• AdLib : KQ – You have a great weekend too!!!

  • AdLib : Thank you ghsts! Great to have you on Vox! Have a great weekend!

  • AdLib : KQ – Absolutely, Rahm was insisting HCR was dead and Obama refused to accept defeat…and prevailed!

  • ghsts : Thanks all love the stream!

  • ghsts : so with you on that but no one really sees signing statements but the apparatchik, my own ignorance on the subject is a testament to that because I am informed.

  • KQuark : You have to admit though after the Brown election Obama revived the ACA from the dead when he had that debate with the GOP and offered his own plan. The man is frustrating at times but he tends to rise to the occasion

  • AdLib : You know what, it’s getting late and seems like a good time to bring tonight’s very successful edition of Vox Populi to a close. Thanks so much Kquark, ghsts, Bito and all of our other members who made this such a fantastic discussion tonight.

  • AdLib : ghsts – True, he can try and use Executive Orders, Signing Statements and directives by departments. Hope he does as much of that as possible.

  • AdLib : Will do, KQ!

  • ghsts : Ok I know no one ever gets me on this but the only thing President Obama can DO on his own is what he did with DOMA. ACA is a tribute to Reid and Pelosi, and I love them for trying so hard.

  • KQuark : Adlib watch the video “Testify” I posted and you’ll get a chill up your spine

  • AdLib : KQ – But is the GOP still a conservative party or an extremist party? I don’t think they have a lock on conservatives.

  • ghsts : Baggers are inconsequential to everyone it’s just fire, time to roast a pig.

  • AdLib : ghsts – What big Progressive goals can Obama accomplish with a Repub House?

  • KQuark : Again always remember these number 40% conservative 20% liberal until they flip flop we’re always playing from behind

  • KQuark : See therein lies the problem ghsts very few people want a progressive revolution in this country if that’s what you mean.

  • AdLib : KQ – I don’t think so. Because the GOP will always be fighting for worse and worse cuts and laws. Obama will look very moderate compared to them. You said it would be an election of bad and worse, the GOP will always look worse after 2 years of this.

  • ghsts : Not baitin, but what is the plan for the prez next two years, keep low? Sometimes you got to hide to survive.

  • ghsts : I won’t fight the trend, just try to stay true and hope for the best but that is a lousy tactic for revolution.

  • KQuark : Walker teabaggers whatever will all be forgotten.

  • AdLib : I disagree, baggers don’t want or like Mitt and I don’t think he can win. If he does, he will be fatally damaged by the RW extremists and the baggers will not be energized to support him.

  • KQuark : I’ll tell ya what is gonna happen. They are finally gonna reach a settlement on this budget and if you thing the left is gonna blame the GOP for the inevitable cuts you’re mistaken. They will blame Obama.

  • ghsts : That is what makes me sad gop/baggers are conning everyone and the winner will be someone like mittens that has the msm, and big money, looks good on tv and appears decent enough to not do too much damage himself.

  • AdLib : ghsts – Right with you, I think that is where we are headed because with all of these GOP govs and the House veering hard right, it will be a constant battle abd contrast between reasonable Dems and extremist Repubs. And the youth will again support the Dems in big numbers.

  • KQuark : I think the kids are irrelevant unless their is a third party situation like Nader. Look at the turnout from 2008. The mass number of young voters was not really there

  • ghsts : Adlib you said it, if the DNC can jump start the admin to stick to the high road we have an easy win, status quo I’m not so sure. Look at the faces of WI young proud and Liberal.

  • AdLib : ghsts, that just doesn’t seem to be what 2012 will be about.

  • ghsts : the only kids that vote when the left isn’t LEFT are the sons of baggers and gop youts

  • AdLib : Once people feel what GOP austerity is, as they are in WI and all across the nation, they ain’t gonna vote for more of it.

  • KQuark : what do you mean ghsts

  • ghsts : If the messaging sticks with conservative austerity you’ll see a repeat of ’84, crickets.

  • AdLib : KQ – And I think Dems win in any comparison, even bad/worse. When the 2012 GOP Primary has run, it will show the GOP as the party of extremists. And we have Obama. I think that’s our advantage.

  • KQuark : yup a more correct term adlib

  • AdLib : KQ – Agreed though instead of patient, I’d call the right persistent. They are the parasite that keeps sucking the lifeblood out of our nation, knock them away, they swim back just as determined to suck more. And they do suck, a lot.

  • KQuark : But again Adlib like ghsts implied it becomes a bad and worse comparison

  • ghsts : when baggers/ceterist /moderates see the left bail on the far left they think ‘they did it to them what makes me different’, gw beat us in ’04 cause he went all in on crazy.

  • KQuark : People cannot even realize on the left that just focusing on making the ACA a success would flip the pendulum. It doesn’t mater that it’s a compromise the public thinks it’s liberal.

  • AdLib : ghsts – I think we’ll see the youth vote come out very big in 2012 and the baggers will be overwhelmed. They do not represent more than a small minority of voters and once voters see what Baggerism means in government, they will become even more marginalized.

  • KQuark : The right is patient Reagan started things but did not achieve nearly as much of the conservative agenda as he’s given credit. He compromised and raised taxes 11 times after slashing them. But as long as he talked the conservative game even in code the base loved him.

  • AdLib : KQ – You think the baggers can attract the center? I think the only reason baggers won last year was that impatient idiot voters felt the Dems and Obama should have made everything wonderful in a year and a half and they just threw a tantrum. Now that Repubs can’t play the innocent card, they lose big time in 2012 when it’s an election about choice instead of blame.

  • ghsts : Listen to the kids they get it and they don’t think you’re trying to sell them santa clause so they really trust you when you need them.

  • ghsts : Boner is great case in point, once the man pulled off the dogs on DOMA no one is going to give a shit how much he rants but the homophobes.

  • KQuark : Oh I know I look more at the trends anyway. But look at the flip side. I think if you’re never gonna be rewarded with your base unless you turn the whole system upside down why even try. The center is much easier to gain especially when baggers are the way they are.

  • AdLib : ghsts – I think the contrast will be establish itself. If the Dems are campaigning for economic justice and the baggers are campaigning for keeping the Bush tax cuts for the wealthy and gutting government and schools, the public will get the message loud and clear and see the Dems very favorably because their campaign is constructive, not anti-bagger.

  • BigDogMom : Well kids, it’s time for me to go, my mind is going blank right about now. I’m going to wonder over and read some new posts, was great to see you all again. Good night!

  • BigDogMom : Adlib, get your jist, the Dems have the perfect foil with what the GOP is doing now as campaign ads, the Dems come off like the good guys…let’s hope they use.

  • ghsts : You can try, but only artists understand perspective, give a normal human a crayon and it’s all stick figures.

  • AdLib : KQ – I disregard the generic polls, especially in a Presidential election. Folks will vote based on the presidential candidates and local races and personalities. I think the Dems will have the momentum that is clearly building on their and Obama’s side.

  • KQuark : It’s not about being just as bad it’s about putting what’s really going on into perspective.

  • ghsts : Adlib- Stay focused only on the single flaw of bagger messaging, one after the other and people start to become uncomfortable with their own delusions.

  • BigDogMom : Adlib-should have said “make disgruntled progressives happy”

  • AdLib : BDM – But we have to use our smarts to not play their game, don’t contest them on their issues, present our own issues and campaign for them. Economic justice and respect for American workers being a top one.

  • BigDogMom : I’m going to read up on what FDR did, how did he get everyone to fall in line, or did he get everyone to?

  • ghsts : KQ- People are swayed only when they want to believe the lie, you won’t change that by appearing to be just as bad as the gop that just helps the delusion.

  • AdLib : ghsts – Yep, as long as the Baggers represent what the GOP is, we can beat them in many ways. And asshats like Walker make the choice very clear. They wail about how Obama and Dems are extremists but once in power, they prove that it is not the Dems that are, they are.

  • KQuark : Hardcore base of disgruntle progressives.

  • BigDogMom : KQ-how do we make them happy? Can we make them happy?

  • BigDogMom : Adlib, I think Wisc, OH and other states were cruscial for the middle to see how many normal people were out there protesting.

  • KQuark : The real point is the Dems are always at a considerable disadvantage. Just imagine if you are an independent and you see the left constantly hammer the Dems. You can’t say it’s not human nature to make you view Dems negatively. I look at things like the daily tracking polls and even though the Repugs are behaving this badly they still lead generic congressional pols by almost 5 points

  • ghsts : I felt actually guilt about running in on WI, then IN saved me by being a bigger ass so I had some guilt free protesting.

  • BigDogMom : Adlib, not for the far right, they are itching for us to do just that, they want a fight, they want us outta here…little do they know, we out number them

  • AdLib : That’s why those of us who want to make this happen NEED to get out there in protests and rallies and make that activity “normal” for people who believe in this democracy and want economic justice.

  • ghsts : Adlib- That is exactly why I say just point the baggers back at the gop nonstop if you want to court the center.

  • AdLib : I think the mission is to get people to believe that a rising up of the public is happening. If they believe it, they will join it.

  • BigDogMom : KQ-hardcore base of Dems or Repubs?

  • KQuark : Oh I know most do and most will come home but there’s a hard core base people who are lost to the dems

  • ghsts : The problem isn’t demanding more from good people, it’s thinking you can sell bad people.

  • BigDogMom : Adlib-Would love it!

  • AdLib : Wouldn’t it be entertaining for a real populist movement to arise and sweep the Tea Party into the dust bin of history?

  • PatsyT : Well it is that time for me also… I wish you all a wonderful weekend… goodnight

  • BigDogMom : Adlib-We’re going to have to walk like an Egyptian and start our own way of pulling together

  • ghsts : KQ- I’m going to keep it light but you have to let your defenses down and see that honesty makes for temp hits but in the end people do know the difference.

  • KQuark : BDM anything but that

  • KQuark : night chrisr

  • PatsyT : Nighty night ChrisR…

  • BigDogMom : Night Chris, take care, sleep well

  • AdLib : Night Chris, thanks so much for all of your input and insights tonight!

  • AdLib : Honestly, I think it’s going in the wrong direction to try and work through the corporate MSM. A people’s network, beginning with Facebook and Twitter then with enough backing, maybe tv.

  • BigDogMom : KQ-the only thing I can think of is write letters to them, post on their blogs, complain…sqeek y wheel gets the grease

  • KQuark : I guess I’m just jaded because I still peruse all the so called progressive websites and they are just as relentless against the dems as faux news

  • ChrisR266 : Time for me to retire. Enjoy the rest of your evening, folks, and the weekend as well.

  • PatsyT : KQ I get it…

  • ghsts : Hey Bito- I know your an insider so if you read my posts I still love that your trying.

  • BigDogMom : Pasty, has my husband says, “the guy is a dick”

  • KQuark : I just meant if I had a clue how I could effectively change that fundamental dynamic in our media

  • AdLib : Patsy and KQ, I think it’s happening. Unions and Progressive groups are building coalitions (like the one GROW is in with them now) and a communications network is growing.

  • PatsyT : I am talking Walker

  • PatsyT : See BDM look at him… he needs a tool

  • KQuark : Dems used about every once of political capital they did have on the ACA

  • BigDogMom : bito-is that posted on OT, would sure like to help Gov. Walker out…ha, ha, ha

  • PatsyT : Nonsense KQ you do have more then a clue

  • KQuark : Cheers bito

  • KQuark : I’d be the highest paid Dem consultant if I had a clue about that

  • bito : Are you a concerned citizen with ideas for how we make government operate more efficiently? Are you a state employee with ideas for identifying and eliminating waste, fraud, and abuse? Please complete the survey below and share your thoughts. Your information is completely anonymous – and leaving contact information is only optional. Thank you. «link»

  • BigDogMom : KQ-I think that’s were the President seems to excell at, he knows when to use his political capital

  • AdLib : KQ – We have to recognize what happened with Egypt and build our own network, outside of the MSM. They are a corporate wall between reality and the public.

  • PatsyT : KQ how do we get all these diverse interests on the same page?

  • ghsts : I’m a believer in single message, messaging If I could get DNC hear for a while I would say ignore every question on WI until you pin that one down, with regards to budget pokes.

  • KQuark : But Dems have to remind people through the media filter.

  • PatsyT : That sums it up, KQ

  • ChrisR266 : BDM: There is such a panicked, grasping at something air about what’s going on right now, I am left to believe that some Governors were left to pull it out while the boobs in D.C. tried to figure out how to lasso the radical TP arseholes they sold their souls to save the party

  • BigDogMom : KQ-Yep, sucks

  • AdLib : KQ – Nailed it.

  • BigDogMom : Speaking of puppies, mine is taking up my side of the bed, the big galoof

  • KQuark : indifferent*

  • KQuark : To me it’s pretty simple when Repubs hold the presidency they have a 100% cheerleader on their side, an indeferent MSM and a tiny liberal media against them. When Dems get in office they get it from all sides.

  • BigDogMom : KQ-The Dems better keep reminding the people this time around..they have perfect video of late for their ads.

  • ghsts : BDM- Hey, Everyone should be piling on walker for that reason alone, hard to ever forgive.

  • BigDogMom : Chris, sometimes I swear that’s what they are doing…and they say those welfare queens have a sense of entitlement..I think the GOP takes the prize on that.

  • ghsts : Nooooo not religion, it’s dark outside “the Family” is coming to get me. kittens, puppies, guiness ok I’m better now.

  • AdLib : KQ – True indeed, Americans elected Republicans back in power just two years after they despised them for destroying our economy and getting us into two unending wars. How much shorter can memories get?

  • BigDogMom : ghst, what’s shaking? Answer to your question, I think most people are just figuring out what Walker has put in his bill…and they ain’t buying it.

  • ChrisR266 : BDM : I have thought that for a while. I think the things we’re seeing now are the “nuclear option.” The throw the kitchen sink, women and children at it strategy and hope it buys our sorry asses some time stragety.

  • PatsyT : Hi ghsts!

  • BigDogMom : Adlib, been following them, read “The Family”, scary chit

  • PatsyT : BDM YES they have totallyjumpped the Shark and they have the leather jacket to prove it… Palin

  • KQuark : No one supports it at the time but Americans have short memories

  • ghsts : Hey

  • AdLib : Hey ghsts! Welcome to Vox!

  • AdLib : BDM – This is about the GOP’s sense of entitlement of power and wealth. And if you’ve followed Sue’s and CL’s writings about The Family, God wants them to have all of our wealth and power in their hands and pockets.

  • BigDogMom : Have the Republicans jumped the shark?

  • ghsts : Can someone explain how anyone can support no bid contracts for anything?

  • KQuark : that is true adlib this was a throw da bums out reactionary vote nothing else

  • ChrisR266 : BDM: I agree. They are not a party of foresight. Thus the situation they find themselves in now. I don’t think they can work fast and loose enough. The clock will run out before they can dismantle the populace that will defeat them.

  • PatsyT : Good to know BDM, I can rest easy now.

  • BigDogMom : Patsy-George Will never come close to me, if I can help it!

  • AdLib : Chris – That’s why it sure seems like their overconfidence about having any kind of mandate from the 2010 election seems to be backfiring.

  • BigDogMom : Adlib, your correct, for they are “The Chosen Ones”, forgive me dear lord for forgetting

  • ChrisR266 : And, if the GOP deems it proper to pursue “Slash and burn,” the backlash ought to put an end to it all in 2012.

  • AdLib : BDM – Not as much a grudge I’d say as indignation that power was taken away from them and their corporate overlords. They “deserve” to have control over Americans and steal their money to give to the wealthy.

  • BigDogMom : Chris, sometimes I wonder if they see no farther than the next month with some of the moves they make

  • PatsyT : Thanks BDM I am sure that George Will

  • BigDogMom : Patsy-George Will

  • ChrisR266 : BDM: I don’t think they have enough time for that, especially after what has unfolded over the last two months. People’s radar is going to be on high…

  • BigDogMom : It’s all about the destruction of the Dem party, they are holding a grudge about 2008 and the wupping they got

  • AdLib : Or at least buzzing.

  • PatsyT : Hey who said today that Huckabee is vibrating ?

  • CleoPatra333 : My partner is a Master-Abator.

  • AdLib : KQ – They want it all. I don’t think for a moment that they don’t believe they can win the presidency. But absolutely, they want Congress badly to serve their corporate masters.

  • KQuark : good point bdm

  • BigDogMom : KQ-they want the local and state government, re-districting.. .if they can’t win with the numbers they have, heck they’re going to make it impossible for the Dems to win

  • PatsyT : Oh oh Jinx … that is a great name for a cat

  • AdLib : Jinx Patsy!

  • PatsyT : ChrisR YES I love those ladies!! «link»

  • KQuark : Yup BDM and like I said in a post I don’t really thing they care too much about the presidency in 2012. They want congress.

  • AdLib : Check it out, look for the union label: «link»

  • CleoPatra333 : Chris,I hear you.

  • BigDogMom : Adlib-You know how they work, short term gain only..they only see up to 2012!

  • AdLib : It takes a tool to know one.

  • ChrisR266 : Does anyone besides me remember that song from advertisements in the seventies: “Look for the union label, when you are buying…”?

  • KQuark : exactly but the GOP realizes no one looks into how law actually turns out

  • BigDogMom : Patsy-Now I get it, bad girl! LOL!

  • AdLib : KQ – But can the GOP really accomplish these goals or might the public step up to stop them. One thing to keep in mind is that whatever this asshole and his lemmings in the legislature passes, it can be reversed by the next Dem majority.

  • BigDogMom : KQ, but in the end they wind up cutting jobs?

  • PatsyT : BDM he looks like the kind that needs a tool to get the job done… just saying

  • CleoPatra333 : Always look for the union label, baby.

  • PatsyT : How about those Wakenhut Security gaurds he hired

  • BigDogMom : Cleo, more like a sawzall, a big one…

  • KQuark : Adlib that’s why I say there are no behind the door conspiracies. As long as the GOP says jobs they can do anything in the open.

  • AdLib : Add to all of this, his bill attacks and tries to kill Planned Parenthood as well as allow him to sell off publicly owned facilities to the Kochs and other energy companies as no bid deals…costing the people of WI potential millions in a give away to the Kochs and cronies.

  • PatsyT : Cleo oh I don’t know a craftsman may be in a union….

  • BigDogMom : Patsy, the guy is a “Tool” no need to retro fit him with anymore

  • CleoPatra333 : A craftsman?

  • ChrisR266 : AdLib: D’Oh.

  • PatsyT : What kind of tool would the Governor want?

  • AdLib : Or perhaps you would like a BurriToe?

  • AdLib : Bito – I liked this section: “Democrats contend that Walker seems to be more interested in changing Wisconsin’s political dynamics than in financial stewardship. Even outside observers are starting to agree. “What you’ve got is a governor who’s come in with a great appetite for achieving his ends,” said Norman J. Ornstein, a scholar at the conservative American Enterprise Institute. “This is far more about power than it is about money.”

  • PatsyT : Bito I know he wants some tools so maybe we should send him some.

  • ChrisR266 : AdLib: Oh for gawd sakes…

  • BigDogMom : Hey Pork has a new marketing promo, got rid of “Pork, the other white meat.”…it’s so good, I forgot what it was.

  • PatsyT : AdLib that is gross!! Ewwww

  • AdLib : KQ – Maybe we’ve got a new creation here, ToeDucken!

  • PatsyT : Ohh hI love Dog people during the day it seems like it’s the cat peoole that run things… Ha those cats

  • bito : Limiting unions just part of Wisconsin governor’s agenda «link»

  • KQuark : night C&C

  • BigDogMom : Adlib, as Martha would say, “It’s a good thing”!

  • KQuark : look down south pork is a food group

  • AdLib : Good thing I stopped using bacon fat to moisturize my toes!

  • PatsyT : Night Cher Night Cyrano1

  • KQuark : Adlib Zombies remind me of the movie the Serpent and the Rainbow

  • BigDogMom : Good night Cher, take care!

  • ChrisR266 : AdLib: Well, my dog would like them. Snausages are his favorite thing in the world. The Paco will do almost anything for a Snausage.

  • AdLib : Night Cher!!! Have a relaxing weekend!

  • BigDogMom : Nite cyrano, sweet dreams!

  • BigDogMom : BACON, BACON, BACON, MUST GET SOME BACON…YUM, YUM, YUM..

  • AdLib : Night cyrano1, so glad to have you a part of tonight’s VP! Have a great weekend!

  • ChrisR266 : Golden Slumbers, Cher.

  • AdLib : BDM – I believe the man’s toes were shaped like Snausages. :lol:

  • ChrisR266 : Restful slumber to you, cyrano

  • BigDogMom : Adlib, did the guy had peanut butter on his toes or what?

  • AdLib : Batboy must be rolling over in his grave…if he’s not a blogger at HP-AOL.

  • PatsyT : Oh hey anyone put up Roy Zimmerman?

  • PatsyT : KQ one of these days I need some current pop antidotes……. .. I am turning into a firework… I know you have the stuff

  • KQuark : *where were

  • AdLib : As we’re past the serious issue section of tonight’s VP, time to share some of the most popular headlines from Hackington Pose: ” New Zombie-Creating Fungi Discovered ” , “UPDATE: Northwestern President Condemns Sex Toy Demo” (even updated with breaking sex toy news flash…or hot flash), “Dog Eats Man’s Toes While He Sleeps”.

  • KQuark : With the topic of music night I always had to wonder where where the protest songs of the 00’s generation?

  • BigDogMom : Artist, thanks, they must have felt the need to tell her that, because knowing how she operates, she would just pop up on the ballot two days before the election..”No questions please from the press”

  • KQuark : Yup that’s why it’s an easy target to make fun of

  • cyrano1 : I’m outa here also! Love ya all! :)

  • PatsyT : KQ every Pop song my 12 year old like to listen to has the phrase “put your hands in the air” Major issue when driving

  • Chernynkaya : Well, I think all this talk of the hour reminded me f how sleepy I am–and my typing is disintegrating. so I’ll wish you all a great night!

  • CleoPatra333 : Still luv you all. And you can’t stop me.

  • BigDogMom : It’s 1:21am here in CT…Cher it’s better than calling him “Biotch”!

  • Artist50 : BDM. That was from a long time ago but I couldn’t figure out how to get on this damn thing. I meant that there were journalists that warned her that she wasn’t going to skip Iowa and think she could get in the the race later. They want to scrutinize her in Iowa like everyone else.

  • Chernynkaya : Taht’s oK, Cleo– One night I kept calling bito “Biot” and it turned into another riff.

  • BigDogMom : KQ, settle down, settle down…

  • PatsyT : Artist jump in any time you like …

  • AdLib : Cher – Yep, but we have gone past 11 pm before I believe.

  • CleoPatra333 : Sorry KQ, I did did mean to get your AV incorrect.

  • KQuark : Oooooh! Oooooo! put your hands up in the air like ya just don’t care

  • Chernynkaya : Oh, I see. But I still don’;t think it’s an actual record. Just a record of so many still here?

  • AdLib : KQ – Just about. This is a rollicking good Vox tonight! And no crashes!!!

  • PatsyT : KQ once you got here the party started

  • KQuark : didn’t you guys start about 7 PST

  • AdLib : KQ – Had you in mind as I wrote it!

  • BigDogMom : Adlib, you nailed it…WARNING…W ARNING!

  • PatsyT : WARNING WILL ROBINSON

  • KQuark : AL you know I love a ST reference.

  • Chernynkaya : KQ record of what?

  • PatsyT : BDM Yes they do not like questions…. it is kind of like the Wicked witch of the west getting water splashed on her

  • KQuark : Is this a new record for the Vox P

  • cyrano1 : Gee thanks R266!! Now I want to get in my car and go find chocolate at this hour??

  • AdLib : Patsy – So true, when you ask these Repub robots a question, it’s like that original Star Trek episode where Kirk tells and android, “Everything I say is a lie.” “But if everything you say is a lie…then you are telling the truth…but you cannot be telling the truth if everything you say is a lie…WARNING… WARNING…”

  • ChrisR266 : Y’all just chat away. Back in a fewl.\

  • Chernynkaya : No adlib– I am talking about the persuadeables– the sane. I have a problem with some of them too!

  • BigDogMom : Hey Artist, what did you mean way back, is Palen running?

  • PatsyT : Hey Artist…

  • ChrisR266 : Cher: I just had some 89% pure dark with a titch of lime and ancho chili. It was orgasmic.

  • Artist50 : Hi Patsy I don’t know what I’m doing so I’m kind of watching tonight

  • BigDogMom : Patsy/Adlib – they don’t like questions, because they don’t really know the answers, they know bumper stickers

  • CleoPatra333 : @QK, can’t wait to see her on the beach this summer,rather, this spring.

  • Chernynkaya : Likewise, Cyrano. HAve all my life–neighbors, teachers, work–and family of course.

  • AdLib : Cher – Kind of you to say but there is a line for me, I’ll put the effort into conversations with folks I think have at least a speck of daylight for reason to get in but those that are locked on like a bear trap to the RW BS, I don’t bother at all.

  • cyrano1 : Condolences to everyone! I live in my perfect blue bubble along with my family which is totally blue, and hang out with my friends who are flaming libs like myself. Life is good!!

  • PatsyT : Ahh AdLib but you know what … They don’t like to answer questions

  • Chernynkaya : Yeah, Chris– like the super dark stuff.

  • CleoPatra333 : @PT, don’t do for the fake stuff.

  • KQuark : My wife just got back in the room Cleo she said Koooool she use to be a lifeguard on the beach.

  • AdLib : Sometimes I wonder, if the die hard RW Repubs kind of know they’re not representing the truth but just see it as necessary that they defend it.

  • Chernynkaya : I just wish I had the patience and the cool head to debate the persuadables. I get so mad I antagonize instead of winning them over. Stupid, but I seem unable to change. I use C’Lady and Adlib as role models, but to no avail, yet.

  • PatsyT : Orange County CA I am a real house wife of Orange County and unlike them, everything on me is Real

  • BigDogMom : I tend to just stare blankly at my husbands RW sister and brother….

  • CleoPatra333 : Living in Virginia Beach, Virginia.

  • ChrisR266 : Cher: Oh for Christ sakes, not that pussy ass stuff from happy land PA, I’m talking about real, 65% or above cacao chocolate that makes your stomach and mind all warm and wonderful.

  • AdLib : Cleo – We have some members out your way.

  • KQuark : Kool Cleo my wife is from Churchland/Ports mouth

  • cyrano1 : Cher: I’ve also mellowed considerably. Now I’m only barely tolerable when in the company of RW’s.

  • AdLib : I gave up the whole concept of debating die hard Republicans. They don’t use facts, references, history, it’s all magical thinking.

  • BigDogMom : Poor KQ, beautiful state, too bad it’s so red

  • Chernynkaya : Oh Noes– not the HersheyPolice!

  • CleoPatra333 : I’m Southeastern Virginia.

  • PatsyT : Well now how is this for reverse racism… She felt that because I was white, blond, green eyes and from arian background I should think like she did. How could I come to any other conclusion?

  • ChrisR266 : You people have got to stop this disinformative propaganda about chocolate! What the hell? This is unAmerican. I’m reporting all your asses.

  • Chernynkaya : LA, CA.

  • Chernynkaya : Me too, KQ. I have zero tolerance for certain rabid Rw’s. And here I just claimed I was more tolerant! But trust me–I am. I used to be ridiculous.

  • AdLib : Where are you Cleo?

  • cyrano1 : chrisR266 and BDM: Exactly! Chocolate got to me also! Now I can eat it again with no hot flashes. Just get headaches instead. Oh well.

  • ChrisR266 : Cleo: No, OH-IO here.

  • KQuark : Nope the bright red state of GA.

  • AdLib : L.A., CA

  • BigDogMom : Southwestern CT

  • CleoPatra333 : Are all you guys/gals on the Pacific coast?

  • ChrisR266 : BDM: What? Chocolate?!? WTF?

  • PatsyT : Cher, thats just it you are stuck there with someone from the Bates Motel…

  • KQuark : Yeah as I get older I have a tougher time keeping quiet when people talk right wing crap. I think it actually hurt me toward the end of my career. I know it did with one director at least.

  • AdLib : Patsy – I agree about that, the diehard loonies who think Beck or some other authority figure has handed them wisdom in a Big Mac wrapper always look loony. But that kind of blind faith can’t be argued out of people, IMO.

  • ChrisR266 : BDM: YAY! Give your Father in law a great big hug for me! He’s a righteous dude.

  • Chernynkaya : Yeah, biut where are you going to go on Catalina?

  • PatsyT : KQ … She did not see me coming… she thought that she was making so much sense … I had a few questions she had no response to and then she had a melt down… Woww maybe we should have asked for our money back.

  • BigDogMom : Chris, I went through it naturally and early, 7 yrs latter still getting them….only when I eat chocolate, now does that suck or what?

  • KQuark : But it’s like Adlib said just a blind spot like being part of a club I guess.

  • KQuark : My cardiologist is a pure enigma. One of the nicest guys I even met and the best doctor by far I ever had. He litterally does anything he can for me. They don’t even ask me to pay for doctor visits if I can

  • ChrisR266 : Cher: I know of what you speak. Never went through the conservative streak in the mid years, but find myself getting more weird ass liberal (as some of my friends would say).

  • Chernynkaya : Patsy– what an awful experience! If it was anywhere but catalina, I’d have left.

  • cyrano1 : ChrisR266: Eventually the flashes will go away – along with any hopes for a meaningful relationship. Yay!! Free at last!!

  • BigDogMom : Patsy, my father-in-law confessed to my husband that he really likes Rachel Maddow, he said, “but don’t tell your brother or sister, you know how they are with Fox and all…” never laughed so hard, he’s 88!

  • KQuark : Patsy it is amazing what people will believe

  • Chernynkaya : Chris– I know that the common wisdom is that people become more conservative with age, but in my case I became more conservative in my 30’s and have gotten progressively progressive since then. And as I get older, I have more compassion, and mUCH less judgment.

  • ChrisR266 : BDM: Eff the hot flashes! Sheesh, going on 6 years and I can’t seem to shake them. Don’t suggest hormones, not going to happen. AT least I’m of good temperament and strong constitution. I just sweat a LOT. Like the thermostat went up 10 degrees. Sigh

  • PatsyT : AdLib my hubby thought it would be nice to surprise me with a trip to Catalina … so off we went and stayed at a bed and breakfast and much to our surprise the hostess was an avid BECK watcher and has to have the March of dumb asses or whatever they called themselves this was a major issue and O boy fire works!! but I looked at it this way… she was making a total ASS out of herself and if that many folks like that then so be it… they will show them selves to be total ASSHATS … the other guests at the B&B came up to us later in the day and said … Should we have our food checked for poison? No one bought her crap because it has the basis in delusion and eventually people get that.

  • CleoPatra333 : BDM, I hope so!!

  • BigDogMom : Cleo honey, just wait, it will happen naturally!

  • ChrisR266 : Cher: It may be different with us, we shall have to watch ourselves closely as we it those 70s and 80s. I watch my parents resist with gusto, but old learning from youth happens to creep back in at times. It’s tough, they’re two of the coolest people I’ve ever known.

  • BigDogMom : cyrano-LOL!! don’t touch the stuff myself, but my 30 something sister does, get that!

  • BigDogMom : KQ-I’m more like that now…not as selfconcious as I used to be…might be the hot flashes

  • CleoPatra333 : I need to re-invent myself.

  • KQuark : I wish BDM. If you cut me open I have 47 rings with a 30 year old’s mind and a 87 year old heart.

  • cyrano1 : BTM: It would take so much, I’d end up paralyzed in the ER! :)

  • Chernynkaya : Luv you too, Cleo.

  • BigDogMom : cyrano, botox baby, botox!

  • Chernynkaya : I think you’re right Chris! ;-)

  • CleoPatra333 : I love you guys/gals

  • ChrisR266 : Cher–not so late and you’re not getting stupid ;-)

  • cyrano1 : BDM: RRRrrrriiiigght! But the face is a dead giveaway!

  • Chernynkaya : Chris– I have found the opposite to be the case.

  • KQuark : I use to be an optimist but for obvious reasons I’m a seize the moment type now.

  • CleoPatra333 : What’s that?

  • BigDogMom : Hey cyrano, 70 is the new 50

  • ChrisR266 : I have found over the years that the most difficult phenomenon to resist the move toward conservativism in one’s mature years. Of course, conservative also means narrow when it applies to older populations. There are a number of reasons why this happens in general. It does not mean that is is destiny.

  • cyrano1 : When you get into your 70’s like me you’re just happy you haven’t reached the alternative yet. :)

  • BigDogMom : Cleo-it’s gets better….with age, 52 yrs young

  • Chernynkaya : Cleo– I missed it again! :lol:

  • CleoPatra333 : I’ll be 47 this year

  • Chernynkaya : Cleo– I just got it. Don’t worry–next year you won’t be.

  • PatsyT : Opps I know you are very much the optimist other wise you would not bother with any of the online activism. I am just saying don’t ever give up stand your ground and avoid RWs that watch Beck.

  • KQuark : Hey we should stitch those two thoughts together adlib as a basis for a post

  • CleoPatra333 : I would prefer to be 45

  • Chernynkaya : Cleo– I’m nOt 45 either! But what does it mean? Or is it so late I am getting stupid. :-)

  • BigDogMom : Adlib, I did the only thing I knew how to do…thinking she was family, like my mother, but she’s not, she’s her father’s daughter…her mom died young so that was her influence.

  • KQuark : Exactly Adlib. I think rationalization is a more powerful motive than reason because it involves thought and emotion.

  • cyrano1 : BDM: I’ll bet you can!! It’s pretty pervasive almost everywhere, but Appalachia and the South are definitely hot pockets!

  • PatsyT : AdLib,

  • CleoPatra333 : OT, I still have problem saying that I’m anything but 45.

  • AdLib : Patsy – I’m an optimist too but what I’ve found in human nature is that those who use reason to arrive at the best conclusions think they can use reason to convince people out of beliefs that aren’t based on reason. Have you ever tried to convince a Republican that he/she is voting against their own interests? It’s like trying to convince Arianna that she should have principles.

  • BigDogMom : cyrano, I can tell you some stories about the hillbillies of Wise Mountain, VA…I bet Adonai can too, he live just on the other side of it

  • ChrisR266 : No reasoning with racists. Racism is a defensive mechanism. Defensiveness is a nut not easily cracked by normal means.

  • CleoPatra333 : Hey Adlid, Hey Cher, Hello to everyone

  • KQuark : No but I’ve been to half of the bum eff little paper mill towns in the south.

  • BigDogMom : Miss Cleo!

  • PatsyT : Well Hello Cleo

  • Chernynkaya : Hey. Cleo!

  • AdLib : Welcome to Vox, Cleo!

  • cyrano1 : KQ: Have you ever been to Jeff? (short for Jefferson Davis, I think). We drove through S Georgia before the civil rights movement and Jeff was out of a time warp, throwing us all back into the early 1900’s. A teensy very dead little town in the middle of nowhere. The only two people I saw were a stocky old white guy in bib overalls yelling “boy!” to the young black guy a few yards away. We decided to get back in the car and keep driving instead of stopping for lunch.

  • PatsyT : Well AdLib I am the optimist … sometimes

  • Chernynkaya : AL– that’s a great motto! I have to remember that.

  • CleoPatra333 : Ladies and Gentleman, I have been very, very, urban, urbane, for 46 years. When is it going to stop making a difference in everyone else’s lives?

  • BigDogMom : OMG friggin Lock Up

  • AdLib : Patsy – this is the first time that instead of us simultaneously saying the same thing, we’ve simultaneously said the opposite. Drink!

  • Chernynkaya : BDM I do think those folks are lost causes. I’d do what you did.

  • KQuark : They sent in two cars the driver must be AA

  • PatsyT : Hey KQ this is better then lock up on MSNBC

  • KQuark : Shots fired! Officer down! Just kidding.

  • Chernynkaya : AL– when I was in LA, I was shocked by the racist nick knacks they sold in the AIRPORT!

  • BigDogMom : Adlib, now I know why my mother left when she was 18 and went north to Univ of OH….she couldn’t take it…you should this cousins father…rabid rasist, KKK

  • PatsyT : YOu know BDM don’t give up, look at Senator Byrd from West Virginia.

  • AdLib : BDM – My motto about that is, you can’t reason people out of a position they didn’t use reason to acquire.

  • BigDogMom : Patsy, for years I have tried to reason with her, just gave up…

  • AdLib : BDM – Oh man! I spent little time in the South until the last several years, was in LA quite a bit (flew out the day before Katrina) and I realized how clueless I was about how much racism is cemented in parts of the South. The racist attacks on Obama since the campaign didn’t surprise me after that.

  • PatsyT : BDM you know what if you had asked her ” What do you mean by that?”

  • ChrisR266 : BDM: Wow. Makes me quake.

  • Chernynkaya : BDM– she still used the term “darky?” Is her name Scarlett??

  • CleoPatra333 : Thank you BDM

  • KQuark : No idea let me check.

  • BigDogMom : Adlib, I know ain’t it, my cousin had to point that out to me on the phone, thinking it would impress me…then she said she didn’t trust the darky in the WH….hung up on her, haven’t talked to her in almost a year

  • PatsyT : KQ DUI ?

  • KQuark : Wow we have our windows open and right now I can hear a cop over his loudspeaker trying to pull someone over.

  • Chernynkaya : BDM– I realize now that I live in a bubble. However, I have travelled in the South so I have a small inkling. Very small.

  • ChrisR266 : Oh Geeze BDM, really? Wow.

  • AdLib : BDM – The water fountain – it’s sad and it’s funny.

  • PatsyT : BDM That should be a bumper sticker

  • ChrisR266 : I think the force gives us fireflies in the summer to stave off the dark. In the winter, the force give us snow. Snow lightens even the most bleak landscape.

  • KQuark : Actually it’s not nearly as bad as when we moved here. The place we live near now is right next to a campus so the kids are a breath of fresh air.

  • BigDogMom : Look on the bright side everyone, my mother’s home town of Wise,VA, the Piggly Wiggly still has that “Blacks Only” waterfountain on the side of the building…white people drink out of it now, (because it’s the only one that works), that’s progress right?

  • ChrisR266 : I said to someone over at the other place a few months ago that they should stop bitching about the snow.

  • AdLib : We’ve got at least 4-5 members in OH.

  • ChrisR266 : Oh, the dark, I just weary of the dark.

  • KQuark : Hell Marietta is flaming librul compared to Kennesaw

  • PatsyT : Nighty Night Khirad… enjoy the day tomorrow

  • cyrano1 : QK: Wow! Marietta??? I’ve actually been there! Lived in McRae and Atlanta briefly. McRae back in the 60’s is a story I still tell to this day! I lived in an over the garage apartment owned by the local KKK grand poohbah!!

  • AdLib : Night Khirad!

  • ChrisR266 : Suck it, Khirad. Love you.

  • KQuark : Oh the both parties the same. Everyone should be represented by Gingrey, Isaakson and Chambliss. They won’t think they are that much the same at all.

  • BigDogMom : Night Khirad, sleep well

  • Chernynkaya : “night, k.

  • BigDogMom : KQ-Should I wear my ripped jeans that drag on the floor or my overalls?

  • AdLib : KQ – Now I remember, that and all the racism and Palin’s sneering, “pallin’ around with terrorists”.

  • Khirad : Oh, and it was 80 today. :-P

  • Khirad : Well, I need to straighten out the kilt for tomorrow’s gigs, before I collapse. Night.

  • BigDogMom : Chris, where in OH, booms in OH

  • Chernynkaya : KQ– I’m sure that would be a wake up call–from hell!

  • ChrisR266 : BDM: Oh yeah, the dark part. Can DST come too soon? Not for me. I have Halide lights in my basement to grow plants and stand under when it gets too depressing in OH-IO

  • KQuark : I probably should put everyone in the Planet up for a week one at a time :lol:

  • BigDogMom : KQ-“Same” crowd? Que?

  • Khirad : OMG, I remember that town.

  • KQuark : That’s why I have so little patients with the “same” crowd.

  • BigDogMom : Chris, just damn cold here…dark too

  • ChrisR266 : BDM: Ok. I hope the tea fits the bill for you this night. Cold and rainy here so I can feel it.

  • BigDogMom : KQ-LOL!

  • PatsyT : Well KQ thats funny! but it’s not

  • ChrisR266 : Ok, Cher, you get a pass. Grrrrrr.

  • BigDogMom : Chris, yes wussy tea, I don’t drink soda or alchol…too late for cofee

  • Chernynkaya : Chris– I had a huge flagon of Hefeweissen beer at dinner and I’m still buzzed. Does that count?

  • KQuark : Yup remember I live in the town where every homeowner has to own a gun AND bullets. Yet they are worried about a health insurance mandate.

  • BigDogMom : KQ-Yes those…now I remember

  • Chernynkaya : KQ– putrid. Says it all.

  • Khirad : Or not. Jeeze. Yes, I remember that crap now.

  • ChrisR266 : Aw, BDM: wussy tea.

  • BigDogMom : Chris-“Nighty Night” herbal tea

  • KQuark : Here’s a t-shirt from there «link»

  • ChrisR266 : Sleep wonderfully, Choice.

  • BigDogMom : Night CL

  • Khirad : Oops, wrong one.

  • ChrisR266 : BDM: tea? Seriously? Sheesh! LOL

  • PatsyT : Nighty Night CL All the best to you…

  • Chernynkaya : Take care CL!!

  • AdLib : Night CL and thank you for all the good works you do every day!

  • PatsyT : Hiya Artist!

  • Khirad : «link»

  • choicelady : Hi all – I’m off to bed, too. Long damned day, and while I got nuttin’ to do tomorrow, I have Cat Alarms at about 6 every morning. Nothing, and I mean NOTHING, trumps feeing the beasts. GREAT conversation with all of you, and lovely to meet so many new folks in greater depth. Sleep well everyone – sweet dreams!

  • PatsyT : I think of all the different causes and sites … What is working? Which one is getting the best results?

  • Chernynkaya : Great idea, Patsy!

  • AdLib : Hey Artist50! Welcome to Vox!

  • Artist50 : Cyrano – where else they gonna go?

  • KQuark : Well one sign they had was something like “kinda like a caramel colored Jimmy Carter”

  • AdLib : KQ – Remind me about the Big Chicken, someone dressed up as a chicken?

  • BigDogMom : Need tea, will be back

  • Chernynkaya : CL I’ll try to find yours too.

  • AdLib : BDM – Yep, “Barbie and Disney Princess” syndrome. Your prince will come, just brush your hair and look pretty, no need to do anything, the Prince will rescue you. Not my daughter, she knows better than that.

  • PatsyT : It would be great to gather info from folks here as to what works for them locally and state wide and nationally … then put together a best practices kind of post.

  • BigDogMom : KQ-No, do tell

  • choicelady : Cher – and we can talk off VP etc. I have your email somewhere or will send through AdLib again.

  • KQuark : Anyone remember the “big chicken” incident during the 2008 election. That was about 3 miles from my door at the time.

  • BigDogMom : Artist-Huh?

  • Artist50 : BDM – Iowa told Palin she wasn’t going to skip them and get in the thing late yesterday

  • Chernynkaya : CL–I hit enter before done. I’ll put the info up at TO/OT later.

  • BigDogMom : cyrano-Same here, no problems, but does get pretty heated at town hall meetings…which have doubled in the last 6 mos. with the number of people

  • KQuark : Fortunately I got to grow up in a very liberal area for the education system alone.

  • choicelady : ‘Night Adonai!

  • Chernynkaya : CL– COOL!

  • AdLib : KQ – I totally understand, when you’re surrounded by hostile people with mindless allegiance to the GOP, you do have to be prudent about how you work for change.

  • cyrano1 : KQ: I get on my grassroots soapbox and really have to realize that I can put a bumper sticker on my car and don’t have to worry about someone rear ending me. Yard signs stay put. I’m surrounded by pretty nice reasonable people. It has to be tough in polarized, hostile areas.

  • choicelady : Cher – I probably ought to as well. Let’s talk – I’m not up on that at ALL. It’d be fun to do it together!

  • Chernynkaya : KQ– see, that’s the kind of thing AdLib and I have zero experience with. It changes the game. (Red state I mean.)

  • ChrisR266 : Oh, that was good. Now Adonai: The quotation is relevant and true, to the extent that the generation understands empowerment. I fear at times that the passive consumer mythology has eroded confidence in boomers and gen x to such an extent the we just might have to rely on the millennials to save us. What a rub.

  • BigDogMom : CL-Ma Bell put my Gram’s phone, that weighed a ton, in one of their museums!

  • AdLib : Night AD! Thanks so much for joining us tonight!

  • Khirad : I know how you feel KQ, and I’m in the ‘liberal’ part of Arizona.

  • choicelady : BDM – in the early 80s there was one last CA phone system like that. It was in Gaviota, just up the highway from Santa Barbara. Went to make a call – no dial. Operator took my call from Gaviota 8. It’s all gone now. Too bad!

  • KQuark : TC AD

  • PatsyT : Nighty night ADNOAI!

  • BigDogMom : Adlib, like “Barbie Princess”?

  • KQuark : We’ve done several phone ins with Cobb Democratic party but man you talking about a mountain to climb. Seriously I would not even dare put signs up with out fearing for my life.

  • PatsyT : Did someone say WAVE ? «link»

  • Chernynkaya : Also CL, htat’s why I am considering that training at O of A. Community.

  • BigDogMom : Night Adonai, good quote…only thing we need teachers to teach it

  • AdLib : CL – That is a whole other ball of wax, how the Corps have used materialism to control and sedate the public. Very important that people disengage their identity and their value as a human being from their possessions or they will continue to be so easily manipulated by the corporate powers that be.

  • Chernynkaya : Peace, Adonai.

  • Chernynkaya : CL– I don’t think it’s either/or, but I tend to agree will Malcome. at the same time, there are way more distractions than in the days of Ma Bell.

  • ADONAI : Well kids, I’m done. Good night folks.Peace be with you. ……… “The philosophy of the school room in one generation will be the philosophy of government in the next.” ~Abraham Lincoln

  • choicelady : Patsy, BDM, whoever – yes – LOCAL politics is excellent. That is where you can make real change. In CA though, Prop. 13 took all that away and centralized everything. If you’re not in Sacramento, you really cannot do much. So you HAVE to focus even state politics at the district offices. Constituents MATTER.

  • KQuark : CL you are the best ;)

  • BigDogMom : CL-Gram’s telephone number was Davis597

  • bito : #uncloakkoch some thing watch later. «link»

  • choicelady : OK everyone, I’m not all THAT old, but I remember when we had a party line, no dial, operator connected PHONE. With a wire. And from that point on, we made change anyway. I fear I’m with Malcolm Gladwell – organizations rely on human interaction FIRST, then networking. This Planet survives because of the personal contacts we’ve all made and keep making. You can’t make social change with people whom you do not trust. It is essential to know those around you have your back and vice versa. That is why unions do well – the actions are built on trust. My organization as well. The Planet is unique in this – a blog with real people who have met and worked together outside the blog. OK – off my soap box!

  • Chernynkaya : BDM– I just wrote something validating your comment!

  • PatsyT : cyrano1 HA thats funny I like the phone calls… and the live protest!

  • AdLib : BDM – That’s not a small thing, that’s a big thing. As I mentioned earlier, the protest against the Kochs only required us to drive from L.A. to Palm Springs. One day out of our lives and it made a big impact nationally. FOlks need to “get” that what we’re doing in our own ways, by getting physically involved in our world and democracy, we create ripples in our society that can multiply into waves.

  • BigDogMom : Adlib-I think you are going to start seeing the 50 somethings and the younger kids doing it, they have more time, the 30 somethings are working on their “Career” and the 40 somethings have to carpool their kids to every fucking event happening

  • PatsyT : CBDM Get involved in the School Board! Kids or not … it is SO important!

  • Chernynkaya : My son is 32 and was always active and politically aware. but his job promotion has taken more time. Last weekend he told me he needs to focus on other priorities. Like work. And I can’t argue. But it was the same for me–sometimes life changes make an ebb and flow of activism.

  • cyrano1 : Local level! school boards, state reps, US reps. It all takes campaigns, contributions, endorsements, yard signs, doorbelling, and phone calls. I’ve done it all for decades – except the phone calls. Just can’t invade home privacy that I myself won’t tolerate from others.

  • BigDogMom : Khirad, not me, I went the opposite way, less material stuff, less miss perfect….more radical, I don’t give a shit what you think of me…but I’m still polite!

  • Khirad : C’Lady, your nephew is in the MTV Generation. We’re a real mix. I could also make a good case for Gen X. Every generation has its plus and minuses (I actually have a few problems with Millennials, like I remember a time before cells and high speed internet and the importance of alone time), and just about every one sells out/burns out as it gets older. And thus it has always been.

  • AdLib : KQ – Glad to hear there’s some back up for generations needing to rise to the occasion.. I think this one can but there are many more obstacles (i.e. distractions) that need to be overcome to get people off their asses and into the street.

  • Chernynkaya : Chris–I hold your seat.

  • KQuark : I’m the opposite AL. The only Democrat that represents me is the prez.

  • Chernynkaya : If anyone has the time, this summer Organizing for America has community organizer training for the 2012’s.

  • BigDogMom : Cher/Patsy-More and more people are becoming disappointed with their school boards, in my town about 10 new people want to run

  • ChrisR266 : Smoke break… back in a few.

  • PatsyT : All I gotta say is look out for AH and her “Patch” !

  • choicelady : BDM – yeah, the lust for goodies comes from not having much attention from people. My brother and sister in law never should have had a kid. He was a hoot as a little boy, but they never had anything but criticism for him. He was and is one of the loneliest people I know. And we used to be friends, but he’s scared I will get him to care more about what he CARES ABOUT than about what he owns. And I would, too. He may come around, but it’s sad to watch the process of denial of his essential inner self.

  • AdLib : Cyrano1 – I’m in L.A. so I’m in the same boat, I’m in a very blue district/city/st ate so I don’t have the best insight to what folks in a purple or red district have to deal with. But you are so right, change begins with the candidates in a primary and that’s an important area for us to focus on.

  • PatsyT : Look at Wisconsin … it is the State Senators that are saving the day!

  • Chernynkaya : AD I thought you were too, when at HP!

  • BigDogMom : Adlib if we all started doing something, just one small thing, it might make a difference, going next week to talk to the towns Dem committee, might work on Chris Murphy’s campaign

  • PatsyT : Yes Yes Yes Cher! How can we get that across to people?

  • KQuark : My nephews in his early 20’s and he’s just a little hippie in Vermont. He grows organic food and raises livestock and all

  • Chernynkaya : Patsy–the Right has patiently built up at the local levels–like the unexciting school boards. we need to copy that.

  • AdLib : BDM – Excellent! We have to focus local and what you’re doing by writing letters to the editor is very effective! Well done!

  • ADONAI : Cher – I know! I was talking to HITO the other day and she thought I was 50 or 60.

  • BigDogMom : Ad is just a baby in age, but one who would be called an old soul

  • choicelady : Cher – will do. We are being foolish, and I will tell you allllll about it. Best thing I’ve done to date? Stay in my office today. Isn’t THAT pathetic.

  • ChrisR266 : Khirad: Yes, I agree. Gen X music might be the best. No argument here.

  • PatsyT : Sorry if that was no on Topic but … think of the ramifications … local issues being controlled by you know who

  • KQuark : ugh locked up for a sec again

  • KQuark : Yeah CL they can do it much faster because they already have state assisted healthcare

  • Chernynkaya : ADonai– you sound like an old guy who thinks the kids are the worst ever. Like every generation, and you’re so young to be so grumpy. ;-)

  • cyrano1 : choicelady: Absotively korrekt!! All politics ARE local!

  • ChrisR266 : I’m experiencing some lag (Uh oh…) but I would exit the generational discussion by noting that the moments that cohere a generation are large, culturally significant in import, and deeply striking because they come at vulnerable times in maturation. Remember this about the Millennials.

  • BigDogMom : CL-I have two sisters who Gen X-ones ok, the other likes her BMW more than us

  • PatsyT : OK well this is SCARY… We already have trouble with them in “Aliso Viejo Patch” with our school board and they are letting RW zealots post away as legit- like the wife of the mayor of Rancho Santa Margarita Jeninfer Beale…who wants vouchers.

  • ADONAI : I’m part of Generation-X. Boy, we REALLY dropped the ball.

  • BigDogMom : cyrano-key thing is to start at the local level

  • choicelady : Chris – if Gen X is about 30 now, then yes. It includes my nephew who is rich but unprincipled. He WANTS to be, but he can’t give up his lust for EXPENSIVE bright shiny objects of which he has huge amounts. Sad.

  • ADONAI : BDM – As I said earlier, every generation produces great people. The production has just went way down the last few generations.

  • Chernynkaya : CL– off the VP– I want to hear what CA is doing!

  • cyrano1 : AdLib: You’ve targeted my biggest gripe!! Grassroots activism is the only means we have to get the the right people on the ticket at the primary level!! Maybe I’m too gung ho, living in a blue state in a blue district and just don’t know how hard it is in purple and red areas?

  • KQuark : Exactly Adlib in fact the 20’s was not much different than the 00’s in it’s self indulgence in some ways

  • BigDogMom : Adlib-thats why I started writing letters to the editors, every bit counts in reminding people what the truth of what the GOP are really doing in DC

  • AdLib : Hey Khirad!

  • choicelady : Cher – I agree about the state alternative agreement! Bernie Sanders is ecstatic, and frankly VT is going to be the first single payer, NOT CA. And I lay that at the feet of the State Strategy Group which I was to attend today but blew off. We’re starting to fall over our own feet – only CA progressives can SO often snatch defeat from the jaws of victory!

  • Chernynkaya : Patsy–anything she is involved in I hope fails. Like her “Game Changers.” HAH!

  • AdLib : AD – Looking at the generation that dug this hole we’re all in, can’t disagree that it has been lazy, selfish and self-indulgent. But generations can be transformed, as the Greatest Generation was by WW II. Nothing like the threat of real domination and oppression to get people off the La-Z-Boy and out into the streets. But still so many lazy Americans who think clicking on their computer is activism. It’s an important part but only part.

  • BigDogMom : AD-Not all of them, yes they want to party, but from what I see in my niece and others her age, I think they got it going on…it depends where they are living…one town over the rich kids could give a rats ass

  • Khirad : Yes, about those do-gooder Millennials – they will do good things. But Gen X still had better music. Me, I’m smack-dab in between the two in a generational no-man’s land.

  • PatsyT : I think it a smaller version of HP but local with control from the queen above… targeted on local issues.

  • KQuark : Sorry Cher

  • ChrisR266 : BDM: Yep. I thought I was aware. I was raised to know, and despite their outward demeanor, some of these kids could put me to shame (I don’t let them know that, of course, LOL). They’re passionate–abou t life.;

  • KQuark : Exactly Chere there response again shows they have now serious interest in healthcare

  • Chernynkaya : Patsy–what a flop.

  • choicelady : Chris – that’s really nice to read about your students! I’d agree with those whom I’ve met, but I don’t know a lot of them anymore.

  • PatsyT : OK friend I have to ask you about AH and the “Patch”

  • Chernynkaya : Obama punked them, but the MSM will say he “caved.”

  • KQuark : desert of despair I meant to say.

  • PatsyT : B I N G O Cher!

  • BigDogMom : Chris, my niece and her friends are far more informed that I was at that age

  • AdLib : BDM – 2012 will be a huge election for her future and all of ours. We definitely need to get the younger folks energized early and make sure they recognize that their standard of living for the rest of their lives is at stake.

  • KQuark : Tell me about it Cher. It was not lost on DailyKOS and Talkingpointsmem o but AOL HP is a desert

  • Chernynkaya : They woke up, Patsy.

  • Khirad : No Cher, this ONE particular time I was motivated only by ridiculously sardonic motivations. :-P

  • ADONAI : AdLib, I think most people only try as hard as they have to. That’s what separates good from great. The extra effort. Each successive generation wants to put in less and less effort. They grow up in a world they think is owed to them. Too ready to settle.

  • KQuark : ghsts left a great link everyone should find informative on the ACA timeline

  • ChrisR266 : The Millennials have my affection and support. As I think back on it, I never uttered the same words about Gen X.

  • Chernynkaya : CL and KQ and an under-reported story was the Obama “compromise” with the Repubs about reforming the ACA for each state. Makes single payer more possible.

  • cyrano1 : choicelady: If they can’t kill it, they’ll starve it!! Lotta work to do!!

  • PatsyT : Cher, California was dreaming, what would the song be now?

  • BigDogMom : Adlib-will do, she always comes with me to anything here, but need to get her involved with the Dem party in 2012 to help

  • ChrisR266 : So many pundits deride this Millennial generation, but I see not evidence to warrant me to do the same. They are great people. Earnest (but stressed, we made them this way), aware, yet hesitant (because they shouldn’t have to do THAT yet–they’re in college, after all), open, empathetic, loving, smart.

  • choicelady : Chris – lovely to have you here. You’ve added a HUGE amount to all this!

  • PatsyT : They seem to be having trouble recruiting … wonder why?

  • choicelady : KQ – that’s why I loved what Obama did. The whole thing is pegged to the same payment as single payer in CA – 1-8% on a sliding scale tagged to your income. Small deductibles, TONS of free preventive screenings, and lots more that is very good and very fair. Big problem – cuts in the federal funding are desperately hurting those added to Medicaid programs. THAT is not part of the plan. It’s the GOP “gift” that keeps on giving.

  • AdLib : BDM – FWIW, pass along my props to your niece. As tough as it seems, we need her in the fight with us.

  • Chernynkaya : Patsy, I think so.

  • Chernynkaya : Khirad, was she a hot tomato?

  • PatsyT : Cher was that the ramen noodle protest ?

  • Khirad : Patsy, like the FB page “Can this tomato get more fans than Ahmadinejad?”So far it has 30,006.

  • AdLib : Night funksands! Thanks for joining us!

  • PatsyT : Hey Sheen is game and he has tiger blood so…

  • Chernynkaya : Did you all read that the Cal State student held a big protest over costs?

  • AdLib : Chris – The way you describe them gives me a lot of hope that they can support what needs to be done to save our nation.

  • PatsyT : KQ chuckle chuckle

  • Chernynkaya : Patsy– I thpought you were speaking Sheen there.

  • ChrisR266 : Evening, FSands.

  • BigDogMom : Adlib-feeling a mixture of both, she reads my FB post and has gone to several protests regarding school budgets with some of her teachers

  • KQuark : Funk is the second best word after F#$@

  • choicelady : cyrano – it’s OK. I’m paid to read that crap! I figure why not share it with all of you who DID NOT HAVE TO? It’s my purification ritual…

  • PatsyT : not think Charlie Sheen … thinking Charlie Sheen

  • ChrisR266 : BDM: Can you blame her? Look at all of what your niece has been listening to over the last three months. It would depress the hell out of me.

  • KQuark : don’t fake the funk, funk :)

  • PatsyT : thinkingNighty Night funk… All the Best

  • cyrano1 : PatsyT: Politically correct or as opposed to Mac? I’m a PC user.

  • AdLib : BDM – Do you think your niece is angry or defeated? WOuld she be motivated to protest or just think, “What’s the point?”

  • BigDogMom : Nite funksands

  • Chernynkaya : ‘Night FS.

  • PatsyT : funk I am think Charlie Sheen

  • funksands : Oops wife is home. Off to watch Maher! Good night!

  • KQuark : A big problem in the manufacturing sector people don’t talk about much is our production has actually been increasing but not employment up to the great recession.

  • ChrisR266 : Aw Patsy, Golden slumbers to you, girl.

  • choicelady : bito – it started to work. Youngstown “Vindicator” used that line in editorials about public workers stealing from unemployed steelworkers – then Girard got in the mix FOR the public sector, and now it’s NOT working any more.Suddenly people are understanding the ‘race to the bottom’ and how everyone is impacted.

  • funksands : Ad, I feel that someone is going to come out of left field for the GOP so to speak…

  • PatsyT : cyrano are you PC?

  • ChrisR266 : AdLib: I think they know that the paths are there. They do see some starting points. They do need lots of assurance that they can trust their instincts and their education to follow the road not taken. Or, sometimes to follow the road taken for a while and then to blaze a path of their own making.

  • Chernynkaya : CL but he wants the nom. He’s now trying to look like the Brawny Paper Towel guy. Which is appropriate== Koch product.

  • cyrano1 : Okay, how many of you reflexively hit the refresh button and lose all of the previous comments? I’ve done this waaaay too many times!

  • AdLib : As for the GOP Presidential Candidates for 2012…Palin is dead in the water, Huckabee has too much baggage, Romney has HCR in MA and Teabaggers and RW Christians don’t like him, Pawlenty has no constituency and is dull as dishwater, Newt is old news…who have they got? No one that can win their primary AND a general election.

  • PatsyT : ChrisR A complete pleasure Nighty night

  • BigDogMom : Adlib, I know my neice who is just finnishing up her student teaching is not very hopefull and will settel for anything if she can’t get in a school

  • choicelady : Cher – Pawlenty (first of all, it’s Anglicized from Palente-Italian you know) and I agree. Yawn.

  • cyrano1 : funksands: Fabulous plan! :)

  • Chernynkaya : I’m glad you got here, Chris!

  • ChrisR266 : Just so I don’t forget to say it: I have looked forward to this all week, folks. Badly needed, and sorely appreciated, I hope you know.

  • BigDogMom : bit-I think the masses are realizing the income disparity, that’s why Gov Malloy hit the top 10% in CT with an Income Tax increase

  • funksands : Cyrano, I’m feeling a lunch coming on one of these days. Very cool.

  • Chernynkaya : Oh, good KQ– I have been reading so much I sometimes blur.

  • AdLib : Chris and AD – You’re both coming from opposite directions on the youth sensibilities and both of you are connected to it. WOuld like to see what you two agree on. Is this generation accepting lower expectations or seeing a path to achieving what they want?

  • KQuark : Cher I think I saw the source you are talking about.

  • choicelady : bito – which conference? Palm Springs? No I never got called on there. The fix was in – Bob Edgar knows me and gave everyone else a shot which was fair. I can talk with him any time.

  • cyrano1 : funksands: Wow! neighbors! I’m just north of Bothell!

  • BigDogMom : A mandate w/o regulating price is insane

  • bito : I saying that that is the R’s tactic, we can’t let corp money change people’s minds.

  • Chernynkaya : I need to find the chart I saw about manufacturing jobs. it’s not all tht grim.

  • KQuark : A mandate without subsidies is just insane

  • funksands : Cyrano, I’m in Bellevue. :-)

  • PatsyT : Opps those are FB pages

  • cyrano1 : choicelady: Thanks for the correction. I didn’t read Romney’s plan – only heard about it second hand and it obviously wasn’t accurate.

  • KQuark : Exactly CL

  • funksands : 3. Main Stree not Wall Street

  • ADONAI : AdLib – I’m sure they do. But careers are becoming an endangered species. Unless you have no soul. Wall Street is always looking for the next idiot to pin everything on.

  • PatsyT : and the list goes on

  • PatsyT : 1,000,000. against offshore drilling, Beer Party (they are all over Wisconsin!) Boycot BP,

  • BigDogMom : Bit-Non-Union are just waking up to the fact that if the Unions go, their wages go down to

  • Chernynkaya : Bito- I may be wrong, but I see some worker solidarity with the unions. Look at the polls.

  • choicelady : cyrano – NO! I’ve read the MA plan, and it was horrible carrying a $5K deductile and $10K out of pocket with everything totally linked to the unregulated private insurance market. The federal plan is infinitely better (read it, too.) But the mandate was Romney’s idea, and that’s what the teabaggers HATE even though they looove the private insurance industry. Go figure.

  • AdLib : Patsy – That is one thing that should give us all hope about fighting and winning against this plutocracy. They used Facebook and Twitter to overthrow a tyrant in Egypt, surely we can use them to elect a Congress that will fight for us.

  • funksands : 2. Home town, not Empire

  • bito : The R’s tactic right now seems to be pitting Union workers against non Union workers. We need to empathize that these are workers rights!

  • funksands : 1. Bring our jobs home

  • cyrano1 : funksands: You live up here? Yikes!! Sooo tired of the grey and rain!! I’d fly back to CA but I’m sick of airport security!

  • PatsyT : BDM US uncut is already big on FB Some of the top pages I go to are

  • Chernynkaya : CL and others– no one touting Pawlenty? Yawn.

  • KQuark : My second guess would be Pawlenty with his current run to the right

  • funksands : AdLib, what do you think?

  • BigDogMom : Adlib/FS-That’s what Maher was saying tonight, get a damn message!

  • funksands : Coldest February ever here last month.

  • ChrisR266 : Ad Lib: career jobs. But with a twist that we boomers didn’t imagine. These kids do view their entry jobs ( and eve subsequent positions ) as a means to an end. They think and dream about what they really want to do, in the sense of being masters of their own destinies.

  • AdLib : Funksands – You are so damn right! Get a message and hammer it like the GOP does, it sure works…at least that’s what my local death panel says.

  • funksands : Cyrano, you got that shit right. By the way, you tired of the weather here yet?

  • choicelady : KQ – yes, the fix is in for Romney, but he has such baggage: the MA health care bill (REALLY awful compared to Obama’s) and being a Mormon. That sticks in the RW religious craw.

  • BigDogMom : Patsy-I think the US-Uncut is going to be big on FB

  • cyrano1 : funksands: Seems that the bumper sticker stuff has worked pretty well for the GOP. Dumb it down and hammer it in! :)

  • funksands : Chris, 3.5 million manufacturing and professional service jobs sent overseas 2000-2009. 5 unemployed for every one job.

  • AdLib : AD – Some probably will but will they accept such a dim future? Might some want more from their lives?

  • KQuark : I know BDM it’s in my mind only like Adlibs debate

  • PatsyT : AdLib … if some do not know there are many pages on FB some with thousands if not hundreds of thousands of followers … Like Egypt they are taking things into their own hands

  • funksands : AdL: Is it just me or does the left and middle left need to get one message with no more than three part to it and repeat about 11 billionty times?

  • ChrisR266 : AdLib part 2: That is in large part because many of the jobs they compete for were not farmed out overseas or whacked in the wholesale job gut of 2008 and 2009. The jobs that went away aren’t coming back, and they aren’t the jobs that college graduates are competing for right now.

  • KQuark : Rubio maybe but I don’t see how they can triangulate the latino vote with the teabaggers on board.

  • Chernynkaya : Cyrano–they HAVE no big guns. But yes, I agree.

  • ADONAI : No doubt BDM.

  • BigDogMom : KQ-Palin wont’ run, she’s done

  • AdLib : Chris – Point taken. But are we talking career jobs or just retail type jobs?

  • cyrano1 : cher: I don’t think the GOP’ll put out any of their big guns until 2016. Tell me I’m wrong.

  • bito : C’Lady, did you ask a question at the conference? I have a feeling that you did.

  • KQuark : Oh Palin would be the dream opponent

  • BigDogMom : AD-Yeah and their parents will be the ones out there protesting

  • ADONAI : AdLib, or they just move back in with their parents and get a job at American Eagle.

  • choicelady : I want Newt to run – “Three-time adulter for President!” Can’t beat it as a campaign slogan.

  • ChrisR266 : AdLib: I’m going to take some issue with your last comment about graduates and jobs. They’re getting them now, in prettyt significant numbers.

  • AdLib : Patsy – That’s cool to hear. And consider how now, with the publicity the Kochs are getting because of WI, they feel really informed and many are likely spreading the word now too! Thanks to you!

  • KQuark : Romney is next in line there primaries process is truly fixed

  • Chernynkaya : Rubio was touted as their great Brownish Hope. He was their rock star. Maybe not in 2012, but I think he’ll run. He’s been laying real low.

  • PatsyT : but so does Trump

  • choicelady : AdLib – I was proud to be there, too! It was just GREAT!

  • KQuark : Bingo I’m on board AD

  • PatsyT : AD he has the hair

  • ADONAI : Let me settle this right now. Mitt Romney is winning the Republican nomination. It’s his turn. Print it. Seal it in a jar. Bury it.

  • AdLib : AD – Consider that all of these college students, wanting part time jobs while attending or full time jobs graduating, may have as a motivation to be activist, corporations strangling the job market and pushing down wages. I think that’s going to be very powerful in 2012.

  • choicelady : BDM – forgive me yes, Jimmy Choos. I’m out of date.

  • cyrano1 : funksands: Agreed! A moderate Republican buried in tea bags!!

  • PatsyT : AdLib, some folks were so surprised and glad I sent them a link!

  • KQuark : Romney won’t need the teabaggers just like McCain did not win with the base.

  • ChrisR266 : Funk: exactly. The song remains the same. And it loses its luster, eventually.

  • Chernynkaya : FS I don;t think their fear ever gets dispelled.

  • funksands : Romney is doomed. He is caught in the middle of forces he doesn’t have a clue how to control.

  • KQuark : Yup like someone who runs against Rubio in the GOP won’t remind them that he’s not really one of us.

  • PatsyT : Yeah Bito on the Twitter !

  • Chernynkaya : BDM– I didn’t know that. tell Boom thanks. she’s also a champ at letters!

  • cyrano1 : KQ: Do you think Romney has a chance with the teabaggers? He designed our current “Obamacare” system, only it was even better than what we ended up with.

  • funksands : They played every fear card they have. It’s like watching “Halloween” 80 times in a row. After a while, it starts to lose it’s effect.

  • AdLib : Patsy – Very cool and just as Bito’s work on Twitter made a big impact, your work on Facebook surely did. This whole movement is about connecting with the rest of Americans out there who have principles, informing and activating. And what all of us did (including others at The Planet who spread the word) was pull together to make a difference. And we did! But we can’t rest on our laurels!

  • ChrisR266 : Funk: I wrote about the GOP death knell to someone the other day. They’ve gone nuclear, smelling the stench of the rot.

  • BigDogMom : Chris-they have already fallen into a worm hole

  • KQuark : :lol: funk

  • PatsyT : funk I like the ‘tearing space and time’ !

  • Chernynkaya : KQ– Barack Obama. And think of the Latinos.

  • BigDogMom : To all-boomer and I also plaster the Planet on our FB pages, my friends now call me a 60’s radical hippy

  • KQuark : I still think the fix is in for Romney

  • Chernynkaya : The GObP is stymied about the unemployment #’s.

  • PatsyT : Cher I started it as a way to keep an eye on the kids but … there are many other uses

  • funksands : Ad, the GOP knows they’re screwed. They can’t move further right without tearing time and space, so they are pushing all the chips in and going for the kill.

  • ChrisR266 : BDM : I agree wholeheartedly. That’s one of the most offensive things I’ve ever seen in public dialogue.

  • ADONAI : chris, Every generation produces great people. I’m just saying that production has really taken a nosedive. Unless we’re counting American Idol. Generic pop music has never been stronger.

  • KQuark : I don’t see a guy with a vowel at the end of his name winning the GOP nomination Cher but I could be wrong

  • Chernynkaya : _PAtsy–great job! We need a FB presence.

  • AdLib : The GOP is screwed in 2012. Their motivated base are Teabaggers who are already being rejected nationally. So, to win the GOP primary, you’ll have to be someone unpalitable to the general public. And, did you see today, Unemployment dropped to 8.9 %? The poor GOP, wishing for America to fail so they can rape it when it’s weak and down. Ain’t gonna happen!

  • PatsyT : Adlib, Although I did not get to the Palm Springs event I plastered Facebook pages and sent personal messages with links to Planet to so many and how funny … they started saying the same stuff that was said here first at the Planet!

  • BigDogMom : The other big mistake Christie made was that video of him cussing out a teacher

  • ChrisR266 : Adonai: Another thing about the i gen: they are being raised by the gen Xers, not by the Boomers. Different set of cards here altogether. We don’t have them in college classrooms yet. We should next year and for about fifteen afterwards. I can give you a better take then.

  • Chernynkaya : FS– It was easy to agree, wasn’t it!

  • funksands : I agree. Hooray indeed…

  • ADONAI : HOORAY!!!!!!!

  • cyrano1 : choicelady: Agree! Just hope we can swing it back around in 2012 so we don’t have to play their game!! Too results oriented I guess.

  • Chernynkaya : AL it will. And I joined Twitter last few weeks and have been Tweeting away!

  • choicelady : kes – good night. Have fun especially with the friendly stuffed animals!

  • funksands : I agree with everything Adonai says. I just wanted you all to know that.

  • choicelady : AdLib – xxxxx for that shout out!

  • AdLib : bito – You helped make that happen with your dogged work on Twitter! Well done! And kudos to Choicelady as well for hooking us up and helping to make the rally the success it was. And the way I see it, one success should lead to the next.

  • BigDogMom : KQ-The Huck-a-buck needs to sell his book, he’s a male Palin right now…liking the $$$

  • choicelady : cyrano – I think this won’t BE over by 2012. I trust the GOP to keep on making bigger gaffes as they go. They have NO sense of the people. Like Christie calling the highway patrol officer an idiot for asking Christie to obey the LAW. They keep having foot in mouth problems every single day. They cannot give up their agenda, and it’s kiling them.

  • Chernynkaya : KQ he’s not. Keep an eye on Rubio.

  • Khirad : Speaking of Unions. Mubarak, Ben Ali, Lukashenko, Khamenei, Hu, notice something? Seems to me independent unions are a good indicator of a democracies health. And in that spirit, there is hope for Egypt. «link»

  • Chernynkaya : BDM– the river can’;t happen fast enough for me.

  • BigDogMom : CL-Malloy has raised the top bracket, so they are taking to the streets…sorry, in their Jimmy Choo’s

  • bito : AdLib, The #uncloakkoch rally did start a snowball IMHO

  • Chernynkaya : AL I have to agree and am proud to have been there. Thank you for nudging!

  • cyrano1 : Cher: You’re right. Gingrich has his scam going. Fund raising for a campaign that’ll never get off the ground.

  • KQuark : I question if the huckster is running now

  • ChrisR266 : Adonai: I have broached this issue with them. It is distraction, humor, and diversion. It is not what trips their triggers or drives their passions. I’m more worried about the younger ones (the i gen) than I am about the Millenials.

  • choicelady : BDM – the rich are threatening to march on Hartford? In their Gucci shoes? That’ll be a sight to see! It will get awfully crowded with all those limos pulling up to save the poor rich folks a few steps. A nightmare scenario!

  • BigDogMom : CL-Police Unions, the Blue Wall, the Brothers in Blue, don’t mess with their UNION!!! And that is exactly what Christie is doing…hubby says he’s going to wind up in the River one day

  • AdLib : Bito – Cool video, will watch it all later. Thanks for it!

  • Chernynkaya : KQ– Gungrich ain’t running–just raising tons of money.

  • cyrano1 : Cher: Posting half of it would take too many volumes!! It’s so huge and unwieldy – and currently so fast moving nobody can keep track!

  • Chernynkaya : Er.. that was POST the half of it– and BDM– That’s great!!!

  • choicelady : Oh BDM – I thought you meant cops as in arresting the rest of us! Yes – don’t mess with them. Why are they and firefighters ‘brave heroes’ when they DIE and ‘scum suckers’ when they wish to retire decently?

  • ADONAI : I dunno about pinning our hopes on the next generation. Have you been on Youtube lately?

  • AdLib : Cher – I am in awe a bit at how much our protest against the Kochs in Palm Springs has impacted national events. As you say, when we were protesting to Uncloak the Kochs, just a month ago, no one knew who they were. We helped to tee them up for getting whacked nationally in the media over WI! This absolutely affirms how powerful activism is, getting out and protesting. Now they can’t hide in the shadows, now whatever and whoever they finance will be tainted and that is meaningful. Now, let’s keep it up and inspire more folks here and elsewhere to join in.

  • Chernynkaya : Cyrano–T/Y! but I don;t poet the half of it.

  • BigDogMom : Cher-On your despair, I started writing letters to the editor of my local papers to remind people what the Repuglies are doing and its not about jobs…just small snipits, nothing to long

  • KQuark : GOP presidential candidates are going down like dominoes. Palin, Gingrich an now Huckabee

  • ChrisR266 : Choice: you are so on the money. I had the most outrageous discussion with a class of seniors this afternoon. Unfreaking believable it was. But they are tremendously well prepared young people. Thoughtful, honest, witty, passionate, funny as all hell. And, they know that when they graduate, it’s time to put on the big people’s clothes.

  • Chernynkaya : BDM agree! This is the acid test for the Dem Pary.

  • cyrano1 : Cher: Our cherished source for the latest in union news!!! Thanks!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!

  • choicelady : AdLib – YES. I think this is the tipping point. The decline of Sarah Palin is also important. The religious right and the neo cons over played their hands EVERYWHERE, and people are fighting back. We cannot stop or they WILL prevail, but if we keep on keepin’ on, we WILL win. And we must get back a congress with SPINE that gives real support to Obama to get what WE want not what the whiny puppies want.

  • Chernynkaya : CL– se that last few Daily Planet–under Unions. Big news.

  • BigDogMom : CL-They are not a bad lot, in fact alot of them are just big pushovers

  • choicelady : Chris and BDM – had lots of NY cop experience. One thing works – being funny and polite and making sure they don’t have to pick you up. If you can make ’em laugh, they’re yours.

  • bito : «link»

  • BigDogMom : This is for the Dems to loose, they need to keep reminder the people what it is they stand for and keep showing videos of WI, Trenton, NJ and OH

  • Chernynkaya : OH , kes–BOO! But sleep well!

  • cyrano1 : PatsyT: I live in WA state. Just go down there to visit friends when the grey up here gets too hard to endure. Just got back a week ago! :) Thanks!!

  • bito : Night k’es and did you get the link to play?

  • AdLib : Kes – Have a great evening!

  • Chernynkaya : AL the great thing about all the protest is that they snowball–they become more acceptable. But I still kinda despair. I see WAY too many people who won’t even be bothered to send an email in support of something.

  • ChrisR266 : Oh Kes, enjoy!

  • ADONAI : peace kes

  • PatsyT : NIghty night Kes!!

  • choicelady : Chris – that’s very encouraging. I always taught adult union folks in NY but worked in RI, OH, PA with them, too, but I don’t have a lot of Y or i generational contacts outside of the state capitol crowd here in CA.

  • cyrano1 : BigDogMom: Hope you’re right!!! We need to keep the union issue ALIVE!!

  • PatsyT : cyrano, you let me know if you are ever going to the pier, I know even better spots.

  • BigDogMom : Nite kes

  • ChrisR266 : Cyrano: they will not forget. They are their parents’ children. Boomers don’t forget.

  • AdLib : cyrano1 – The Planet is part of a coalition of many of the top Progressive groups and we are working together. Groups including MoveOn.org, TrueMajority, Common Cause, CCC/Impact, Credo, CNA, and on and on. It is happening and folks here are part of it!

  • kesmarn : Well, folks, I must take my leave here. The Fave and I are going to spend some quality time with Michael Jackson and some friendly stuffed animals.

  • choicelady : Oooo Cher – Providence? Labor always had a bad time in RI thanks to the mob. That’s HUGE.

  • BigDogMom : Cyrano-I think they will remember whats going on now

  • cyrano1 : Adonai: What worries me is that they’re (GOP) doing it now instead of just before the 2012 race. Our public has the attention span of a starving gnat!!

  • ChrisR266 : AdLib: GOP has never considered the youth as the hope of the party. All their efforts and infrastructure is focused on the lower middle class white voter and the middle class older voter. Nothing in between. Obama succeeded in no small part because they figured out that youth has only so much time, attention, and room–and they maximized that. But they’re a passionate lot. And once they get out of college, they feel quite free and empowered. And, they just aren’t by lot conservative. They don’t live their lives that way, and they don’t want that to disappear.

  • choicelady : Chris – if the i-generation is the check off generation, what do you think they’re good for to progressives? Does anything but their thumbs move?

  • BigDogMom : Did anyone see Daily Kos article on my new Governor, Dannel Malloy? I’m in Ct for those who don’t know….good review of closing the budget gap the right way, the rich are theatening to march on Hartford

  • AdLib : The bottom line remains, we have to organize and put petty differences behind us. We ARE the majority and the billionaires are only a fraction of a percent of voters. There’s much we can do from our computers but we also have to get out from behind them and protest in person. A sea of people need to stand in the streets and demand economic justice.

  • PatsyT : «link»

  • Chernynkaya : AL- 4 months ago only wonks heard of the Kochs. And have you all seen the latest WSJ poll? 65% or something support unions. Definite overreach!

  • PatsyT : Hey guys read it later but this is how you can push back at Union Busting and attacking Teachers… This was in my district last year and yes I was on the picket lines !!

  • ADONAI : To be honest, the quicker Republicans take everything away, the better. Now people think clicking the Like button on their fucking Facebook page means their part of a revolution. Kill it. Gut it. Start over.

  • choicelady : For every move by the House there is remarkable stodginess from the Senate which I suddenly LOVE. All the House has done can be undone in a trice by the Senate. Hold the line on the EPA etc. No house works alone.

  • cyrano1 : AdLib: We need more press and need to CENTRALIZE all of these disparate left wing groups into getting us organized! How many emails do we get from how many groups? Too many!!

  • BigDogMom : Adlib-I think so, retired Cops, Teachers and Dockworkers were with the Big Blue Wall in Trenton…

  • bito : C’Lady, that was a twit on the Planets twitter account.

  • kesmarn : AdLib, I hope it Western hemisphere Cairo.

  • BigDogMom : Or any Union in the Northeast!!!!

  • AdLib : So, what do folks think here, might this overplayed hand by the Kochs and their GOP cronies ignite a real working American revolution across the country? Public workers and union members are at the forefront but might not all workers start marching with them?

  • KQuark : Sorry had to close some tabs my browser froze

  • BigDogMom : Chris, one thing you don’t mess with is Cops in NY, NJ, MA or CT

  • Chernynkaya : Chris-:lol:

  • choicelady : bito – just name the person you’re answering so we can keep some kind of idea what’s going on. Otherwise – let ‘er rip!

  • cyrano1 : BigDobMom: You’re referring to the Fox newscast from Wisconsin riots that had palm trees in it?

  • ChrisR266 : BDM: I was wholly impressed and inspired with New Jersey. Wow. “Former Plus sized head model” Christie is in for it.

  • kesmarn : bito, I bet Rachel even had folks with cheese hats on, but we’re not fooled.

  • choicelady : AD, Chris – now I get it. See. Came in during the middle of a story. Now I’m caught up. Thanks!

  • BigDogMom : Cher-More than Huckleberry

  • Chernynkaya : BDM– Chirstie ie THE most dangerous IMO

  • AdLib : Chris – Can you explain more about your POV on mobilizing students? How the GOP will be stumped but what about the Dems?

  • BigDogMom : Hey bito, LOL! Yep, no stinken Palm Trees!

  • ChrisR266 : The Millenials just needed to be freed to be what we hoped they would become. I’m so excited.

  • cyrano1 : PatsyT: Figures!!! Pretty wealthy bunch there, but they have the BEST food at the pier!! :)

  • bito : Rachel Maddow is FAKING video from Wisconsin – the video shows snow on the ground and not ONE palm tree !#WiUnion

  • choicelady : Oh gosh, AD – I should have remembered the Kentucky Sports Crotchet. Sorry – been away a while.

  • BigDogMom : The next big movement will be in NJ, there were over 50,000 cops protesting in Trenton yesterday

  • ChrisR266 : The Y (millenials) will make the change. Of all the students I’ve had, there the most recent grads down at the OH-IO statehouse protesting with everyone else.

  • cyrano1 : AdLib: AMEN!!!

  • PatsyT : cyrano… San Clemente

  • Chernynkaya : Today, 1000’s protested in Providence to protest teacher layoffs.

  • cyrano1 : PatsyT: What cities, towns are in S. Orange County? Like Dana Point?

  • AdLib : cyrano1 – Indeed, a recall in WI and revitalized citizenry could be the spark to turn back the plutocratic push in this nation. We should all invest ourselves in winning in WI and OH because it will spread faster and stronger than the BS tea Party crap.

  • kesmarn : cyrano, sorry — delayed response — Gloria was a hero to many of us, no?

  • KQuark : I know PT just funnin’ with ya

  • ChrisR266 : Everybody needs to understand two things. The first things is about college students today. The i generation (incoming freshmen and younger) are the “check it off the list” generation. Mobilizing them will be such a challenge that you can be sure GOPers will be stumped.

  • choicelady : bito – I’d forgotten that about AFL-CIO.

  • BigDogMom : CL-So did Ezra

  • Chernynkaya : CL– and about fraking– the House just de-fanged the EPA.

  • ADONAI : HA! Kaintuck

  • choicelady : BDM – hope Gloria wiped the floor with Bill.

  • PatsyT : KQ I ment south orange county CA Very conservative!! and we recalled their voucher loving, hate public school, small gubmnt asses!

  • BigDogMom : The big video that’s going viral is the one where the WI Dem Rep was takled by the cops…the cop wasn’t even from Madison

  • choicelady : KQ – my new concern about geothermal is control given the fracking over gas. Oil and other mega corporate energy companies give not a tinkers dam about what legacy they create to extract what they sell. I don’t trust them with geothermal either.

  • cyrano1 : AdLib: This will get heads rolling not just in Wisconsin, but all over the country if we can just keep the country focused for more than a soundbite!

  • AdLib : Patsy – You done great down there! You’re right, it sure can be done and should be!

  • kesmarn : bito, that’s Kaintuck geometry. Don’t listen.

  • Chernynkaya : Bito–we’ll freakin’ SCHOOL ya! :lol:

  • ADONAI : bito, In any right triangle, the area of the square whose side is the hypotenuse (the side opposite the right angle) is equal to the sum of the areas of the squares whose sides are the two legs (the two sides that meet at a right angle).

  • KQuark : NJ

  • BigDogMom : Patsy-1 yr and 25% by district, but it looks like they may have the numbers

  • ChrisR266 : AD knows I love him and have begrudging but sincere respect. We talk smack because that’s the way of it all, you know?

  • AdLib : cyrano1 – I would hope so. After what folks in WI are witnbessing, with the Koch Brothers taking WI over as a subsidiary, they should hopefully get plenty of signatures.

  • KQuark : I went to school in South Orange

  • kesmarn : College boyfriend was from Hopkinsville. We fought like cats and dogs.

  • PatsyT : Orange County

  • cyrano1 : kesmarn: Gloria was one of my first heroes!!

  • bito : Hey All, I will be mostly an student tonight, so learn me! ;-)

  • PatsyT : Adlib, they can totally recall Walker… WE DID IN SOUTH ORANGE !!! Just last year! To school board member that were pushing vouchers and PERMANENT TEacher pay reductions

  • Chernynkaya : AL- they’d better. I think they are all over it.

  • AdLib : BDM – Thanks for the info, didn’t know about the 25% per district. That does complicate things.

  • kesmarn : Love Gloria.

  • ADONAI : choice, I am from Kentucky. I was raised to hate every state around us. Why? Because at some point their sports teams will come into contact with our sports teams.

  • BigDogMom : kes, she was good, no repugs on tonight, Tracy Ullman on too

  • choicelady : AD, Chris – there is a freaking RIVER betwixt you in KY and OH. It’s like some of my women friends in Y’town who hate the Steelers. Give it UP! You’re all in the same BOAT. Hate Dalls, detest Arizona, but this near enmity is like hating your reflection!

  • AdLib : Cher – The Dems are getting it roling, I would imagine that unions everywhere just might want to contribute to that.

  • Chernynkaya : BDM I found out that Ezra is against universal coverage. Surprised me!

  • ChrisR266 : Choice: I’m back for real now. Just threw one in before I exited.

  • cyrano1 : AdLib: so about a year to gather over 500K signatures? A cakewalk!!

  • kesmarn : Gloria Steinem is from TOLEDO OHIO.

  • BigDogMom : CL-Good show, Gloria Steihem & Ezra Klien

  • AdLib : cyrano1 – That’s an excellent question!

  • PatsyT : Hey Bito !!!

  • choicelady : BDM – whom did Maher pillory tonight?

  • BigDogMom : Adlib-it also has to be 25% by district,

  • ADONAI : AdLib, they’ll get half a million easily. The rest shouldn’t be too hard.

  • Chernynkaya : Yes AL– until January 2012. The 8 repubs can be reaclled now.

  • AdLib : BITOOOO!!! Hey!

  • cyrano1 : AdLib: Can’t they start gathering signatures in advance?

  • choicelady : Ok Chris -AD is from KY? I’m totally confused. But I am beginning to understand. I think… And that was a quick smoke break. What’d you do – torch ’em?

  • AdLib : From the AP: “MADISON, Wis. (AP) — All those angry protesters calling for a recall election to replace Republican Gov. Scott Walker will have to wait a while. According to the Wisconsin Constitution, an elected official must be in office for a year before someone can launch a recall petition against him or her. That means the earliest anyone could mount a recall petition against Walker would be January 2012. Organizers would need signatures totaling 25 percent of the votes case in the last gubernatorial election. In Walker’s case, that translates to about 540,200 names.”

  • kesmarn : Yaaaay, bito! And Neil Armstrong and John Glenn came from StupidLand, too.

  • cyrano1 : bito: Great choice!! They’re probably rather energized at this point?

  • ADONAI : If this was the opening salvo of the Republicans newest war on unions, I don’t think the unions are in a whole lot of trouble. I mean, unless the Democrat’s TOTALLY fuck this up. But they’ve never done that before…….

  • KQuark : Amazing we can drill thousands of holes in the ground for oil but zero for geothermal.

  • bito : AFL-CIO held their foundation meeting in Columbus. OHIO

  • choicelady : Hey BDM! Great to see you!

  • kesmarn : And I say that in the nicest possible way…

  • AdLib : KQ – Because oil companies along with banks own our Congress and thus the policy they make. And the last thing they want is developing competition to fossil fuels.

  • BigDogMom : I think Walkers backed himself into a corner

  • KQuark : Yup AL because Death Valley is taken

  • kesmarn : The stupidity of Ohio, BDM.

  • cyrano1 : KQ: Exactly!! All of that thermal energy going to waste!

  • ADONAI : KQuark, you’re familiar with oil, right?

  • BigDogMom : What’s the subject

  • choicelady : ADLib – yes, WI was part of the populist movement of the 1890s. They are much further along than OH. Good start!

  • KQuark : Watching them develop geothermal tech in Iceland I could not help wonder why we aren’t developing same in that region.

  • ADONAI : I am from Kentucky.

  • cyrano1 : BigDogMom: I’d love to watch Maher but can’t afford HBO!!

  • ADONAI : Hey BDM!

  • AdLib : KQ – Soon it will be the Dead Pond then the Dead Dead Sea.

  • choicelady : Chris, AD – now I’m hopelessly confused! Obviously walked into the middle of a story. Do tell!

  • BigDogMom : Sorry so late was watching Bill Maher

  • ChrisR266 : Choice: AD

  • ADONAI : KQuark,I’m still waiting for Yellowstone to erupt. That one’s gonna be historic. And incredibly lethal.

  • kesmarn : Hey, BDM!

  • AdLib : Hey BDM!

  • KQuark : Let me end my O/T with saying the Dead Sea is now the Dead Lake

  • PatsyT : Hey BDM!

  • cyrano1 : choicelady: Public humiliation is such a diversion from the message – but sooooooo satisfying!

  • choicelady : Chris – I’m confused. WHO is from KY?

  • BigDogMom : Hey all

  • AdLib : CL – I take your word on Brown. As you say, as poor as he is, Meg would have made everything 100x worse.

  • KQuark : Sorry the ash comment got me O/T

  • ChrisR266 : Smoke break. back in a few. Adonai can stew.

  • choicelady : AdLib – OK that squares with what I’d been told. Recall is out. Public humiliation? Priceless.

  • KQuark : Even thought is was not about climate change it reality just slapped you in the face over and over again that it was happening fast

  • cyrano1 : AdLib: Hope this works!!!

  • kesmarn : Hey, AD, the elections were thrown, but it was the crooked Sec of State not me, Chris and boomer!

  • choicelady : Chris – NO one can fix this state, not even Jerry. And he’s actually a flake. His first term was inept to be nice about it. Waaaay better than Meg, but he’s a liar and a chisler and believes several different things before breakfast. We have to change the structural problems. We cannot depend on him.

  • KQuark : Watch a great series I was saving on DVR last night called When Earth Erupts abut tectonic plates

  • AdLib : However, when it comes to State Legislators: “In the latest salvo surrounding Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker’s (R) controversial budget plan, the Democratic Party of Wisconsin on Wednesday endorsed recall efforts against several GOP state senators. Democrats are targeting eight Republican senators who are eligible to be recalled this year in an effort to take control of the state senate and prevent Walker from passing his agenda. The GOP currently holds a 19-14 majority in the state’s upper chamber. Three of the eight would need to be recalled and replaced with a Democrat in a recall election in order to flip control of the state senate.” «link»

  • ChrisR266 : Aw Adonai, You make me smile!

  • cyrano1 : Hi Adonai and PatsyT!!

  • kesmarn : Hey, cyrano!

  • ADONAI : choice, They know what they did……

  • PatsyT : Hey, Cyrano!

  • ChrisR266 : Because HE’s from Kentucky.

  • ADONAI : Hello cyrano!

  • choicelady : AD – why do you hate Ohio?

  • cyrano1 : Hey Adlib!! :)

  • AdLib : Hey cyrano1!

  • kesmarn : funk, yes, young voters in Ohio didn’t vote in the last election and now they’ve got to deal…

  • ADONAI : Will there be nuclear fallout with the cinders? Without the fallout it’s just a giant fucking ashtray.

  • AdLib : Sad to say but just found this from the OH Bar site: “Q: Could an Ohio governor be removed through a recall election? A: No. Neither the Ohio constitution nor the Ohio Revised Code (ORC), Ohio’s collection of written laws, provide for recall elections for statewide offices. For this reason, Ohio voters cannot use recall to remove a governor.” «link»

  • choicelady : Chris – I knew it was small, not THAT small, but the problem was the breadth rather than the depth of the ‘take over’. I know things could shift radically in two years, but in the meantime…?

  • cyrano1 : funksands: boomer locust here reporting in. I’m on YOUR side!! :) Hah!!

  • ChrisR266 : Everybody chill out about CA. They’re going to be ok. Jerry might have scared some people, but I have confidence in him. He is a smart, hard, and cool dude.

  • funksands : 90% of voters under 30 did not vote in the last election. They better wake the fu*k up if they don’t want to inherit cinders from the boomer locusts.

  • choicelady : Chris – yup. My links are Cleveland and Youngstown, and at least there it’s more aware and tends to be Dem. People have been so misled; now the chickens are roosting, and they don’t know what to do with all the egg on their faces.

  • ADONAI : I hate Ohio. But I’m with’em on this. Union busting is where I draw the line. You wanna maybe rough some people up? Fine. But for the love of GOD let them at least negotiate for the medical bills.

  • PatsyT : ChrisR that is great news!

  • KQuark : CL cheers

  • ChrisR266 : Kes: me too. Franklin county. It will never go red again, ever, no matter what.

  • AdLib : Patsy – And such a prop should disallow out-of-state financing.

  • choicelady : KQ! GREAT to have you here!

  • PatsyT : AdLib… Yes!

  • kesmarn : I’m in a really blue part of the state. We’re just a wee bit ticked at those rural farm counties at the moment.

  • ChrisR266 : Everyone forgets that Ohio went red by .O5% This is not a red state by any means, and Kasich is galvanizing the blue to unprecedented heights

  • choicelady : AD – yes CA has died by hyperdemocracy! Best analysis is “California Crackup” by Joe Mathews and Mark Paul. They lay a huge amount of dysfunction at the doorstep of stoopid voters. I’m hoping for better – people are beginning to think about the consequences of what they’ve done.

  • AdLib : The referendum process in CA and elsewhere has been hijacked by corporations, out of state interests though legit props get on as well. What states need to do is get a prop on their ballots that limits props to citizens of the state.

  • ChrisR266 : They live with it or correct it, but never admit it.

  • kesmarn : Hey, KQ!

  • PatsyT : Hey KQ!

  • AdLib : KQ!!! Hey!

  • ADONAI : wassup KQ!

  • ChrisR266 : Choice: I know my peeps, OH-IOans are really bad about admitting ignorance, ill attention or mistakes…

  • KQuark : Helloooo

  • choicelady : Chris – I know, and seeing OH go red was a shock. I lay it to progressives NOT voting.

  • kesmarn : Yes, Chris. You’re in Columbus, no? I think Ohioans already have serious buyers remorse. It’ll only get worse, too, with Kasich.

  • ADONAI : The problem with having a referendum system like California is …. well, everything that has happened to California.

  • ChrisR266 : I agree that it could and probably would succeed.

  • ChrisR266 : Hi Kes: referendum would be the way here.

  • choicelady : kes, AdLib, Chris – I think yes referendum is what I think IS very useful. That’s interesting, AdLib – have to wait for the max damage before you recall the SOBs? That’s weird.

  • ADONAI : choice,I’m bookmarking the website presently

  • ChrisR266 : Choice: you are correct, I agree. But Ohio is also not a conservative state, rather a moderate one. That’s why the whole thing is so unsettling. This just isn’t the kind of onslaught OH-IO is used to or expects.

  • choicelady : AdLib – “little” research? Hah! It’s life altering for us in CA and for them in OH. Never would have known it without your work. That’s HUGE!

  • kesmarn : Chris and c’lady, tremendous distraction level here, but I’m getting emails from Ohio activist groups that are looking to reverse SB5 via referendum. They’re optimistic. Dunno if it’s justified…

  • choicelady : Patsy – yes, I think you were one of the first people to tell us about US Uncut. GREAT movement if we can keep up the momentum.

  • AdLib : CL – My understanding is that you can recall in OH but the office holder has to have served for one year first.

  • ADONAI : BoA should catch shitloads of flap from every direction. People are losing their jobs and we’re deriding “elitist teachers” but these fucks didn’t pay one dime?

  • choicelady : AD – the failure of B of A to pay taxes is the focus of US Uncut’s actions. That’s a movement we HAVE to see get going. It’s fantastically successful as UK Uncut, and I just passed the info to my members today – I have 1.5 MILLION people in CA who like to raise a ruckus.

  • AdLib : AD – Yes, I saw that about BA. And Exxon too, paid virtually no taxes. WTF, each teacher is paying more in taxes than the entire B of A corp and they’re “greedy” and need their wages cut?!!

  • choicelady : Chris – Ohio is not a populist state. I think my ally there looked into recall and don’t think they have it. I might be mixing it up with something else they did not get in the wave of initiative, recall, referendum, but one of those at least is NOT legal in OH.

  • ChrisR266 : It’s funny, but the mood here is so fundamentally disturbed, that people are still reeling, in a sense. No one saw this one coming. I think it’s betrayal at the basic level that people are feeling. For already beat up OH-IO, it’s like a blow in the gut.

  • PatsyT : BoA is catching some flap from UnCut

  • AdLib : Aw shucks, CL. I just did a little research…and you shared the info with the unions so it’s a team effort!

  • ADONAI : choice,I have not had the pleasure. If I come across it, I’ll give it a sip.

  • choicelady : Cher – it’s indeed the only place we’d be purists! But one has to have SOME standards. Sniff.

  • ADONAI : Speaking of corporations, did anyone see that report on NBC stating that BoA didn’t pay any taxes last year?

  • choicelady : AD – ever had George Dickel TN Sourmash? Saw it being made about 40 years ago. Think there’s still some of that vintage around. It’s not in hot demand.

  • AdLib : CL – Indeed because tax cuts are government subsidies, when corps don’t pay taxes, teachers get their pay cut to pay for that. They should be required to document that the investment we’re making in their business is paying off or give us our tax money back.

  • Chernynkaya : Excuse me for a few minutes– a visitor appeared. Back soon!

  • choicelady : EVerbody – AdLib is wholly responsible for letting the unions KNOW that OH has a truth in political advertising law. They did NOT know that! He has galvanized the movement in OH because of it!

  • ChrisR266 : AdLib: That is already happening, as I understand. What is more interesting here is that in OH-IO, people rather let their elected officials crash and burn. Recall is not in the ken of the public. We’ll see if it rises in the next few weeks.

  • Chernynkaya : CL– the only way we could be considered purists is in Margaritas.

  • AdLib : Chris – I think the recall card should be played heavily, especially on any Repub legislators who won in moderate districts. Hammer them with getting recalled and they will change their tune.

  • kesmarn : Too bad boomer isn’t here. I actually did have Merlot with dinner tonight. That’s her vino.

  • choicelady : AdLib – back to the cuts (margaritas are nice, but…) I TOTALLY agree. If corporations are ‘fictitious persons’ then let’s hold them to the same standard as CalWORKs moms getting $600 per month? Quarterly reports, finger imaging, paperwork out the wazoo and reclamation of anyting considered “income” above what’s authorized AND payback of anything obtained for which there are not measurable standards of work. Seems only fair.

  • funksands : Red Stripe, the cause of and answer to many of my problems.

  • ADONAI : On the occasions I do drink, I like American whiskey. The name on the label doesn’t mean much as long as it was made around here.

  • ChrisR266 : Choice: good for me. I’m getting bits and pieces, of course, but what I learned over the bar at Bonefish Grill tonight leads me to believe that more R senators may be getting uncomfortable with this.

  • AdLib : Chris – As CL and I have found, there is a Truth in Political Advertising law in OH that the unions and citizens should pursue, especially if a recall is on the table.

  • Chernynkaya : AL– you’ve mentioned pomMargs twice now– and now I have to get some!

  • choicelady : AdLib – I think that’s what you and D. had, but Cher and I went au naturel. If that’s how it’s spelled…

  • PatsyT : Well funk that would be Red Stripe.

  • AdLib : CL – PlanetPOMegranat e margaritas.

  • ChrisR266 : Cognac, all.

  • ADONAI : It’s all corporate news and corporate media. It’s one long infomercial for whatever they want you to believe. All paid for out of their pockets. That’s why nothing ever moves past a left or right argument. Why ideas and opinions outside the left/right dynamic merit no mention.

  • Chernynkaya : Same here, CL!

  • choicelady : Chris – I have family and friends fighting the bill in OH. Let’s talk about talking off line on what you’ve learned. I need to pass it on. They are not getting good info.

  • funksands : Patsy, I’ll have what you’re having….

  • kesmarn : Hola, Cher! Howdy, AdLib and friends!

  • AdLib : Hey Kes!

  • PatsyT : Hey funk, hope all it great

  • AdLib : CL – If only! The wealthy should have to pay back tax cuts if they don’t create jobs…and they need to document all the additional jobs they financed with tax cuts.

  • Chernynkaya : Hi kes!

  • choicelady : Cher dear, you can NEVER go wrong with me. We’ve shared margaritas! A bonding moment.

  • ChrisR266 : Talked to a staffer from Duffy’s office tonight (R, Worthington OH-IO). He’s been analyzing calls all week. Went through over a thousand calls last five days, not one call in favor of SB 5. Further, he confirmed that the R-Senators were not consulted about the bill before its introduction.

  • Chernynkaya : What’s even worse is that the majority of the country does NOT agree with that AT ALL. It’s as if they don’t care what we think. Did anyone see the WSJ/NBC Poll?

  • choicelady : AdLib – the next move should be a proposition for truth in tax deductions act. We give breaks – WHERE ARE THE JOBS????

  • funksands : Hey Patsy. What up?

  • kesmarn : I sent my note of sympathy to the Muslim community in Yorba Linda today. Figured it was the least I could do. And hola, everyone. The Fave is here and we’re having a Michael Jackson marathon tonight, so I’m seriously distracted.

  • Chernynkaya : Sorry, CL–thought you were too busy to read anything. :oops:

  • choicelady : Hi funk – thanks for letting us know where the REAL ‘death to granny’ policies are and who’s making them.

  • AdLib : Just how far can this corporate propaganda and bashing of the working class go? Teachers are greedy for being paid $50k salaries but billionaires NEED millions in tax cuts? WTF???

  • funksands : This just proves that the GOP has three classification of humans: Friends, enemies, and prey

  • PatsyT : Hi Funk!

  • Chernynkaya : Seriously–no joke. Something must be done to remove the word “news” from Fox. And it should be considered as asource of campaing contribs. for the air time they give baggers.

  • funksands : Hey Chris!

  • choicelady : Cher – I knew that.

  • ChrisR266 : Hi ya, Funk

  • ADONAI : AdLib, That’s a good question. I think it’s because no one would ever take it seriously even though it is a serious issue.

  • funksands : Hey Ad. Nice place you got here.

  • choicelady : Cher – the protesters were probably the mob in Yorba Linda, the TP folks trying to terrify peaceful Muslim families on their way to a conference on the importance of charity. They had palm trees there. Hmmmm.

  • Chernynkaya : Iread that today, FS

  • funksands : CL, I thought it was a joke when I heard it. No joke. Utter lunacy.

  • AdLib : Hey funksands!

  • ADONAI : “death races”?

  • AdLib : Why can’t we sue Fox for fraud?

  • Chernynkaya : OOPs– that was for CL.

  • choicelady : Hey funk – now that’s planning! Kill ’em but make sure they’re planted properly… Is that anything like “death panels”?

  • Chernynkaya : AL– the plam trees proved that Fox switched tapes of protesters to make them look hostile.

  • AdLib : When I’m surrounded by those WI palm trees, my favorite suntan lotion is Old Milwaukee

  • Chernynkaya : CL– They cleaned the capitol building and then let the protesters back in. And about a hundred other maneuvers. ;-)

  • choicelady : PAtsy – used to summer in the Dells. I can’t wrap my mind around palm trees, but since everything looks like Vegas these days, it should NOT surprise me I suppose.

  • funksands : Somebody probably already mentioned that the Wisconsin budget cut Medicare and Medicaid spending while simultaneously increasing funding for funerals for the indigent.

  • choicelady : AD – well I needed to know that! It’s earth shattering! As one who has spent much time in WI, I’d never have thought it possible. BIG story! Thanks! Who needs workers’ rights when you can focus on palm trees?

  • PatsyT : Wisconsin Dells will go to no end to bring in the traffic… nnow they have Palm Trees!

  • ChrisR266 : Cher, you’re correct. Senators are starting to look at the polls and logging the calls to their offices. It’s starting to scare them mightily.

  • ADONAI : Evening choicelady! And I think the big news in Wisconsin right now, according to the Colbert Report,is that Wisconsin has palm trees now! That’s amazing! Normally they can’t really exist in that kind of climate! Kudos to Fox “News” for catching that!

  • choicelady : Hi Cher, AdLib, Patsy, kes and hi to Chris and AD whom I don’t know well yet! Hi ‘guest” whoever you are. Welcome.

  • PatsyT : Good Evening Choice!

  • AdLib : Hey CL!

  • Chernynkaya : Hey there, C’LAdy!

  • Chernynkaya : AD– I have noticed and I guess many of us shrug and think, “Oh, it’s just sports.” Forgetting the billions it makes and what a big industry it is.

  • choicelady : Evening everybody – AdLib, just read the part about D’s present to you! She is one sweet kid! Congrats! So what’s going on in WI we don’t know about?

  • AdLib : Where aren’t anti-trust laws bypassed?

  • ADONAI : Has anybody noticed that sports league casually bypass established anti-trust laws but everyone seems to accept it?

  • PatsyT : AD not from my view!

  • ADONAI : Patsy, and I’m mediocre at all of them. :)

  • AdLib : Chris – Up in the air in terms of the bill not passing the way it’s expected to?

  • Chernynkaya : Chris– i think I read the assembly is gonna take time pondering.

  • ChrisR266 : Things are looking to be more up in the air than MSM would have one thinking based on this week’s reporting

  • PatsyT : AD you have many talents

  • AdLib : Chris – Do tell…

  • ADONAI : Patsy, I’ve mastered the “emotionally distant father” routine.

  • AdLib : Hey AD!

  • ChrisR266 : Had an interesting conversation with a worker in an Ohio Senator’s office this evening.

  • Chernynkaya : Hiya, AD!

  • AdLib : Hey Chris!

  • PatsyT : AD you have tooo many kids!

  • ADONAI : Hola! You gotta be patient with the kids. They LITERALLY don’t get it. And even if you explain it as simply as you can,what do they have to relate it to? You just gotta keep reinforcing it.

  • PatsyT : Not bad ChrisR… thanks for asking and yourself?

  • ChrisR266 : How are you Patsy?

  • Chernynkaya : Hi chris!

  • PatsyT : Hey Chris!

  • ChrisR266 : Evening, all!

  • Chernynkaya : I’ve been ready for years! Totally jealous of my friends. I am one of the last to have any. And my son is 32!

  • PatsyT : The rallies are so worthwhile! I loved talking to other folks from all over- Some were from Wisconsin

  • AdLib : Cher – That Grandchildren thing can sneak up on you pretty quick.

  • Chernynkaya : Patsy, it’s almost over–just a few more years. I am ready to schlepp grandchildren already!!

  • PatsyT : Wow AdLib, that is inspiring!

  • AdLib : Patsy – Exactly, I never regret the doing, just the waking up or schlepping.

  • Chernynkaya : OMG– She gave you her Dollar? Oh, jeez…

  • PatsyT : I don’t regret any of those Schlepps myself… I miss some of them.. Let’s see Dance Mom, Swim Team Mom, Orchestra Mom, Chamber Music Mom, Volleyball Mom, Musical Theater Mom…. and I’m not done!

  • AdLib : Cher – I was speechless, which is rare for me. And at the bottom, she taped a $1 bill (the parents had given me a gift card). So sweet but I’m never removing it from her homemade card.

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