Vox Populi – 4-23-2010

Questinia : hi

AdLib : See you later Cher! Have a great weekend!

Chernynkaya : Oh I jsut did! well thanks Ad and see ya later.

Chernynkaya : I can’t post now for some readon

AdLib : Night Kes!

kesmarn : Good night, everyone!

kesmarn : ‘Night, Patsy!

AdLib : Thanks everyone for another thoughtful and fun Vox Populi!

kesmarn : Right back atcha, Cher. I may have to sign off now, though. Midnight here and I’m turning into a pumpkin…

AdLib : Missed you Patsy!

AdLib : Since you noticed, Kes, guess I had to include it.

Chernynkaya : I know, kes, but I have no worries about you–you’re the gemster.

AdLib : It’s about time to wrap tonight’s edition of Vox Populi. The chat continues at the related post, here’s the link: «link»

kesmarn : Do you think he’s trying to tell us something by not posting the link?

PatsyT : Thanks all …..

AdLib : It’s about time to wrap tonight’s edition of Vox Populi. The chat continues at the related post, here’s the link:

kesmarn : Cher, we seem to egg each other on in many ways…:lol: We’re a kinda dangerous combo!

PatsyT : computer issues…

Chernynkaya : You got an A+ Patsy.

PatsyT : Test

Chernynkaya : Cheddary! Kes!

Chernynkaya : Night, K sleep well.

AdLib : Oh, you’re still on the road!

Chernynkaya : Khirad, I saw the remix, but nothing is as funnu to me as his original because he is Mr.Personality! So spak=rkly.

AdLib : Night Khirad! Welcome back from your DC adventure!

kesmarn : Night, Khirad. You’ll be safe. You have the right ancestors!

AdLib : And that was from last year. Russia is a bit behind the U.S. in many ways.

Khirad : Well, I got to get some rest. I’m goin’ deep to the Confederate capital tomorrow with New York plates. Night.

kesmarn : The background is truly magnificent. In a cheddary kinda way.

Chernynkaya : His suit is snazzy too!

kesmarn : Blagojovich inherited that wig.

Khirad : And autotuned: «link»

Chernynkaya : He is scary and hilarious! Even the cheesy decor in th BG is bent.

Khirad : Trololol dubbed: «link»

kesmarn : I cannot stop laughing when I see that vid!!!!!

AdLib : Heh! His toupee looked like it was ready to leap to its death!

Chernynkaya : No prob, kes, we still watch that about once a week!

Chernynkaya : OH that was the link to the funny video, trolololol!

kesmarn : Cher, you saved me!

AdLib : Kes – even better!

Chernynkaya : «link»

PatsyT : Too bad Dick Armey is out of office

kesmarn : Cox probing Lindsey Graham in investigation?

AdLib : Lindsey Graham Dives into Examination of Cox”

kesmarn : Teehee. Easy for you to say, AdLib. I don’t have the link at hand, though!

AdLib : Kes – just post the link and the chat software automatically turns it into “Link”.

Chernynkaya : Pasty– I’ll find it in aminute.

kesmarn : Oh God, Patsy, now I’m on the spot. I’m not tech savvy enough to get the link posted!

Chernynkaya : ADLIB– I’ll never be able to stop laffiing, now..

PatsyT : kes link please

AdLib : “Bush Yanks Cox From SEC – Looking For New Head”.

Chernynkaya : KESMARN! Oh no, now I’m done!1 :LOL: HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAH

kesmarn : All we need to cap off the evening is the video of the Russian guy singing “Trolololol”!

PatsyT : Polls make it harder for Bush and Cox and the SEC

AdLib : Okay, who else wants to make a Cox joke.

Chernynkaya : You guys make it harder to type whe3n I laff.

AdLib : Kes – Thanks!

Chernynkaya : I was an elephant seal!

kesmarn : AdLib, …on the “After porn episode…” comment. Too funny.

Chernynkaya : Yes I are!

AdLib : Cher – No, you doesn’t!

kesmarn : Cher!

Chernynkaya : I meant IT.

AdLib : Night javaz!

kesmarn : Prayers for b’ito, without a doubt, j’avaz. Have you heard anything?

Chernynkaya : Kes– I doesn’t get any better…!

AdLib : “After porn episode, Cox to remain in Bush…Admin.”

PatsyT : Nighty Night Javez will do

Chernynkaya : “Night, Javaz.

javaz : good night all, and everyone say prayer for bito, please.

Khirad : kes

kesmarn : “Bush Supports Cox”

PatsyT : Make that SEC C an X

Khirad : You are right, Cher. By the way, this part of VA seems to be Ron Paul heartland. Then again, why not feed into that meme and hope to peel off as many GOP votes as possible, whether though voting Libertarian, or not showing up at all (much more likely).

Chernynkaya : Adlib!! YES!!

AdLib : Headline from 2008: “Porno at SEC Exposes Cox”.

Chernynkaya : JINX!

javaz : AdLib, gotcha – I know what you are saying. and even Blues Tiger and I have butted heads – I’ll say it again – we agree more than disagree.

kesmarn : Cher, we’re on the same page!

Chernynkaya : Kes– I don’t know but I think it was Trisha’s boy.

kesmarn : Yup. Tricia’s little boy. Oy.

Khirad : Nixon’s grandson? That’s like Imelda Marcos’ son being in politics too. Lord help us all.

kesmarn : Hahahahaha! Why didn’t I think of that?

Chernynkaya : First of all, the SEC story is probably just a small piece of the whole debacle. But it’s being played in the media, not just because of the sex angle, but because it feeds into the Ron Paul and RW memes that government IS the problem. Let’s make all govt.workers looking like drooling jack-offs.

AdLib : Okay…the name of the man helming the SEC when there was a porno scandal…had the last name of Cox?

kesmarn : That’s really low…

AdLib : kes – Yes, they are trying to deceive people into thinking that this just happened under Obama’s SEC.

kesmarn : Oh, Cher, I didn’t realize that! Was Christopher Cox at the helm of the SEC then? You know his son is running for office? Nixon’s grandson. God help us.

AdLib : javaz, all I see here are friendly colleagues discussing the issues. I’ve been on the other side of the fence from a number of people here, including my fellow founders, KQ and Kalima. The whole idea of The Planet is proven by your comfort in being able to freely express yourself and be replied to with respect. Gotta love the cool folks here who want honest discussions, anger-free.

Chernynkaya : Kes– even worse for the GOP–It was 2007!

kesmarn : I thought it was interesting that it was Chuck Grassley who ordered the investigation, too. Go figure.

kesmarn : Argh! Seriously, AdLib?? This was 2008 when this happened. How could Obama have a thing to do with it?

AdLib : The GOP is trying to confuse people by linking Bush’s Porno SEC instead to Obama.

javaz : God, I am shocked, shocked I tell you! Is Blues Tiger still here? I can relate even though I do not always agree with you, but we are the rebels on this site! Our opinions are at times are not welcome, we are the rebels. It does not mean that we dislike anyone here, and we sure as hell hope that you all don’t hate us, but can we agree to disagree?

Chernynkaya : Right adlib and others — not only because the dems will lose seat after Nov, but it could actually be energizing. The dems enthusiasm deficit will hurt us more than just midterm party changes.

Khirad : Haha, I loved that story, kes. Yes, no outrage over that or the Dept of the Interior’s coke sex parties.

PatsyT : kes YES and Lesbian Bondage Clubs !

AdLib : Cher – Good. I think it needs to be hammered into people that the baggers have what they claim to be their main issue at the center of the political world and they are shrinking into the shadows.

kesmarn : I hope the Tea Bag people are paying attention to the way their boy Bush’s SEC was enforcing the rules for financial responsibility by watching porn 8 hours/day. Where’s the Tea Bag outrage over that?

Khirad : By the way, at the Teabag gaggle I saw, where they went to everything from Immigration Reform to this, Freedom Works was prominently there. They didn’t even hide it.

AdLib : Cher – Absolutely, the biggest legislation Obama can realistically pass must happen before the Nov election. Dems may retain control but the majorities will shrink and the traitorous ones like Ben Nelson and Lieberman will happily thwart more change.

PatsyT : I am sick of whining tax payers. Go to another country if you hate it so.

Chernynkaya : Rachel has a few times I tyhink, Adlib.

Khirad : This is definitely connected to midterms, but of course.

AdLib : The Baggers are a fraud. Astroturf indeed which did suck up legitimately upset people who don’t know they’re being played. This Financial Reform de facto proves they are total frauds who only want to attack the black president. I wish KO or Rachel would hit this, if they haven’t already.

Chernynkaya : PATSY– EXACTLY!

Chernynkaya : I also think, Adlib– they need to get something done before November.

kesmarn : The (lying) objection I’m hearing from them is that the plan creates a fund to bail out financials at tax payer expense, again. WHICH IT DOES NOT!

PatsyT : O boo hoo what will we do without the T baggies to up ratings??

AdLib : The reason the Dems are trying to rush this bill through is so the GOP can’t use a time lag to make up a “Poverty Panel” (instead of a death panel) that they’ll claim is a plan to bankrupt Granny.

Chernynkaya : I don’t think the baggers care about anything substantive–exc ept that a democrat–and a BLACK one at that, is in the WH. Period.

kesmarn : I hope you guys are right on the decline and fall of the Great Tea Bag.

Khirad : Indeed Cher, as my trip to the Philly Tea Party attested, I think the wind is out of their sails, and they got nothin’ but fadin’ to do.

kesmarn : Surely, they’ll find some way to link Wall St. reform to abortion and gay marriage. What else do they have?

PatsyT : Isn’t this what all that Anger is all about? They sure drove home the -There’s a lot of anger out there point-

AdLib : This could be the same HCR dance, pretend you’re working with Dems then pick an issue that you claim destroys reform and vote against it. IOW, they want to be for it before they’re against it.

Khirad : They want to water it down, no doubt. But, it’s a lot harder to use the paranoid low-information leverage they were able to use to water down HCR, I would hope. Then again, I’ve given up assuming the Tea Party is anything but really upset about a black man as president… Else, they might come through and be consistent on this.

Chernynkaya : As far as I am concerned, I think the year of the Bagger is over. they got nuthin. they may have a few last gasps but they are insignificant.

kesmarn : Oh, the Repubs are desperate on this one. Saying the Prez is trying to “destroy Wall Street” which will then “destroy America.” That is really reaching!

Chernynkaya : It is BS, i think –just like HCR they will try to water it down–although I have heard several Dems say they won’t let them.

AdLib : Why isn’t the MSM interviewing tea baggers on financial reform. I thought this was their (supposedly) main issue? Why aren’t they called out for being silent on this?

PatsyT : AdLib their game is up … We can see that man behind the curtain

AdLib : ONTO OUR NEXT TOPIC: THE GOP HAS FOUND THAT THEIR BS WON’T WORK ON FINANCIAL REFORM SO THEY ARE SIGNALLING THAT THEY WOULD BE WILLING TO WORK ON FINANCIAL REFORM WITH DEMS. IS THIS JUST A PLOY TO WEAKEN IT INTO SOMETHING RELATIVELY MEANINGLESS? ARE THEY AFRAID OF TEA BAGGERS TURNING ON THEM? AND WHERE IS THE TEA BAGGER SUPPORT FOR THIS, WHAT SHOULD BE A CENTRAL ISSUE FOR THEM? IS IT BECAUSE THE BLACK MAN IN THE WHITE HOUSE WANTS TO DO IT?

Chernynkaya : Absolutely, K. As you say, green is their favorite shade!

Khirad : Night Seek and Hito.

Chernynkaya : Peace, Seek.

PatsyT : Night Seek

Khirad : Exactly Cher, I was just saying that they didn’t care about the racism angle at all. That was just too cute.

PatsyT : Night HITO

kesmarn : G’night to BT, Seek, HITO!

Chernynkaya : Bye’ HITO!!

AdLib : Night Seek!

AdLib : Night Hito!

SeeknDestroy : G’night folks….Peace.. ..:-)

kesmarn : If I’m not mistaken a lot of the wage and safety guidelines in NAFTA are totally unenforced, too. If those jobs were decent and safe, people would be more inclined to want to stay in Mexico.

Chernynkaya : Javaz, Im not going there with you tonight. Maybe tomorrow, in the AM.

HITO : sorry to interrupt, I’m tired, so Good night kids.

AdLib : Night BT!

PatsyT : Nighty night Blues Tiger

AdLib : Khirad – You are so right. If we tried working with Mexico and SA on long term plans, in fact, if the World Bank would, this and many other issues would be addressed.

javaz : Cher, what? Who are the people in your world? You have such restrictions on people who you would consider friends! I am shocked, because you are a liberal, but I am starting to think that you are not. Do you mean people have to pass a test to be worthy of your friendship?

Chernynkaya : Khirad all big biz is anti reform and pro illegal.

Blues Tiger : Good night all thanks for the chat, my better half beckons

Khirad : Well, interesting about the Chamber… …nah, not really! The only color they see is green.

AdLib : BT – I understand, it is different out here. Reminds me of The Grapes of Wrath, those from OK coming out to CA to pick fruit for pennies.

Blues Tiger : The problem is Mexico nationlized their Oil so the Corrupt are in charge of that too Khriad

Chernynkaya : If there is no other option, of course I would feel differently. but here in LA there is no excuse.

Khirad : How about helping Mexico drill for oil in the Gulf? I think anything to do with supporting Mexico’s economy, as corrupt and Hispanic the élite are, only benefits the US in the long run. Thing is, we never think in those long-run terms.

AdLib : …don’t shop there.

Blues Tiger : But thats just it AdLib most of the AG related jobs in Cali are totally different than the ones here, here it is a way of life for most of us raised in rural areas

AdLib : CXher – I’m with you. I’ve already taught my 6 year old about Walmart, she knows that they put people out of business and jobs and that we’

Chernynkaya : ADlib– I totally agree. I thought you meant people who used the end services form illegal indutries– like meat cutters and such.

javaz : I shop at Walmart ! Not all the time, but if you saw where we lived, there’s not a whole lot of choices – My God Cher, are you not a liberal?

PatsyT : Javez you so naughty…

AdLib : Illegal Immigration occurs because of both sides of the equation. One party comes to work and earn money, the other wants to hire people at low wages. Why aren’t both parties held to the same standard? If we shouldn’t hate our Agricultural Industries who give the jobs, why demonize people for simply taking them?

Blues Tiger : Both La Raza and The Chamber denounce the Laws as anti business and racisit

Chernynkaya : Adlib– I probably shouldn’t answer that– I don’t even speak to people who shop at walmart. almost.

Blues Tiger : AdLib Okla cracked down on the employers, actually all we did was pass a version of the Fed Law they refuse to enforce then enforced it

javaz : I’m a born again virgin remember and I take matters into my hands – personal responsibility and all that

kesmarn : I would bet that one thing we can all agree on is that business owners who deliberately employ illegals need to be dealt with…seriously .

AdLib : I think BT and Cher are right. Some IIs are doing some jobs that citizens would do but are being hired so they can be paid far less. What responsibility does the user have for II?

Khirad : Me too, javaz

javaz : I’m bad

javaz : To the women here, do you utilize C-size or A-size batteries?

PatsyT : We have always had immigrants – It just that now they are of color

kesmarn : I just feel so badly for the deported ones, though, BT. One of my neighbors was deported and his wife and child are still here…lonely without him.

AdLib : BT – Absolutely, Mexico is the key problem. The only real solution to illegal immigration from Mexico and South America is for the US to support legit govts that actually care about building up decent economies. If Mexico had good paying jobs…there might be a reverse immigration problem.

Blues Tiger : kes somehow lawns got mowed, cattle got fed, motel beds got made and houses got roofed before the mass migration north

kesmarn : Thanks, Khirad!

Khirad : By the way, this page has great resources on the bill – with factsheet, opinion, and more. Save it for later: «link»

Chernynkaya : BT it’s not just the work–its that employers don’t pay them mimimum wage. This issue in part is a business one–IE businesses do not want legals!

kesmarn : I know the economy has a huge effect on this, too. In Ohio, people are fighting over jobs like roofing installers, maintenance and cleaning jobs, lawn care people…stuff that was entry level for immigrant workers before 2008.

AdLib : This isn’t that different from the HCR situation. All those old folks on Medicare who don’t want others getting the same benefits. It’s a kind of jealousy. Here we are in a society where the same people claim capitalism is great and competition is good for America but they don’t want the competition of others for jobs and services.

Blues Tiger : AdLib we do that now with immigrant refuges, which in reality is what most Mexicans are , refugees from a Coorupy ZGov

Blues Tiger : Part of the problem as I see it is that too many people feel that they are only doing work no one else will, the people doing they migrant farm work are a small portion of the immigrant population

Khirad : Cher, the local paper did an op-ed recommending reforms again, but did mention simple things like different agencies not being able to communicate because they use different radio-walkie-tal kie systems, and, cell phone signals don’t work well on the rugged border. I mean, these are ludicrously simple things to streamline. It just makes you wonder where the money goes… sheesh.

kesmarn : Yes, here we are, to use the cliche, a nation of immigrants, and we wrestle with this. No easy answers…

AdLib : BT – I understand your point. The only sticking point would be, in a free country, ordering people to live in a state and not be permitted to leave.

javaz : My father came over at 7 years old and they walked and they could not speak English – my father was an illegal immigrant – from Quebec City Canada. He got a job when he was 10 years old during the depression, and he served in WW2, as did his brothers. My mothers parents were German, you would not believe the anti-American crap that they put up with, especially once the war happened.

Khirad : I know, this is a sticky issue for me as well, kes. Very complicated.

PatsyT : Cher good point about Dems and reform

Blues Tiger : Kes if they don’t secure the borders and finally do something about the Mexican Gov this issue will never go away

Chernynkaya : I would also like to see better border enforcement for future immigrants. If that means a fence– and I don’t know about that, then that might be necessary. what do you think?

AdLib : If I can zoom out for a moment…conside r what major issues were addressed by the last three presidents, Bush, Clinton and Bush. Compare that with Obama tackling HCR, Wall Street Reform, Immigration Reform, DADT, ending the Iraq War, DADT and Climate Change. Those purist Dems should lay off the Double Downs and consider what this president and Congress are attempting to accomplish in the first 2 years of his presidency.

kesmarn : Right, Khirad. If those kids had to live in Mexico, they’d be lost. This is their country. Sigh… it’s so complicated. I’m def pro-immigrant, but even I ask myself sometimes: how many folks can we absorb?

Khirad : And think about it AdLib, I remember the last time this came up. We’re talking about possibly going down the road of setting up internment camps in the meantime to hold them, if they were to ’round ’em up’. Hyperbole, perhaps, but I wouldn’t put it past Maricopa’s Sheriff Joe.

Blues Tiger : I totally agree AdLib thats why I think all states should hhave to absorb their fair share

PatsyT : OK OT I am hearing that the Cubs are winning

Khirad : They have a good Latino program on local public radio Kes. They did one where they followed two straight A students. One got a great scholarship, the other, well, was illegal. It really is sad. They came over when they were like one or something and are as American as anyone else, in fact, they are the American Dream. It’s unfair to punish them for their parent’s decision.

Chernynkaya : here’s another thought about the politics of Immig, Reform: The Dems cannot lose on this issue. Even if the bill doesn’t get enough votes to pass, they will be seen as having tried.

SeeknDestroy : Freebird!

AdLib : For me, this is an issue of desire vs. reality. I understand the desire not to have any people in this nation who aren’t supposed to be here legally. That is not an outrageous position. On the other hand, there is the reality that those 30 million could never be removed. So it seems most pragmatic to me to accept that they’re here and work out a system to integrate them better into our society than pass laws that express a desire that can never be fulfilled. Honestly, how many illegals could be deported from AZ in a year using this law? 100? 200? And how many will enter AZ in the meantime? This is totally unworkable.

Chernynkaya : Ok BT.

kesmarn : I have a good friend whose parents came here as migrant farm laborers, next generation worked in factories in the North, third generation are college grads. It’s impressive to see.

Blues Tiger : I wasn’t going down that road though Cher

AdLib : BT – Again, 46% refers to those who don’t pay Fed Income Tax only And out of those are most Senior Citizens on SS. What percentage of Americans are on SS? Subtract that number from the 46% to get a more accurate number.

Chernynkaya : BT– it makes all the difference because one way of stating it implies tax cheats and scofflaws.

kesmarn : Yes, Cher, that was a great article.Well documented.

Chernynkaya : Kes, that’s part of the article about taxes I was talking about.

Blues Tiger : paying them in then getting them back sorta equals not paying

kesmarn : Low wage earners do pay taxes, though, even though they may qualify for Earned Income. And they subsidize the economy indirectly by working for sub-standard wages.

SeeknDestroy : 46% was taken in 2009…after the recession had hit heavy…that number might be higher now

PatsyT : We need a Hate is UN American campaign

Khirad : javaz, you need to escape down south if need be. The Tucson police chief (Roberto Villaseñor) wasn’t so hot on this.

Chernynkaya : I meant about the 47% don’t pay taxes is not true–sorry.

Blues Tiger : what talking point is that?

AdLib : BT – No, 46% of people don’t pay Income Tax. They pay all kinds of other taxes including Medicare, SS, on property, vehicles, etc.

Chernynkaya : BT after the VP I’ll show you an article that refutes the RW talking point. It’s technically NOT TRUE. I measnt o post it on Trollbusters.

AdLib : javaz – I completely understand. I’m no shrinking violet but I would feel intimidated living in that atmosphere of hatred that is all around AZ now.

Blues Tiger : I understand AdLib, but 46% of Americans don’t actually pay income tax now, most of these people will fall into the lower income catagory too

Chernynkaya : Adlib– I forget. I’ll find em.

javaz : I agree with you AdLib, but in my neighborhood, it makes me a target.

AdLib : Cher – I would love to see those stats! Are they in Troll Busters?

kesmarn : javaz, that’s really a shame — that these people have made you feel unsafe just for being who you are. Being liberal seems to be a crime in their view. Craziness.

PatsyT : Khirad Every year we are getting a new batch of 18yr olds We need massive voter drive!

AdLib : BT – I’m in L.A. and Cali has a very large illegal immigrant population. I support their becoming citizens because in the first place, 30 million people could never be deported from this nation so they will be here either way. Might as well get them to pay their way and be good citizens. The only other option is to have them here and have less of an incentive to be good citizens and not have them contribute financially for social services they use.

HITO : If they hate you don’t watch their damn dog!

javaz : Can you imagine?

javaz : Our neighbors that we dog sit for, absolutely hate us, and regard as an enemy.\

Blues Tiger : so where will the go?

Chernynkaya : HITO illegals can’t but if you mean green carded–don’t forget, there is NO AMNESTY being proposed–they can’tr stay with no job.

kesmarn : BT, I’m glad to hear it. Those kids will be the contributors in the near future.

Khirad : Patsy, High School students walked out. And Arizona Hispanic Republicans say they view it as an attack on their civil rights. I hate to say it, but that’s what they get for associating themselves with that party. Okay… I love to say it.

javaz : Not all of us here go along with the extreme right wing that has taken us over – think back to the 50’s and the lynchings, and then imagine that you live in that – and imagine that your neighbors and friends are armed. It is not a good place to be – I fucked up. Yes I did, I let them know we are liberal leaning. It is not a joke.

Chernynkaya : AdLib– I do have the stats! I posted them a while ago, and they would be a net gain as citizens. i’ll fu=ind it later.

Blues Tiger : Kes we are one of only 6 states that give assitance to children of illegals to go to College

HITO : Cher, if they can get on assistance why would they leave?

AdLib : WHoops! What I was saying is, “…so we can’t be certain what the scenario would be.”

Chernynkaya : Kes, if there are no jobs they will leave.

AdLib : BT – We would be assuming right now. We don’t have stats yet to determine how much in revenue would be generated by two immigrant parents paying taxes vs. what their family would require. I’m just saying that we don’t know the numbers so we can’

kesmarn : I don’t mean to come across as anti-immigrant at all. I just worry that people are taking such risks for a better life…and do we have a better life to offer them? We should. State affected need Fed help for human services and education.

Blues Tiger : Cher if Vermont was closer to Mexico they would have more than their fair share of immigrants

PatsyT : Why no T parties rallying against this government intrusion ??

SeeknDestroy : Right after Gilligans Island

Chernynkaya : Because there is no nation of vermont or country of OK.

HITO : You watched the “Joker’s Wild”? Oh boy.

AdLib : Interesting, isn’t it that the people driving the GOP are birthers, tea baggers and anti-immigrant. As Jack Barry might have said on the old game show Joker’s Wild, “Racist! Racist! Racist!”

PatsyT : Excellent Cher

kesmarn : I think there is a concern, though, AdLib about whether or not there are jobs available for them…

Blues Tiger : AdLib I understand your point but then most of them have large families tat will get more assistance and entitlement funds once they are legal. It really is a burdun.. why should someone in Vermont who supposrts making them legal and new citizens of my state not get to share in some of the burdun?

Chernynkaya : I wrote a post about this and quoted some independent researchers. illegals do pay taxes but not as much as they cost–that’s true because they are illegal and pay minimal taxes. IF THEY WERE LEGAL THEY WOULD PAY (oops!) their fair share of taxes and they would be a net gain for the economy and the Feds.

PatsyT : I applaud the Latinos who are saying they will boycott AZ

HITO : Gutless Omnipresent Peckerheds

HITO : PT .. like the “Toothless Bunch”

AdLib : kes – But again I ask, if they are legal and paying city, state and fed taxes, they would be adding revenues to pay for their use of public services.

javaz : My state is so corrupt and I do not know what to do about it.

PatsyT : HITO Yes should have said that but they have lots of sneaky names too

kesmarn : BT, I think you were saying 500,000 to 1 million, no? And, yes, that would strain any State budget, it’s true.

Khirad : Hey now, let’s change AZ to Maricopa county, shall we?

AdLib : BT – My point is that whether or not they are legal, they are already there. Driving cars, shopping in the markets, going to hospitals. What would be the difference if they were technically legal? Aside from local, state and fed gov’t getting money from them to pay their fair share for public services.

javaz : Sheriff Joe, and read this, the man who sponsored the bill is Russel Pearce, and his hands are not clean, but he keeps getting elected again,

HITO : Patsy, are you talking about they as in them…the GOP?

PatsyT : Javez they are trying to target things all over this country. They have an agenda

Blues Tiger : Our DHS is bankrupt from it all

kesmarn : Exactly right, javaz. Once the precedent is set, where does it all stop. You were right to point out to your neighbor that his own grandson could be affected.

HITO : BT – talk about crashing and burning a state budget, if it’s not already

Chernynkaya : BT- 500 million? What are you talking about??

AdLib : Think of all the tax revenues the nation would get if 30 million people suddenly started paying taxes and into SS and Medicare.

javaz : I must’ve misread something – hey this legislation in my state – I hate it, absolutely hate it. Who are they going to target next? Gays, blacks? Me?

Blues Tiger : What I mean AdLib is that it may be easy to see it as black and white as just make them legal when you live in Vermont… I have to wonder if they would be so gung ho for it if their state was going to have to absorb 500,00-million new people

AdLib : The cops in AZ are out of control. In a state where Sheriff Joe is allowed to have dictatorial control, bad things have happened and far worse would if this law isn’t struck down.

SeeknDestroy : kesmarn…lol

kesmarn : Cher, yes, tazing old ladies is the most fun part for them…especiall y when it resets their pacemakers.

HITO : Pitbulls too Kes. Cops don’t like going there too much.

kesmarn : AdLib, I believe there are Pomeranians in Harlem!

javaz : I stand for the rights of people regardless of race, color and creed, and sexual orientation.

AdLib : BT – WHat do you mean “absorb”? They’re already here.

Blues Tiger : Cops love them tazers!!!

Chernynkaya : Kes and then taze them, right?

AdLib : Kes – I gather you’re not in Harlem?

Blues Tiger : So lets say we makethe 12-30 million people here ilegally legal, what then? who apsorps all these new citizens?

HITO : And what if they’re having a bad day? Angry and hostile…lookin g for Gonzalez would be a good thing.

kesmarn : The cops in my area confine themselves to pulling over women over the age of 65 who weigh less than 110 pounds and have no Pomeranians in the car.

AdLib : javaz, you’re misunderstanding , no one is saying that about you, we know where you stand.

SeeknDestroy : Never crossed my mind javez

Chernynkaya : Oh, it’s obvious the cops will sadistically harass all brown folks. IMHO–not all cops are bad, but they have authoritarian (and Bullying) personalities.

PatsyT : Javez not at all Never

HITO : No Way, Javaz.

SeeknDestroy : Dunkin’ Donuts?

javaz : My God, do you all believe that I am a racist bigot? WHOA

kesmarn : Oh, javaz, never for a minute did I think you supported this bill!!

Chernynkaya : I sure don’;t Javaz.

AdLib : I had a friend who worked with the police department in Philly. He knew cops very well and explained how sensible they are. They would naturally rather spend their time not confronting dangerous people and having the chance of getting shot at. So give cops the choice of filling up their day arresting innocent looking Latinos or confronting dangerous drug runners and killers, guess which they’ll choose?

javaz : Am I reading this wrong in thinking that you all think I am for this bill? You could not be more wrong. This bill is wrong, and it’s not really about immigration because my state also has the birther bill, and my gosh, I am so against that.

HITO : I knew you’d know, Cher.

SeeknDestroy : I looked it up HITO…it still exists…just under a different name

Chernynkaya : It’s called ICE now and NEVER NEVER listen to Ramirez, sweetie.

Blues Tiger : I don’t understand why AZ went to such lengths, our Laws here worked for the most part

kesmarn : Every week I must ask the weekly dumb question: is weed the major drug that comes in from Mexico? Or is the harder stuff gaining market share?

HITO : I pondered how INS felt about this intrusion into its responsibilities and Ramirez reminded me that they have ceased to exist since 2003. Was I asleep then?

Chernynkaya : Oh, no argument there Adlib. I’m just saying that there are issues aside from the racism and even beyond jobs.

AdLib : Cher – These racist idiots don’t realize it but all the police manpower wasted on dragging in Latinos who are Americans instead of combating the drug cartels is going to make them far less safe.

SeeknDestroy :

Chernynkaya : SEEK_ That’s perfect!

javaz : No AdLib, that is not true at all – there were 1,387 calls for the bill, and almost 12,000 against it. We are against it

SeeknDestroy : Planecrash McGee?

AdLib : BT – Thanks. “Rasmussen” and “Poll” go to gether as poorly as “McCain” and “maverick”.

Chernynkaya : Actually, there is a problem in Phoenix– it’s the kidnapping capital of the continent and it drug cartel. Legalize weed while we’re at it– a twofer!

SeeknDestroy : LOL

SeeknDestroy : Polls are for strippers…..

kesmarn : Oops. Meant “old farts” not “pld farts!”

Blues Tiger : it was 70% AdLib but it was a Rasmusan Poll

AdLib : Seek – I broke Google’s knees last time for not knocking so now it has to crawl.

AdLib : javaz – The polling they announced, which could indeed be bogus, had a huge majority supporting the bill, around 60% or more.

kesmarn : javaz, do you get the sense that time alone will change AZ politics as the pld farts depart for the Tea Party in the Sky?

SeeknDestroy : Google is crawling the site?

javaz : What?

HITO : LOL Adlib…did you take funny pills before?

AdLib : “Repub” and “babe” fit as poorly together as “Blago” and “acquitted”.

HITO : Javaz, you loving this nubie gov?

javaz : There were thousands of people against the bill, and maybe a 100 for it – it’s political posturing for the extreme right, and these were college kids and high school kids in the majority, do you think that they will not register and then vote for the GOP?

AdLib : Hito – javaz would know better but she came off to me as a total tool of the party.

SeeknDestroy : Adlib…LOL

kesmarn : In short…a typical Repub Babe?

PatsyT : Blago- Palin -they are all just one election away from being reality TV fodder

HITO : So she’s a pushover or is more sponge than human

SeeknDestroy : A drunken school principal

AdLib : Kes – Cher’s nailed it but I’ll add on that she comes off with all of the intelligence and charisma of a librarian overdosing on cough syrup.

HITO : Dondi was comic strip in the NYDailyNews, FYI.

HITO : Adlib: He was the best human Dondi I’ve ever seen.

kesmarn : Cher

PatsyT : Brewer looks like a school principal

AdLib : Hito – If Blago’s hair alone were governor, okay, but with blago attached…just didn’t look right.

Chernynkaya : Brewer looks a lot like all those horse riding women whov’e gotten too much sun and too much saddle.

kesmarn : I didn’t see any news on TV today. What does Brewer look like?

Chernynkaya : HITO they can’t the ACLU and maybe the Feds will get involved. but really, I was responding to yr states rights comment.

HITO : Adlib, let us remember the appearance of Blago….lol

AdLib : I’ve never seen Jan Brewer before, she does not look like one might imagine a Governor.

PatsyT : BT they might want to Dems now

Chernynkaya : The Reps now have a Southwest strategy, to replace the old Southern one.

HITO : Cher, if it’s a fed thing than how can AZ legislate this?

kesmarn : javaz, is anyone trying to say those young protesters are “outside agitators” or something?

Blues Tiger : maybe in Cali Cher, but not in other states

SeeknDestroy : Excellent,javez

AdLib : BT – It will be hard for Latinos to support a party that is bent on making them a second class citizen.

Chernynkaya : BT– the vast amjority of Latinos=Dem

javaz : YES it is a tipping point proven by the thousands of young people that walked off their campuses – both college and high school – to protest the bill. It is a very sad day for Arizona, but the light is the number of youth that protested

HITO : Even though they cite polls ad nauseum

Chernynkaya : Patsy– applause!!

Blues Tiger : The Latino vote isn’t all Dem now AdLib

HITO : The GOP has kept Steele for god’s sake, they don’t seem to give a shit about any contributing factor

AdLib : Bush got close enough to steal both elections only because of the Latino support.

Chernynkaya : HITO– immigration has always been a Federal responsibility.

PatsyT : This transparency thing is really working out for Obama. We can really see the bigots now.

AdLib : How can the GOP win presidential elections without Latinos?

HITO : The old state’s rights might offer a backlash though

SeeknDestroy : Nov….Pardon

AdLib : Hito –

Blues Tiger : Forcr the Feds to deal with the issue

AdLib : Won’t the racists in AZ be pissed off when national law prevents them from oppressing minorities?

SeeknDestroy : Let’s see how the Hispanic votes goes this December

Blues Tiger : I think they want them to push reform ahead

kesmarn : HITO,

SeeknDestroy : LOL

HITO : As I previously posted, I hope Alberto Gonzalez is driving his teen’s pick up without his wallet when he gets picked up in AZ.

Chernynkaya : I think the AZ law make reform more likely than ever.

AdLib : Whoops, left out that this is the AZ law I’m talking about.

SeeknDestroy : Cool, kesmarn

AdLib : READY OR NOT…OUR FIRST TOPIC: THIS MOST EGREGIOUS IMMIGRATION LAW THAT HAS JUST BEEN SIGNED INTO LAW IS A LICENSE TO RACIALLY HARASS LATINOS. PRES. OBAMA HAS RESPONDED WITH WANTING ACTION ON IMMIGRATION REFORM. MIGHT THIS BE A BLESSING IN DISGUISE? WILL WE GET GOOD REFORM? WILL RACISM BE INFLAMED? HAS THE GOP JUST KILLED THEIR CHANCES FOR WINNING PRESIDENCIES BY ALIENATING LATINOS? WHAT DO YOU THINK?

kesmarn : Seek, tastes great. Not overly sweet.

Blues Tiger : I miss the can sugar in Soda

SeeknDestroy : Begin? More beginning?

Blues Tiger : Of course AdLib

kesmarn : You should have seen the look on my daughter’s face when I told her I was addicted to Mexican Coke.

AdLib : Okay, are we ready to begin?

HITO : Oh, I bet that’s delicious and the way it used to be made. Better for you

AdLib : BT, I got it and am looking forward to responding. Are you familiar with Kenny Wayne Shepherd?

SeeknDestroy : How does it taste?

kesmarn : Mexican Coke is make with granulated sugar, not high fructose corn syrup.

javaz : I can’t even misspell correctly!

HITO : Kesmarn: Were you in AZ when you bought that Mexican coke?

javaz : you bethca

Blues Tiger : AdLib I sent you a mail to the admin

PatsyT : I will wonder about that K

AdLib : Otay Panky!

javaz : Whoa, this is gonna be a good one

HITO : haha LMAO

kesmarn : We just bought Mexican Coke tonight. I can explain, honest…

HITO : KMAO!

AdLib : Hito and Kes – Bup ip I puup my lips ober my teep…

HITO : Owe me a coke Kes

kesmarn : Jinx, HITO!

SeeknDestroy : Did you hit yourself in the head repeatedly?

kesmarn : No, AdLib, you’d need to have a lot more teeth removed to do that.

Chernynkaya : That’s rite AdLIb!

HITO : Adlib, NO I can still sense you have teeth.

PatsyT : WooFF wOOf

AdLib : hEy! i’VE jUST dISCOVERED hOW tO tYPE wITH a tEA bAGGEER aCCENT!

javaz : PATSY!!

PatsyT : Wait let me get my dog on the keyboard…

SeeknDestroy : Tap tap

javaz : Blues Tiger!!!

Blues Tiger : hello? is this thing on?

AdLib : gOoD.

javaz : one of my favorite people, but not sure she’s a born again virgin!

kesmarn : nEvEr!

SeeknDestroy : Adlib….LOL

Chernynkaya : NOpE

AdLib : aRE yOU mAKING fUN oF mE cHer?

SeeknDestroy : Cher…LOL

javaz : Cher!

Chernynkaya : OOH , let’s all type in both upper and lower case tonite!

SeeknDestroy : Hi Blues Tiger……Me neither

javaz : I paid 300 dollars, and I kid you not, to marry my husband in the Catholic Church, and I think my hymen grew back and then goodness – hee hee

AdLib : Whoops…Hey BT!

AdLib : hEY bt!

kesmarn : I’m glad you didn’t edit it out.

HITO : Hello BluesTiger. I’m not a virgin.

Chernynkaya : I never edited it, kES.

kesmarn : That was so funny, Cher.

SeeknDestroy : Virgins!!??!?!

Chernynkaya : And I was an elephant seal!!!

Blues Tiger : hellooooooooooo I’m virginal by the way

PatsyT : Who is cooking MOM ?

javaz : This is going to be one wild night with HITO, Seek, and me, and this might be why we were banned from another site that we will not mention

SeeknDestroy : Agree with HITO 100%

HITO : Javaz, do I have to be born again to become a virgin again?

kesmarn : HE COOKS HIS MOM?

Chernynkaya : U B terrific, HITO!

HITO : I love doing this guys. Adlib, this is so terrific.

Chernynkaya : No Javaz– that’s the part i meant

SeeknDestroy :

javaz : We are born again, Cher, guess you missed that part

Chernynkaya : Yes Kes– and his mom when she visits.

kesmarn : Does he ever cook Chinese food, Cher?

AdLib : Seek – You don’t know how right you are.

Chernynkaya : Javaz–not me!

AdLib : We’ll begin Vox Populi in a few minutes, waiting to see if any others will be arriving.

SeeknDestroy : Adlib and I are here all week….mostly Adlib……….o k, just Adlib……:-)

Chernynkaya : My chinese hubby adores my corned beef.

javaz : Hi Cher, we’re all virgins here, we’ve been Born again!

kesmarn : Yummy! I did corned beef dinner in slow cooker tonight.

PatsyT : Hi Cher

HITO : hiya Cher!

Chernynkaya : BBQ!

SeeknDestroy : Hi Cher!

kesmarn : Cher! What’s for dinner?

javaz : Oh, we are supposed to say HI, and not declare our virginity when we come on –

AdLib : Hi Cher!

PatsyT : Seek LOL

SeeknDestroy : I only smoke DURING sex……(rimsho t)

Chernynkaya : Hi all, I’m in and out if that’s oK? Cooking and popping!

PatsyT : kes it’s that Ohio thing

HITO : You can smoke on Virgin Air if you can light your cig while holding onto the wing.

kesmarn : Patsy! we’re echoing each other again!

AdLib : Big!

AdLib : There is no smoking on Virgin Airlines. Bug surprise, huh?

HITO : LOL

HITO : Kesmarn “carry on”

javaz : LMAO

PatsyT : Oh kes not agian

HITO : My kids were shocked too.

PatsyT : Only if the carry on

SeeknDestroy : Adlib has his funny bone, per usual

kesmarn : Only when they really start to carry on during therapy, AdLib.

AdLib : No Seek! Don’t goo back, whatever you do!

javaz : HITO! Really? I’d never think that you were not a virgin. I am shocked, SHOCKED, I tell you,my world is crushed

SeeknDestroy : LOL

AdLib : Hmm…I wonder if psychiatrists will start charging patients for extra baggage?

HITO : Saw KQuark’s new av. He’s a youngen. Who knew?

SeeknDestroy : typo!

SeeknDestroy : Took me 16 years to lose mine….why goo back?

kesmarn : Or Virgin Airlines…charg e for carry on baggage?

HITO : I’m not a virgin.

PatsyT : Hi, Hi and Hi again to all!

javaz : LOL

AdLib : This is becoming a Virgin Megastore!

AdLib : Hi Kes!

javaz : I’m a born again virgin, just ask my husband

AdLib : Hito, I know, I was trying to say thanks for posting that and that there are no mods on The Planet.

kesmarn : Hey, everyone! Survived another week…whew…

HITO : Hi Kesmarn.

kesmarn : Have I stumbled into the Virgin’s Convention…? Wrong room…most def…

HITO : Adlib. I wasn’t inviting the hp mods here! Silly, was inviting the other kids on the thread.

PatsyT : Big day on the picket lines at the CUSD here in south Orange County!

HITO : Javaz, hmmmm, I just got rid of my uterus, but I don’t think I can become a virgin again. Tell me how?

AdLib : Hey Patsy!

AdLib : Mods not welcome on the Planet, Hito. Nice to see you.

SeeknDestroy : Hi PT!

HITO : Hi FunnyPatsy and Javaz. How are you crazy girls?

PatsyT : Hi everyone!

SeeknDestroy : Not av again…….hmmm mmmmm

javaz : We are virgins again, ask seek to explain!

javaz : HITO

AdLib : ROD SERLING: Witness several bloggers in a live chat. Suddenly realizing that they are chatting 40 years into the past. Time enough to warn of the dangers in the future ahead. They’ve just logged onto…The Twilight Zone!

javaz : Hi seek!

HITO : evening everyone, sorry I’m late. How cool was it that the mods at hp pended first, but then let it go to the top? time to visit another planet…you can have this thread back kids. or come with us over to planetpov for some live discussion…bri ng your brain. Adieu

SeeknDestroy : LOL–javaz…… HI there!

javaz : AdLib, really, do not burst my bubble, I like being a virgin, and my husband would take great pleasure too!

SeeknDestroy : Time Machine! The Don and Mike Show!

AdLib : javaz – That’s a quirk in the chat program! If you refresh the page it will say “1 minute ago”.

AdLib : Very cool! Looking forward to it!

javaz : last message on my screen says 40 years ago and 4 months! Yeah baby, 40 years and 4 months ago, I’d still be a virgin! Now we’re talking – it’s a time machine!

SeeknDestroy : Very good.Yourself?HI TO and I will be here shortly.

AdLib : How are you this evening?

SeeknDestroy : Hey Adlib!

AdLib : Hey Seek!

SeeknDestroy : lol

AdLib : Vox Populi begins shortly at 7:00 pm PST. Please join us for this live chat about the week’s events! You can chat on the sidebar of any page or on the full Vox Populi page, click on the following link to go there: «link»