Vox Populi – 5-24-2013

AdLib : Night!

funksands : Night buddy. Take care.

AdLib : Good, very glad it worked out and not surprised you had a thoughtful fallback position.

funksands : Oh, yes we pretty much got everything we wanted. If they are going to make him go back we had a strategy to get what we wanted. 3 days at his current school, 2 days at the high school with a 1 on 1 aide. Best that could have happened given the circumstances. We were really fortunate. Thanks for asking.

AdLib : Okay Funk, get some rest pal! Have a great hike and weekend!

funksands : Ad, get better and good luck on Tuesday. I am a pumpkin. Gotta get some shut-eye. Talk to you soon!

AdLib : Funk – Oh…so did they make a favorable decision or do you have to wait to hear?

AdLib : …turn around, I meant.

AdLib : Funk, very cool! Funny how things can turn away that way.

funksands : Individualized Education Plan. My oldest son’s school district is demanding he move back into the district. They don’t want to pay for his special school anymore.

funksands : We started going once we had kids. We thought it would teach them some lessons. Taught us a lot instead. We go back to see some of the same people. Very moving.

AdLib : IEP?

AdLib : Wow, that sounds like a great tradition!

funksands : We had our final IEP meeting with the district yesterday, so we’re just mentally and emotionally shot.

funksands : I hike up Mt. Si every Memorial Day weekend with friends. 4 miles up, 4 miles down. The weather isn’t going to be too hot though, so we may delay. That is not a hike to do in the rain. Bataan death march comes to mind. We usually go every other year to the Military Cemetery south of here. Its a really cathartic experience. My wife and I are exhausted right now though, so we may do nothing.

AdLib : What are you and the family up to this weekend, Funk?

AdLib : Thanks Funk! Either way, they’ve played great and made it to the Championship game so I’m happy.

funksands : That’s really cool. I’ll be sending positive vibes your way on Tuesday.

AdLib : 1st base and RC, she bats 5th, power hitter!

funksands : What position does your daughter play mostly?

AdLib : Funk – Assistant Coach, really cool that they’re peaking now while the top teams are freezing up.

funksands : Ad, that’s awesome. Are you coaching?

AdLib : Sleep well and feel better Murph!

funksands : Murph, have a good sleep my man. Hope you are feeling better.

AdLib : They came in 4th during the season, have won 3 straight playoff games and play for the championship on Tuesday so practice all this weekend.

MurphTheSurf3 : Well gang…..I must stay faithful to my promise to sleep more….on the road to recovery.

funksands : Championship? Sweeet! They have a shot?

AdLib : Baseball practice for daughter’s championship game.

funksands : Anyone here have any Memorial Day plans?

funksands : Night AB.

AdLib : Bacon shirt? Does that come with a pair of sausage pants?

AlphaBitch : OK boys. Next week same time? I have out of town company, but I’ll try to check in sooner. Lubs y’all.

funksands : Ad, no kidding.

funksands : Ha!

AlphaBitch : Here, let me lick that shirt off ya!

funksands : Made of bacon? That’s an awesome shirt.

AdLib : Funk – Seems to me that only someone mentally ill and a danger to stay in the US would want to return to a war zone!

AlphaBitch : Thanks MTS. Say wha, Funk?

AlphaBitch : Hey Funk – did you know cafe press has BACON tee shirts???? Saw them today when I was looking at offensive shirts for one of my chirren.

funksands : (Murph, she’s right here)

MurphTheSurf3 : AB- you are missed

funksands : Ad, no kidding. You’d think being excused from a war zone would be an acceptable hall pass to stay longer.

AdLib : Yes AB, change things pronto!!! Miss ya!

AlphaBitch : Yep. State is real leery about asylum. The kid works as an interpreter, for Cheese sake!

AlphaBitch : I’m turning into C’s big pumpkin and need to go to sleep. Just checked in. I love Fridays and VOX; just seldom home anymore. That needs to change pronto..

AdLib : AB – That’s ridiculous! Yet Cubans are justified exiles, Afghans aren’t?

AlphaBitch : But close…

AlphaBitch : Clueless, Funk.

funksands : “Classy In Action”?

AlphaBitch : Sure. I was an avid reader while working with the kids.

funksands : Night KT.

AlphaBitch : Night KT. Bed bugs and all that.

AdLib : Hey AB! Thanks for the reference material!

AlphaBitch : I’m sad. My last Afghan child was denied a visa because he had no “proof” he would return home after school. WEll DUH!

KillgoreTrout : Hello/good night AB, passing ships in the night. I’m going to call it quits and start on this weekends music thread.

AlphaBitch : Funk – I’m CIA babe.

AdLib : Night glenn, have a wonderful holiday weekend!

AlphaBitch : MTS: Both are great reads. Wright won the Pulitzer – scary stuff and I actually went to his home and got to see his research.

MurphTheSurf3 : Funk…I think your reading of the Muslim Left is accurate.

funksands : Night Glenn.

MurphTheSurf3 : AB thanks for the contribution. I will look into your source suggestions.

funksands : AB, stopping in to drop mic on us. LOL. Thank you nice lady.

KillgoreTrout : Have a great weekend glenn.

AlphaBitch : Funk – glad you are OK bro. Been over that bridge myself when we lived in Skeedaddle.

MurphTheSurf3 : Goodnight Glenn.

AlphaBitch : Hola Ebola! Interesting conversation. I recommend the book “The Looming Tower” by Lawrence Wright to look at the founding of the concept of Wahabism (a crazy dude from Egypt who looked like a toad – named Qutb or something) and the Reza Aslan book “No God but God” to get a great perspective on possible reformation. Now I’m off to sleep.

funksands : Murph, until the Muslim Left, (which exists) is given space and time enough to organize, I fear most muslims will continue to prefer and government like Iran. Secular, but with clerics that will step in when things get too liberal-ish.

glenn : Alright, my fellow Planeteers. Waaay past my bedtime, so I’m calling it a night. Thanks for all of the informative discussions. I always love coming here. A great Memorial Day to you all–let’s hope peace gets a chance soon in our world.

MurphTheSurf3 : OK ALL thanks for your thoughts on my requested topic.

KillgoreTrout : Ad took care of it.

AdLib : …it’s fantastic.

MurphTheSurf3 : KT what video are you trying to point out….can’t you list the url?

AdLib : glenn – Yes, it

MurphTheSurf3 : Funk…Al-Azhar al-Sharif institute in Cairo is the preeminent voice of Sunni Scholarship and it is silent on the murder of Egyptian Coptic Christians in the name of Allah. I don’t hold out much hope.

glenn : Ad–thanks for “rescuing” me again. Did you watch it? It actually made me cry the first time I watched it.

AdLib : glenn – Thanks, saw it. Perfect! Here’s the link: «link»

AdLib : Funk – Very interesting though I could only imagine how the extremists would fight any change like that with all they had.

KillgoreTrout : Murph, youtube videos won’t show up on VOX. I don’t know why.

MurphTheSurf3 : Ad Lib- think about how Islamic adherents have reacted to the publication of images of the Prophet, references to Allah, critiques of the Koran (or worse acts labeled as sacrilegious in the treatment of the book)….coverag e of “Days of Rage”, mass demonstrations, acts of retribution has often been couched as “not acceptable but we need to understand the genesis of the anger”. I am seeing a change in the coverage (especially in Europe). I watch a panel discussion of BBC1 a couple of days ago and a very moderate group shut down the usual assertion by an Islamic spokesperson that Islam is a religion of peace.

glenn : Funk/Ad–I just looked it up. I can’t seem to do links from YouTube (I’m technically semi-illiterate) , but I just got on YouTube and typed in “chasing away WBC with give peace a chance” and I got the video. It was in Santa Monica, CA

AdLib : And we will have to accept that loner/outcasts, whether Christian, Muslim, etc. will always be dangers. The Newtown shooter killed many people just as the Boston Marathon bombers did.

funksands : There’s a thread of “reformers” that are pushing the idea of a Sunni “Pope” to gather together the threads of the moderates, extremists, and traditionalists. Interesting idea.

AdLib : Murph – On the other hand, might it not give American Muslims the leading role in addressing the most destructive aspects of their religion?

funksands : Murph, that answers Glenn’s earlier question about what moderate muslims “do”. They move.

AdLib : glenn – Haven’t seen that video, will watch it. Peace is actually a pretty good thing.

KillgoreTrout : Thanks glenn, I’ll have to check that out.

MurphTheSurf3 : Ad Lib…I think you are correct about American Muslims. Which puts them into a real tight corner I think.

glenn : KT–On YouTube.

AdLib : It is a challenge when a religion in the 21st Century has the same kind of prohibition against talking about their religion as those in the distant past. How can you have a modern reformation of Islam with such an explosive tripwire intended to prevent it?

KillgoreTrout : glenn, very cool. Where did you see it?

glenn : Ad–“All we are saying is give peace a chance”. Loved that video of the high school kids chasing off the Westboro Baptist Church with that song playing in the background. I think the song was only in the video, but it sure was powerful.

KillgoreTrout : Ad, I completely forgot about Memorial Day. It sounds like a good theme. I’ll get started on it later tonight.

MurphTheSurf3 : Funk- I see your point. I would also point to the efforts by the modern Turks (Ataturk being the most important) and the North African socialist movement that Mohammad Mosaddegh represented. Both efforts have been rejected by most Islamic leaders in that part of the world.

AdLib : Murph – I would wonder though what percentage of Muslims in America are moderate, wouldn’t that be a majority?

funksands : Then Wahhab came on the scene and completely screwed everything up.

AdLib : KT – Since it’s Memorial Day Weekend, maybe songs about America, Vets and Peace?

KillgoreTrout : The whole idea of a one true god is what causes so much pain and strife in this world. It is antithetical to the concept of spirituality.

funksands : Murph, if you think about it, the Islamic reformation has already come and gone with the Ottomans.

MurphTheSurf3 : Glenn- there are 23 sects in Islam but their differences are largely a matter of rival leadership, geographic orientation, religious expression….no ne that I know of reflect the kind of modernist approach we are discussing. The American Islamic Council has made an effort to consider issues of Islamic life in the American secular society but these do not seem to address the matter at hand.

KillgoreTrout : I think interfaith efforts are a really good thing.

KillgoreTrout : My comment is for Ad.

glenn : Funk/Murph–Didn ‘t see your replies about Hashem Aghajari. It seems that change may be coming to Islam–albeit slowly and with a great deal of resistance. But isn’t that the way change always comes when dealing with religion(s)?

KillgoreTrout : Hey, I’m a bit stumped on this weekend’s music thread? Would you like to take the driver’s seat?

glenn : Murph–That is the heart of Islam, I know. So, how do fellow Muslims, or even those of who are not Muslims, go about dealing with that? I’m not entirely sure of this but isn’t there only one “sect” of Islam? For example, in the Christian religions, we have Catholics, Lutherans, Baptists, etc. Do some Muslims have to begin the “enlightenment ” of their religion? Is there anyone in the Muslim world capable of that? As I said, I don’t know much about Islam, except the basics of which you speak.

AdLib : I’m b-a-a-ack!

MurphTheSurf3 : Funk- I do. I became aware of him via my Muslim friends He is the kind of person I am looking for, but he paid a steep price for his work and has now been silenced forever (unless he can get out of Iran)

funksands : He gave a major speech in Tehran about the need for an “Islamic Protestantism”. It’s a really really good speech. He was also arrested for it and sentence to death. (commuted to only 5 years in prison).

MurphTheSurf3 : Funk- I know several Iranians who share the same experience- not happy with the tyranny under either the Shah or the Ayatollah.

funksands : Anyone remember the Iranian author Hashem Aghajari?

MurphTheSurf3 : Glenn- you are capturing the essence of the problem in your questions. It hasn’t been widely discussed- walking on eggs for fear of offending but Islam is being put into a corner by its adherents and is being seen as isolated from the common history of religion: development cross time; movements within it that seek new learning and adaption to a changing world; many points of revelation/disce rnment/prophecy. ….Judaism, Christianity, Hinduism, Buddhism all share this but not Islam.

funksands : Murph, their family fled when the Shah was deposed. They didn’t have too much use for the regime that followed.

KillgoreTrout : Absolutism is rarely a good thing, especially in religion.

MurphTheSurf3 : Glenn- one of the greatest problems is that at the heart of Islam is a belief that all revelation took place during the life of Muhammad and it is to be found in its entirety in the Quaran. No New Testament, no Reformation, no discernment of meaning beyond the traditional, no body of critical scholarship, and no leadership structure that can address any of this.

glenn : Murph–so if the people who speak against Islam are shunned, what do they think is the answer? I’m not trying to be a smartass, but if people of their own faith cannot speak critically, then people of other faiths speaking critically of Islam will not have any effect, either, right?

KillgoreTrout : Oh, I hadn’t heard about that until now. How awful.

MurphTheSurf3 : KT- the attack, hacking to death, and beheading of the British soldier on the streets of London-it has apparently popped a festering national boil.

MurphTheSurf3 : Funk- and I suspect those Iranian/Persian friends are very careful about what they say to whom. In much of the Muslim world any critique of Islam is punishable (either formally or informally) and those who did it are shunned.

glenn : Murph–I agree. There are way too many in the Muslim community who are “holy warriors for the faith.” But, how do we deal with this? Is there a way for moderate Mulims to get through to their more fundamentalist brethen? I mean, in a way, isn’t that the same problem we have here in the U.S. with our extremists on the right? My idealism leads me to believe that education is the key, but how do we educate people who don’t want to be educated? Or, how do we get them to believe in moderate (or even modern) education when they are promised heaven if they kill infidels? What does your Muslim friend think is the answer?

KillgoreTrout : Murder?

MurphTheSurf3 : KT- yes. My friend is a doctor, a hematologist and oncologist, and he admits that the model for Muslim faith in much of the world requires a willingness to disdain the world of reason, of science, of earnest dialogue, of critique, of openness to others…..we spoke shortly after the murder and he said that this issue is one which his community is trying to handle without much success.

funksands : Murph, we have some Iranian friends that say much the same thing as your friend.

KillgoreTrout : Murph, I definitely agress with that. If it wasn’t for the great thinkers and risk takers of the Age of Reason, we’d still be in the Middle Ages…so to speak.Without a reverence for science, any nation will remain behind.

glenn : KT–Yup–that’s the one. I forgot the r/tp “re-branding” of that war.

KillgoreTrout : You mean that “war of Northern aggression?” Even though it the south that started that war.

MurphTheSurf3 : Glenn- read my response to Ad Lib and see what you think.

glenn : Hell, KT–the idea that the Deep South LOST the Civil War, much less the recent presidential election hasn’t taken hold.

MurphTheSurf3 : Ad Lib…here is the problem. I spoke with a Muslim friend and he was frank. There are many Muslims worldwide whose Islamic faith is fundamentalist- in fact he said the number of “modern” Muslims is relatively small (he thinks that 25 to 30 percent is realistic). Now of the those who are fundamentalist, how many are “terrorist” oriented- not many, but still when compared with other religious groups, the numbers are significant (holy warriors for the faith). He told me that Islam has not had a reformation, an enlightenment and that this hampers its efforts to deal with the modern world and to to deal with those whose purpose is to bring it down. It was a startling conversation.

glenn : Murph–I can understand the reaction of the Brits to this horrific crime. I think, though, that we have to begin reacting to individuals as criminals–not blame their ethnicity. People are still looking for simple solutions to complicated problems–unempl oyment, lack of education, lack of hope, and continued divisiveness among the “haves” and “havenots”. Similar to Ad’s recent article about that.

KillgoreTrout : People from northeastern cities and rural areas too, are more accustomed to diversity. Sure, there are exceptions, but I think in the deep south, the idea of diversity being a good thing just won’t, or hasn’t taken hold.

AdLib : BRB! Keep the convo going, will return in a couple minutes!

AdLib : Murph – We haven’t talked about it yet but yes, I think the combination of the Boston bombings, the London killing and a variety of other arrests of Muslims planning attacks is having a devastating impact on the attitudes towards Muslims. It is of course as unfounded as claiming all white men are child murderers because of Newtown but fear is often followed by hatred. I don’t think it’s fair that the 99% of good folk who are Muslims have to convince the public not to brand them terrorists but they may need to make some effort…prejudi ce is insidious.

MurphTheSurf3 : Glenn- the experience of “Christian” terrorism, violence, anger is far more muted, and the examples of actual action rare. Europe has experienced a lot of violence related to this.

glenn : KT–I guess I’m still a “jersey girl” at heart–even though I haven’t lived in NJ for over 50 years!

glenn : Murph–“Moderat e Muslims have to find a way to deal with their extremist cousins effectively or their credibility will be entirely gone.” While I agree with this, why aren’t they calling on “moderate Christians” to do the same? At least in this country. I’m not sure about how much religion is pushing the right in Britain and Europe.

KillgoreTrout : Absolutely comparable to what Jackie Robinson went through, only even more, because Obama he the top job in America.

KillgoreTrout : glenn, you’re not a willfully ignorant redneck.

AdLib : KT – Sad but true for all those who are the first. Obama, like Jackie Robinson has to take insults and indignities and not return them but act as if he’s not bothered by being treated like a lesser person.

glenn : KT–I just don’t understand that thing about the white power structure. I’m white, and I truly don’t care what color you are, as long as you have policies and ideas that I can see are good for me, as well as the country. Call me selfish, but I just don’t get that “white power structure” thing–I just want sane people in office–no matter what color, or even political party, they are.

MurphTheSurf3 : Ad, KT, Funk, Sally, Glenn…have you all talked about the murder in London yet? I have many British connections and what I am hearing is that the attack has lit a fuse. Anger against Islam is at fever pitch even among those whose natural positioning is liberal. The basic point: Moderate Muslims have to find a way to deal with their extremist cousins effectively or their credibility will be entirely gone. There are calls for an international revisionist movement that shapes a modern and moderate Muslim experience. Much of Europe is abuzz abut this and the huge number of murders of coptic christians in Egypt has now been linked to it. Any thoughts.

AdLib : glenn – Indeed, the amount of pure hatred and blatant hypocrisy these loons on the far right have displayed has made them toxic in the majority’s eyes. I think it will be a long time until the Repubs have a real shot at winning the Presidency again. Who wants their hateful vision of America as a reality?

KillgoreTrout : Very true Ad. That’s why so many gun nuts are fighting so hard to keep their assault weapons and high capacity mags.

AdLib : KT – As we’ve called it before, the Cold Civil War has now become front and center, no longer is the white vs. minorities social war in America beneath the surface.

KillgoreTrout : Obama has to work twice as hard and be twice as virtuous due to the naysayers and prognosticators who say, see, we told you a black man wasn’t qualified and never will be.Even here in the 21st century, we have far too many people taht see black Americans as inferior to whites.

glenn : Ad–not only just Muslims, but Democrats, Latinos, blacks, and anybody else who is “not proud” of our country. I just “love” the way that whenever there is an article about FLOTUS, at least five of the righties bring up her statement about being proud of her country for the first time in her life, but they tear down the country at every opportunity and say how “ashamed” of this country they are, and don’t even recognize President Obama as “their” president! It’s becoming more and more obvious how stupid they are, so I guess we can thank the MSM for that, at least!

KillgoreTrout : glenn, their base is made up of people who want to hold on to the white power structure. They gladly believe anything their GOP masters tell, but it supports their prejudice.

AdLib : glenn – That’s it, if Repubs attack our government or threaten armed rebellion against it, they’re patriots. If Muslims did it, they’re terrorists.

AdLib : glenn – The sad truth is that until 2015, we simply don’t have a House that serves any constructive purpose for America. So we have to really try and take back the house in 2014.

glenn : Ad–yup–and drowning the government in the bathtub is the same as “death to America”, but the base is either too stupid or too obstinate (or both) to see it!

AdLib : Funk – A D+ in infrastructure? That seems to be on a par with most of the Repubs school grades, they probably see that as improvement.

KillgoreTrout : So many Chicken Littles in the GOP and media. The sky is falling, the sky is falling. They admit to wanting the president to fail, and when things don’t get done they say he is incompetent. What slease bags they are.

AdLib : Glad to hear you’re feeling better, Murph!

funksands : BRB

AdLib : KT – Nope, the Repubs are trying to have it every way. Obama is evil for using drones but terrorists should be killed wherever they are. Obama is evil for keeping prisoners in Guantanamo but they should be kept there forever because those Muslims want to kill us. They clearly hate anything Obama says or does but when they say the same thing, it’s fine.

glenn : Dems and/or Independents really do need to gain control of the House so we can get things moving again in this country. I hate waiting until 2015, though–why oh why can’t we get moving now? (Another rhetorical question).

MurphTheSurf3 : Ad Lib…much better….doctor s, some treatments, extra rest…back on my feet.

AdLib : Funk – If that’s not traitorous, I don’t know what is.

funksands : Hey Murph.

funksands : Here’s our infrastructure report card: «link»

AdLib : Hey Murph! Great to see ya! How are you feeling?

AdLib : glenn – Yep, that’s the pro-white double standard that Repubs are fighting to retain. They can vow, “Death to America’s Government!” because they’re white, no one else can.

MurphTheSurf3 : feeling much better, thank you all very much.

glenn : Hey Murph–are you feeling better? Saw you were “out and about” earlier in the week.

KillgoreTrout : Murph, how goes it?

MurphTheSurf3 : So wassup y’all?

KillgoreTrout : What gets me (this week)is the big flap about drones and Americans being targeted overseas. First the GOPers try to paint the president as being “soft on terrorism (because he’s a secret Muslim) now they whining becuse our drones are taking out terrorist. They think traitors still should be proyected by our constitution. They think American terrorist who join al aida still deserve due process of the law. Frickin amazing.

funksands : $4.4T in unfilled capacity in the US since the downturn. Due to unemployment and lack of government spending. We could have rebuilt our entire country with free money. And we wasted that once in an lifetime opportunity squandered. They should be in jail

glenn : KT–You know, it never ceases to amaze me that those on the right can say things like the radio host who wants to shoot Hillary Clinton in the vagina, and that President Obama should be shot, or the foxso-callednews bimbo who said that people should punch Obama voters in the face. These things are okay, but should one Muslim voice criticism of the United States, then the Muslims are “evil” and must be stopped.

AdLib : glenn – What’s the difference between a terrorist blowing up a bridge and a Repub House denying money to prevent a bridge from collapsing? To those driving on the bridge when it collapses and those dealing with the bridge being destroyed, I don’t think there is one. So if a=b and b=c, Repubs are terrorists.

KillgoreTrout : glenn, I agree. Actually they ARE terrorists considering the job of a terrorist is to spread fear. Fearmongering is one of the biggest tools in the GOP tool baox.

AdLib : KT – The Repubs are such liars. Beginning when he took office in 2009, he did indeed bend over backwards to compromise with Repubs and they made him look like a fol for doing it. Then in 2012, they attacked him for saying mean things about them…and not being bipartisan! Most Americans know what the GOP smells of and it comes from a cow’s backside.

funksands : So what now? It seems like Congress is resigned that nothing is going to happen until 2015.

glenn : KT–I’ve always said that the r/tp’s were verging on treason. I think they have done more damage to our country than terrorists!

KillgoreTrout : Ad, LOL!

funksands : Ad, that makes more sense. I hadn’t seen that.

KillgoreTrout : Even after Obama has bent over backwards to work WITH the GOPers, they still are determined to see him fail. I think it verges on treason. If the president fails, our country fails too.

AdLib : Funk – I read that it had already been damaged by other trucks banging into it before this one.

glenn : Funk–I second AdLib–glad you’re okay!

AdLib : KT – I thought “bupkis” was Latin for “Nada”!

funksands : Seriously. Bridge was built in 1955. A truck hitting that support should NOT have taken it down. That was one of the good bridges too.

glenn : KT–I naively thought that when President Obama won re-election, r/tp’s would face reality and start working–just start working. Boy was I wrong. Seems to me it’s gotten worse. I do believe they have lost their minds!

KillgoreTrout : I read that a big truck slammed into one of the supports. Luckily, no one was killed.

AdLib : Funk – Glad you’re okay! Thank goodness the Repubs cut or blocked money to pay for security at embassies and repairs of our bridges and roads. That means, it’s Obama’s fault.

KillgoreTrout : Bupkis? Isn’t that Zionist lingo?

funksands : Not bad KT, a little freaked about that bridge, I drove across it on Monday!!

AdLib : Hey Funk! I think it’s more of the case of, “That’s all we got on Obama! Bupkis!”

KillgoreTrout : Hey funk! How goes it?

funksands : Wow! Glenn that sounds really cool. I love all of the color!

glenn : Ad–that too–never getting an honest answer!

glenn : Funk–good evening. Oh, I did different colors in almost every room. Yellow and red and purple (both light and dark) and a deep pink and a chartreuse (yes chartreuse) and a calming blue in my bedroom, with a lighter blue ceiling. They just make me so happy! I know I sound like an idiot, but it’s such a difference!

KillgoreTrout : The GOP is so obvious in their attempts to slur this administraion, namely, Obama and the Fist Lady. The GOPers just can’t handle seeing a black couple in a White House. It makes them crazy, or crazier.

funksands : I’m really impressed with the evolution of the GOP House. They used to just investigate blow-jobs, Christmas Cards and bad land deals. These scandals are positively statesmanlike in comparison

AdLib : glenn – Maybe it’s because you know you’d never get an honest answer from a Repub?

glenn : KT–why is it that when ask questions about the r/tp’s they are rhetorical ones? I asked a couple of those rhetorical questions myself earlier tonight. Maybe that’s what the “R” by their names stands for–rhetorical!

KillgoreTrout : Yeah, a new coat of paint can do wonders. I repainted my apartment last year. Made a world of difference.

funksands : Glenn, what color?

AdLib : glenn – I like the reverse psychology approach. Obama should propose bills to increase carbon pollution, cut SS and Medicare and outlaw Single Payer. The Repubs would pass bills for the opposite then he could just drop the charade and sign them!

glenn : KT–I’m just great! I have a bright and happy house, thanks to my new paint! It just makes me so happy!

KillgoreTrout : I think there were 54 embassy attacks from 2001-2007. Why weren’t the repubs whining then? Rhetorical question.

funksands : Good evening ladies and gents

glenn : Ad–I think Dems should campaign for more cuts–that way the r/tp’s would have to come out to oppose them. Then the r/tp’s would be the “spenders.” At least that’s the way it seems to work nowadays–if the Dems are for it–no matter what “it” is, r/tp’s are against it.

AdLib : glenn – You’re better informed on the alleged Benghazi “coverup” than most Repubs. There is no scandal, just the deception that there is one. The Repubs are alleging a scandal without having one fact to prove there is one…so they altered WH emails to create one themselves! That was the end of any credibility.

KillgoreTrout : Pretty good glen, and you?

glenn : Hey KT–how are you?

AdLib : Thanks pal, that’s a great suggestion!

glenn : Ad–thanks for the link. That just proves my point about the media. Those results should be all over the news. Again, where are the people who are defending those cuts? Or better yet, opposing them? Now, I must admit I haven’t watched much news lately–I got so confused about what the cover-up was with Benghazi. Was it the talking points? Was it because President Obama wasn’t in the situation room immediately? And the IRS “scandal”–esp ecially when I found out Issa had been informed by the IRS all along. I swear, I just can’t keep it straight any more. Even the AP scandal has me confused…was it legal or not?

KillgoreTrout : HeyAd. Have a hot Toddy for that cold.

AdLib : Hey KT! A good evening to you!

AdLib : So, when the Repubs campaign on more cuts in 2014, do they rally their troops or thin them out?

KillgoreTrout : What’s up Planet peeps?

AdLib : Yep, check out this story: «link» Here’s a quote: “Among that group, self-identified Republicans say they have been most affected. An astounding 46 percent of Republicans have felt the effects of the sequester, compared with just 32 percent of Democrats. Perhaps unsurprisingly, just 39 percent of Republicans support the cuts, compared with 54 percent who oppose them. That’s a significant change from a March WaPo/ABC poll, which found that only 27 percent of Republicans said they had been affected by the cuts. Among Republicans, the number of respondents who “strongly disapprove” of the cuts has climbed 8 percentage points in the past two months.”

glenn : Ad–I didn’t know that more r/tp’s are claiming it is hurting them. That’s really good news. I agree, they won’t turn Dem or even Independent, but perhaps they will sit out the elections. That’s a good thing.

AdLib : glenn – Couldn’t agree more! Look at how CNN is in a nosedive because they’ve tried to go Full Metal Exploitative. If a media outlet was committed solely to getting the truth out and focusing on what really matters to Americans, they would be incredibly and uniquely successful. The corporate talk shows that now pass for news shows are just plain pathetic.

glenn : Ad–I also think the MSM has heard for so long how they are “carrying President Obama’s water” that they think they have to report on these scandals in order to be “fair and balanced.” The media are copying foxso-callednews just to get ratings. That..and the fact that most media outlets are corporate owned. That..and the fact that news is no longer considered “loss leaders”. If it loses money, it can’t be tolerated. IMO, if a media outlet actually tried true journalism, they would gain more readers and/or viewers, and news would no longer be a loss leader.

AdLib : glenn – The silver lining to the sequestration pain is that more Repubs claim it is hurting them than Dems. Regular Repub members are recognizing that they are being hammered by the destructive policies of their own party. I don’t expect most of these people to switch to Dem or even oppose the GOP but it could really depress turnout in 2014…especiall y if the pitch is, “Do you want more of what’s happening in DC under Repubs?”

AdLib : I do think the public gets what’s going on though, they know they can’t trust much of the MSM considering how many false stories have come out recently and they know the Repubs are blocking everything and just trying to build up one scandal after another. So we have a Tale of Two Realities, the MSM/GOP Bubble and the reality the rest of us live day in and day out.

glenn : Ad–I know. Why aren’t we seeing 24/7 reporting of how quickly the deficit is shrinking? Or why aren’t r/tp’s taking credit for reducing the deficit because of sequestration? I wouldn’t believe them, but I bet the base would. They should be shouting from the rooftops how approximately 37% of the U.S. is suffering from sequestration, but bygod, they’ve almost gotten rid of that pesky 47% they always complain about. Only 10% more to go, and we’d have a “perfect union”. Isn’t that what they’ve been telling us for the past five years? Cowards–all of them. If this shit was so good for the country–why aren’t they talking about that? BTW, those are rhetorical questions.

AdLib : glenn – Yes, that was really brought to a boil with Cheney leaking the WMD in Iraq BS to the NYT then attributing those lies to the NYT. The MSM now no longer needs to verify any story, if it’s sensational, who cares if it’s true, as long as it brings in more viewers and more ad dollars.

AdLib : Meanwhile, our country falls apart, bridges fall and we’re seeing 24/7 “news” about IRS audits that didn’t harm anyone just because it’s a great vehicle to attack Obama? WTF?

glenn : Ad–I really am sick of our so-called journalists nowadays. So much of what passes for journalism is reporting on what another network or reporter said or did. It’s not facts–it’s just becoming an endless loop of s/he said/s/he said something else. Drives me crazy!

AdLib : glenn – Not a worry at all! I agree with the sentiment!

glenn : Ad–WOW–did I get that wrong! Just as bad as the tbaggers in rewriting history. I’ll try to look things up or ask the next time I want to make an historical reference!

AdLib : glenn – And what about the MSM playing all of these BS scandals up while the important things are ignored?! The economy is less important than Repubs having a show trial over Benghazi…with doctored emails? Really? The American public ain’t buying it!

glenn : Ad–all of those things you listed–the economy, Wall St., deficit, unemployment–ar e exactly the reasons we have scandalgate, IMO. The r/tp’s certainly don’t want to focus on those things because, as one of them said, “we don’t want to make the President look good.”

AdLib : glenn – “Never again” is often associated with The Holocaust. As for letting the Repubs win by default again, especially these Baggers, I do think a lesson was well learned in 2010.

AdLib : Meanwhile, the economy is improving, the deficit is shrinking, unemployment is going down and Wall Street is going up. That’s what’s going to make the difference and it’s in Obama’s and the Dems’ favor right now (though it could change…but Repubs will likely be blamed more for blocking progress).

glenn : Ad–I agree about getting Dems activated and energized. I’m all for adopting the Alama slogan–“never again”. (At least, I think that came from the Alamo. Never again will I sit out a mid-term election–or even a local one, for that matter. That’s the only thing I admire about r/tp’s. They do seem to be organized and activated for the state, local, and midterms.

AdLib : glenn – The polls don’t reflect that the public is buying the BS about the “scandals” or tying it to Obama/ And as time goes by, each of the scandals and the alleged connection to Obama fall apart. So no, in the end, I don’t think they’ll have any effect on voters in general.

AdLib : The Baggers are still front and center in The House and the GOP, look at the VA races for Gov, Lt. Gov and AG, all RW extremists. Can they win? Even against such a tool as Terry McCauliffe? I don’t think so.

glenn : Ad–how do you think “scandalgate” (choose one) will play out in 2014? Will the r/tp’s have a new one by then? Or will America have forgotten by then? Somehow, I think all the so-called scandals will be repeated ad nauseum in r/tp ads.

AdLib : glenn – We’re going to have to get Dems energized and activated to throw out the Repubs and I think the Repubs are sure helping on that front. I’d suggest that the DNC run 2014 as a national election, all about pulling away control of the House from the Baggers and getting 2 years of good works done. That’s a powerful message!

glenn : Ad–I can only hope you’re correct about r/tp’s losing in 2014. I was worried about the presidential election, but you were correct (I won’t say you were right–too much negativity associated with that word), so I’m “hopping on your bandwagon”. I do know I won’t sit out the 2014 elections, especially not here in GA. Although the Dems don’t seem to have a strong candidate–as usual.

AdLib : If control of the House could swing Dem? Wow…

AdLib : There does seem to be a cementing of the GOP civil war, get the popcorn, it’s going to get nasty…especial ly if the Repubs lose in 2014 as I think they will.

glenn : Okay, Mitch works for me, too.

glenn : So…which republican/tpart ier shall we “discuss” tonight? I think Cruz is becoming my new “fave”–with the way he’s ripping into the repubs!

AdLib : I plan to blame someone for getting this cold, I’m thinking Mitch McConnell.

glenn : Sorry to hear about your cold. Those spring colds are bummers!

AdLib : Heh! Boy, a change in paint can make a huge difference!

glenn : I’m well,thanks. Got rid of all the “turkeyturdtan ” paint in my house, and it’s now a bright and happy place!

AdLib : Doing okay, fending off a head cold.

glenn : How are you Ad?

AdLib : glenn – So true! How are you this evening?

glenn : America’s bridges are falling down. What a shame and a disgrace!

AdLib : Don’t forget to say “hi” or “America’s Bridges are Falling Down!” when you arrive!

AdLib : Vox Populi, our live chat about the week’s events begins tonight at 7 pm PST. Hope to see you then!!!