL isn’t Grandholm not a natural born citizen?
ChrisR266 : We’re all going to have to work real damned hard over the next 8 or 9 months, but I truly believe that this one is ours to lose in November.
MurphTheSurf3 : CL your take on Jennifer is new to me. Need to look deeper
ChrisR266 : Aw, KQ, thanks. It is genuine.
KQµårk 死神 : Actually I was just thinking the GOP future can’t be bleaker when you think about their possible candidates.
MurphTheSurf3 : Sally…she was a fine governor…I hope she is not done with her political life.
KQµårk 死神 : That’s real cool Chris.
choicelady : Murph – I got really mixed feelings about Granholm after seeing her with her husband here at the Sacramento Press Club. I cannot explain it, but I felt while she’s definitely on the right page, she misses a lot of interesting stuff including the possibilities of rebuilding manufacturing. Now with the auto rebound, she keeps acting as if it never happened. And she and her husband are awfully “cute” together which rather annoyed me. I still like her, but I reserve full tilt enthusiasm until I hear more from her that seems really informed.
ChrisR266 : A50: I’m not a during the week POVer, but the weekends are my special time. Sanity and real conversation keeps me engaged and crisp.
SallyT : Murph, she did miss a little at first but heck she is new at it. She is getting better.
MurphTheSurf3 : Artist….I really value my Planet time for just the reasons you note….
KQµårk 死神 : alone
ChrisR266 : Murph: and no Christie. No savior. They’re fcuked.
KQµårk 死神 : Yeah I don’t blame my older brother much either. My younger brother is just one of those people that live through impulse along. He’s probably the most damaged because he’s my mum’s favorite.
MurphTheSurf3 : Anybody out there watching Jennifer Granholm on Current TV….She is starting to get good at her new schtick….very interesting guests…tonight a set considered the brokered convention business…ALL were clear…no one with any heft will want a last minute nomination….so no Pawlenty, Daniels or Bush.
SallyT : Seattle is more expensive than Portland but she would be to close up there.
choicelady : KQ – ah. A typical American family! I do NOT blame your brother for being eternally pissed about Vietnam. Your younger brother? Well, we all have them.
ChrisR266 : Murph: this year is a weird confluence for me. I lived 6 years in Wisconsin after I finished my doctorate in the 80s, and was born/raised in Ohio, where I’ve been since 1990. I feel like I have a foot and half a heart in both places.
Artist50 : Thanks Funksands, I need to get here more, I really enjoy this place.
choicelady : Murph – REALLY? Walker is nuts! He has a really tin ear for the implications of what he says! These guys all think everyone just agrees, and then they’re bowled over by the outcry. I guess when you hang with the Kochs, you lose ALL sense of reality.
KQµårk 死神 : My father and mother are true blue Dem my brothers are more apolitical. My older brother never stopped being bitter about his time in Vietnam. My younger brother is an idiot.
ChrisR266 : Murph: Walker is toast. He will go down. They could run a monkey and he will go down.
MurphTheSurf3 : CL…sssssshhhhh hhhhhh
MurphTheSurf3 : Did you all see the Walker of Wisconsin has announced he intends to use the bank mortgage auto pen settlement to patch up his budget! Insane….the man must want to be ousted.
KQµårk 死神 : She’s in the Seattle area and that’s still a little close for comfort.
choicelady : KQ – is the male side of your family simpatico in political ways as well as familial fondness?
ChrisR266 : Murph: I suspect so too. And, the Dispatch here in Columbus has been running a series this week about how the GOP Legislature has bought a membership in ALEC for “policy education” purposes, and how ALEC is paying all of their expenses to all these “conferences and workshops.” People are starting to figure out clearly what’s going on.
choicelady : Murph – The “other place”? You have a secret club? LOL!!!
MurphTheSurf3 : Night Funk…see you around “the other place.”
choicelady : KQ – I spent my entire adult life living as far away from my crazy mother as possible. Well worth the effort.
KQµårk 死神 : We’ll be taking care of my father and closer to my brothers so it will be a nice change.
MurphTheSurf3 : Chris…the ALEC connection is an important one and I suspect they are really pissed that they have been exposed as the conspirators they are.
choicelady : Goodnight, dear funk – sleep well. I will look for you!
SallyT : There you go again, Funk!
KQµårk 死神 : Take care Funk.
choicelady : KQ – taught a course for UAW Region 9 in Wilkes Barre once at their conference. Nice area – good people there. I am going to be very relieved you’re there!
ChrisR266 : Sleep restfully, Funk.
ChrisR266 : Murph: I think they’re all coming off as weird this year because every newly installed Gov’s agenda has been already laid out by ALEC. There was no adaptation of strategy state by state, they just started slashing and burning. Look at Wisconsin and Ohio. No strategy whatsoever. They sorely misinterpreted the motivations of voters in 2010.
SallyT : Oh, crazy mum’s can be the worst. And, yes, it can be expensive but we sure are liberal!
funksands : Folks, sorry to cut it short, but I gotta pack it in. Artist, good seeing you. Stop by more often. CL, I’ll be in touch soon
choicelady : Murph – Kasich, the current disgusting Ohio governor. The one who got his butt handed to him when he tried to dis the unions in OH. He’s converted from Catholicism to Pentecostalism
KQµårk 死神 : LOL too expensive on the West Coast and too close to my crazy mum.
SallyT : KQ, oh, why don’t you come over here to Portlandia
MurphTheSurf3 : AH HAH…Kasich…. so weird, but aren’t the GOP Gov’s as a crowd…weird.
choicelady : Artis – yes, Strickland lost to KAsich but would beat the living snot out of him if they revoted today.
KQµårk 死神 : Near Wilkes Barre, Joe Biden land.
ChrisR266 : Murph: We’re talking about Kasich.
choicelady : Chris – the idea of marrying someone for “status” creeps the shit out of me! And marrying Kasich at ALL creeps me even more!
choicelady : KQ – oh happy day! I know it’s freaking colder, but you have HALF a chance of finding more people of like mind. What part of PA? I get over there now and then.
MurphTheSurf3 : Chris…who are you and CL speak of?
ChrisR266 : A50: he’s a cocky SOB.
Artist50 : Wasn’t Strickland the old Ohio Governor?
funksands : CL, at CPAC. That’s the next logical way to fire up the crowd.
ChrisR266 : A50–no notes. He just went to the mike and started in.
KQµårk 死神 : Oh CL we are moving up to PA this year.
MurphTheSurf3 : funk….they are negative because they have nothing to put forward….so all they can do is react to the guy in charge…and Obama is more and more in charge.
ChrisR266 : Choice: Yes. He’s in a new “conservative” congregation now. My sister in law worked for his wife before they got married. The only thing we can figure as to why she agreed to marry him is that she thought it would be cool to marry a politician. Just no chemistry there at all.
choicelady : funk – ick. Beheading? Anyone in particular? Gross!
Artist50 : Chris – I read his speech, it was pathetic. Did he even have notes? I saw the clip of his Parkinson’s demo which my dad died of – disgusting!
KQµårk 死神 : Living down South almost 20 years really changes your perspective on what you would accept in a Dem that’s for sure.
SallyT : There you go, Funk!
choicelady : KQ – I really would like you to move! You deserve so much better!
KQµårk 死神 : Exactly CL I’m seeing that as well. I see you over there too Churchlady.
ChrisR266 : Funk: I think we’ve moved past eventually and into finally.
funksands : Jesus KQ, that’s pretty grim…
choicelady : Chris – I read where he started Catholic and wound up Dominionist, likely just for votes. Any truth there?
funksands : Sally, a beheading would liven things up.
KQµårk 死神 : How would you folks like to be represented by Gingrey, Chambliss and Isakson? Hell I might even take a Nelson down here.
SallyT : I don’t even think CPAC is that exciting this year.
funksands : Murph, what’s really surprised me is the GOP turning into such a negative party. I get them being negative on Obama. But they’re all so negative about everything. Eventually people are going to get really tired of it and gravitate to the only person in the race with any optimism
ChrisR266 : They’re going to stick it to Romney.
choicelady : KQ – one of the things I’ve noticed here, on The People’s Voice, Angry Black Lady, Politicususa and other thoughtful sites is the increase in people hungry for understanding real policy and exhausted by the emotional temper tantrums of the so-called progressive Left. So the latter is narrowing in size and scope.
ChrisR266 : Murph: Santorum.
MurphTheSurf3 : FLASH POLL….who wins the CPAC straw poll….Paul has taken it several years running……but now?
ChrisR266 : KQ: Correct.
KQµårk 死神 : It’s Ted Strickland right?
ChrisR266 : Choice: Kasich is from Westerville, where I live. He was this wacky and manic in the 90s and his devotees just chalked it off to “youthful exuberance.” Ha.
MurphTheSurf3 : For the GOP….HUBRIS is not working out as a Party Mantra…I prefer Obamas, ARETE…. Hubris (overweening pride leading to a fall)…Arete (virtue that elevates)
choicelady : Murph – yeah, Strickland 56%, Kasich 36% if they voted today.
choicelady : STRICKLAND! I can’t keep it in mind because Tony Strickland here is our WORST legislator. I must have an emotional block about it.
KQµårk 死神 : Dang I missed most of that Chris.
choicelady : Chris – I DID see that and read a transcript. It was unde a post “Why politicians should use teleprompters.” I gather he also mocked out people with Parkinsons. Oh joy – my father had that. What a warm and fuzzy thing to do to them. What a maroon that man is! Kasich. Not my father.
ChrisR266 : Funk: I think they will try. What is important is how people react to that. We now know that they do not take to it kindly, and the reputation that gets hurt is the GOPTEA, not the Democrats.
funksands : Chris, I saw that. Wild!! Maybe he forgot his insulin??
KQµårk 死神 : There is always going to be a portion on the left that won’t vote, but they rarely vote anyway.
MurphTheSurf3 : CL…strickland would beat kasich
ChrisR266 : Choice: it’s Strickland.
ChrisR266 : A5 and KQ: You should have seen the fiasco that was Kasich’s State of the Union this week. Not in the statehouse but in Stubenville. Rambling, largely incoherent and about one quarter of it highly insulting to a whole variety of voters.
choicelady : Artist – I read today that the former Dem governor (cannot recall his name) would beat Kasich 56-36 if they voted today. Why can’t I remember his NAME??? I like him.
funksands : The economy and the market is going to look great for most of the year….until Congress gets its hooks into tax negotiation. Then we’ll see. I can see the GOP doing everything it can to pull of another debt ceiling stabbing of the economy intentionally.
KQµårk 死神 : Replace about any GOP governor for shyte and most voters would agree.
KQµårk 死神 : Funk yeah I read about that too it’s too funny for words.
Artist50 : Ohio hates Kasich -his approval rating is less than 40% but they can’t recall.
ChrisR266 : KQ: exactly. Neither do moderate democrats. I really don’t think in the end, the progressives will desert, either. This is a new day, folks.
KQµårk 死神 : CL I’m very cautiously optimistic on the economy. I hope this summer I’m just cautiously optimistic.
funksands : A50, that would make a good t-shirt!
choicelady : Chris – that’s part of their strategy: do what doesn’t work but do it LOUDER. They think we just did not hear the first, second, third into infinity times.
funksands : KQ, you mean they don’t share Frothy’s concern about women on the battlefield?
SallyT : The few friends I have that claimed to be TP in the beginning said that they don’t know this TP today. The ones that got into office are more government control power hungry than they were wanting.
Artist50 : Yes Sally. Didn’t they want jobs and all they’ve gotten was social legislation?
KQµårk 死神 : Independents don’t give a shyte about social issues.
choicelady : KQ – and some things I see – “is the economy going in the right direction” are in Obama’s favor.
MurphTheSurf3 : As most of you know, I am in a red, red, red, red, region in a red, red, red, red state….and the GOP here is all focused on local elections with the theme: We are NOT like the loons on the national level. I see the shift to House, Senate, State Assembly and Governor’s Mansion, but there is so much more Dem noise now than I can recall ever
funksands : CL, exactly. The co-founder of the tea party is a supporter of OWS for that reason.
KQµårk 死神 : Really if the economy just slogs along at this pace the Repugs lose every issue.
KQµårk 死神 : Yup even on the deficit Obama has a slight lead.
choicelady : Sally – there is a new book out by Thea Skocpol about the TP, and yes, they are not all wackos, and many are DEEPLY disgusted with the juvenile, whiny candidates they first thought were their salvation. Ryan and the TP BLEW it by trying to dismantle Social Security and Medicare. The guys elected were too damn young to “get it”.
ChrisR266 : KQ: Correct. That was all they had. No economy, no win. They will not win on social wedge issues. They will lose, and they know it. that’s why this attack on women’s health is so crazy! They’re just driving people away.
KQµårk 死神 : The amazing part is we see a reversal in the traditional left right polling. Obama is beating Repugs on taxes and national security and so far losing on the economy. It’s really crazy days that way.
funksands : Murph, I think/hope you are right. It is incredibly interesting.
ChrisR266 : Choice: I know! One would think they have well nigh abandoned this state.
Artist50 : Mitch’s wife also left him with his 4 daughters and ran away and married another man, several years later she came back and they remarried. It makes him look sympathetic – kind of.
funksands : Deficit dropped 29 billion last month. Ruh Ro
MurphTheSurf3 : funk…good image but I am beginning to think that Citizens United has allowed the Clowns to take over the Circus driving out the ringmasters.
SallyT : Does anyone else think that maybe the TP (Not the KochTP) but the folks TP are disappointed with the people they got in to office in 2010?
KQµårk 死神 : Chris the GOP is losing their issue, the economy fast.
choicelady : Chris – Ohio with out whackadoodle ads? Who’d recognize the place?
funksands : Thanks CL, that’s very kind of you.
funksands : Murph, I’ve always viewed the GOP clowncar as running interference for the quiet, buttoned-up GOP’ers that are behind the scenes slowly dismantling society
ChrisR266 : Even the Chamber is backing off the whackadoodle ads here. It’s been relatively calm for Ohio the last few weeks.
KQµårk 死神 : I hear ya funk.
choicelady : funk – oh, sorry to hear you’re so tired! Hope we can pep you up a tad.
funksands : Dead tired, but had to pop in and say hello for a bit.
ChrisR266 : Funk! Hi my friend. I hope you are well and happy tonight.
funksands : Hi Sally
choicelady : funk! Welcome! AdLib has things to do tonight, so he left. House rules – don’t leave burns in the carpet or he won’t get his Vox deposit back. Other than that – we’re all here and talking about a brokered convention. Since I’m “moderating” other topics are being entertained as well, including the uptick of reinvestment since business may have decided not to bother with the GOP at ALL.
KQµårk 死神 : I mean Romney is a fake and phony by any measure. He is the epitome of the slick guy that will say anything to get elected. Worse he thinks all he needs to do is attack Obama and not say what he’s for.
MurphTheSurf3 : Funk…choice is leading us into prophet GOP visions…..what in the hell are they going to do.
SallyT : Good evening there Funkie!
ChrisR266 : Choice: I saw that. I was sorry to see he passed away. But, you can attest, it is better here.
funksands : What’s on the burner tonight?
MurphTheSurf3 : KQ…Faux…yeah , think you are correct.
funksands : Hi K, Murph…
choicelady : Murph – that’s amazing news! What goes on at the local and regional levels is so under-reported BUT is the wave of the future. It’s one of the reasons this and other sites with local reporting is ahead of the MSM.
MurphTheSurf3 : FUNK….howdy…
KQµårk 死神 : Hey funkytown.
funksands : Hi!
KQµårk 死神 : There is a huge schism like I’ve never seen with the base and establishment GOP.
MurphTheSurf3 : Chris…I need to look into that….I know of a group of banks here in Mo. that have said they will not be contributing to any campaigns but will be investing in residential rehaps and refinancing of underwater property.
choicelady : Chris – I have ties in Y’town, and they are even seeing a bit of momentum in steel etc. Never thought it would happen! There is a LOT going on with worker ownership, too, though John Logue, the brains of the Ohio Employee Ownership Center at Kent State just died. Very sad – he was quite young.
KQµårk 死神 : Surf the teabaggers think the fix is in and feel like Romney is not one of them.
MurphTheSurf3 : KQ..what do you know about TP anger with Faux….any details
KQµårk 死神 : Back
choicelady : Murph – what an interesting thought! Investing and living with Obama rather than getting any of these mill stones around their necks!
ChrisR266 : Murph: The hiring trends, especially in these states written off as worst hit: Ohio, Pennsylvania, Michigan. There’s serious manufacturing increases here, the rest of the nation isn’t hearing about it because the MSM isn’t reporting it often.
SallyT : Murph, I just see that no one is really going with anyone that Fox is giddy about.
choicelady : Chris – all love back atcha, my friend!
choicelady : Hi Artist – did not hear you come in. Now THAT is a great handicap – being caught with lots of dope! Can he be “forgiven” the way Newt was?
MurphTheSurf3 : KQ…did you see my question on the TP anger at Faux….any details?
MurphTheSurf3 : Chris…where do you see the business community doing as you suggest…cuttin g their GOP losses and reinvesting in the economy?
ChrisR266 : They might have survived and had a shot at this election had the economy remained in the toilet. But it is now clear that the moneymakers aren’t going to let that happen anymore. 3 years of crap is enough already.
SallyT : Yes, Murph, that was so.
MurphTheSurf3 : Sally…when I heard that Palin, who has proven to have no real influence on the campaign at all, as a keynoter, I knew they were all noise with nothing behind it.
ChrisR266 : And anyway, I think they’ve already jumped off the ledge. This situation is just not salvageable, especially since the business community has decided to cut their losses and throw back into growing the economy again. They’re screwed.
Artist50 : Mitch is my Governor and he’s gone more socially conservative lately. He didn’t used to be. He was caught with a major amount of dope at Princeton.
SallyT : They got Palin at the last minute and she has only been good for herself and show business.
ChrisR266 : Choice: All my love your way, darlin’.
ChrisR266 : Mitch Daniels will never be President of the USA, EVER. This would be suicide. The party is already on the ledge, Daniels from a brokered convention would be jumping off it.
SallyT : CL, I want them to choose someone like they have, Romney, than Cain, than Perry, than Gingrich, than Santorum and find out like they have with all of these that they have a dud!
choicelady : Chris – Dear heart – YOU would not sizzle from holy water! THEY would!
choicelady : KQ – but who IS he? Even I have no clue! Why is he not running now? Is this another arrogant – I want to be anointed – kind of gig?
MurphTheSurf3 : KQ…why is the TP turning on Faux…do they feel used, set up, manipulated…
KQµårk 死神 : BRB
ChrisR266 : Choice: burned a little. Probably holy water. LOL.
KQµårk 死神 : Don’t get me wrong I think a brokered convention is a long shot but the right wing loves Daniels.
choicelady : Chris – is that sweat or holy water?
choicelady : Sally – now that’s scary! It’s better for the GOP to elect someone and have buyers’ remorse??? LOL!!!!
KQµårk 死神 : CL and getting vetted by the media during the general is suicide.
SallyT : CL, the Repubs change so often, knowing them for short periods seems better for them. Once you know them, they are tossed out.
ChrisR266 : Whatever the scenario, it does not bode well for any GOPTEA candidate. What an unadulterated fiasco.
choicelady : KQ – but WHO IS MITCH DANIELS? No one knows him or what he thinks and his history and his policies. I think Murph is right – a brokered convention and new face is a disaster for the GOP so won’t be allowed to happen.
ChrisR266 : Choice: I’m back, and wiping off the sweat. Damn.
KQµårk 死神 : If you heard how much the teabaggers hate Faux News now you would be shocked.
KQµårk 死神 : If it is brokered I think they go with Mitch Daniels.
SallyT : KQ, I think FOX NEWS is getting weak kneed. They are having a hard time keeping their flock in step with them.
choicelady : Everyone – it is my profound belief that if a new candidate emerged in the convention, time alone would make that candidate’s victory impossible. Virtually no one who MIGHT emerge is known by the US public. How could they pull together a good campaign and win their BASE much less moderates and indies?
MurphTheSurf3 : Brokered conventions will depend on three things a) no one having enough to win in the first, second or third ballot- after that order breaks down and chaos becomes the story, b)control of the delegations by “bosses”- party, candidate surrogates, c) a structure to take 3000 people forward and process their will….CHAOS! SO, NO. NOT GOING TO HAPPEN.
KQµårk 死神 : kneed lol
KQµårk 死神 : Rove was backing Romney but even he is getting weak needed because Romney’s support is so shallow.
choicelady : KQ – I’m lost here. Who is Rove backing?
KQµårk 死神 : No matter what emerges it’s bad news for the GOP nominee and good news for Obama and that’s all I really care about so let them fight all Spring into the Summer.
SallyT : You know, I think it might just go to a broker conv. Jed Bush, oh not that would be fun!
choicelady : Murph – that’s outrageous! Paul is hijacking delegates? OMG – could he DO that and WIN?
KQµårk 死神 : I have to admit CL I’m not so sure anymore. All the big money is on Romney but he can’t close the deal by a long shot. This is very different than the 2008 race where Obama and Hillary had a broad loyal following. Republicans seriously are changing their alliances daily.
choicelady : Chris – if you fell into a Pentecostal Vox Populi, you are LUCKY TO GET OUT ALIVE AND BORN ONLY ONCE!
MurphTheSurf3 : Fascinating backstory is that Paul’s people have taken control of a number of the delegations, even those that seemed to have been won by others. In other words, the delegates are Paul people voted in by Romney, or Santorum or Gingrich folks. The Paul people are bragging about this openly……more mess….good.
choicelady : And since AdLib is not here, we do not HAVE to do that topic. Suggestions? Or free form?
KQµårk 死神 : Surf it’s always the radicals that get all the attention. It’s just a truism of human nature.
SallyT : Right, KQ! Some of the things she was saying would fit right with the Repugs today. How the poor are poor because they don’t work hard and why should anyone help them. And, the poor should pay the same tax as the rich! Bitch!
choicelady : Well, may we change topics? WITH ROMNEY SLIDING, WITH SANTORUM RISING BUT NOT FOR LONG, WITH NEWT IN THE PITS AND PAUL UP AND DOWN, WHAT DO YOU PROJECT FOR A WINNER, AND WHAT ARE THE POSSIBILITIES OF A BROKERED CONVENTION? WHAT MIGHT THAT MEAN FOR A TOTALLY NEW LEADER?
MurphTheSurf3 : Choice….true but Muslim leaders will tell you that those interpretations are widely rejected in much of the rest of the world….there is a lot of energy around militant behavior and a lot of it is anti christian…see the cover story for Newsweek this week.
ChrisR266 : Choice: It didn’t look like an archive. Maybe it was… pentecostal?
KQµårk 死神 : And like all of Kalima’s Morning Blogs show the Tories pulled the same fast one on the Brits that the GOP did here.
ChrisR266 : Murph: Oh, whew! Thanks. I was worried I had left this dimension for good.
choicelady : Chris, dear – yes, you are here with us on Friday Feb. 10. You must have gotten into an archive?
MurphTheSurf3 : Chris….if you consider spending Friday night talking about old men in long dresses who think they speak for God normal…yeah you are back.
SallyT : KQ, I said earlier that I also watched The Iron Lady and Maraget Thatcher was a bitch! Well, that is my opinion. I didn’t like Reagan either, tho.
choicelady : Murph – I went to a conference on Islam and Violence and was blown away by the beauty of the Qur’an and its emphasis on peace. ANY religion other than Buddhist, has violent writings. But the US Muslims are working through the one book finding NEW interpretations on peace, justice, humanity, and yes, interfaith unity. It’s there – I have a Quar’an and read it, though it’s hard going, and I’m very impressed by the similarities to the justice parts of the Bible. There’s less gore and violence than in the Bible. It lies in the interpretation as much as anything. But ain’t that true of EVERYTHING?
ChrisR266 : Ok…I just had this weird moment, got flicked into another Vox Populi dimension. Looked just like this one, but oh, the conversation and players were WEIRD. Am I here now…?
KQµårk 死神 : Probably the biggest problem in Europe right now is their embrace of austerity measures. They are heading for slow growth for a very long time.
SallyT : I just remember watching the Egptian uprising. There were a lot of Muslims and they were noticed because of their pray time. But, there were a lot more that weren’t. Many secular. I was just wondering, KQ. Thanks
MurphTheSurf3 : Sally T…One of my doctors is Muslim and a leader at his mosque. He says that the young in this country are backing them movement to a reformed Islam. Islam has no New Testament. It is stuck with its Old Testament, the Koran. That book, when taken literally is not one that tends toward reformation, openness or tolerance….thu s the radical tinge. In the U.S. there is more and more of an effort to look for hte common ground shared by many faiths.
choicelady : Sally – my experience with Muslims here and in LA is that it is a powerfully vital movement in the lives of their young people. Why? It is THE most communally rich religion I’ve EVER experienced. And they are spectacularly great to me – they are so generous with time, hospitality, and explanations of things. They adore their children and the kids all know it. The young women in particular are the new leaders – and the men are proud of them whether said men are old or young. I LOVE them and the vitality they have from their faith AND their embrace of secular America. They also have amazing sense of humor. So I think the religion is growing – and that’s part of the fear of Christians who raise their kids in fear, not in love and hope. And those kids walk away.
KQµårk 死神 : Exactly CL and Poland is the best example of a Catholic state moving further right.
ChrisR266 : Choice: I tend to view the actions of the church here and abroad now as quite similar to the actions of a dying breed, much like the GOPTEA. They flail and slash, threaten and bully, but to no positive effect for them. The earth has opened and is swallowing them.
KQµårk 死神 : Sally I think it really depends on the country and their various immigration policies. I know some countries are really setting some Xenophobic laws especially in the old Soviet Block.
choicelady : KQ – I spent a couple of week in Lower Silesia, Poland in 1996, and it was incredibly hopeful with 1200 worker cooperatives and lots of energy. And it all got shot to smithereens in no small measure because of the church. They urged movement to traditional capitalism and xenophobia. NOT a good thing, IMHO.
KQµårk 死神 : No I’m talking more about a rightward general Christian movement.
ChrisR266 : Murph: They should have learned 20 years ago that “crushing the U.S.” is not one of those fruitful approaches.
SallyT : KQ, do you think there will ever be fewer Muslims? Are their young growing away from it or more to it?
KQµårk 死神 : Poland and Russia have huge right wing movements build on false religious ideology. It’s seriously unsafe to be brown in those countries these days.
choicelady : Murph – I’ve been an Episcopalian. Always told dissatisfied Catholics to come on around for the familiar ritual. We are “Catholic Lite – all of the ritual, only one-third the guilt.”
MurphTheSurf3 : KQ…perhaps you are right re. a resurgence in Europe but I do not think it is a Catholic resurgence.
KQµårk 死神 : I think some of that is shifting surf. England has a small but growing evangelical movement. Germany is run by the Christian Democratic Union of Germany. Allot of it has to do with the anit-Muslim sentiment.
MurphTheSurf3 : CL….a small number are moving into what you describe as the “Pentacostal Church”, the rest are walking away from church in general or going to the Episcopal, Methodist or Lutheran churches where the ceremony is familiar but the life is livelier and more real.
SallyT : True, CL and they are the Repugs, too.
choicelady : kes – sweet dreams, and again, congrats on the GREAT news! Your son has such a bright future, and he owes you a LOT for all you’ve done standing by and with him!
choicelady : Sally – unless you’re an End Times believer like Pat Robertson, then God is punishing all of us with something. It’s not a Catholic thing, but the Pentecostals are whipping up a frenzy of “God’s judgement” almost daily.
MurphTheSurf3 : KQ…there is virtually no church left in France (or in most of Europe). That is what is laughable. In Italy Church attendance on Sundays in down to 10 percent, giving has all but disappeared, recruits for priesthood invisible….so they are looking to crush the U.S. to get it back in line (as they now think they should have done to Europe before it was too late) and to recruit heavily from S. America, Asia and Africa. This is how the ranks of clergy grew initially, but those vocations do not last.
SallyT : Good night Kes. Wonderful news. Enjoy your evening!
choicelady : Murph – I do think the erosion from below is a serious issue, but are these people moving toward more openness or toward more Pentecostalism? The Latin Catholic church is being undermined by the latter, and they are scary in their RW politics. The worker priest, my heroes, are scarce upon the ground anymore.
SallyT : I can spell science
KQµårk 死神 : Wish him luck for me Kes.
ChrisR266 : Good to talk to you, Kes. Have a wonderful weekend.
KQµårk 死神 : CL yeah this pope can’t expire soon enough.
kesmarn : Well,last chance to have a chat with the son before departure time, so I may have to say g’night dear friends. Have a warm and wonderful weekend!
SallyT : Priest use to get away with a lot of scare tactics before sciene explained things. Now the Repugs are the scare tactic pros.
choicelady : Murph – yes, and never leave out Society of St, Pius X (SSPX) that is to the right of the Inquisition. They were thrown out of the church – and now Benedict has let them back in as an official “order”. They gave aid and comfort to James Kopp who murdered the doctor in Buffalo, NY. They are creepy beyond belief.
ChrisR266 : Choice: I think your instinct and intellect is right about this one. This rift is maybe cataclysmic.
KQµårk 死神 : Surf I take it as Rome is opportunist just like any organization. The reason they target America differently than say France is because they know it’s more conservative.
SallyT : Few believe God is punishing non believers with earthquakes anymore.
choicelady : KQ – Oh – Benedict is a Inquisitional Pope compared to John XXIII. Now there was a POPE – Vatican II, exonerating Jews for “killing Christ”, interfaith – and there are rumors he was murdered by the traditionalists which Benedit so righteously IS (self-righteousl y…)
MurphTheSurf3 : kes…and fed up with authority by whatever name.
kesmarn : Most people will never be as docile and sheeplike as earlier Catholic/Protest ant congregations used to be. People are better educated now.
choicelady : Chris – I met with Bishop Swing, former bishop of CA, who founded United Religions Initiative that seeks real interfaith work. I said that this was the brick wall – all of us everywhere vs. the fundamentalists. It will rival the Great Schism and Reformation in scope I think.
ChrisR266 : KQ: That “new liberalism” is a crock of crap. The church looks more to me like pre vatican II than I can ever remember.
MurphTheSurf3 : KQ…I follow church stuff in general and Rome is behind ALL of this crap…Benedict is a figure head as JPII was at the end (both sick and really old) and the old order is reasserting its control…the trouble….the “faithful” are walking away and the pyramid will collapse from below.
KQµårk 死神 : I’m still surprised how many parties in ‘liberal’ Europe have religious names.
choicelady : Murph – everyone in even my organization’s most progressive churches get that where YOU are is indeed the wave of the future. Our largest churches – our “megachurches” – are all incredibly focused on justice and Christian Humanism.
KQµårk 死神 : Then again with Europe’s rightward anti-immigration shift anything can happen.
kesmarn : I think even Lawrence must have been high.
MurphTheSurf3 : CL…opus dei and other ulta groups capture this Pentecostal Fundamental Evangelical approach and it will fail….as long as that church thinks that going back is the way forward they will trip over themselves coming and going.
KQµårk 死神 : The ironic part is the church in Rome seems more liberal now and it was always the opposite before.
choicelady : kes – wasn’t that the only way to watch LW then????
ChrisR266 : Murph: I left in mind when I got kicked out of CCD at 13 and physically when I went to college. I know what you speak.
kesmarn : “These” not “this”!
kesmarn : c’lady, that is so cool! I hear you. This women do not take crap from the Good Ole Boys.
KQµårk 死神 : Oh I do that too Chris just a recommendation for the rest of the week. I probably take two days off every week just doing completely different things.
choicelady : KQ – they are in for a big shock when they discover that they’ve unleashed the instruments of the church’s destruction. I have a friend in Catholic Charities who is watching all this with horror.
ChrisR266 : Choice: you hit it: Pentecostal. Exactly. That’s what was the final nail in the coffin for me.
choicelady : kes – the head of Network, the nuns’social justice organization with 67,000 members, is run by a former colleague of mine. She’s a bitch on wheels, and takes no hostages, and she can hold her own against “the old boys’ network”!
KQµårk 死神 : Like you said CL they are moving in that direction. They think being extreme like evangelicals will recapture the flock. But history shows that’s backwards logic.
MurphTheSurf3 : Chris…that emigration has already begun….for many reasons….for so many who want a church (like me) CHristian Humanism is very attractive….fo r church services I go where the congregation is liberal, involved and in charge of the church and the clergy represents the culture fully.
kesmarn : c’lady, maybe when they’re really, really, really high….?
ChrisR266 : KQ: I just decided one day to take Fridays off. No news, just blissful fluff. I had such a good day teaching today, I thought aw, I can stretch it. Should have left it alone. Lesson learned.
choicelady : kes – No! You mean 20-year-olds DON’T watch Lawrence Welk??
kesmarn : As we saw today, the Catholic nuns are much more in tune with reality. Always have been.
choicelady : Murph – you may have hit on a critical issue: they are getting more and more ultra conservative NAR (New Apostolic Reformation) “converts” that are taking the church in that direction. What the Bishops don’t get is that it is mean to DESTROY the church as they know it and turn it Pentecostal. They’d better watch out – beware of your wishes!
KQµårk 死神 : Chris I pretty much tune out 99% of cable news and that does it for me. I can handle it on the internets.
ChrisR266 : Murph: I agree, but don’t they realize they will fail? People will not go back to that. They will refuse, and make their displeasure known by their migration out of the church.
MurphTheSurf3 : Kes…yep, they are totally delusional.
kesmarn : Murph, that is gonna be like trying to convince 20 year olds in 2012 to watch the Lawrence Welk Show.
KQµårk 死神 : touche CL
kesmarn : Romney was just born to condescend.
MurphTheSurf3 : Since we are continuing to make reference to the RC Bishops….let me say again…FOR THE BISHOPS….the big issue IS the control of “their” flock when the flock no longer wants them as shepherds. SO, the current crowd of Church Princes has set its sights on a smaller and more militant old time church with plans to regrow from there. Thus the fundamentalism. Expect more of the same. They want the church of 1950 and are going to work toward that as the solution to all of their problems.
choicelady : KQ – then why did they refine it to an art form?
ChrisR266 : KQ: I tried to practice no news Friday, but I failed. I saw this unfold and was just in stitches. These clowns can’t get their shit together if the solar system depended on it.
kesmarn : Chris, still a few more apps out there, too. So maybe more news later…
ChrisR266 : Kes: And, only way to go to graduate school. They pay you!
KQµårk 死神 : Kes yes conservatives are up in arms because Romney was so condescending with that line.
ChrisR266 : Kes: woo hoo! Hell of a problem to have, ‘eh?
kesmarn : Yes, Chris. Assistantship and tuition waiver at both! YAY!
ChrisR266 : KQ: It’s hell having a good sense of humor and great taste, isn’t it? LOL.
KQµårk 死神 : Well didn’t the Catholic church outlaw fallacio for centuries for that reason?
kesmarn : Yes, snowy and son is leaving for LA early in the a.m. to visit his sweetie.
ChrisR266 : Kes: Fellowship or assistantship news yet?
kesmarn : “Severely conservative”!? !? That’s hilarious.
KQµårk 死神 : Chris that’s another fav of mine too.
ChrisR266 : Kes: damned cold down here, too. Snowing. Up in Jeep town too?
kesmarn : Thanks, Chris! So glad the lad has found his niche!
choicelady : Oh Sue – have fun, and drink some for us! See you soon I hope!
KQµårk 死神 : Kes you came in late. Romney today saying he’s ‘severely conservative’ is a much bigger gaffe for righties. It’s like he’s calling them severely mental.
choicelady : KQ – If every sperm is sacred then where is the protest about Viagra?
ChrisR266 : Evening, Kes! I understand congratulations are in order. Great news!
kesmarn : Have fun, Sue! G’night!
ChrisR266 : KQ: my second favorite tunes from the MP movies. “Bright side of life” is the first, of course.
kesmarn : Hey, Chris! Freezing and snowy up here in the Glass City.
choicelady : Chris – all is good now. The earlier part of the week was rugged, but tonight, fine. My POV article caught up with me and all holy hell erupted from some quarters – but support, too.
SueInCa : Well kids i am off too leaving to listen to a group downtown and maybe have a rita or two. Good Night
kesmarn : Not genuine and actually pretty mean, too. “I like being able to fire people.”
KQµårk 死神 : CL no wonder why all week Monty Python’s ‘Every Sperm is Sacred’ has been playing in my head.
ChrisR266 : Hi Choice. It’s great you agreed to help AdLib have a life. Hope all is well with you. I’m just fine and dandy.
SueInCa : Kes he is very unlikeable because he is not genuine. He is even a bit much for republicans and that takes a lot
choicelady : AB – all good, even head stomping kitties, so have a good night! Thanks for dropping by!
kesmarn : Good night, AB. Rest and good health to you and kitty and the Blov.
SallyT : Good night AB. Sorry we aren’t going to get crazy tonight. But I know that kitty is more important.
choicelady : Chris! Good evening and how ARE you? I’m moderating tonight – AdLib went off to have a life briefly.
SueInCa : Later AB kiss the feline
MurphTheSurf3 : AB////Meow…Goo d night.
KQµårk 死神 : Take Care AB.
kesmarn : I read that most analysts are saying Romney’s biggest obstacle is the fact that nearly everyone hates him.
ChrisR266 : Good evening, friends near and far.
choicelady : KQ – “should” is the operative word. As bishops SHOULD have over vaginas. Howsomeever I do believe they’re far more interested than church teachings would like.
AlphaBitch : Thanks, Sue. And not to be rude, but to tend to me, I’m off to la-la land. With a black kitt-eh curled up alongside. Peace out, Planetarians. We rule.
SueInCa : CL that is funny but not because they are still acting the same way now
KQµårk 死神 : At least Romney proves money can’t buy you love.
SueInCa : Cool beans AB that is a weight off your shoulders
choicelady : BAck in ’84 in Rhode Island, four priests were found out to have molested kids. The church acted very vigorously then – they stepped RIGHT UP and excommunicated the woman heading Planned Parenthood in Providence. Now don’t tell ME they don’t act decisively! (Snark)
KQµårk 死神 : Well I have as much personal interest in Romney winning as bishops should about woman’s vaginas.
AlphaBitch : Sue _ YEP. We are officially “under contract”.
kesmarn : So true, Sue. Catholic women pay no heed. If they listened to these bishops, there would be many more families with 10+ kids.
AlphaBitch : Kes: he’s almost back full force (pity us). We let him cuddle and sleep with us last night, and he protested non stop that food was not available 24/7 like at the hospital….he stomped on our heads till 2 AM when we put him on the porch with his “sister”. LIke Simon’s Cat, only more annoying cuz it was real.
KQµårk 死神 : Oh and WTF did ‘secular government’ become a bad phrase? I thought that’s what the founding fathers wanted.
SueInCa : AB did you get the offer?
choicelady : KQ – I snort with laughter about your comparison!!!! I’d give YOU a lot more credit on running the campaign!
SallyT : Sue, I agree and I think the younger generation think this is even more redic from us old farts. None of us in that!!
SueInCa : I guess it really all depends on your level of religiousity. Someone like me would not care for a Bishop or a minister telling me what I can and cannot do. I am sure a lot of Catholic women don’t listen either if they did dispensation for re-marriages would be flooding the Vatican
AlphaBitch : CL: That was only PART of the stress – selling one house, buying and remodeling another, big storm, tree down, live wires on ground, trees crushed, everything else AND crazy work. Too much. It’s why I’m never here (although my heart is)
choicelady : AB – Ohhhh I LIKE that – Shari’a law enacted. But that’s exactly what’s happening here. These institutions take ALL our tax money but decide they dole out THEIR “values”? And yes – it’s a cover up or deflection from their disgusting actions around protecting molesters. It was heating up with the bishops’ arrests, so what did we expect? After all – this has been in the works for MONTHS. So why NOW? To deal with the arrest coverage, that’s why.
KQµårk 死神 : I tweeted earlier that old white celibate men controlling women of child bearing age’s reproductive health was like me running the Romney campaign.
kesmarn : AB, just caught up and saw that you have a sick kitty. Hope he feels better soon!
MurphTheSurf3 : FOR THE BISHOPS….the big issue IS the control of “their” flock when the flock no longer wants them as shepherds. SO, the current crowd of Church Princes has set its sights on a smaller and more militant old time church with plans to regrow from there. Thus the fundamentalism.
choicelady : AB – oh I’m so sorry about Kitt-eh! Sick cats do generate stress. Anyone who thinks you can’t love ’em like family is not someone I’d care to know.
AlphaBitch : Bullshit, CL. And I’m waiting for and Islamic facility to open up and ask that provisions specific to shari’a law hold – like if an employee is accused, if it is a woman, then there must be FOUR witnesses but only TWO for men etc. Now watch em howl. What a can o’worms they have opened.
kesmarn : It’s such a symptom of the bishops’ paternalism too that they feel it’s the employer’s job to dictate term. What about the fact that no one is being FORCED to use contraception here. The decision is ultimately with the individual. And idea they really don’t like.
SallyT : CL, that is why I think these Bishops making an issue of this when they can’t take care of their own sexual problems.
SueInCa : The pedophile thing AB I say they do it because no worry about BC
choicelady : He Sue! Great to see you. I’m more or less moderator tonight since AdLib decided he had the right to a life, silly man. I’m here til the computer craps out.
choicelady : AB – Congrats! I’m in the same ballpark. Or more…
AlphaBitch : Sue – sorry if I missed it. I’m half asleep and will likely bug out in a few. My kitty just got home from the kitt-eh hospital after suffering from pancreatitis. I’M STRESSED and HE gets sick….
SueInCa : AB I thought we were the same age I turn 59 in April
choicelady : AB and everyone – it is my considered opinion that this eruption of Mt. Bishops is to move the spotlight OFF the fact that two bishops were arrested for covering up molestations. This is to propagate the idea that the church IS the fount of morality. (Just don’t look behind that curtain too much, OK?)
MurphTheSurf3 : CL-+- why do all of the non-catholics have to tiptoe around heaven? Because they think they are the only ones there. (Aso works with mos fundamentalists)
AlphaBitch : Not by much, CL. I turn the big SIX = OH! This year. Hurrah for me!
SueInCa : AB you and I both ask the same question
choicelady : AB – Cough. He graduated in 1967. I’m a BIT older than you…
AlphaBitch : CL – what moral values allows those bishops to cover up the pedophilia?
KQµårk 死神 : Yeah but O’Donnell really ticked me off when he misrepresented how universal healthcare works around the world. It is not ALL single payer far from it and many systems rely on employer mandates. He showed he has no clude
choicelady : Murph – yes, but this ruling exempts all specifically religious insitutitons. Now there’s no ambiguity. But I’m still steaming that ONLY Catholics are portrayed as having moral values. Not wishing to corrupt God’s creation with overpopulation isn’t a moral value????
AlphaBitch : Ah, CL – you are a constant surprise. When did your ex go? Blov graduated in 1977 (he thinks – must be a Purduian thing. I KNOW I graduated Texas A&M 19 and 74.)
kesmarn : Oh wow… I know from Fighting Irish too. But that was another lifetime…
choicelady : kes and Alpha (HI Alpha!) my ex went to Purdue. I know from boilermakers…
MurphTheSurf3 : CL…but then O’Donnell showed that almost all of the states had loopholes….he really knows his legislative language.
KQµårk 死神 : CL I did catch that and it shows the hypocrisy of the right like Sue said it’s really about ginning up the right wing to beat Obama.
kesmarn : Yowzah. Boilermakers.
MurphTheSurf3 : CL…but then O
AlphaBitch : Him’s a Boilermaker or something like that.
AlphaBitch : Yeppers
kesmarn : Did the Blov REALLY go to Purdue???
choicelady : KQ – did you see Rachel last night on the issue? Twenty-eight states direct contraceptive coverage, and NINE require it of CHURCHES. This ruling FREES the evangelicals from having to do that in those nine states, one of which is GA and one is IA. Obama is their liberator!
KQµårk 死神 : Kes more power to ’em if I had the aptitude in Maths I would have been a Theoretical Nuclear Physicist instead of a Chemist.
AlphaBitch : Otay. I’m keeping my fingers crossed along with my eyes…
kesmarn : Awwwww… I love you guys! Hey!AB…we haven’t heard back from Texas yet so don’t rule it out!
MurphTheSurf3 : KQ…I will follow up with Ad LIb…this idea has been percolating. I will mention your particular interest. Admin folks are very smart about set up stuff.
SueInCa : KQ they had a problem with Obama not the news I think.
KQµårk 死神 : And what struck me in the polls CL was that the so called evangelical (Protestants) were the only real group that had a problem with the ruling.
AlphaBitch : Kes! Not UT??? Damn Sam. I was hoping to get some Kes time. But the Blov went to Purdue – we have shirts we can send……
SallyT : Kes, I think I might argue with you on that……
kesmarn : Hey BFF! I think it really is a positive. To be flexible and still principled.
choicelady : Oh kes – he might not have gotten the MATH from you, but he got the work ethic, the confidence, the foresight, the drive ALL from you!
kesmarn : I have the same feeling, Murph. He’s a self-made man…didn’t get it from me!
SueInCa : Hi all and Kes you are right about Obama they think it a weakness the rest of the world sees it as a positive
choicelady : KQ – my organization did flood the media with – “are you nuts? What about OUR rights and values” PR, but so far, nobody gave a damn. That’s how RW we have become – Protestants are considered not to be of interest, and liberals are suspected of being hedonists in general.
KQµårk 死神 : Surf their are some great debates going on what to do with Syria or Iran now. Maybe that could be a topic of one article.
MurphTheSurf3 : Kes….MATH…kn eeling on the ground, bowing at the waist and saying with humility: “I’M NOT WORTH!” W-0-W!!!
kesmarn : On the contraception thing, I don’t know if I’ve seen this mentioned, but I am thinking this says so much about Obama’s willingness to listen to other points of view, adapt and find solutions. He’s no dictator.
KQµårk 死神 : CL great point.
choicelady : KQ – I think the RAGE most of the non-Catholic world felt that Protestants, Jews, Muslims (not sure of their position on contraception, but hey) and NON believers all were being said to have NO morals or convictions. For everyone who uses contraception, that’s a highly thought out moral value – for family reasons and global ones. It’s despicable that only anti sex issues are “moral”.
KQµårk 死神 : TC AdLib.
MurphTheSurf3 : KQ….yes I think an article discussion might be very valuable.
kesmarn : Mathematics, Murph. He has worked so hard. I’m proud of him.
KQµårk 死神 : Surf I agree I don’t think the first foray was a mistake. I think Obama went more left first to settle on a left solution.
MurphTheSurf3 : Kes…wonderful to hear of folks going into advanced studies. what field?
SallyT : Well, Murph, the Rebugs aren’t talking about the economy!
kesmarn : Eternally grateful,KQ.
AdLib : Great news Kes! Congrats to your son, that’s fantastic! And KQ, cheers for the assist! Okay, now I really am off! Night!
MurphTheSurf3 : Bye ad lib, we will talk.
SallyT : See you later, AdLib,
choicelady : Murph – I suspect you’re correct!
KQµårk 死神 : Cheers but just sharing my experience. I had the same issue because I decided to go for my advanced degree a few years after undergrad.
kesmarn : B’Bye, AdLib!
choicelady : AdLib – Bye!
MurphTheSurf3 : Spent a good part of today arguing over the Obama-Church Hospitals (not just Catholic)-Contra ception kerfuffle. I think the whole thing was a set up. The Obama people held it up long enough to make the GOP look really bad to independents, for the libs to be happy that the O admin had tried to push it through and for the compromise to look like a master stroke. I think they planned it from day one. Expect more of these attacks.
AdLib : CL – And the MSM presented this as if only the rights of Catholics are the issue, not the rights of women. Real misogyny if you ask me. Okay, now I’m heading out. Have fun! Night!
kesmarn : Thanks so much, all! KQ– remember you advised him to go for a master’s after that earlier disappointment. Brilliant advice!!
choicelady : ADLib – we’ll step out to smoke. Not to worry! Have fun!
KQµårk 死神 : KES AWESOME!!! I love to hear great news for great peeps.
kesmarn : Take a sec to read the good news below before you go, AdLib!
SallyT : Kes, that is WONDERFUL!!!!!!! !!!!!!!
choicelady : Oh kes – that’s spectacular news! Congratulations, and yes, kudos to KQ for good advice. We are SO happy for you!
AdLib : Kes – Thanks so much. I should head out now so I bid all of you a wonderful evening and remind you that I have a large cleaning deposit on Vox Populi so please, no cigarette burns in the carpet. Night!
kesmarn : Doing very well! Son got some good news — acceptance into PhD programs at Purdue and Michigan State — so far. And a LARGE thank you to KQ for some very good advice he gave about two years ago on navigating the grad application scene.
KQµårk 死神 : Great idea surf. I don’t mind a little homework.
choicelady : AdLib – I KNOW, and it generated pushback from Protestants (cough) who have sent out LTEs and press releases saying – what about OUR religious values!!! The MSM is not doing well with this – they pretend ONLY Catholics have morals, and that is seriously pissing off the mainline religions.
AdLib : Murph – Sure, let’s discuss that!
KQµårk 死神 : I agree CL. The more Repugs try to overplay this now the more THEY lose.
choicelady : kes – Hi! How are you tonight?
AdLib : CL – I think that the GOP has been so desperate for a wedge issue, they have jumped in on this with both feet and won’t leave it alone. Now, they are campaigning for the right to PREVENT women from getting contraceptives.. .that 99% of women do or have used! And forcing women to pay up to thousands more for them. A real winning issue, so happy they’re married to it!
MurphTheSurf3 : Ad Lib- we can discuss later. I would love to have a “article discussion” on the Planet every now and then. Send a note out and ask anyone interested to read a certain article (like the Sullivan one) and then set up a time for a IM discussion (time limited). We would do it right.
choicelady : KQ – with the Catholic health care system buying into the settlement, I think it’s now a moot point as a “pound Obama” issue. One bishop is muttering about “fungible money” but since they’re not paying, it makes no sense.
kesmarn : Good Friday evening — To AdLib as you’re on the way out the door and to everyone else!
KQµårk 死神 : One last off topic. AdLib you MUST see ‘In the Loop’ if you have not seen it. Political parody gold with lots of lovely cursing by Scots.
choicelady : AdLib – have a wonderful evening! We will do our best to keep up high standards.
KQµårk 死神 : He he Cartman reference I love it AdLib.
KQµårk 死神 : CL Republicans are still going to be upset but Obama totally diffused the issue politically with his ‘compromise’. Another amazing piece of politically jujitsu.
AdLib : BTW, I WILL BE HEADING OUT EARLY AND HTE LOVELY AND WONDERFUL CHOICELADY WILL BE HOSTING VOX POPULI FOR THE REST OF THE EVENING. PLEASE RESPECT HER “AUTHORATAY” AND TOPICS…SUCH AS THE CURRENT ONE ON CONTRACEPTIVES.
AdLib : Murph – Haven’t read it but will check it out.
choicelady : OK – let’s see if I can get this done for tonight’s topic. WHAT DO YOU THINK THE LONG-TERM CONSEQUENCES WILL BE, IF ANY, FROM THE CONTRACEPTIVE UPROAR? WILL THE GOP CONTINUE TO RUN ON IT EVEN THOUGH IT’S BEEN ADDRESSED, AND IF SO, HOW WILL IT AFFECT THIS YEAR’S ELECTIONS?
SallyT : Oh, KQ, I also watch the Iron Lady. Boy, she sounded like a real Repub!
MurphTheSurf3 : Ad Lib et.al. has anyone/everyone seen the intriguing article by James Fallows in the Atlantic- Obama, Explained? Worth a read. Bookend to Sullivan’s fine piece a couple of weeks back.
AdLib : KQ – Yes, a very clever film!
KQµårk 死神 : Yup AdLib and Sullivan stole it the fecker.
AdLib : Can you imagine this country under a President Santorum with a Repub Congress. The Mayan’s would have been proven right.
KQµårk 死神 : AdLib did you ever see the movie ‘Confederate States of America’ it would be like that.
choicelady : Well folks, speaking of civil war, AdLib had suggestions for tonight. He’s taking off in a bit, so I’m filling in as best as a technology challenged person with a crappy computer can. Here is the topic:WHAT DO YOU THINK THE LONG TERM FALLOUT WILL BE FROM THE CONTRACEPTION/CA THOLIC CHURCH ISSUE? WILL THE REPUBS CONTINUE TO RUN WITH THIS EVEN THOUGH IT’S BEEN ADDRESSED AND IF SO, HOW WILL THAT AFFECT ELECTIONS THIS YEAR?
AdLib : KQ – Yep, you and I coined that phrase a while back and being completely objective, I think it does well describe where things are.
KQµårk 死神 : Indeed AdLib.
KQµårk 死神 : I think Obama is truly presiding over a Cold Civil War.
AdLib : Electing a Repub at this point would be the equivilent of the Confederacy winning the Civil War.
KQµårk 死神 : That’s real Americana Sally.
AdLib : CL – I agree with your feeling about Obama and Lincoln having a bit in common. And politically, we’re in as much of a civil war as could take place nowadays.
SallyT : CL and KQ, I was raised in a dirty collar existence. The family were farmers.
KQµårk 死神 : I bet the blue collar experience no matter what order it is stays with you longest.
choicelady : AdLib – Oh good – you found it! Get your evening off to a great start!
choicelady : KQ – mine is the reverse. Raised in a white collar family but worked and lived a blue collar existence for years. Either way it generates empathy for others not like you.
AdLib : Slurrp!
KQµårk 死神 : Exactly CL. I’m a total product of my blue collar roots even though I worked white collar jobs after college.
choicelady : ADLib – I think your martini is under the table. WE did not drink it!
choicelady : KQ – nothing generates empathy so much as life experiences. That is another thing I did not know about Lincoln. We raised in IL always hear the happy chirpy side about his mother.
AdLib : Sorry, popped away for a moment. Who took my martini?
KQµårk 死神 : CL Yes I was thinking about that too when watching the documentary. Fortunately Obama had a better life too.
SallyT : KQ, Gingrich would go for that!
choicelady : KQ – that said, I get no impression Obama suffers from depression as apparently Lincoln did, and quite badly, too. It’s agonizing to think of his anguish and his courage despite that.
KQµårk 死神 : I didn’t realize his hate of slavery may have come about because his own father kind of slaved Lincoln out when he was young. An IL law said a parent could force their offspring to work and get the fruits of their labor. The kids would only get two bits.
choicelady : KQ – I feel a real similarity between Lincoln and Obama.
choicelady : Sally – then don’t GO to Florida! Sorry you’re a bit under the weather. It’s going around. Whatever it is.
KQµårk 死神 : The more I learn about Lincoln and his life warts and all the more I’m amazed by him.
choicelady : KQ – NO! I did not know that, and my hubby is a great reader of things Lincolnesque.
SallyT : Well, thank you Choice! I feel a little baked. Meds….I wouldn’t pass a drug test in FL.
KQµårk 死神 : I just watch a great documentary on Lincoln. I never realized he started a duel with an opponent but they called it of at the last second.
choicelady : Oops – lost foodchain again.
choicelady : Sally – Choice is choice. How about you? Even only HALF here you’re ahead of most people.
choicelady : foodchain – you’re back! Welcome!
SallyT : Hi, Choice! I am only half here. No comment, AdLib! I will be with you full time in a few. How is Choice this evening, tho?
MurphTheSurf3 : CL I bow in your general direction. Thanks for the kudo.
choicelady : KQ – you pulled it off well, dear friend!
KQµårk 死神 : Wow I think we pulled a sprain with the English language.
choicelady : Murph, darling – you’re a mensch!
choicelady : KQ – can you serve Molotov cocktails to a teetotaling Mormon? Is that kosher. Can I mix any more images?
MurphTheSurf3 : Choice- if it comes down to pistols at 25 paces I will volunteer to be the “second” to both parties and then finish off the wounded.
KQµårk 死神 : Exactly CL and the conservatives want a candidate that throws Molotov cocktails.
choicelady : Hey – Sally’s here!
choicelady : Murph. Do we have any hope of a Burr-Hamilton type standoff? With their “guns are always good” mentality, how can they think of censoring duels? GREAT old American tradition!
KQµårk 死神 : After today’s gaffe at CCRAP expect Santorum to take the lead AdLib. Also Rasmussen has Obama beating Romney by 10 points so there goes his electability argument.
MurphTheSurf3 : Ad Lib…my computer was acting up, repaired and doing well which means I am doing fine. Add to that the Ron Paul people here in Mo. are making a move on the delegate race which means that Rick and Newt are going crazy. Is dueling far off?
choicelady : KQ – yes, that is about the level of his engagement. Marshmallows.
AdLib : Latest Rasmussen poll: Mitt – 30% and Santorum 30%. Lots of Repub talk from Repubs, even leaks from his campaign, that Mitt has a “lukewarm” problem.
choicelady : KQ – yes, the word “severe” does not work with “democracy”. I’d feel sorry for Mitt if he were not so awful in so many ways.
KQµårk 死神 : CL he reloads his marshmallow shooter.
KQµårk 死神 : Cheers surf.
choicelady : KQ – and Mitt just goes back and reloads.
AdLib : Hey Murph! Doing just fine! You?
MurphTheSurf3 : KQ-+–Sorry to hear of your troubles….send ing positive vibes.
KQµårk 死神 : The man just can’t stop shooting himself in the foot.
choicelady : Murph – most of us are fine. How’s by you?
choicelady : KQ – never thought I’d urge a man to take to the bottle, but with Mittens, it could only help.
KQµårk 死神 : Teabaggers understandably saw that as an underhanded complement. I mean severely is a total pejorative description no matter how you cut it.
MurphTheSurf3 : H-E-L-L-O Just back from a day of glittering at CPAC:::::Just Kidding but boy wouldn’t I love to sparkle plenty that crowd….HOW IS EVERYONE?
choicelady : “Severely” WOULD be the right word, just NOT for Romney. Newt, yes. Santorum – without a doubt. Paul – just severe would cover all. But Romney – well, I guess severe shows the internal Mitt. Creepy though…
KQµårk 死神 : He’s a teetotaler that’s the problem.
choicelady : Hey Murph – great to see you here!
AdLib : CL – Nope, just the first part, Romney was talking about being a “severely conservative” governor.
KQµårk 死神 : Yup CL.
choicelady : OMG. What IS in that man’s drink?
choicelady : AdLib – did he SERIOUSLY say that?????
AdLib : KQ – “I’m severely conservative and will be a severe President if elected!”
choicelady : KQ – tell more about Romney’s gaffe. I’m not up on that and DO want to know!
choicelady : AdLib – and a hillarious night!
KQµårk 死神 : We gotta talk about Romney’s ‘severely conservative’ gaffe at CCRAP. Conservatives hate that gaffe more than all the others.
choicelady : KQ – we understand. Take care of yourself, but stay as long as pleases you?
AdLib : I recall that now! It was a hiatus night!
choicelady : Or tour de farce. He was funny!
AdLib : Glad you’re here KQ but please don’t hesitate to tip your hat and bid adieu whenever you’re not up to this.
choicelady : Now foodchain seems to have vanished. One night funk ran this all alone, asking and answering his own questions. It was a tour de force!
AdLib : Nope, just running around a bit!
choicelady : KQ – oh, sweetie – I’m so sorry!
KQµårk 死神 : I’ll hang on as long as I can. Gotta little more pain this week.
choicelady : Welcome back, AdLib – thought you’d been swallowed in the technology maw!
AdLib : Hey hey!
choicelady : Hmmm – excuse me.
KQµårk 死神 : Hi CL I just heard you “POP”!
choicelady : Hi KQ – how are you?
choicelady : Evening, AdLib and foodchain – lovely to see you!
AdLib : Vox Populi, our live chat about the week’s events begins tonight at 7 pm PST. Hope to see you then!