AdLib : Heh! Take car KQ and sleep well. Thanks to you and Sally and everyone else for a rousing edition of Vox Populi! See you on The Planet and hopefully here again next Friday night!

KQµårk 死神 : Alright my head is starting to feel like your gravatar AdLib. Take care good night.

AdLib : KQ – You’re right, even if Obama wins big over Romney as I think he will, I would see 6% as a huge margin of victory.

KQµårk 死神 : Sally what AdLib said. I could not have said it better.

KQµårk 死神 : Sally I would never presume to tell you which side is good or bad but I will give you my opinion when I come up with it some day.

AdLib : Sally – It’s far too complex for there to be a good or bad guy. Historically, there are good arguments that can be made for why each has validity in their conflict. Bottom line for me as of right now though is that the Palestinians, who do have terrorists and terrible people marbled among good and suffering people, are being horribly oppressed by the Israelis out of fear. There are extremists on both sides who are hateful and prejudiced but the majority of both want peace. As here in he US, a minority of extremists seem to dictate for the majority of Israelis and Palestinians and have a vested interest in keeping the conflict going because without it, they would lose power.

KQµårk 死神 : Sleep well Sally.

KQµårk 死神 : Agreed AdLib no matter what is holding them back you would hope they consider things in a reasonable manner. I just don’t think in this political environment a Dem could win by more than 8-10% like in the 60′s and before that.

SallyT : Good night KQ. See on here later!

KQµårk 死神 : Yes and part of that control is for 35-40% (just an arbitrary range of figures) of those type of people that would never ever consider voting for a Democrat. If they did consider voting Dem they would admit they cannot control their lives.

SallyT : I still want you guys to tell me if Irasel is the good guy always and Palestine are the bad guys. I need you to debate that for me sometime.

AdLib : KQ – In the end, I am hoping that the election this year will be a referendum on ignorance and I think Americans will reject it.

AdLib : We’re right with ya, Sally! Sleep well!

SallyT : And, you both have left me behind. So, I will call it an evening and leave you two.

AdLib : KQ – Right, I see what you’re saying! There is tht control issue on the right and the left, on the left we have politically correct people and Emoprogs, on the right you have fascists.

KQµårk 死神 : Agreed AdLib we are talking about different aspects of the same phenomenon. It is interesting how people get to the same philosophy from different angles though.

AdLib : KQ – It’s semantics as to what it’s called but we’re agreed. People do compartmentalize and can be hypocritical with no awareness of it. People can be against racism but be prejudiced against a different religion, believe in science but believe in Creationism, etc. There are those who are truly ignorant then there are those who wall off an area of their mind from critical thought because of their need to believe something.

SallyT : And, you don’t buy things on time unless it is farm equipment.

KQµårk 死神 : The best analogy I can think of is how a scientist like a chemist wants to understand nature. That’s a big part of our motivation. Whereas chemical engineers who are usually more conservative have a desire to control nature like the flow and other physical behaviors of chemicals.

SallyT : I know my parents thought you should have one credit card for emergrancy but no more.

SallyT : I think to many of the people that made it through the depression weren’t around anymore to say, “HEY! BECAREFUL!”

AdLib : Sally – Good point and I think that instead of greed, it was that brain washing that helped cause people to get upside down in their home through borrowing. I think many were thinking, “It finally happened! The American dream finally happened for me and this is the money I get to have and spend!” The Depression generation likely made up a small percentage of that, I’ll bet many older folk still owe little on their homes.

KQµårk 死神 : Exactly and I can’t call that scientist ignorant because they know the facts behind evolution. Now you can call ignoring facts ignorance but it’s a little different than that. I still think it’s more of a need for some people to rationalize everything around them to fit into nice tiny compartments. That’s why I think control is such an issue with most conservatives.

AdLib : there

AdLib : KQ – As a scientist, you can appreciate that their are some scientists who also believe in Creationism. These are people who are very intelligent but as you say, they have a blind spot when it comes to certain things. I would suggest that it is a perfect illustration of the difference between being unintelligent and being ignorant.

SallyT : AdLib, many people were fooled in thinking they were making it by 2nd mortgages on their homes. They never were going to make that lump sum ever in a paycheck.

KQµårk 死神 : See AdLib to me that’s not ignorance viewing the world through the pursuit of money and power. That to me is a choice they make. The primal part is the need for control people like Romney have.

AdLib : Sally – And people are brainwashed with “The American Dream” and “In America, if you work hard enough, you too could be a millionaire!” As I mentioned earlier, the odds are 99.9% against any typical American being a millionaire…an d yet many believe it without having the slightest idea of how it could happen for them despite the odds.

KQµårk 死神 : IDK I know the difference between ignorance and just not being intelligent. But there is a special blind spot with some people who have incredible intelligence. I think it really is a core belief to them for whatever reason and they spin their world toward that belief even knowing the real world at some level.

AdLib : Sally – Yep, the GOP deals with everything through money-colored glasses. Romney will probably agree to pay off Newt’s campaign debts or something and Newt will be there, smiling beside Romney an attacking the “Food Stamp President”. But deep down, he will be snarling at how he was stabbed in the back by his party and sliced apart by Romney and his money.

SallyT : There was a time when everyone thought they could be the Charlie Sheen character in Wall Street.

SallyT : But, I see your point, AdLib. They will apease him somehow.

AdLib : KQ – Delusion seems to me to be based on ignorance. Certainly, fear can be a motivator but a several years ago, a majority of entitled-minded college graduates believed they would be millionaires…j ust because they had such high opinions of themselves. No fear, just ignorance.

KQµårk 死神 : I thought that would happen earlier than later AdLib but remember this was the guy that held up the budget out of spite because Clinton put him in the back of AF1.

SallyT : He sure seemed hot at that one gathering. Didn’t have anything good to say about the establishment/GO P.

KQµårk 死神 : Sally Newt is beyond pissed and he might just keep running out of spite.

AdLib : Newt may be pissed at the GOP but they will throw him a bone, at least offering him money in some way through consulting or something and he’ll come together with Romney at the convention. It will be the most uncomfortable thing for an egoist like Newt though and will be well worth the price of admission to see his forced smile at Romney.

KQµårk 死神 : True AdLib and there are the low level delusions and hither lever ones. But they are all based on primal fears and control issues.

SallyT : AdLib and KQ, will Newt get pissed at the GOP?

AdLib : KQ – It is easy just to delude oneself. “Hey, ROmney wants me to be a millionaire too! Don’t have to consider how few people ever become millionaires or how it could happen to a truck driver like me, that’s what I want to believe so it’s true!”

KQµårk 死神 : All I can tell you about Israel is with the Lukid party and Netanyahu in charge they are even more right wing when it comes to war than the GOP.

SallyT : You can tell that there are people out there that you can’t reach like that old lady still believing Obama is a Muslim.

AdLib : BTW, Intrade has Romney with a 91% chance of winning FL. The wheels really came off of Newt in the last debate, I think he’s finished but he served his purpose well…for Dems!

KQµårk 死神 : It’s all the same family of mental processes AdLib. The ironic part is it takes much more brain power to rationalize because you have to fool your own senses.

SallyT : I know Irasel is brought up all the time. Every debate, too.

AdLib : KQ – The GOP is one big delusional machine for the many and cash machine for the 1%.

KQµårk 死神 : Sally I am a total neophyte compared to Khirad on the middle east.

AdLib : It’s a deal, Sally, I’ll do the best I can.

KQµårk 死神 : The whole GOP is one big rationalizing machine.

SallyT : Okay, you two, I am serious that one night you two and Khirad educate me in Israel and Palestine.

KQµårk 死神 : Sally never assume the conservative mind is logical. That’s the mistake liberals always make about them.

AdLib : Just for your amusement, Intrade has Obama with nearly a 55% chance of re-election…an d he hasn’t even started his full campaign! He will be re-elected but we will have to work hard to fight against the hundreds of millions the 1% will use to defeat him.

SallyT : I agree, AdLib. I just can’t understand why there would be more that would want to go backwards.

KQµårk 死神 : Of course the other side will say all Obama’s policies failed if the economy flatlines during the election too.

KQµårk 死神 : AdLib I guess that’s why my mind says if Obama does win it’s by allot.

SallyT : I know he had been the Gov of CA but most of the country still saw him as “Win one for the Gibber.” sp???

KQµårk 死神 : Sally absolutely and that’s why he’s revered so much today. Because he accomplished very little.

AdLib : Sally – Look at what the GOP is stuck with, they want to strip out regulations from the very people who destroyed the economy and took away the jobs and home equity from many Americans. They want insurance companies to be free to have control again over Americans. They want the wealthy to pay less taxes, the poor to pay more and the middle class to get virtually nothing. How can you run on that and win? You can’t so they’ll have to fabricate an Obama they can attack and all that negative campaigning, which is all they have, will also help sink them.

SallyT : Sometimes I think that there were people that voted for Reagan because he was a movie star and liked the roles he played.

KQµårk 死神 : Actually I’m saying Obama is like Reagan. He is personally popular.

KQµårk 死神 : Oh Sally I’m trying to get in their heads too not yours.

SallyT : But Romney is no Reagan.

KQµårk 死神 : The last election like this where the incumbent did not turn the economy around at this point was 1984 with Reagan and his personal popularity was high. I think this could be allot like that election. For some reason I see Obama winning in a virtual landslide or losing. I don’t know why.

SallyT : I know KQ, I am not arguing with you just with them.

AdLib : All the trends are in the right direction and Obama’s numbers rise with them. If they continue and there is a general sense in the financial community that they will, barring a European economic disaster or elsewhere, Obama will be golden. Especially against a pro-Bush policy loser like Romney.

SallyT : So they want to give it back to the guys that caused the bank mess and threaten more wars?

KQµårk 死神 : Sally the electorate has the attention span of a gnat. Even so most people do see Bush as the one who made the economy fail. They just are not sure yet if Obama did enough to turn it around yet.

SallyT : What Repub Presdent balanced the budget?

AdLib : Romney can’t even find a way to appeal to those not in the 1% in his own party! So how is he going to appeal to indies? He will flip flop again and put on a new persona as a moderate but the footage from the primary will only expose the charade.

KQµårk 死神 : AdLib I’m with you I’m really trying to see how Romney could appeal to anyone but rich Republicans and I can’t. But I think that’s a problem.

AdLib : KQ – Agree and I think Obama’s stand on the 1% paying their fair share, as much as the white working class and ROmney trying to present the 1% as entitled to privilege, will burn Romney with indies.

KQµårk 死神 : To me Obama has to expose Romney for the elitist he is and just stop some of the hemorrhaging of the white working class with Dems.

AdLib : I truly don’t see any substance to Romney and I don’t think most do. Even with an economy weakening, what case can Romney make to say things will be better for anyone other than the top 1%? If his credibility is hammered and destroyed, as it should be, he is disarmed from presenting anything that could be respected or believed. That’s why I think hammering his dishonesty and hollowness is primary for Obama.

SallyT : Can’t independents see how we got into this mess? Can’t they see that it is going to take time to get it turned? Cant they see we are not falling back but moving forward. And can’t they see Romney would do just that, take us back?

KQµårk 死神 : Sally I wish I knew but keep in mind allot of them are ex-Republican moderates so I hate to say things like balancing the budget are important to them.

SallyT : Okay, if you two are staying with me. Tell me what do Independents want in a President?

AdLib : KQ – Yep, I was and remain a big fan of Dean but Rahm despised him, wanting to take all the credit for Obama’s and the Dem’s wins in 2008 for himself so Dean was treated badly and tossed aside, with no involvement in the party or Obama Admin. Would like to see him in there somewhere.

AdLib : Night Cher, say hello to your hubby for me and have a great weekend!

KQµårk 死神 : Absolutely AdLib DWS is a quantum leap better of course Dean was a pioneer though.

AdLib : Night Chris, sleep well!

AdLib : Chris – I am in complete agreement with you! Howard Dean made it possible for Obama to win and the Dem party to win huge victories in 2008. I do think Debbie Wasserman Schultz is doing a good job (far better than that DLC loser Tim Kaine who only helped the Repubs win in 2010).

SallyT : KQ and AdLib, you guys staying or going.

SallyT : Goodnight Cher and Chris.

KQµårk 死神 : Dunno AdLib we would truly be in uncharted territory.

Chernynkaya : Guys, hubby is calling for some company. I must regretfully say goodnight. Be good!

ChrisR266 : Well, must sign off all. Have a wonderful, relaxing weekend.

KQµårk 死神 : I really think the right has to really split for that to happen AdLib but that is a possibility. Without Paul the GOP could split to teabagger libertatian and GOP establishment.

AdLib : KQ – The economy is important but I think it’s more of a pundit thing to say that it depends on the economy. Will most indies trust Romney to look out for their interests just because the economy doesn’t continue as desired? I think it is far more about having an unacceptable alternative and that’s what Romney is. Even with a weakened economy, I think Obama beats Romney.

Chernynkaya : AL, I too share the belief sometimes that we will look back at this time and say, “What the fuck was THAT all about?!” It will seem like one of our bad times, and it will seem impossible to comprehend.

SallyT : True, Chris. But, Gingrich has other baggage. He does seem to get pass most, tho

KQµårk 死神 : Cher I’m with you. I still see too many independents buying the GOP schtick.

ChrisR266 : Sally: Indeed, but he doesn’t see himself as the same, no one was ragging on him in the 90s. I really think he sees himself as another Clinton, teflon.

AdLib : KQ – The GOP could be hammered down enough to become a minority party though. Fox will still appeal to those but just as Glenn Beck had his day in the sun, Fox News too could lose its attraction to anyone other than the RW extremists and though there might be 35% of them moving forward, it could be that they become more of a minority party.

SallyT : KQ, it is and that makes me nervous.

Chernynkaya : Well, to me the polling is not that clear. I see the polls that seem to show that the public is waking up, bu then i see polls–like the one saying 56% want us to bomb Iran–that give me pause. As I said, polls always say the public like something and then they vote the opposite. So I’m agnostic on polls.

ChrisR266 : AdLib: Such is exactly why I have been desperately calling for Howard Dean to come back to the DNC chair. He figured it out in 2008, and funneled all efforts into a 50 state strategy, focusing on the House and Senate. That’s what must happen again.

SallyT : Chris, but Gingrich was doing the same thing at the same time so he was a hippo and crete.

KQµårk 死神 : It still all depends on the economy AdLib. It has to keep on getting better and it’s still fragile as hell.

AdLib : Cher – The polling is clear, the public has strongly turned against the Repubs in Congress and the majority strongly blames them for things not working in DC. This has slammed their popularity in generic polls against Dems and they are confronting a reality of losing the House if this trend stays in place or continues.

ChrisR266 : Sally: Remember, The Lewinsky fiasco taught Gingrich that his “failings” didn’t matter. He just might get desperate enough to fling that out there. I can’t wait.

Chernynkaya : AL, from you lips to God’s ears. I want to believe that, and it’s certainly plausible.

KQµårk 死神 : AdLib I hope you are right but with the right wing echo chamber and Faux News I don’t see that happening.

Chernynkaya : I see that Obama has learned a lot in his first 2 years. His original advisers are gone–Gethner soon too–and he’s come into his own. The old DLC folks are gone.

ChrisR266 : Cher: yeah, they know it, they realize it, but the House is is under no one’s control, and the Senate is GOP moribund. They can’t get out of their own behavioral trainwreck.

SallyT : Clinton’s good has bee over shadowed by Bush’s 8 years of bad! and Let me correct myself it would have been 16 years of DEMS. Sorry.

AdLib : Cher – However, look at what happened soon after FDR with Congress, there was no pendulum, Dems held it for 25 years. I think we could have the same model. The Dems rescue the nation from the destruction wrought by the wealthy and their GOP and that will be remembered for some time. What an easy campaign to make for years, “Do you want to return to the days of doom and gloom that the GOP brought you?”

Chernynkaya : I like the LOTR analogy!!

KQµårk 死神 : Sally I think about that and worry about succession in 2016 even if Obama wins with Biden as VP.

ChrisR266 : Sally: I agree. Clinton did a hell of a lot right, and no one seems to be able to see that right now. He paved the way, and Obama has been astute enough to learn from it.

Chernynkaya : I’ve read some article positing that the repubs are starting to realize that their obstruction is working against them.

SallyT : Regardless of your opinion of Clinton personally, if you stop and think about it, and FL had been called right that would have been 8 terms of DEMS and think where we might be.

AdLib : Chris – Not at all, that is very good allegory and I wouldn’t be surprised if King wasn’t presenting an allegory of the 1980′s GOP in The Stand. I would even throw out the Lord of the Rings allegory, where the wealthy and corporations are Sauron, the big eye controlling people to fight against their own and commanding evil armies to conquer. And Obama then would be akin to Frodo, someone of good heart and intentions, trying to dispose of the evil and by doing so, protect the people from domination. That’s kind of corny, I know, but the stakes are pretty huge.

ChrisR266 : KQ: That is why the battle must be for the House and Senate.

ChrisR266 : Cher: Ahhhh. Great minds melding once again.

KQµårk 死神 : But really can they block forever as a political strategy. If they can then the soul of the nation is just as broke.

SallyT : I agree Cher, we have to prepare ahead.

ChrisR266 : AdLib: And that is exactly why they must go down in flames in 2012. The work must focus on the House and the Senate. That is the real battle.

Chernynkaya : Chris–I agree. In fact, we both wrote similar things at the same time.

AdLib : Sally – But the Repubs will continue to try and block his success because it will expose them as the enemies of most Americans in trying to stop things from getting better. And they’ll be worried that a successful Obama means a Dem wins in 2016. So, if the Dems sweep this year, that filibuster rule needs to be modified to allow the Dems to govern. If they can and they pass Progressive legislation, they will prove it superior to the failed trickle down policies and should be able to retain power for some time to come.

Chernynkaya : AL, I hold the pendulum theory. After 8 good years of Obama, who knows. I agree logically, but I also think we’d better start gorooming/lookin g around. Look what happened to the GOP when you don’t plan ahead.

KQµårk 死神 : Yup and if a guy without a soul can win, it tells you America has no soul. Of course the other side thinks Obama has no soul because he’s an AA.

KQµårk 死神 : Exactly Cher we both agree on that for sure.

ChrisR266 : AdLib: I hope you don’t think this too obscure or smarmy of a reference, but I think of what’s going on right now as akin to the epic nature of the battle in one of Stephen King’s early books, The Stand. What we are battling is epic–the soul of a nation–but the battle is well engaged, and November will tell where we will land.

Chernynkaya : I think in any sane country, Obama would be unbeatable–inde ed lionized! But there are very dark forces against us, and there are citizens here who are either stupid, evil, or both. For me this election is a referendum on America itself.

KQµårk 死神 : I’m also not counting the totally disenfranchised left they are never coming back but they were never really with Obama either. People forget people on the left like GG, Moore, Maher, KO don’t vote.

AdLib : Cher – If Obama and a Dem Congress is in place after 2012 and if they do what they’re promising, they will own 2016 because they will have made the lives of all Americans better and you just can’t run against that.

SallyT : Well the Repubs won’t be working any longer to keep him from getting re=elected anyway!

AdLib : It really is unusual that a President with the economy and job stats where they are right now, in the midst of an opposing party hammering him and being so much in the spotlight, is seeing his ratings rise and beats his potential opponents in most polls. Just consider if the economy just continues as it appears it will and once Obama has his campaign running fully and getting ads out there touting the truth about his accomplishments, how strong will he be then?

Chernynkaya : I do too. But I’m already worried about 2016. I know, I know. One thing at a time.

KQµårk 死神 : I for one think if Obama is reelected 2014 will be the best year in decades.

Chernynkaya : OK, I see what you mean now. Yes, I agree. There is nothing they’ve been fear-mongering about that has come to pass.

AdLib : KQ – Iraq ending is a mental weight off of many Progressives and dialing down in Afghanistan, when it becomes more substantial, will be a big relief.

KQµårk 死神 : Cher if we had kept any troops and bases in Iraq I would agree but since Obama kept his promise in Iraq I think most Dems believe him when he says we will be out of Afghanistan too.

Chernynkaya : Take care, Murph. keep up the good fight.

Chernynkaya : Heh! That’s the title.

SallyT : Good night Murph. You will like the NEW Rules, too. See you later.

Chernynkaya : KQ not sure what you mean. I think that as long as we’re in Afghanistan, Iraq seems not as important as it is.

AdLib : Cher – “Mr. Obama Stays in Washington”.

AdLib : Night Murph, have a great weekend!

AdLib : I meant “Night CL!”

KQµårk 死神 : I think Iraq finally ending is a bigger mental albatross with the left than people can imagine.

MurphTheSurf3 : Well folks I am kind of blogged-out right now. Mind going numb. So, adieu.

Chernynkaya : Right, AL! It would be a Frank Capra!

AdLib : Might CL! You deserve a treat or a bonus or something for a job well done this week! Sleep well and have a relaxing weekend!

Chernynkaya : Not a day goes by when Obama doesn’t do something new or overturn something bad. He is the best of presidents in our history, and amazes me.

MurphTheSurf3 : Ad Lib….Your take on the election in the Fall is one I generally agree to.

AdLib : Cher – It makes perfect sense! Life is not like the movies, things rarely are so simple and extreme…which is what makes movies so enjoyable. Life is filled with many more complications. If Obama wins and the Dems re-take Congress, that will actually be as much as a movie-type ending to Obama’s first term as one could imagine and the prologue for an exciting sequel!

SallyT : Good night Kes and Choice.

KQµårk 死神 : Hmmm… I think they almost have to affirm based on the own precedence they set on interstate commerce including Kennedy and Scalia.

Chernynkaya : Wow–time really does fly.

Chernynkaya : Kes and Choice–sleep well!

choicelady : kes – time flies when you’re having fun! I also am packing it in. I’ve had a thoroughly hectic, amazing, whirlwind week, and I’m beat. Good night all – sweet dreams, and we will see you here next week!

KQµårk 死神 : A bad day in the Obama presidency was better than the best day in the Bush presidency for me. I can easily say the top 4 or 5 worse days I could remember in my life were thanks to the Bush arrogance and incompetence.

AdLib : Night Kes!

AdLib : Night Sabreen!

AdLib : KQ – Interesting question on the ACA, KQ. I actually don’t think they will overturn the mandate and certainly not the entire ACA. If they don’t or if they just overturn the mandate, I think it deflates the GOP. After all, if their main attack on the ACA is the mandate and the mandate alone is ruled unconstitutional but the rest of the plan remains… they’ve lost their main argument and the remaining ones are so piddly!

choicelady : Sabreen – I liked Clinton and was glad he won, but he dragged this ball and chain of both his womanizing AND his lack of backbone. I was so ashamed of his cowardice on issues such as Lani Guenier (sp?) That was just stupid of him! And it happened over and over. I’ve never once felt Obama was a source of wincing. I don’t give a damn about Solyndra – every administration backs companies that go under. I care that his POLICIES are what we need and that his very capable strategic bargaining has kept us safe from the GOP predations. He is freaking amazing!

ChrisR266 : Be right back, quick break.

SallyT : Murph, you will have a hard time watching because of this bitch of a woman/Kennedy/ra dio host won’t keep her mouth shut! She doesn’t like Obama.

Chernynkaya : Take care, Sabrren!

ChrisR266 : Good evening, Kes.

Chernynkaya : AL, I love to imagine that! I can remember the day I grew up, in a sense; it was when my ex explained that life rarely has dramatic endings–no all-or-nothing results. And I realized that was usually true. It didn’t have to be perfect for me to see it as a win. Does that make sense? So if we win the presidency, and keep on House–with whatever margin–I’ll be thrilled.

ChrisR266 : Sleep well, Sabreen. Good to talk with you tonight.

kesmarn : Me too, Sabreen! Just looked at the clock… Where did the time go? Have a great weekend, all!

KQµårk 死神 : Sabreen.

Sabreen60 : Gee it is getting late. Night Funk. I’m right behind you. Y’all take care ya hear

ChrisR266 : AdLib: Obliteration was exactly what I had in mind. That party and mindset must die, be put to rest for good.

KQµårk 死神 : Sabrene I hear ya same here.

KQµårk 死神 : Speaking of mandates AdLib who important is it that the mandate in the ACA is affirmed by the SCOTUS?

MurphTheSurf3 : Sally T thanks for the Maher review. I will catch it later.

ChrisR266 : Golden slumbers, my Funk friend.

Sabreen60 : CL, I’m with you. Once I decided on Candidate Obama over Hilary, I have never looked back. The 2008 election was the first election I felt as though I was not choosing the lesser of two evils. I didn’t think of President Clinton as evil, I was concerned about his record as Governor.

AdLib : Night Funk!

ChrisR266 : Kes: I think it did. I’ve been sharing with lots of people exactly what Keystone is, and they get it now.

AdLib : Imagine the impact of a mandate-sized win for Obama and Dems retaking the House and retaining the Senate. It would be an obliteration of the GOP AND the Tea Party. And with a mandate from a new election and wisdom about what Republicans are and how they are not legitimate partners in government, I could imagine some pretty amazing developments over the next 4 years. And if he’s able to replace one of the 5 jerks in the SCOTUS with a moderate or liberal and tip the SCOTUS back to the people…look out! BTW, filibuster reform is not optional in such a situation, it is mandatory and Harry Reid better not stand in the way or we will step up against him.

MurphTheSurf3 : Funk….good chatting with you here and at the other place. Peace.

KQµårk 死神 : Yeah stay away from the Po Po funk.

Chernynkaya : Murph I haven’t seen them, but I’m not surprised. That’s the best we can hope for.

choicelady : kes – some environmentalist groups gave Obama kudos on Keystone. It CAN be created to be safe, but his interest in that will get him few fans from the REAL hair on fire types who wouldn’t know a sandhill crane from a city bus. It’s just something to whine about. They REALLY should care about the aquifer! But that’s under flyover country, so, well, who cares…

KQµårk 死神 : Yeah he will Cher.

SallyT : Good night Funk. Stay indoors!

kesmarn : Cher, that’s interesting. You think Keystone really will happen,huh?

MurphTheSurf3 : Cher…two Keystone alternatives have already come forth and both are better than the orignal plan.

ChrisR266 : Murph: I know exactly what you speak. She is the last of them. They’re the ones making the ruckus this time around. They are a dying breed. And, I probably would have quaffed five stiff ones tout suite.

Chernynkaya : Night, Funk.

kesmarn : G’night funk! Stay safe!

funksands : Goodnight everyone! Eating a very late dinner tonight.

KQµårk 死神 : Not really Chris most of this happened before I met her. She pretty much left that life when she got old enough.

Chernynkaya : Kes, I think Obama will eventually approve a modification of Keystone. I think there is too much pressure not to. All I hope for–and believe–is that he will make the safety restrictions fierce.

ChrisR266 : KQ: It’s your life, too.

KQµårk 死神 : kes that certainly helped.

kesmarn : Anyone think that Obama’s thumbs down on Keystone gained him major cred with the left, also?

choicelady : Cher – no I had to step out and get food for a homeless neighbor. Yes – it IS discouraging but also inspiring to live these days! I feel the things we fought for in the 60s are actually coming true NOW. Long, long list of things we wanted that Obama is making come true for us and everyone, so being discouraged seems odd to me.

ChrisR266 : AdLib: Everyone seems to forget that another part of this upheaval is the stark realization that the economy always does better under Democrats, ALWAYS. It just rattles Republicans to the core, and it Isn’t something Democrats have taken to brag about. But, the moderates and independents are facing that reality now, and it truly is earthshaking for them.

MurphTheSurf3 : Chris, Cher…I live in very conservative rural Mo. One of my neighbors, who is generally unaware of my political leanings, told me that she is so upset with her kids and grandkids….not going to church, dating/marrying the wrong kind of people (Asian, Hispanic and Black), not supporting the wars….then she said: “It has all gotten so much worse since that man Barry got in the White HOuse. How did we let that happen.” I went home and had a stiff drink.

KQµårk 死神 : I always tell her she needs to write a book about her life.

kesmarn : So cool,funk! Please do that>

Chernynkaya : AL–perfectly articulated. I could not agree more.

funksands : Kes: I was planning on making it its own post on the Planet the day after the election. Should be interesting.

KQµårk 死神 : AdLib a big part of that is tax reform. Obama is already winning the argument about fair taxation but they have to come through like they came through with the ACA

SallyT : But, during the debates I think we have said the same thing about Ron Paul. Sometimes he says stuff that is right but he is a crazy dude other times.

Chernynkaya : Chris, yes, I understand it, but am still shocked at how much racism is acceptable and out there now. I never would have imagined mainstream racism being broadcast.

ChrisR266 : KQ: I suspect in a year or two, you two ought to sit down and write that book.

kesmarn : Oh funk, that will be fascinating and exciting to open that letter. I remember — the next day — being seized with a terrible fear for the Prez’s safety, too.

choicelady : kes! My husband and I both cried with the sheer joy of yes, NO MORE BUSH, and especially at the historic power of this president! I could NOT wrap my mind around it – he WON!!! I’m so used to losing, and this time the MOST audacious candidate WON!!! And it moved us to tears. And I’ve never been disappointed in him. Never. He continues to touch me with his humanity and inspire me with his policies and strategies. Wow. So yeah – CRY for happy!

AdLib : I would propose that the one way for the nation to move back to the middle and hopefully, more Progressive…is the economy turning around under an Obama second term with a Dem Congress. If at least the impression that government CAN work when Progressively minded people are in charge and it CAN make your life better, the GOP could indeed be relegated to minority status for 25 years again. They’ve played out their trickle down scenario over the last 30 years, to prove that a Progressive path reverses the inequity and makes things better would lead to a severe disintegration of their validity. Add to that, the old haters dying off and minorities becoming a greater percentage of the population along the way, the GOP could enter at least a Lost Decade.

SallyT : Yes, Maher was definately on Obama’s side tonight. He had to fight with two Repubs but he didn’t let them win. He had nothing but good things to say about the President. He did say he Ron Paul did say some good things but he also said that Ron Paul is crazy on to many things.

KQµårk 死神 : Chris her father was and still is part of the whole AA preacher thing and she’s met so many people like Oprah, Barbara Walters, Jessie Jackson and son, etc… She use to actually work for Doug Wilder’s lieutenant governor.

ChrisR266 : Cher: I just read your last sentence. The racism is really a reaction to the tsunami of change they see coming. They just can’t grip that being white ain’t all that anymore.

funksands : Kes, I wrote a letter to my sons about how I felt and what I thought was going to happen next after that election night. I sealed it and am not going to open it until next election night. I can’t really remember what I wrote.

Chernynkaya : CL, did you see my comment a while ago about Phil Ochs? I hear you, but for older Lefties, I can at least see how discouraged they are.

ChrisR266 : Cher: I do. People will not abide by turning the clock back. Our kids, my kid, will not stand for it.

choicelady : Murph – I’m not the one who heard Maher but yes, apparently he defended him. Who heard that? Murph needs to know!

Chernynkaya : Sally–exactly.

kesmarn : I was surprised to, Chris, to find myself crying ridiculously on election night 2008. All the horror of the Bush years flooding away.

choicelady : Cher – the “left” of the 1930s were people with a serious cause and willingness to be active. These lefties are armchair rads, and yes, that gives them free rein to critique Obama til the cows come home. They have no sacrifice to make, so sure. Bitch.

KQµårk 死神 : I just can’t believe how reactionary both ends of the ideological spectrum are. Being reactionary use to define you as a conservative. And of course the least reactionary politician I can think of is Obama because he always has the long term in mind.

Chernynkaya : Chris, I felt that way too. Do you still? I realize now that the fight had just begun–things came out that needed to. I never understood how racist this country is.

SallyT : As a Baby Boomer that has always been liberal I have to say that we did get radical over the war because our age were the ones drafted. But, if you had money you didn’t go. That can piss you off! When it got to Reagan and the “Me Generation”, we liberals appeared to be behind the times and a lot of us changed sides. I don’t think all of us did and I do see many out there now. Look into the Occupy and you will see us.

MurphTheSurf3 : Choice….fill me in….did Maher heap praise on Obama tonight? As to your MSM obsevation…the progressive media types are seeing more and more of campaign Obama and more liberal Obama….the guy they wanted to elect.

ChrisR266 : KQ. I hope this doesn’t sound funny, but So cool for you. That’s history most people can’t even wrap their minds around.

KQµårk 死神 : Oh and the GOPTEA House I’m sure is a factor as well.

ChrisR266 : I remembering sobbing election night of 2008 because I realized that finally, this thing was going to start turning around. I knew it would not be overnight, but it was–irreversibl y–going to turn.

kesmarn : And the fact that Mandel poses behind the military vet image is irksome, Chris, to say the least.

AdLib : CL – Funny you mention that, I was thinking the same thing today. That blowhard Ed who had been attacking Obama regularly has become a big cheerleader of his, along with a number of the Purist types. And we’re not hearing much from the EMoProgs anymore, don’t see Hamster and such on the talk shows lately. I think the GOP race has totally destroyed these small minded jerks, no reasonable Dem or Indie would consider the possibility of defeating Obama now when they see the alternatives.

ChrisR266 : I think people forget that four years is just a pittance as a generation matures and the demographics of a population changes.

KQµårk 死神 : Oh yeah, Stockley Carmichael actually stayed in her house one night growing up.

Chernynkaya : CL, I expect the Left will feel free to bash Obama again in his second term.

ChrisR266 : Kes: Mandel is a scumbag rivaling the scumbag greatness of Kasich. He will lose.

kesmarn : But consider the 1950′s and what was being reacted TO. No legal abortion, McCarthy witch hunts, the draft and no voting rights for 18-21 year olds. Not pretty!

Chernynkaya : OH, I see, Sabreen. Yes.

Chernynkaya : BTW, what do y’all think about Geithner saying he won’t be asked to stay on?

choicelady : Cher – Whew. I’m glad i’m not imagining it entirely! It seems positive, though after three years of beating our heads against their brick walls, I WILL be cautious. I hope they begin to see reason.

funksands : KQ, seriously? Black Panthers? Wow.

Chernynkaya : Chris, totally agree. The 60′s freaked them out big time. Everything since has been a backlash.

choicelady : KQ – sometimes the immediate experiences (your brother) are pretty intense indicators of what you do NOT want to do or be.

Sabreen60 : Cher, I meant when Newt was Speaker. He was awful – mean spirited and just plain ugly.

ChrisR266 : Choice: I have heard and seen it too. The corportrocacy now realizes that they either back the one who hasn’t ruined the nation, or back the ones who surely will.

KQµårk 死神 : I think a few things are going on CL first Obama’s populist term and winning against the GOP, then the GOP nominees for president and finally the election always makes more or less rank and file Dems tribal.

kesmarn : Oh Chris, I do hope so. Brown is a great senator. And that Mandel creature can’t even be bothered to do the job he has now.

AdLib : Funk – It is possible that the Dems lose the Senate and hang onto the House but the polls are showing generic Dems beating generic Repubs in Congress and there is a growing dissatisfaction with the Repubs. If that happened though, the Dems would filibuster bad stuff in the Senate and Obama would use Exec Orders to get as much done as he could.

funksands : Choice, I hope that’s it. I think that his support among the faux/emo prog left has risen in direct correlation to the number of GOP debates that have occured.

Chernynkaya : CL–I’ve seen teh same thing. As the campaigns get underway, even those who were critical of Obama see the stark choice.

ChrisR266 : Kes: he will win.

ChrisR266 : Our Liberalism and push for change scared the beejebus out of them in the 60s and 70s. It has come back around in the 2010s. Worse so, they see themselves really becoming a minority, undeniably so.

Sabreen60 : Funk, I worried about the Senate. The House – I’m a little more optimistic.

Chernynkaya : Sabreen, happened before Newt this time around. I blame the RR and the Baggers.

KQµårk 死神 : My wive’s parents are ex Black Panthers and they we’re involved with really radical stuff like blowing shit up. That to me is radical.

AdLib : Chris – And during that period, while the MSM will still work hard to keep Romney in the spotlight, Obama will be getting the power of the Presidency to further highlight his agenda and accomplishments. I think Obama will put more of a margin between himself and ROmney over the next month.

choicelady : Everyone – the issue of Maher defending Obama has raised a purely anecdotal issue: I am detecting a much increased support for Obama among the talking heads – Ed Schultz, Joan Walsh, and others. Am I nuts or MAYBE has the work WE have done here and at other sites – work based on logic and reasoned arguments – could it actually be WORKING? It’s not perfect, but it does seem to me more and more pundits are actually saying positive things about the POLICIES and the CHARACTER of this president. Of course I don’t go “over there” at all, but even DailyKos seems more thoughtful and less bombastic. Anyone else think so?

MurphTheSurf3 : Funk- Obama holds the presidency, the House goes Dem and the Senate stays more narrowly Dem IF the economic news stays relatively positive and moving in the direction it is now. IF. One gift from the Greatest Generation and the Boomers is unbridled narcissism. It is all about ME!

Chernynkaya : Funk, I think at the very least we will gain many House seat. And I think we will keep the majority in the Senate.

kesmarn : funk,that is a scary vision of the future. I’m not enough of a numbers person to be able to do the statistics, but I do know the right is seriously gunning for Sherrod Brown here.

KQµårk 死神 : Good points CL. I way overgeneralize I’m sure. Just offering up one perspective of many. But somehow liberal became a bad word because people got scared. Sure people were manipulated by that fear but it did exist on some level.

Sabreen60 : We have Newt and others to thank for the vitriol in politics. Dems and Repubs disagreed about most policies, but I don’t think they saw each other as enemies, but opponents. Repubs and Dems did work together on some issues to reach compromise. Now it’s as though there are two separate Americas and one needs to go ahead and secede.

ChrisR266 : Choice: Exactly damned correct. Curse him, GWB.

AdLib : Murph – Agreed though in the big picture, I think it will leave the image of Romney as Richie Rich who doesn’t care about most Americans hardened in American’s minds.

funksands : “What is the liklihood of this happening?: The Dems just miss taking back the House, and also lose the Senate in the upcoming elections?” The math doesn’t look good barring a HUGE turnout. Opinions?

ChrisR266 : AdLib: Agreed. That’s exactly what we want to happen. All before Obama has to campaign a lick.

Chernynkaya : You know, maybe I’m wrong, but the other night I watched a doc about Phil Ochs–among others I watched recently about the 60′s–and I can’t get over how we’ve moved so far right since then. I can ALMOST understand where people like Emo Robert Sheer are coming form. When on is stuck in the 60′s, and sees the difference now, it’s kinda hard to take. But they are not living in reality.

choicelady : KQ – even as one who is pretty radical now, I realized all through the 60s that there were many ways to be political, and if you disrespected others along the way, you became them. The massive corruption under mostly Nixon though LBJ had his problems, and the profound horror of Vietnam deserved our loathing – but the PEOPLE did not. I personally know of no one who spat on returning vets and know very many vets that never happened to. But that was the beginning of the division between groups and people that became almost irreparable. I’m not sure when it will heal because 9/11 should have done that – and Bush blew us apart again. VERY painful.

KQµårk 死神 : Ut oh Funk must have more of the Po Po in his back yard.

AdLib : Chris – I think you’re right, Newt will die on the vine when it comes to popularity during that period. However, I think the bitterness associated with Romney will settle in for people.

MurphTheSurf3 : AdLib….the hiatus gives Romneys agents time to further deflate the Salamander Balloon Boy (message, money, momentum)

kesmarn : Head for the bunker everyone!!

funksands : sorry I have to leave soon

ChrisR266 : KQ: Indeed. Exactly. Same thing happening now.

funksands : ***********ATTEN TION************ INCOMING QUESTION******** *****

ChrisR266 : AdLib: Help Romney. It will deflate the Gingrich sails altogether.

KQµårk 死神 : Understood Chris but I never saw how it would change things and all it did was scare the country into turning toward the right and now they are the radicals.

MurphTheSurf3 : Choice…I worked with Republican Govenor’s Association on two projects with Dick Ogilve as my liaison….great people…not so much any more….in fact, hardly at all.

funksands : Choice, do you think that moderates could re-emerge inside the GOP if they get their asses handed to them enough over the next few election cycles?

ChrisR266 : Morbid. Oh Lord.

AdLib : So, after the FL primary, there won’t be any elections or debates for a month. Will this help or hurt Romney?

funksands : I like morbid.

ChrisR266 : KQ: But your brother’s radicalism was borne of something real, and significant. It was neither selfish or wrongheaded.

Chernynkaya : Oh, got it now, AL. I misread it.

KQµårk 死神 : funk really I didn’t take it personally. My experiences gives me a terrible morbid sense of humor.

choicelady : Murph – yes, me, too. Chuck Percy was our Senator back in the late 60s. When my brother wanted to be a CO during Vietnam – it was PERCY who backed my brother’s petition. I will never forget that. It was honorable of him to respect my brother’s stand. Wow. I still think there are good people in the GOP – they just mostly are not running for office. Dennis seems to be one of them. He’s a thoroughly nice guy – and he knows I’m VERY different, and he’s respectful of my ideas, too. That’s cool. Ronald Reagan’s son-in-lw meets the Churchlady/Choic elady. Could be worse!

SallyT : I’m a Baby Boomer. We fought the establishment and now we’s is one!

AdLib : Cher – That’s what I was saying, he sounded like he was clueless or intentionally contrary but he didn’t sound like a Repub, just because he had a poorly founded criticism of Obama. People should be allowed to be wrong without being accused of being a bad guy.

ChrisR266 : Evening, Sabreen!

KQµårk 死神 : I was born in the 60′s like Obama and I think we saw allot of the mistakes the early boomers made too. My older brother is ten years older than I and I never bought into his radicalism.

Chernynkaya : Yep, Chris, lost cause.

Sabreen60 : Hi Chris!

ChrisR266 : Y’all: There are some people out there (far right out there) who just will not be moved. They are afraid of anyone not like them, believe in nothing, and spooked by everything. All they cling to is there little 1.2 acres (I’m really not trying to say it like Obama did 4 years ago…). These people are real.

funksands : KQ, not you!!! I was just hoping you’d chase down a few hove-arounds and put some pillows over their faces.

kesmarn : But it was the Greatest Generation that REALLY ruined everything, funk! Ronnie Raygun and Company.

Chernynkaya : My son really surprised me by his animosity towards my generation. He feels we get ours and left little for his generation. Not ME personally of course, but my generation.

AdLib : Funk – The best way to help the old white Southern folks, who are holding back progress in this country, to get to Heaven quicker is to just let them win out on blocking Michele Obama’s campaign for healthy eating in their states. They will continue to grow too big to leave their houses to vote and as uninsured “libertarians” will leave this Earth grasping their chests for where their heart should be.

Sabreen60 : Hey Murph. Just got back.

KQµårk 死神 : Let’s not forget the ‘greatest generation’s’ complicity in this too with Ronald Raygun and Nixon.

choicelady : KQ – Boomers (I am one) have a LOT to answer for.

Chernynkaya : I’m with you CL. That’s what I think too.

choicelady : funk – I would ordinarily agree and HOPE you are correct. But all the good will of post 9/11 went up in smoke soon thereafter because Bush capitalized on it in evil ways. That is what makes me fear we never again will have any unity of cause and purpose. I hope you’re right and I’m wrong. REALLY hope that!

MurphTheSurf3 : choicelady….th at’s the GOP of the North, Midwest and far West that I used to know and work with.

Chernynkaya : CL, if I were a moderate Repub, I would be completely demoralized and would zone out. Maybe they’ve just given up following politics.

KQµårk 死神 : I’ve been clinically dead twice already funk. But I’m too much of a bastard to die.

funksands : Ad, may I officially pose a question to the group?

choicelady : BTW – I never get to name drop since I know wonderful but not famous people mostly. But I DO know and sat with Dennis Revell yesterday, Maureen Reagan’s husband. He’s therefore Ronald Reagan’s son-in-law. I don’t know him well but we talk at various meetings we both attend – and damn if he’s not a really nice guy. I don’t think we have a lot in common, but we CAN talk, and he’s funny and nice – so where did all those great people GO? I hope his “type” will come back soon.

funksands : KQ, do the noble thing would you?

KQµårk 死神 : I’m a borderline boomer like Obama and I do blame allot of American’s divisions on my own group.

funksands : Choice, we are pretty good as a people when everything breaks and when are backs are up against the wall. Right now we are just letting off steam and shedding our skin.

Chernynkaya : Sally, I say that now.

ChrisR266 : Aw, RATS? Sheesh.

Chernynkaya : AL, Dem purists are the same to me as Baggers to me. But I got the impression this fellow was not a partisan–just his opinion. I think he was wrong, but not really partisan. what he WAS was tin eared.

AdLib : CL – Sounds like a very good book! And you certainly don’t hear the RR condemning those who want to attack doctors who perform abortions, they are co-conspirators in terrorism and are condoning murder by doing so…yet get hysterical about Muslims possibly doing the same as them.

funksands : Sally, with our luck we’ll end up with Planet of the Rats or something else shitty like that.

SallyT : Watch it Funk!

KQµårk 死神 : That may very well be what happens CL and what the whole Libertarian thing is all about.

ChrisR266 : Funk: I’m working on it, I’ll just keep drinking the brew…

choicelady : funk – I really hope you are correct. Americans growing up and being adult would be the perfect outcome.

funksands : We just need to hurry up and get all of the boomers to die off, then we’ll be saved. No offense.

ChrisR266 : Hi AdLib. Good to be here.

KQµårk 死神 : AdLib I was going to point out if you were a liberal no way could that come off flat to you. Unless you are a cynical liberal I guess.

SallyT : And we will see the Statue of Liberty laying on the shore, Cher, and we will say, “DAMN YOU, DAMN YOU!”

ChrisR266 : On that we agree, Funk.

AdLib : Hey Murph! Hey Chris! Great to see both of you!

funksands : I predict Americans pulling their head out of their ass before I predict the dissolution of the union.

choicelady : KQ – I often think that while the feds must protect civil rights and some other fundamentals, I’m about ready to saw off the part below the Mason Dixon. I KNOW you live there – we would have a very liberal immigration plan – no reservations for anyone who WANTED to be out of there. It shows good sense. So come on up!

KQµårk 死神 : kes that’s my word lately. I especially love calling Romney and the GOP that for all there predictions about the auto bailouts and such.

AdLib : Cher – Dem Purists are as objectionable as Baggers to me. I would suggest that it seems provocative for someone to label Obama’s speech as flat because it really takes a lot of denial not to recognize that, even if one disagreed, it was not flat. So, being contrary for the sake of it does open the critical floodgates but being kneejerk and calling anyone who criticizes Obama a Repub, is simplistic and closed minded.

Chernynkaya : KQ, either it WILL end–in the way the pendulum swings and people will say “Enough!” or the US will end.

kesmarn : “Nostradumbarse “

ChrisR266 : Evening, Choice and Kes. Hope everyone is well.

funksands : Just to you darlin

KQµårk 死神 : The US is going to look like a loose collection of Nation States in the future. Anyway that’s my Nostradumbarse prediction.

kesmarn : Hey, Chris!

choicelady : Hi Chris! How are you tonight?

ChrisR266 : Aw Funk, you are way over the too kind, sir.

ChrisR266 : Hi Cher.

funksands : Hey Teach!

Chernynkaya : Hi Chris!

choicelady : AdLib – absolutely NO difference whatsoever. Fundamentalist extremists are all the same. There is a great book, Terror in the Mind of God done BEFORE 9/11 that compared bin Laden, the ricin-spreading Japanese cult leader, and Michael Bray the Army of God leader positing murders of abortion providers. One could find almost no difference. The author is Mark Jeurgensmeyer from UC Santa Barbara. VERY good book.

ChrisR266 : Good evening, everyone.

KQµårk 死神 : The only thing is Cher. At one point I did think the Cold Civil War could end but no more.

SallyT : Hi there, Murph! Good to see you.

MurphTheSurf3 : funk….they will go up like the driest of tinder….no weight, no merit.

funksands : Kes: «link»

Chernynkaya : Kes–:lol:

kesmarn : Hey, Murph! That’s a Bonfire of Vanity.

Chernynkaya : Hey Murph!

Chernynkaya : KQ–yes. Civil War. (Still haven’t finished that piece I was writing about that.)

funksands : May I ask a question that I have been pondering for a few days? I’d like to get some opinions. Hi Murph! Make sure and fill that boat with lots of copies of Newt’s books.

kesmarn : Cher, I can see everyone’s but funk’s. His was stolen last night.

Chernynkaya : OOPs Sally, I see you. It’s just KQ and Funk now.

AdLib : Kes – Pretty disgusting but being a Repub, it will probably turn out that he paid for an abortion when he was younger and will be the first to be hung.

MurphTheSurf3 : Late, late, late but better late than not at all. I was out preparing a Viking Long Boat for Newt’s immolation next Tuesday.

KQµårk 死神 : Politics is killing this country in every way Cher. Because you cannot get things done if everything is made to be a political fight.

Chernynkaya : AL–Great point. No difference.

SallyT : Cher, I beg your pardon!

funksands : I’ve never been able to see my own avi until I log out from Vox

Chernynkaya : Oh, AL has his regular avi too.

funksands : KQ: *ding*

kesmarn : Oops…sorry KQ! I didn’t see that you had just posted that link!

Chernynkaya : Hey, I just noticed that everyone here but kes and I have generic avatars. Why?

KQµårk 死神 : See the right wing believes in magical thinking they think that they won’t have to work like the Chinese but everyone else will.

AdLib : Cher and Funk – What difference is there in killing innocent people to enforce religious beliefs at abortion clinics and killing innocent people to enforce religious beliefs in financial buildings.

Chernynkaya : KQ, there was a telling exchange about that on Twitter. Some journalist from a network thought the SOTU was “flat.” He got mail accusing him of being a Repub,and he’s not. But he asked why he was accused of that. I realized that at this point, everything is partisan. That’s just the way it us now.

choicelady : AdLib – well, thankyou – I do have me a good crop of enemies! And KQ – I think I’m passing on that link. Gives me the heebie jeebies.

KQµårk 死神 : Actually funk I think the right wing would love for minorities to be the permanent underclass and do all the hard work.

kesmarn : True dat, AdLib! And here’s the link to the article on public executions: «link»

choicelady : kes – yes. It drove me out of my previous state since I was unable to get any help and was constantly harassed, followed, photographed – it went on for TWO years. They are really insane.

funksands : Sabreen, you are welcome. I thought it was pretty good.

funksands : Ad, you are absolutely right. Conservatives wouldn’t mind having our country be a cross between Branson and China as long as everyone had the right “composition”.

KQµårk 死神 : right on cue CL ‘North Carolina GOP Lawmaker Calls For Bringing Back Public Hangings, Starting With Abortion Providers’ «link»

AdLib : Kes – You can judge a person by their enemies so CL is one fantastic person by definition!

Sabreen60 : Hi Funk! Thanks for the article on Twitter.

Chernynkaya : AL, I truly believe this is a case of pathological projection. Time and again, every thing they accuse us of is something they do or want to do. Every single time.

funksands : CL, nope. And now I don’t care.

KQµårk 死神 : Cher it just proves everything is turned into a political fight today no matter what the facts are.

kesmarn : Oh, c’lady…. That’s just so depressing and surreal — that you’re actually on someone’s hit list?!

choicelady : Hey funk – glad things are back to normal AND that your wife fixed the fence. Ever figure out if the hole was from the bad guy or the police?

AdLib : Cher – I know what you’re talking about. It really is ironic that the RR who are most terrified of Muslims are so similar to the profile of Muslims they attack. They want a state ruled by religious fundamentalists and religious laws to force the population to adhere to their religion. It just sounds like jealousy to me, “America is our country to dominate with our version of Christianity, not your version of Islam! That would be an outrage!”

Chernynkaya : Funk.

choicelady : kes – Brownback of Kansas said the same thing, that abortion providers should be executed. There is a whole “Defensive Action” statement justifying shooting doctors. And the Nuremberg List of pro choice people to be “brought to justice” through execution. I’m on it. These people are NOT just SAYING these things.

SallyT : Rand Paul is one scary dude.

Chernynkaya : And KQ did you see the tape from the TSA? He was NOT detained, nor did he put up a fuss. Man, I so loathe these people.

funksands : Cher, they’d have to have hands free to do that.

KQµårk 死神 : Rand Paul proves the bat guano doesn’t fall far from the batshitcrazy cave.

Chernynkaya : Funk–just tell them to shut up and drink their pruno.

choicelady : Sally!!! I’ve heard that from other men, too – what a stitch!

kesmarn : Cher, you naughty girl… funk’s wife won’t sleep tonight either…

funksands : Cher, that’s not funny. The people locked in my basement were really freaked out last night.

Chernynkaya : KQ–Excellent!

Chernynkaya : Funk–the call is coming from INSIDE the house! S’all I’m gonna say.

funksands : Thanks for your concern.

KQµårk 死神 : Cher that’s like Rand Paul complaining about the TSA taking our freedoms away on the way to a right wing anti-abortion rally.

funksands : Nope, and my wife fixed the fence. It’s like it never happened.

Chernynkaya : Funk! How’s the fence?

SallyT : Funk, anybody in the backyard?

AdLib : Hey Funk! Hope all is well after your home version of CSI!

kesmarn : Hey, funk! Any backyard visitors tonight?

Chernynkaya : I know. These people are sick, authoritarian fuckers. If you want to understand how some Fundies and repubs think about women, listen to Limbaugh. They are like many in the Middle-east culture–terrifi ed of women.

funksands : Howdy everybody!

kesmarn : There was a Repub in S.Car. who proposed that abortion providers be publicly executed by hanging “as a deterrent.” I’ll try to find the link.

KQµårk 死神 : I’m just glad the right wingers are anti-Jewish now (kinda) because you know what Rabbi’s cut off.

SallyT : Personally, I don’t know how women can be cannibals but my husband says if he could do what our dog can with himself, he wouldn’ leave the house.

AdLib : KQ – The RW has missed feeling scared and were relieved to have something to be terrified of. They are the types that are only happy when they are terrified for their lives.

AdLib : Cher – Still, the proposition is that those who want women to have control over their own bodies, are potential cannibals.

KQµårk 死神 : AdLib that was just bizarre but the right wing loved it.

Chernynkaya : Embryos would’ve been acceptable. It was fetuses.

KQµårk 死神 : I looked at Rubio’s ‘record’ he makes Sarah Palin look qualified.

AdLib : Ask Santorum, the true threat in South America and illegal immigration…is Muslim extremist Iranian jihadists!

kesmarn : Sometimes ya just gotta laugh, KQ…

SallyT : Never understood that Shariah Law scare.

Chernynkaya : I’m back. Here’s the Rubio story:«link» iti.co/A00eAT

KQµårk 死神 : kes you have me in stiches.

AdLib : KQ – Mmm…embryos for lunch, just what we Progressives have been waiting for. We’re just polite cannibals!

kesmarn : And yet they’re cool with making “Biblical Law” the law of the land. More projection.

KQµårk 死神 : It’s like making laws against legislating Shariah law when no one has ever tried it.

kesmarn : Is there anything that PBO cannot do, Sally? Well, besides bowling?

AdLib : They did polls on Rubio and he doesn’t help with Hispanics nationally. Grouping rabidly conservative Cubans in with Mexicans and South Americans is misguided.

SallyT : They were right on, Kes.

KQµårk 死神 : Oh like the right wing nut that wants to prevent using human embryos or placentas for foodstuff.

kesmarn : Sally, I did. Y’know what amazed me — they were in exactly the same key!! How did PBO do that? Does he have perfect pitch too?

choicelady : Cher – why did the Reuters story get recanted? Rubio LIED.

KQµårk 死神 : CL I gotta check that out.

AdLib : CL – You’re right, and I feel so embarassed. What about Newt’s ideas to make houses out of shedded dog fur, solve the energy crisis by installing human sized hamster wheel generators in all gyms and solve the jobs issues by making all unemployed people into Soylent Green?

choicelady : Cher – I missed Mitt saying that pseudo-Trump line! Good one!

kesmarn : Isn’t that typical, c’lady?

Chernynkaya : BBL

SallyT : Kes, did you see that mix I put up of Obama and Al?

choicelady : kes and all – has anyone seen the ‘self deportation’ web site where we ALL are supposed to turn ourselves in if we had ancestors who lied about themselves when they came via Ellis Island? One guy, not seeing the joke, got absolutely FURIOUS since one point is that all ‘anchor babies’ need to go back where they came from. That would be HIM. It was pretty funny – or would have been if it weren’t so pathetic of him to defend HIS right to be here but not anyone else’s.

kesmarn : PBO will only have to start singing… Debate over.

KQµårk 死神 : I hate to say they do have one issue kinda, energy but thankfully Obama is more moderate on energy than his base.

Chernynkaya : I despise Rubio. So sad that the Reuters story had to be recanted.

AdLib : With no issues favorable to the indies (and consider how extremist the GOP platform will be coming out of their convention!), Romney will do what he’s started to do, he will run against a fictional Obama that his campaign has created for him. Such an approach only works when you don’t have to confront the real Obama face-to-face. Romney will melt or look like an elitist jerk if he tries to insist in a debate that Obama is “not one of us”.

KQµårk 死神 : What kills me about that Cher is all Rubio cares about is rhetoric not policies. Typical GOP hypocrisy in action.

Chernynkaya : CL-one of Mitt’s only good lines last night was telling Newt he;d fire him if he came up with that moon thing.

kesmarn : To me that whole “self-deportati on” thing is beyond insulting. It seems his message is “come here when we need cheap labor and then get the hell out…over and over.”

choicelady : AdLib – I can’t believe you think Newt has no policies! Why he has stressed putting manufacturing in space! Colonizing the moon! Turning mirrors on cities to fight crime with eternal twilight! How CAN you be so disrespectful of this Great Thinker!

Chernynkaya : When even Marco Rubio tell Newt/Mitt that they better tone down the immigration rhetoric, you know they’re losing it.

KQµårk 死神 : AdLib he is already flip flopping on ‘self deportation’ thanks to Rubio.

choicelady : ADLib and kes – it will be very interesting to see what Romney thinks appeals to us “little people”. He is so wildly out of touch.

AdLib : How about exploding his BS “self-deportati on”. Instead, it is ghettoization of undocumented workers and sending them deeper into a black market employment world. More poverty, illness and sadly, crime would be what happens. After all, living in the US over Mexico, where jobs are scarce in each case, is an easy call.

Chernynkaya : I think so, AL. I mean, he is actually extreme. All he has “going” for him among Indies is his business success and the economy. And the first is maybe moot, and the second might be improving enough.

kesmarn : Yes, c’lady, and doesn’t that say volumes about what the “head” of the GOP is right now. Some of those audiences would make professional wrestling fans look genteel.

KQµårk 死神 : AdLib Romney about took repealing Obamacare off the table so I don’t know what he’s going to campaign on because like you said running on the Reagan platform is a non starter this year.

choicelady : Sabreen – yes, they do seek some kind of self aggrandizement from feelings of inferiority. Mine wanted to be rich and famous, and he never was and never will be. It’s pathetic but scary, too.

AdLib : Cher – Good point, neither Romney nor Newt have run on any detailed policies and when Romney has to run in the GE, I will bet that he avoids that as much as he can. I mean, all of his positions are only attractive to the RW base. Just killing Medicare is one position that should destroy his hopes with indies.

choicelady : kes- someone noted that unlike real debates, these GOP ones have been staged by various party factions, so there are no rules, no standards, it’s all just a chance to cheer and jeer. That’s why they’re so personal and ugly.

KQµårk 死神 : I just can’t wait until Romney flip flops back to the center when he does win the nomination. He’s already started flipping on immigration and the GOP base will not be happy.

Sabreen60 : CL, I think they have an inferiority complex. I think they make up these lies to make themselves seem important or more interesting. It’s kinda sad – as I can now look back decades later.

Chernynkaya : Here’s one of many «link»

choicelady : kes – pathological liars lie for attention, that’s all.

SallyT : Hey, I like the show for entertainment. But, he was really going to bat for the President. Even about the Gov of AZ being disrespectful.

KQµårk 死神 : Sabreen IDK what Repugs were thinking with all these debates. They are all ugly, petty and personal. They are not about issues at all. Even in 2008 by the end there were too many Dem debates during the primaries and at the end they got personal too.

kesmarn : I think generally the moderators have been abysmal across the board, Sabreen. And some of the audiences even worse.

SallyT : Sabreen, I haven’t heard one. Well, nothing but going to the moon.

choicelady : Sally – is it a GOOD thing when a demented fool suddenly comes over to your side???? Maher fighting FOR Obama??? I think that’s almost scary.

KQµårk 死神 : Of course there were other things but you do question ones sanity if they like Republicans.

kesmarn : Oooo…c’lady. You really got the classic pathological liar. The kind that lies even when there’s nothing in it for ‘em.

Sabreen60 : I have not watched the debates, but have read comments here, TOD and Twitter. It doesn’t appear that the moderators asked any of the candidates to lay out an economic platform or a foreign policy platform.

choicelady : KQ – now THAT is clearly insane! LOL!! Glad you got out!

Chernynkaya : CL–just, WOW!

KQµårk 死神 : Exactly Cher and that’s not going to work in the general election. We forget most people don’t know who Romney is and now everyone is defining who he is. When Obama get’s him you would swear he was Gordon Gekko personified.

choicelady : Mine said he was shot trying to talk a guy down in a bar. Oddly, no wound… Then he’d been burned while doing a summer job in a steel plant. Oddly, no burn. And his first love had died of leukemia. Oddly his parents did not know. And on and on and on.

SallyT : Tonight Maher was fighting hard for Obama.

Chernynkaya : KQ–good for you! I think Repubs have a mental disease that bleeds into the rest of their lives.

kesmarn : Excellent reason, KQ!

Chernynkaya : AL–perfect description of Mahre. Emotionally and intellectually stunted.

KQµårk 死神 : I left my first wife because she was going to vote for GHWB in 1992.

Chernynkaya : So far, all Romney is running on is “I can beat Obama that N… who you all think is the antichrist.” All he talks about is Obama. He rarely talks about his platform. Once he DOES talk about it, it’ll be toxic. Let’s not forget he loves Paul Ryan–end of Medicare.

kesmarn : You’re a quick learner, Sabreen. Good for you.

Sabreen60 : Didn’t Maher say he’s a libertarian?

Sabreen60 : LOL. 2 years and I was gone.

AdLib : Cher – Maher is emotionally petrified at 23 years old. Womanizer, pot-is-important , loves saying shocking things and amuses himself while rarely funny to most others (as opposed to just crass.

SallyT : She wouldn’t shut up and poor Martin Bashir couldn’t get a word in. But the NEW RULES were good.

kesmarn : OMG! Sabreen…you poor child! I hope you got out early on!

KQµårk 死神 : That’s why it’s political malpractice for Romney. That’s what you do if you are established like Bush did in 2004. But in 2000 Bush ran a campaign to show what he was for, even if it was all a lie and Romney is skipping that part. He’s made no argument what he is for and Kerry made the same mistake against Bush.

Sabreen60 : Kes, Found out he was in a hospital in Guam with alcoholic poisoning.

SallyT : That Kennedy gal that has a radio show.

Chernynkaya : Mahre is a Paulist–probabl y because 1) Mahre is an immature idiot, and 2) legalizing drugs.

AdLib : Sally, who was the female guest you speak of that was droning BS on Maher?

Chernynkaya : If Huck does, then that great ad will be unusable.

kesmarn : “Falling out of a helicopter”?? WOW. Points for creativity on that one at least, Sabreen.

AdLib : KQ – Romney is trying the Rove psychology of accusing your opponent of what you are. So Obama, who has tried most of his Presidency to be bi-partisan, is a divider…becaus e he wants the wealthy to pay the same taxes as their secretaries. That’s not an argument he can win when in a debate with Obama.

SallyT : KQ, I don’t think Bill Maher said anything to upset you tonight but this bitch he had on gave me a headache!

kesmarn : I think he will, Cher, because his corporate masters will tell him to.

Sabreen60 : Geez, CL are you psychic? My first husband. The man would lie about any and everything. I was so young and believed him. Even the one about him falling out the helicopter when he was in Vietnam – where he had never been.

KQµårk 死神 : Great question Cher I think he will at some point.

Chernynkaya : Do you think Huckabee will get on board the Mitt train?

KQµårk 死神 : Hey Sally to the T.

SallyT : Cher, you devil you!

SallyT : HI Sabreen, AdLib, Kes and KQ! Sorry so late.

AdLib : Hey Sabreen! I agree, the compulsive liars will just respond to an exposed lie with a new lie, there is no conscience or feeling that they did anything wrong. Lying to get what they want is a simple and reasonable proposition to them. But Huckabee’s 2008 ad that Newt was rebroadcasting was actually on the pount, if someone lies to get into the WH, how dangerous and untrustworthy will they be once they get there?

Chernynkaya : No Sally. I’m holding his. (Oh forgive me.)

choicelady : Sorry -I was married to one, and you’re correct.

KQµårk 死神 : Sally exactly that’s how aristocrats think.

choicelady : Sabreen – I was married to one. You

SallyT : Cher, you holding your own?

Sabreen60 : Hi Sally!

choicelady : Sally – Moi? An Aristocrat?

Chernynkaya : Sabreen, I’m with you on that. That’s how liars are.

KQµårk 死神 : The other big lie about Romney is that he calls Obama divisive but he’s never made one overture to even moderates to bring this country together. He just assumes since he’s the entitled one people will follow him. He really is the worst candidate I’ve ever seen run for president to make a case why he should be president.

kesmarn : Hey, Sally!

Sabreen60 : CL, I think pathological liars don’t care whether you know they’re lying or not. I have known a couple. When you call them out, they simply giggle or smile or say your hearing is bad.

choicelady : kes – there are different jobs. I have a friend who did a full day’s training and others who did not need to.

AdLib : Hey Sally!

kesmarn : That’s just what I want. I’m practicing my “menacing look” for the Baggers.

SallyT : Hi CL you Aristocrat.

Chernynkaya : Hiya, Sally!!

AdLib : And we all know how Romney acts when he’s caught in a lie…stammer, laugh, smile, stammer, fumble, laugh, smile, babble.

Chernynkaya : No training kes. I was a drone. The ones in charge told me what to do that day.

kesmarn : Oh I am going to be SO ON IT, c’lady. Those Baggers better watch it!

choicelady : Hey Sally – how are you? GREAT to see you!

AdLib : Consider the GE and how there will only be lies to use against Obama while there will be mountains of truths to hammer Romney with.

Chernynkaya : CL, I think he is a serial liar. I think he is so hallow he doesn’t know what he said–he’s on auto-pilot. No core at all.

SallyT : Good evening.

choicelady : kes – well at least ONE precinct in Ohio will be incorruptable! Kesmarn is on the JOB!

kesmarn : Cher,did you have to go for training or anything? I hope I can fit it in with work.

Chernynkaya : Kes, that’s great. I did it once and tho it was hard, it was fun and I felt so proud of myself. I still get teary eyed when people vote.

KQµårk 死神 : And think how big that is AdLib. Even politicians in your own party have different agendas.

choicelady : AdLib – from your PEN to the legislators’ conscience!

AdLib : CL – From your mouth to the Legislature’s ear…

choicelady : Cher – do you think Romney has either a split personality or ADD? Can he REALLY say that shit and not remember it?

kesmarn : Oh hey, I just remembered — got a call from the Board of Elections today asking me to work the primary here on March 6. Have no idea how they got my info. But cool. I wasn’t home @ the time but called back left a voice mail that I would be glad to do it.

AdLib : KQ – I like the description of CEOs as dictators who don’t have to answer to those who he leads. With all the crushing of unions, ask Romney about supporting the voice of the many through unions vs. having more unilateral control over all his employees…and the image of the CEO falls apart.

Chernynkaya : KQ–I think even ROMNEY said those things about Kerry! I can show you a quote where Mitt said a Blind trust was a scam, meant to hide things–which he accused Kerry of doing.

KQµårk 死神 : Yup kes and the no charisma and flip flopper thing too.

choicelady : AdLib – with all the distortions, it seems necessary to have something that will let people vet ads and call out untruths. Or whatever… Heh.

KQµårk 死神 : I just don’t see Dems attacking Romney’s radical foreign policy yet is what I’m saying.

kesmarn : You mean the “out of touch elitist” thing, KQ?

choicelady : KQ – I don’t see the Dems ceeding foreign policy NOW!

KQµårk 死神 : Obama is going to do to Romney what Repugs did to Kerry the only difference is this time all the shit they said about Kerry is more true about Romney.

kesmarn : That seems to have been a big factor, Sabreen, and it sure bought us a world of pain.

Chernynkaya : Agreed, AL.. We will need to work!

choicelady : kes – this is the worrisome thing. AWOL, bankruptcies, etc. – the MSM would not deal with it. Dan Rather did (and his evidence was accurate despite lies – the IBM typewriter WAS in use in 1971 ’cause I used one!) and got fired for it. MSM give cover to the conservative no matter how rotten his past.

AdLib : CL – It is a minority though of voters out there who see the policies of the Dems and Repubs as similar, which was the way it was in 2000. Now, some may have a blanket disrespect for all politicians but I don’t hear many making the case that there’s no difference.

Chernynkaya : CEO’s have one responsibility only: To make a profit. The US is not in the business of anything, least of all, making money. How is that so hard to understand? Do we now need a national discussion of what a nation is about?? I think we do.

Sabreen60 : Kes, It seems that far too many people only cared about someone they could have a beer with.

KQµårk 死神 : Also what the hell experience does Romney have with foreign policy? It’s terrible Dems cede that to every GOP nominee.

choicelady : AdLib – that was a popular meme in 1976, 1980, 1988, and again now. It’s largely the work of disgruntled lefties, but it’s also “they’re all just a buncha crooks” types who always vote RW anyway despite clear evidence that the RIGHT are the crooks.

AdLib : Cher – Today though, there is a clear choice and difference between the parties. Those who voted for Bush just to try a slightly different flavor of the same ice cream surely don’t see the Bagger GOP and the Dems in the same way today. I think Obama will crush Romney but we will need to work our butts off to counter the coming money storm from the Kochs et al who will be advertising lies to corrupt the election.

kesmarn :

kesmarn : And the crazy thing is, Sabreen, Dubya’s business record was of 100% FAILURE! Why didn’t people notice that?

Chernynkaya : CL–That’s true! Thanks!!

KQµårk 死神 : The biggest difference is a CEO runs a dictatorship of sorts and a president has to deal with an opposition party.

Chernynkaya : Kes, CL is NOT being kind. I agree with her totally. Now go blush somewhere!

choicelady : Cher – one way to get over worrying about the voters is to remember in both terms – WE DID NOT ELECT BUSH. Voter fraud and SCOTUS elected Bush.

Sabreen60 : I think I remember reading or hearing that only 2 presidents were from the business community – one being Dubya.

AdLib : Cher – In 2000, it was a popular meme that there was no difference between Repubs and Dems and that was understandable though clearly wrong.

kesmarn : Again You’re too kind, c’lady.

choicelady : kes – and I think Barak’s mom would have found YOU fascinating, too! Sorry that was an opportunity missed by you both.

KQµårk 死神 : Bush was the first MBA president but Hoover was a businessman most of his career because he was an inventor.

Chernynkaya : AdLib, you always make me feel better about voters. I’m still gobsmacked that we elected Dubya. I really am. So I never know how they will vote. I see polls where a big majority says they like a policy, and then they vote for the person who’s against that very thing. Honestly, I don’t know anything about voters.

kesmarn : Wish I could have known Barack’s mom, c’lady. I think she would have been fascinating to talk to.

choicelady : KQ – I agree. Can anyone think of a businessman who was a GOOD president? Who did not run the car into the ditch? I cannot.

AdLib : KQ – Excellent point. The leader of a country requires very different skills than a greedy corporate exec. It should indeed be made clear that what corporate execs practice is profits over what’s best for the majority of those they lead. Is that what we want? Wasn’t Bush our first official Corporate President?

KQµårk 死神 : If Gore had destroyed GWB when he made that argument it would not have been close enough for Bush to steal the election in 2000.

choicelady : kes – I see NO problem linking you two. First – there’s that word socialist. Clearly it’s a family hand me down. So there ya go.

Chernynkaya : KQ Well, I wouldn’t go so far as to say it’s the biggest thing, but it’s a good response to mitt. Also, lot’s of pudnuts have been saying that too.

choicelady : KQ -in all my days, I’ve never once been aware that Mormons gave a tinkers farthing about Israel. I’m seeing pressure here.

kesmarn : I’m trying to figure out some way that I might be related, c’lady, but so far no luck. It’s tough connecting Hungarian socialist to Kenyan socialist.

AdLib : Cher – I think most of the ignorant “I can be a millionaire magically one day” voters are the Baggers and other Repubs. Most reasoning people aren’t buying trickle down anymore, all the polls show they support higher taxes on the 1%…and if they thought that would affect them, I doubt they’d support it. I’m pretty confident about most voters not falling for the “Mitt will magically make me rich if elected!”

choicelady : Uh-oh – I’m talkin’ kes/Obama conspiracy and Google is baaaack…

KQµårk 死神 : The biggest thing Obama needs to counter with Romney is that being a CEO is nothing like running a country.

choicelady : kes – does this mean you’re related to Obama? I’m looking for a good conspiracy. Everyone has them I hear…it’s the IN thing.

kesmarn : It was a wild time, Cher. I remember very little of it.

Chernynkaya : Um that would be “HI.”

KQµårk 死神 : How come none of these ultra right wing nationalists don’t have a problem with Romney outsourcing our foreign policy decisions in the Mideast to Israel. I mean saying he would make the US have no space between Israel’s foreign policy is borderline treason.

choicelady : Cher – I would have agreed 8 years ago about the billionaire wannabes. I don’t think it’s so prevalent today. Even HGTV is featuring lower cost, less upscale housing on their programs. Less “kitchen envy” for me!

Chernynkaya : Kes, I nver know you went to school in HA! Awesome.

AdLib : Or…”Everytime you are confronted with an untruth you’ve promoted, you laugh and smile. Why is it so amusing to you?”

kesmarn : Cher, yes…parochial school, Catholic girls academy (same one as Marcy) and Catholic college (except for junior year @ the EW Center in Hawaii, where Barack’s mama went to school).

Chernynkaya : AL, It doesn’t make sense, but you know there are lots of people who harbor the fantasy they they too can be millionaires. But even among those who know they can’t some people worship the rich. I don’t trust voters very much.

choicelady : kes – it would be very interesting to know if Newt has Amway ties. RAchel pointed out his family foundation gave big money to that “pray away the gay” group that was so icky.

AdLib : How about prefacing a gotcha on Romney with, “…and could you begin your answer without a forced laugh and smile?”

KQµårk 死神 : Lunatic Fringe great 90′s song kes.

kesmarn : Romney reminds me of an Amway saleman. Glazed eyes. Peddling crap. Isn’t he somehow connected with those Michigan — deVos–Blackwate r–Amway people?

AdLib : Kes – Nice one!

AdLib : Cher – I get it but in the current environment of 99% vs. 1% and the 1% being “successful” because of bail outs and tax loopholes, that’s an argument that can be dissolved pretty quickly. All Obama needs to point out is that only 1% of Americans are millionaires so 99% of us won’t be.

Chernynkaya : Kes, did you go to a parochial school?

choicelady : AdLib – he will probably be the nominee, but he won’t get elected. The recent display of “human qualities” was so thin on the ground as to be meaningless. And he’s exhausted the supply of human emotion already.

kesmarn : Me too, Cher.

Chernynkaya : HAH kes–good one! (I had to take Latin in HS.)

kesmarn : Hope Newtie remembers his Latin so he can figure out what the word “lunatic” really means.

KQµårk 死神 : Hopefully he doesn’t AdLib.

KQµårk 死神 : AdLib Romney offers very little. His whole case is his business acumen and he stands on the shoulders of the last to great presidents that were prominent businessmen George W Bush and Herbert Hoover.

choicelady : AdLib – PLEEZE don’t put fat butt Newt and “moons” in the same sentence. Cannot handle it.

AdLib : CL – So how does ROmney get elected?

Chernynkaya : There is only one talking point that I think Mitt may have–among a certain sector. he said, I am successful, therefore I know how YOU can be successful too. I know how to do it. Now, it;s BS, but of all he;s said, that’s the only thing that makes any sense.

AdLib : Gingrich is taking credit for crescent moons.

choicelady : AdLib – Romney’s appeal is meaningless stuff about “making things better”. You got it.

kesmarn : Nada, c’lady. Nada.

KQµårk 死神 : CL all those pundits have really been exposed the last few months.

choicelady : Kasich is taking credit? So Big K – whadja actually DO to save those jobs???? Hmmmm???

KQµårk 死神 : kes

AdLib : Hey all, I’m back! So…what is Romney offering that appeals to indie voters? I can’t really see much more than empty generalities about making everything better.

Chernynkaya : What else would a soulless robot moan over? Seriously, have you seen the last 2 Newt ads against Mitt? Wow. I hope the DCCC buys them.

kesmarn : And then Kasich was on earlier today taking credit for the Ohio auto sector jobs that Pres Obama saved. Rooster taking credit for the dawn again. I’m surrounded by idiots.

choicelady : KQ – it’s a toss up between Reich and Moore. Anyone ever see them in the same room or would all the air get sucked out immediately?

KQµårk 死神 : It’s like Romney saying making $370K was not much. Of course now we found out that was not true and he made closer to $480K in wages from speeches and such.

choicelady : Cher – exactly. Moaning over bricks and mortar. That’s kinda creepy.

Chernynkaya : Exactly, CL. I mean, how tone deaf is that?

choicelady : Cher – substitute “bank” for Shylock in Merchant of Venice: “if you prick us, do we not bleed…” Oh. Wait. No we don’t.

KQµårk 死神 : I don’t know who is more desperate for attention Kucinich or Moore.

kesmarn : I mean I know that’s something that needs to be addressed, but -+- really!

Chernynkaya : Here’s the actual quote: “Well, the banks aren’t bad people. They’re just overwhelmed right now. The banks are scared to death, of course. They’re feeling the same thing that you’re feeling.”

kesmarn : The FOX local station is interviewing Kucinich in their studio. “What’s the biggest problem Toledo faces?” K: “The toxic algae bloom in Lake Erie.” RIIIIGHT.

KQµårk 死神 : Cheers Cher that’s the other thing he said I forgot

Chernynkaya : And he added, “They’re feeling what you’re feeling.”

choicelady : Cher – banks have “feelings”???? ?? Aw where – in their night deposit drawer? Come ON – get a GRIP, Romney!

KQµårk 死神 : This is what he actually said. Romney, “Now, the banks aren’t bad people. They’re just overwhelmed right now,”

Chernynkaya : What is kuchinich whining about now?

Sabreen60 : I do believe Reich is a Puma.

choicelady : kes – used to LOVE Dennis. No more.

Chernynkaya : CL–Mitt said banks have feelings. He actually said that.

kesmarn : OH GOD!!!! I just looked up and fucking KUCINICH is on the local news in Toledo!

choicelady : kes – LOL!!! I think you’ve define “personhood” in Romney’s eyes perfectly!!! Corporations yes. Human beings – not so much.

choicelady : KQ – WHAT banks are “hurting too”? Not the ones that created the mess! What a buffoon is Romney!

Chernynkaya : CL–Reich is a loser. I can no linger stand him–another PL Emo moron.

KQµårk 死神 : Reich is your typical firebagger. Like Hamster and the PUMA’s they wanted Hillary and attack Obama from the left even though both never attacked Bill Clinton.

kesmarn : Romney speaks lovingly of the banks and their feelings. He truly does believe corporations are people. He just doesn’t believe people are people.

choicelady : kes – I really, really respect her for her long and total commitment to labor and laboring people. I know she’ll get trounced by pro choice folks, but even with my record of commitment to choice, I will take her over almost anyone any day.

Chernynkaya : KQ you just nailed it: “stupid” lies. His lies are not even cleaver. He’s such a liar, he’s one of thise people who say they’ve seen a movie when they haven’t–just senseless lies. and he keep getting caught!

KQµårk 死神 : I mean ‘banks are hurting too’ WTF in this day and age in front of people being foreclosed on.

choicelady : KQ – that was my screeching commentary about RR then. He never made a peep of protest against Clinton’s massive sell outs – and he has the NERVE to criticize Obama for not yet having unravelled the despicable mess Clinton made. Not ALL George’s fault!

KQµårk 死神 : Cher I can’t get over how many stupid things Romney says and that includes stupid lies.

Chernynkaya : Hey, Sabreen!

kesmarn : Marcy Kaptur was a lone voice in the wilderness opposing NAFTA back in the day, KQ.

choicelady : Cher – I totally agree about your assessment of Mitt. Spot on!

KQµårk 死神 : Reich claims to be this progressive saint now but where was he when Clinton signed all those trade agreements that had no provisions for labor?

Chernynkaya : Cl, Mitt is a terrible candidate and politician. Truly awful–objective ly, not as a partisan. But he looks so good next to everyone else. He will be decimated by Obama among anyone with half a brain. (or about a 3/5 of the population.)

choicelady : Sabreen! Welcome!

choicelady : ADLib – EXCELLENT. Congrats all around to the girls!

kesmarn : Hey, Sabreen!

choicelady : Cher – RR is not even a GOOD economist!

kesmarn : Hey, KQ! Howdy back…justa minute ago.

Sabreen60 : Hi Everyone!

choicelady : KQ – LOL!!!! Thank you for verifying my feelings about RR. He’s a narcissistic popinjay, IMHO.

kesmarn : YAY! BabyLib!

KQµårk 死神 : kes when did you sneak in howdy.

AdLib : OT – Game over, they won! Heading home so brb!

kesmarn : What a dilemma for the GOP: the racists love Newtie and the rich guys love Mittens. Split base.

choicelady : kes – they have to wait until you’re at work. You’d blow them out of the water. They pick times you can’t show them up.

Chernynkaya : I don’t put much stock in Reich –at least not as a political pudnut. He’s an economist mostly.

KQµårk 死神 : Reich is a Nostradumbarse when it comes to predictions. He still thinks Obama is going to choose Hillary as VP.

choicelady : Cher – that’s pretty funny: improving his skills, weak as they are. Damning with VERY faint praise!

Chernynkaya : I’m starting to think all these debates are improving Mitt’s skills, weak as they are.

kesmarn : I’m so outta the loop, having missed the SOTU and the latest Repub debate. Why do they wait till I’m at work before they do anything fun?

KQµårk 死神 : 80-90% of the baggers will show up for Romney no doubt but it won’t be a turn out like 2010 at least not in the same ratio of Dems sitting home.

choicelady : Robert Reich says we should not want a Newt primary win – he’s too damn scary and dangerous. Not sure that’s true, but I take his point. Thought I think he himself is often a jerk.

kesmarn : Wow…that is weird, Cher…

KQµårk 死神 : After FL allot of states Romney even won in 2008 are comming up with the southern states.

Chernynkaya : Kes I don’t know. It won’t let me reaTweet or favorite anything.

AdLib : KQ – I think Romney has it locked up…and the Baggers will be furious.

kesmarn :

Chernynkaya : Good point, CL–we’re descendants after all.

choicelady : kes – no need, dear friend. It’s Google who should feel cheap. YOU are perfection personified.

KQµårk 死神 : I think it will be drawn out thanks the Gingrich’s win in SC and the southern states coming up but I just don’t see how anyone else can win with all the delegates for FL going to the winner.

kesmarn : Hola, Cher! What happened with Twitter?

choicelady : Cher – that “conquering” of Mt. Everest was the Brits. We have chosen to emulate their habit of empire and dominion.

Chernynkaya : And kes, I’m in Twitter jail for some unknown reason.

kesmarn : I feel so cheap, c’lady.

Chernynkaya : Kes, at least it’s not crawling you! Welcome!

choicelady : kes – That’s so, so, so GOOGLISH! At least Google could have said “hi” to you!

Chernynkaya : Americans are really a war-loving nation. We use the term “war” for everything. Christ, we even “conquer” Mt Everest.

choicelady : KQ – Maybe Romney has it, but I’m not putting money on it. Every state is different, every population.

kesmarn : Google just left me…Without a word.

KQµårk 死神 : So who thinks Romney has this GOP nomination Gong Show wrapped up if he wins FL?

choicelady : kes – I hope Google deferred to you. You have standing. They just interlope.

choicelady : KQ – oh, indeed, but the real defection came over Vietnam I think. McGovern was the dividing line – good a guy as he was, he was not speaking their language.

Chernynkaya : I pout up a pretty good history of Alinsky by Angry Black Lady today for those of us unfamiliar with him. She also said what Tweety said–he was liked across the spectrum.

kesmarn : Good Friday evening, kids. I just crawled in with Google.

KQµårk 死神 : I think it was allot more complex than both those issues CL.

choicelady : KQ – Booker is correct.

choicelady : Cher – Chris Matthews, with all his problems, pointed out that a whole lotta conservatives LIKED Alinsky so that’s a major stupid move by Newt. Those who know liked him. Those who don’t are just scratching their heads – Huh?

Chernynkaya : If people voted–and we had no Constitution–th is place would be a tyranny.

KQµårk 死神 : CL that was the gist of Booker’s argument the 14th amendment guarantees equal treatment for all and there is one class of people that don’t get that now.

choicelady : KQ – I actually don’t think that’s true. It was Vietnam that lost us the white blue collar vote. He DID know he’d lose the South. But it deserved to be lost. Too bad we did not build a fence.

Chernynkaya : Yes CL. And it’s not just that they’re nuts. Most are really low info. Most voters don’t know who Boehner and Canter are! And that’s why I love this Saul alinsky thing by Newt–nobody knows who the hell he’s talking about.

AdLib : All the GOP has are lies so with that sign hung on them, they are disarmed. That’s why I think it should be a focus.

choicelady : KQ – American have to get this point: we do not get to vote on other people’s rights. They are guaranteed by law, period.

KQµårk 死神 : I just saw a pundit interview someone who said after LBJ sighed the civil rights act he knew they would lose working class whites for generations.

choicelady : Cher – that’s what I’m saying. Indies haven’t a clue. One way today, 180-degree opposite tomorrow. Nut jobs are not just in the rightwing…

Chernynkaya : CL, I’ve said this before and still think this: I don’t believe many polls. Voters are inscrutable. Anyone who tries to tell us what they think are kidding themselves and us.

choicelady : Cher – you can Google the vote on the Civil Rights Act, and yup – you’re right. Some PL and Emoprogs claim LBJ pounded the podium and the Dixicrats caved. NO WAY! Even Al Gore, Sr. voted against it!

KQµårk 死神 : Christie said that NJ should bring up same sex marriage as an election measure and Booker articulated one of the best reasons why civil rights should never be dealt with that way. «link»

Chernynkaya : I didn’t see Booker, but other responded. Christie knows jack SHIT about the Civil Rights movement. What a load of crap. The whole point was that Southern voters WANTED segregation you fat asshole.

choicelady : Cher – I read polls saying Indies are still sort of leaning toward Obama. I think they lie…indies, I mean.

choicelady : Hey AdLib – tell her congrats from me!

KQµårk 死神 : Woot go team AL!

choicelady : KQ – no – what happened? The words “civil rights” and “Christie” don’t fit well on the same page.

Chernynkaya : KQ-I have written off EVERY Repub. This election is only about the Indies–who lean right by a significant percentage.

AdLib : Hey CL! She just scored a basket!

KQµårk 死神 : Anyone see Cory Booker’s response to Christie on bringing up civil rights on a voter referendum?

choicelady : Cher – I was pretty sure you meant Romney. Just checking!

choicelady : Wow AdLib – that’s GREAT. Are you a sideline shouter or a quiet Dad?

Chernynkaya : CL-Romney!

Chernynkaya : AL–YAY!

choicelady : Hi KQ – always good to see you!

AdLib : Cher, ithey’re up 8-6!

KQµårk 死神 : CL welcome!

choicelady : Cher – you can’t stand what a blatant liar WHO is? I assume you’re not meaning Obama!

KQµårk 死神 : Cher I’m with you. I cringe every time he lies because I know at least 40% of the people no matter what will believe him.

Chernynkaya : Choice!! Hi there!

choicelady : ADLib – did her team win? Overtime?

choicelady : Hi everyone! Hope you’re all well?

AdLib : I think there needs to be a primary focus on framing Romney as a fraud and a liar, “If his lips are moving, he’s lying.” With his image cemented as a fraud, there’s no way out for him.

KQµårk 死神 : Cher absolutely that’s a big problem. That’s why it’s so important that we don’t let go of the true meme that Romney is a liar and other MSM memes that are developing.

Chernynkaya : Yes, KQ, The only reason Mitt looked good was, yet again, his opponents are so bad. Not the same with Obama! I just can’t stand what a blatant liar he is.

KQµårk 死神 : Obama does not invest offshore, in blind trusts, etc.

Chernynkaya : Is her team winning? GO Team AdLib!!

Chernynkaya : But what steams me is that people won’t hear the fact check. They may just watch the debate. I think all Obama can do before the debates is try to debunk the lies ahead of the debates.

KQµårk 死神 : In at least three places Romney’s response to ethical charges Gingrich made was ‘well Newt you are just as bad’. That won’t work with Obama.

AdLib : Cher – At my daughter’s basketball game. It was a half hour late today.

KQµårk 死神 : Obama can say it but will the media back him up.

Chernynkaya : Romney will be flattened. But the thing is, he simply lies about everything. I wonder how that works in a debate? CAn Obama say to him, that’s not true? Can someone call him on it in real time?

AdLib : Wait until Romney faces off with Obama on immigration, he’ll be flattened.

Chernynkaya : KQ, he could actually BUY votes in a swing state.

Chernynkaya : Where are you AL?

KQµårk 死神 : WB Cher!

Chernynkaya : I’m baaaaack!

KQµårk 死神 : If Romney thinks he can buy a debate audience like he did against Newt and debate on petty issues he’s gonna be hugely dissapointed in the genera.

AdLib : FYI, I’m doing this from my iPhone, have to refresh to see new comments so excuse the delays!

KQµårk 死神 : Like usual Republicans turn an issue like immigration into demagoguery. Gingrich just could attack Romney because both don’t want comprehensive immigration reform that matters.

AdLib : Romney loves immigrants in the same way Newt does, those toilets of the wealthy need lots of cleaning.

Chernynkaya : I’m going to clear my cache anyway. BB soon.

Chernynkaya : OK, will do.

AdLib : Cher- There is a funky thing sometimes when reloading the page. Try clicking on the Planet logo at the top then going to the page you want.

Chernynkaya : Just like Romney’s grand daddy did.

Chernynkaya : But since we’re early, I have had trouble loading the Planet again. I get the page to appear, but the circle loading icon spins endlessly.

AdLib : We can always self-deport.

Chernynkaya : I’m great AL, thank! KQ–that’s terrible.

AdLib : KQ – Nice to see you!!!

KQµårk 死神 : Hey Cher for some reason your Daily Planets don’t seem to load fully on my laptop. It’s a problem on my end no doubt.

AdLib : Hey Cher! Doing great, how are you?

Chernynkaya : We can stand around awkwardly for a while, KQ.

KQµårk 死神 : Hey I’m unfashionable early for once.

Chernynkaya : Good evening! How are you tonight, AdLib?

AdLib : Don’t forget to say hi when you arrive!

AdLib : Vox Populi, our live chat about the week’s events begins tonight at 7 pm PST. Hope to see you then!

AdLib : Sleep well!

SallyT : I’ll probably be here and good night to you, too.

AdLib : Heh! Thanks, I love OR!

SallyT : And, you can move to Oregon anytime! No complaints.

AdLib : Thanks Sally! Have a great weekend and maybe see you here tomorrow for the SC Primary results. Night!

SallyT : See you in the posts!

SallyT : Anyway, have a good night and thanks for staying up with me and closing the bar.

AdLib : Yep, enjoyed the chat too!

SallyT : I had to show you I was typing the same thing to you.

SallyT : Well, I think it is just the two of us,

AdLib : Well…looks like it’s around that time to end tonight’s edition of Vox Populi! Thanks Sally for closing the bar with me! Have a great weekend!

SallyT : That would be cool.

AdLib : Actually, OWS should do the Human Megaphone of his laugh, echoing it every time he does it in a debate.

SallyT : There will be when they get the Dems in the audience.

AdLib : There should be a loud moan from the audience everytime he does that.

SallyT : I think they already have, Adlib.

AdLib : At what point will most Americans tire of the phony laugh and phony smile as a way to answer serious questions he doesn’t like?

SallyT : And, Newt will say to the host, “How dare you ask me such a question!”

SallyT : He is going to get so tongue tied that his face will cave.

AdLib : If Romney is choking on such simple issues now, what do you think’s going to happen against Obama?

SallyT : There you go. Murph has it!

AdLib : Cool, thanks Murph for the link and Sally for the catch!

SallyT : It might have been on Rachel’s tonight.

MurphTheSurf3 : «link»

AdLib : Laura Ingram?

MurphTheSurf3 : INGRAHAM: You’ve noted that there are signs of improvement in the economy on the horizon. How do you answer the president’s argument that the economy is getting better in a general election campaign if you yourself are saying that it’s getting better? ROMNEY: Well, of course it’s getting better. The economy always gets better after a recession. There’s always a recovery. There’s never been a time anywhere in the world where the economy has never recovered. But the question is: has it recovered by virtue of something that the president’s done, or has he delayed the recovery and made it more painful?

SallyT : I can’t remember where I heard it, damn it! But it was that lady that has that conservative talk show.

AdLib : Murph – That would be extremely cool, to get such scoops! Cheers!

AdLib : Sally – I do want to track that down!

SallyT : They said that was going to be in the Dems ads for sure!

MurphTheSurf3 : Ad…I will reach out to my SC friends for some inside scoops. I should have a few good stories.

SallyT : AdLib, you have to find that radio talk show that Romney was on that he said that after a recession there is always an upturn and that is where Obama is. The host said she didn’t think that would sound good and Romney said, “well, that is the truth,”

MurphTheSurf3 : Ad..count me in.

AdLib : Night Murph, we’ll have a SC primary thread here tomorrow, hope to see you then!

MurphTheSurf3 : Ad and Sally….I think we are all correct….much truth here tonight. Enjoyed our late night chat. Cheers! And good night.

SallyT : I agree AdLib!

AdLib : Pig Newton.

SallyT : Murph, LOL, I think you have nailed him!

AdLib : Sally – In a debate against Obama, both Newt and Romney would be shown up to be abject liars and frauds. This is the huge think Obama has going for him, he alone will be speaking truth while all Romney or Newt have to run on are lies. As those lies are knocked out from under them, they will fall.

MurphTheSurf3 : A newt is an aquatic amphibian of the family Salamandridae, although not all aquatic salamanders

SallyT : AdLib, I wonder if Newt would be that swift against Obama. Right now he is throwing out lies and attacks against Obama that aren’t true, like he is the most dangerous President ever. I don’t think he will have those kinds of come backs with Obama next to him. I think he will have a hard time against the truth.

AdLib : Sally – I think Obama would totally humiliate Newt in a debate as well. As for how he looks, Newt is like a walking stomach, a physical mirror of his self-indulgence and greed. Romney reflects his superficiality and greed as well but you are right, he is not a toad like Newt.

MurphTheSurf3 : Sally….looks count….I wrote last night that Newt reminds of that fat little kid on the playground who is a know it all in the classrooms (whose arrogance drives even the teachers crazy). He got picked on and bullied. As an adult he has become the bully. Bullies never look good. In his case he will look really bad.

SallyT : Have you guys notice when they announce them at the beginning of a debate and they walk out on stage? Newt looks, well, icky next to the others. Except for Ron Paul. Paul just looks old.

AdLib : Murph – I agree that Newt would be far swifter on his toes in a fight against Obama than Romney but in his swiftness, would be far more repulsive to the indie voters who don’t like hateful candidates. Mitt will be less hateful but less skilled at debating Obama. So, on the nubers alone, Romney would look right now to be the stronger of the two but in the end, I think Romney could lose as badly as Newt would.

SallyT : Another thing, guys, Romney and Obama are both nice looking men. Newt, well, he will look fat and dumpy up against Obama.

SallyT : Murph, I don’t know if it was a debate but it was a face off and they said that Newt was tongue tied. Maybe it was something after they were both out of office. I will have to read more about that. However, they said that Newt looked down beaten up against Clinton. Of course, most would, don’t you think? Clinton can talk like no other. That man is smart and knows so much.

AdLib : Murph – Got it! As I said, they don’t need the 3 Straight Victories ballroom when it is now “1 out of 3 Victories!”. I’m liking this race again, was a bit disappointed when it looked like a quick win for Romney but it did have its plusses.

MurphTheSurf3 : Ad Lib….reading your post it sounds like you sort of disagree and agree at the same time. I think reading your POV I do too. They both will look awful.

SallyT : They thought Newt might yelled at the media host but he won’t be able to get away with that with Obama.

AdLib : Murph – I don’t know that I’d agree, Newt is so hugely disliked by moderate voters, he would only be digging himself a deeper hole each time he attacked Obama. As for Romney, I do think he’s clearly exposed that he has a glass jaw and can’t deal with anything that doesn’t go his way. On that count, I do think he will be much easier to beat than some may think. And on the debate stage, seeing the artificial, fake smiled Romney up against Obama will make him look so weak and insubstantial.

MurphTheSurf3 : Sally….good point but I do not think Clinton and Gingrich were ever really in a staged debate together were they?

MurphTheSurf3 : Ad Lib…misled you…my reference was to the ballroom….so they think they will need a small one…for a small crowd…but I suspect they are also downsizing overall including the penthouse suite (now closet).

SallyT : Murph, someone pointed out that Newt was tough in debates but that he caved when he went up against Clinton. He can’ bark loud enough against the truth.

SallyT : I’ll do my best for ya, AdLib! I was planing on pointing to the ocean.

MurphTheSurf3 : Sally….Obama will have an easier job wiping out Romney because he will not be able to fight back as effectively as Newt who is more capable in the bare knuckle debates we are now seeing.

AdLib : Sally, please point the “This Way To California” sign to TX so those Repubs don’t come back here!

AdLib : Murph – That’s very funny! They need to start saving now because they’ll have to spend a lot more against Newt! And no sense to rent the Victory Suite when you’re going to lose!

SallyT : AdLib, I think Bend got stuck with all the Calif Repubs, too. But, I think they are leaving now.

MurphTheSurf3 : Ad Lib…Having read your piece on how an easy win for Mitt would keep him unprepared for the battle with Obama, I know what you mean about a fast win having an upside. But the way this is going, Mitt will be exposed to far more damage than a fair fight would create…..here is a little tidbit….the Romney campaign has asked the hotel where they were planning their primary night festivities for one TWO sizes smaller than the one they reserved. Oh My!

AdLib : Better? Well, Romney would lose by less than Newt in running against Obama but I truly don’t believe that in the end, either could beat him.

AdLib : Sally – I get it and totally understand. You surely don’t want a replay of what happened in the past. However, such a boom could only be based on a real economy, not a bubble. People would be moving back to OR for real jobs at realistic wages and paying a more reasonable price for homes.

SallyT : Okay, you two, who is the better of the two to go against Obama?

AdLib : Murph – That’s great news! I do see an upside to Mitt quickly winning the nom but I see a far better benefit to Mitt having to be sullied more and having to spend more of his money on Newt than on Obama.

SallyT : No doubt about it. It takes a lot of different things. But, as you are trying to point out, you have to start somewhere. I am just the doubting Thomas for discussion sack. You know I am all for it in the long run.

AdLib : Sally – I knew of people who moved up there after selling their homes down here. You explained it perfectly, they took their profits here, bought their “dream house” there then slowly realized…”How do I get a job that will pay for this?”

MurphTheSurf3 : Ad LIb…I was VERY involved in the state political scene for years and this person is a Dem field organizer whose GOP info sources are excellent.

SallyT : And, you know, AdLib, Portland had the biggest turnout of the 99%.

AdLib : Murph – This is from folks you know out there? Sure hope that’s what happens tomorrow, making life miserable and complicated for Mitt makes me smile.

SallyT : And, Portland is one of the most liberal cities you can ever imagine. Pretty city, too, with the two big rivers and all its bridges. At night it is a beautiful site.

MurphTheSurf3 : Anybody who is still here…the word from SC is Newt by 4 to 6 Percent AND the State Organization is definitely NOT in the field.

AdLib : Sally – FYI, CA is suffering from the same problems, home prices are still high, taxes are insufficient and unemployment is high. It takes a number of elements to get our economies back on track and I do think HC is an important one. It will help but more is needed and one big thing would be higher taxes on the wealthy to help pay for more government spending on infrastructure, teachers, firemen, etc. The more money there is in more of the 99%s hands, the stronger our economy will get.

SallyT : They could buy land cheap, AdLib, and they built these great big houses. Than they realized that there weren’t that many jobs. They couldn’t sale the houses so they just walked away. It is a real sad story down in Bend because of that. Oregon is trying hard to get more businesses. But, no one is moving corp offices or plants right now.

AdLib : I understand, I remember when people from CA were flooding up to OR and WA. It is kind of an unspoken story about what happens when a bubble gives homeowners in expensive cities money to move to other cities. It’s like a disease that spreads.

SallyT : We do have a lot of movie companies come here because of our corporate taxes.

AdLib : And OR would of course be with CA and many other Blue States in setting up HC Exchanges. If you consider the cost to employers of HC, it’s a huge chunk. Any state with an exchange that allows their employees to be covered affordably, would be a magnet for business and that means jobs.

SallyT : It got so bad with people moving in here that we started advertising that it really does rain here! It wasn’t funny, AdLib. It was serious to the people living here and trying to get by. There are no simple answers.

AdLib : Sally – OR would be a huge beneficiary of a state HC exchange and would attract businesses from the South.

AdLib : Sally – I do think that what would happen would be a two stage thing. First, the Southern states would try to prove how much they don’t believe in government and would not create exchange. Then once they see how it has damaged their state, they’ll do a u-turn and start them up. Just as AL has with their anti-immigrant legislation that chased out workers and let crops die on the vine. Once they realized how it hurt them, they’ve now turned around and are voluntarily trying to undo some of that law.

SallyT : Oregon, and we have a high minimun wage, which people come for, and good state health care for children. We had a lot of high tech companies but they have moved out. Our large call center in Bend went overseas.

SallyT : Well, I think the North is ahead of the South in so many ways. Perhaps that might be one of the ways to wake up the south.

AdLib : Night Invient!

AdLib : Sally – That is a pickle you’re in. It would seem though that having more businesses move back there (where are you again?) and offering competitive salaries would help to address the situation best.

SallyT : Good night Invient. See you later, I hope.

AdLib : Sally – Not judging, just trying to address your concerns. There are a lot of Blue States out there, many of which have suffered the reverse, a loss of population to Southern states. Think of this, it could lead to a rebirth of states like MI which have lost a lot of citizens. There would be many states that have exchanges and as population migrates to them, the Southern states would first suffer then I think, eventually jump on the Exchange wagon. Eventually, it may very well lead to national single payer. But in the process, the best minds may migrate North and economic growth may benefit the North far more than the sSouth.

invient : Sally, ad. Good night. I’m out. In case you don’t find the article I mentioned on that blog here it is. «link»

SallyT : Hopefully, people are now moving back to Calif and leaving us with oversized houses that no one can afford. They just walked away from the houses because they were upside down. That has crippled our state and tax income.

KQµårk 死神 : Yes that’s how it works for the most part AdLib. The big losers are the trial lawyers in the no fault system so they would push back. Because the rewards are fixed based on specific types of injuries. But care is always provided first. It sounds like tort reform but it’s not. Because tort reform does a bad job of differentiating different types of injuries.

SallyT : Our taxes here are out of controlled because so many people relocated from Calif and over paid for housing here (which of course was cheaper than Calif). Now with the housing market collapes we are suck with high taxes and no jobs.

invient : If its exciting sure, otherwise no. Where are you moving?

AdLib : KQ – I will have a thread up for tomorrow’s SC returns. Sleep well and see you here tomorrow!

SallyT : Yes, AdLib, I do know that. I think you are over judging me on this. I am just saying that one state cannot support everyone. And, if you are the state that is smart enough to do that right thing, you can’t expect them to do it for everyone. That is when the people in the state that have thought ahead get punished in housing costs and other things as well.

KQµårk 死神 : Wow it’s getting late. I’m out for the night as well. Anyone gonna be around when the results of SC come in?

AdLib : KQ – As long as the judgements plaintiffs would get were logical and for those who suffer deaths to loved ones or permanent injuries that require care for the rest of their lives, they would need to be assured of being able to receive large enough judgements that fairly address that.

KQµårk 死神 : I guess the thing to look at were no fault works well is with car insurance. It’s not like a doctor would get off without paying more than anyone else. Yes there is some trade off like other countries you don’t have the massive rewards juries give in the US but the other side of the equation is more fair too.

AdLib : Yay KQ! I forgot where you said your were moving!

SallyT : AdLib, it showed how people can be told something to sway them but how important trial by jury is because they hear the real matter and how it happened.

AdLib : Sally – This is how you grow an economy. There are the REAL job creators which are small businesses and which then need to hire employees. Did you know that when you hear jobs reports, it is mostly small businesses that have hired all those people? It may seem like a long time now but not long ago, we had a booming economy that was producing a lot of jobs and they came from start ups. So if you want a jobs boom, you need a small business boom and slashing the expense of HC for small business would be a boon for that.

SallyT : They had the coffee machine set higher than the coffee maker company said it should be set.

invient : Mandatory arbitration. That should be illegal. I thought you couldn’t sign away your rights.

SallyT : I know, Invient, and the pictures. I don’t think people knew that McDonalds had gotten more complaints and usually just paid them off. That coffee was as hot as the water in your car radiator!

AdLib : Sally – I saw that doc and it totally blew up what most people have been deceive about when it comes to the McDonalds hot coffee lawsuit. The public has been convincingly lied to and needs to learn that.

invient : Yes, bill Meyers had good analysis on the souths mentality and how it was developed. He was on real time.

KQµårk 死神 : Well we are getting out of the South this year, we’ve had it.

AdLib : Invient – As a fantasy, I would get some satisfaction out of letting the South secede and find out how quickly they would collapse without the Feds giving them money. However, many of our Progressive friends live in The South so that would be unfair to them. In essence, at least psychologically, there continues to be an ongoing Civil War, as the SC debate proved.

invient : Kq, I watched hot coffee as well and it is eye opening. Especially the scene where they tell the story of the guy who voted for it, then it happens to him. My case isn’t frivolous, oh woes me.

SallyT : Perhaps, but not everyone can work for themselves. And, there are just so many jobs. Don’t get me wrong. I am for it but I also know how a state can get over run by those moving in, too.

KQµårk 死神 : The worse part is tort reform is not even effective. Litigation makes costs high not because of lawsuits. The whole malpractice insurance is a worse racket than HC insurance was. They pay less than 50% of premiums for claims as an example.

AdLib : Sally, as KQ mentions, I think that the flow of people from Red States to Blue States would bring many who will create jobs. Anyone starting up a small business would be much better off in such a state, not having to pay for employee HC or have employees out due to not having HC. It’s not just the poor who this would help, it’s the entrepreneurs who would greatly benefit and having them move to Blue States would mean more jobs.

SallyT : I saw a show on HBO about lawsuits and how the corps put stories out that make them seem foolish when in fact they aren’t. Like the lady that sued McDonalds over the coffee.

invient : Kq, if we do separate, let’s keep the southerners down wind and water. Just saying.

invient : Isn’t that what malpractice insurance is?

KQµårk 死神 : The way southern states compete is they run to the bottom. They don’t care if people make a working wage and give corps ridiculous land deals, environment waivers and tax breaks.

AdLib : KQ – The Repub lobbying for capping malpractice burns me up. The wealthy can have unlimited capital gains and loopholes but someone whose life has been severely damaged and will need paid care for the rest of their life should just be screwed so that insurance companies can make more unlimited profits. At the same time, I am always for making a system work better and as you describe, a pool for malpractice awards makes enormous sense.

invient : Adlib, on the Norman Goldman radio show a guy called in about succession from southern states so they can have their lessez faire capitalism. It was about them usually getting more federal dollars back than they put in.

KQµårk 死神 : Think about it AdLib in blue states you actually would have the freedom to work for yourself and not be a wage slave.

SallyT : Okay, AdLib, if the state they are coming to have jobs.

invient : KQ: better yell palomino.

AdLib : Sally – All Blue states that have an exchange should absolutely welcome all folks to their state. Since people still have to pay through the exchange and it’s not an entitlement, it costs the state nothing. And think of the huge drop in unpaid medical costs that are passed onto those who pay premiums, if all the undocumented workers who use the emergency room for primary care have HC and get treated early, before it becomes an emergency. HC costs will really go down.

KQµårk 死神 : Actually AdLib I learned allot about the true cost of malpractice from the Denialism blog.

SallyT : That’s okay, KQ, if it is the wife. Just not the Police.

KQµårk 死神 : I’m locked up constantly.

invient : Ad, sure thing.

SallyT : I bookmarked to read later, Invient. Thanks

SallyT : Well, as long as you’re not locked up, KQ.

AdLib : Thanks Invient, opened the site in a window and will read later!

KQµårk 死神 : Sorry for the double post my system locked up for a second.

AdLib : Seeya Murph!

AdLib : Night Patsy! Sleep well!

KQµårk 死神 : Sweet dreams Patsy.

KQµårk 死神 : Sweet dreams Patsy.

invient : Here’s a blog I like to read, the author had a recent article on mitt that I enjoyed. «link» He is creating a network called North Star, that is meant to reinvigorate the left. By left I mean super left.

AdLib : Night CL! Have a wonderful weekend (should be raining a bit so you stay warm and dry as you can during the march tomorrow!).

KQµårk 死神 : There is AdLib with more regulation by the medical boards instead. All it really means is broader risk pools or single payer malpractice insurance in some systems.

MurphTheSurf3 : Got to leave. But here is my man, the Prez at the Apollo to seranade y’all (a tip of the hat to SC)…«link» .youtube.com/wat ch?v=EGtImPa5ygw

SallyT : Night Patsy.

invient : Night patsy

PatsyT : Hey I have to pack it in myself… Love to you all ..

choicelady : Goodnight all!

SallyT : Goodnight CL. Be watching for you later.

choicelady : ‘Night Patsy – you have a good one, too!

invient : Night cl

KQµårk 死神 : Sleep well CL my ADD almost missed your post.

PatsyT : Nighty Night Choice Dear, All the best

AdLib : KQ – I really like the idea of a pool for malpractice claims but there would need to be some kind of financial pain inflicted on the dr. who malpracticed.

SallyT : Yes, AdLib, that could happen. And, the states with HC shouldn’t let them immigrant into theirs.

invient : We need more Bernie’s in the world. People that actually defend their positions against someone who is just loud.

KQµårk 死神 : I agree AdLib. You will also see people moving back to ‘blue states’ because they will progress faster on the ACA. The days insurance is only tied to your employment will be over faster than people think.

MurphTheSurf3 : Invient….true

choicelady : Everyone – the back is getting achy and the mind is giving out. All that wind and rain to and from the Bay Area tuckered me out, so I’m heading off to bed. I wish you all a GREAT weekend and sweet dreams. ‘Night everyone!

invient : Murph, yes I know. Of course, the dems don’t want his message either.

SallyT : Bernie was quick to correct him on a couple of things, tho.

choicelady : AdLib – I will work up an article on ACA this weekend if I can, and I will give you a heads up about it when I’m done. I mastered the technology once and ONLY once on graphics, so that’s where I need help. Anyway, I appreciate the offer.

AdLib : Sally – I think HC could be what finally destroys the GOP. Most Northern states will use the ACA to start up state exchanges for health care. The GOP states will refuse because they hate “guv’ment” controlling our lives when it doesn’t have to do with sex. As time goes by, people will move out of those states to get affordable HC and the brain drain and population drain will lessen their revenues and political representation in The House. The GOP’s anti-HC stand could be what ultimately dooms them to long term minority status.

SallyT : Buddy was sure campaigning but that is the only place he was getting air time.

KQµårk 死神 : I’ve noticed that there are more and more blogs like the Planet, peoples view etc. popping up that were tired of the mega blogs on the left.

MurphTheSurf3 : Invient…Buddy ‘s message is not one the GOP wants promoted. They will continue to work against him to keep him an irrelevant distraction.

PatsyT : KQ Cesca is an oasis of sanity over there…

invient : SallyT, they were talking about corporate democrats in that show, It reminded me of benett here in Colorado. Err.

SallyT : I agree Invient. You could see on Bernie’s face that he was having a hard time staying in his seat.

KQµårk 死神 : Bob Cesca is doing his best at AOLHP but they are majority Paul cultists over their. Actually I just go to his blog now.

choicelady : KQ – I hear after the people of color boycotted Kos that it started being more responsible, while HP (spit) is going bankrupt. I pay no attention to the rest. More and more blogs are like the Planet – the folks listed on the right side, and Politicususa.com – all doing solid analytical work. The hair on fire places such as FDL still attract some, but not so many. What remains to be done is a full court press on the MSM by us – the Right does it, so we need to do it as well.

MurphTheSurf3 : sally….Bernie is someone I donate to and phone bank for. His office has proven helpful a number of times even knowing I am from Mo. As one staffer said: “Where else you going to go?”

invient : SallyT, that was the best real time I’ve seen in a while, let’s hope buddy romer doesn’t pick up. He would be a sane republican.

KQµårk 死神 : We should have a “no fault” type malpractice insurance system like most other universal healthcare systems have. It’s not the cost of the lawsuits, it’s the costs of all the unnecessary procedures that doctors order for CYA in the US

SallyT : Bernie Sanders on Real Time tonight really got hot when defending HC. Bill Mahur agreed with him 100% that it was a great starting point and it will be built on. Bernie also said that Vermont will pass a single payer and that will be a start for the nation.

MurphTheSurf3 : Choice…wonderf ul. Heck Ad Lib was a wonder worker when I first started fumbling around.

choicelady : KQ – the emoprogs (I call ignoprogs for their ignorance) never will admit it’s working just as they wanted. They wanted it all of a piece, not phased in, because, well, it was more PURE that way. Bah!

AdLib : CL – Would love to help you any way I can with such an article!

AdLib : KQ – I think Sullivan just beat everyone else to the punch though it was a great piece. As the year goes on and the campaign truly gets underway, the case for Obama will be made by many (including many here at The Planet).

MurphTheSurf3 : AdLib…there is also a growing sense that a more communal (i.e. socialistic!) model will deliver better service, protect physicians from unwarranted litigation and compensate them at a reasonable level).

KQµårk 死神 : What the hell has happened to so called progressive blogs and pundits?

choicelady : Murph – OK, if AdLib and the Help DEsk will deal with my incredible fumbling with technology, I WILL do a major post since I just spent three hours training someone on all the issues. Might as well move it out into the ether, too.

choicelady : Murph – that is a GREAT survey! Doctors feared Medicare, too, but today most of them like it, and ACA in 2014 brings all payments to much higher levels for Medicaid and Medicare. It is going VERY well and serving millions. I mentioned to one group though that we can have advertising to recruit people to the military but not a DIME to let them know about health care programs for them. I want the HOUSE and SENATE and WHITE HOUSE back so we can coordinate these things WELL. How, if it SAVES money, covers millions who’ve gone without – how is this BAD for doctors, patients, and the general welfare of the nation?

KQµårk 死神 : Anyone else find it sad that the best defense of Obama’s record to date was written by a right leaning independent. Andrew Sullivan

AdLib : Murph, that’s very interesting. I think the provisions that change the pay for service to paying for quality care have proven to be better for them than they thought.

KQµårk 死神 : Exactly AdLib that’s why it’s so stupid for emoprogs to keep on attacking the ACA from the left. It already provides the PO and single payer like CL said.

MurphTheSurf3 : CL you should do a major post on ACA as a working model for us. I think it would be great.

AdLib : KQ – And they’re afraid that the ACA will be built on and improved as SS and Medicare were so the 99% may finally get health care as a right and Single Payer. The RW only has another 2 years to kill it before its biggest aspects kick in, then, it would be like proposing to kill SS and Medicare…which , they still seem open to proposing but they’ve got no public support for it.

KQµårk 死神 : True CL.

MurphTheSurf3 : Ad Lib. I surveyed the six doctors I see when ACA was newborn. 5 of 6 opposed it. Now it is 5 of 6 in support.

choicelady : Sorry – hit the wrong button – this month the medical loss ration kicked in at 80 and 85% directed spending on health, not profits and administration. Already one company pulled out of the health insurance field. If that keeps on, well, we HAVE a public option by default in the High Risk Pool, and it’s incredibly affordable as some of our own folks can attest. With ONE tweak – the waiting period without insurance – voila! It picks up those who have been denied, dumped, abandoned and we are that much closer to a “Medicare for All” system that would DEFINITELY be cheaper than subsidizing private insurance.

KQµårk 死神 : I saw where Ryan’s plan would put 75% of healthcare costs on the backs of seniors.

KQµårk 死神 : AL we all know they want to kill the ACA because they know Americans will like it. Like Americans like every entitlement program that improves the lives of the 99%

PatsyT : Exxon shoul rename the body of water that they have dumped the most oil into!

AdLib : CL – I saw that, health costs have stopped their steep rise…just after the ACA was put into law. Real coincidence…

choicelady : Thanks to ACA and careful stewardship by Obama, costs are rising very little now. This month the

KQµårk 死神 : Hmmm… interesting observation CL.

AdLib : Invient, KQ had a great cartoon on the dog-on-roof thing too!

SallyT : Not me, Patsy. And there has been a lot of leaks on the Alaska one already.

AdLib : The reason the GOP wants to kill the ACA so quickly is that by 2014, states will be able to set up exchanges and the power of that to drive down the cost of health care will become clear. It’s ridiculous when Romney claims ACA raises billions in health care costs and slashes Medicare. Can’t wait for him to have his head handed to him on a platter in a debate with Obama.

KQµårk 死神 : There are dozens of pipelines though so why attack that one?

choicelady : KQ – Romney strikes me as having ADD. I’m quite serious about this. He acts impulsively and without thinking of consequences. OK – maybe that’s just privilege manifesting the “no consequences” part, but he is impulsive and idiosyncratic, and it just says to me – something’s not quite right here…

PatsyT : On that Keystone Pipeline… It would not take much for a terrorist group to disrupt that and create total havoc. Do we want to give terrorist any more easy targets?

KQµårk 死神 : Exactly and he’s seen more of America than most up us with his multi-ethnic background.

SallyT : The roof of my car wouldn’t hold my dogs!

invient : I have a great political cartoon for that. Link incoming.

KQµårk 死神 : I mean how fucking smart is putting your dog on the roof of your car. Their is a basic disconnect in Romney

MurphTheSurf3 : KQ Thinking of Obama at the Apollo last night in terms of your observation re. his diverse experience.

choicelady : Murph – that’s helpful since (blush) I got the 20,000 figure from, gulp, Romney!

SallyT : I thought they had an independent study and it was going to be only 6500 jobs on that pipeline.

choicelady : Murph and KQ – I said Romneycare was essentially catastrophic coverage at a national health meeting, and I am now persona non grata (I don’t even get invites anymore) there, but it’s TRUE. ACA is SO much better!!!

KQµårk 死神 : Being Mormon is like being home schooled you get very little exposure outside that community. The best part about Obama is he was exposed to people all over the world at all income levels and different cultures. This makes a person wise which is what a president needs to be.

AdLib : CL – That 20,000 jobs comes from the pipeline company. A much lower estimate comes from an independent group and they say it would only create 7,000 jobs.

MurphTheSurf3 : CL Cornell Study makes it pretty clear that the Keystone jobs are closer to 6000 AND offsets from job loss in other regions will drop that by half.

SallyT : Someone said that maybe Romney doesn’t want to show his tax returns because he hasn’t given all his 10% to the Mormon Church. He has been holding out on them, too. LOL

choicelady : AdLib – even the rotten aspects of Keystone still involves maybe 20,000 jobs, but again – the very people who’d work the pipeline would be harmed with environmental contamination. People KNOW this, and they are not furious with Obama but with the crappy way the line itself is being pused without environemental controls.

KQµårk 死神 : Exactly CL and that’s the BEST Romney could do.

MurphTheSurf3 : CL Great ACA summary vs. RomneyCare

AdLib : Risking the destruction of the water for the entire Midwest and incurring toxic pollution, worsening Climate Change…for maybe 7,000 jobs? That’s a great deal?

KQµårk 死神 : I’m sure it did surf but Romney did not run for reelection because his poll numbers were 34% in MA.

SallyT : Mormons take very good care of their own BUT only their own.

choicelady : KQ – Romneycare is proving not so hot. To keep the premium low for the state, it’s slapped on a huge deductible ($5000) and $10,000 out of pocket. Now you can get catastrophic coverage, but you cannot afford to PREVENT the catastrophe in the first place! Obamacare has huge numbers of tests and measures to help you prevent getting sick and then much lower costs if you do. It’s also subsidized on a sliding scale based on your income rather than a flat (and usually too low) flat rate. It is SO much better than Romneycare I cannot even say enough about it!

SallyT : That is right CL. They were really upset that no one was listening to them and their concerns. I think that got a good response for Obama with them because he appeared to take them into the consideration of it even over jobs.

invient : Ad, damn those externalities. You can’t expect corporate tools to pay for it.

AdLib : Hey Invient!

KQµårk 死神 : You have to remember Romney never “lived on the streets” he does not have a clue what being middle class really means. Even his Mormon faith has shielded him from allot in life.

invient : Still kicken. After my kombucha drinking : P

AdLib : I like how someone described it in a comment in TO/OT, with Keystone, we would get all the pollution and toxic crap from the pipeline but the reason it goes to Louisiana is so that it can processed then shipped out overseas. The one question I want someone to ask on this is, “Is Canada promising that all the oil that comes from the pipeline will go to America? If not, what is the exact percentage?” Truth is, we would likely see very little of that oil and pay a high price for the pipeline, especially once the inevitable accident poisons the water for the entire midwest.

choicelady : Hi invient! How are you tonight>

invient : Hopefully you all caught the maddow bit on Romney, he admits Obama has improved the economy. Me thinks it’s over for mitt, but I’m probably wrong

choicelady : Sally – that is right. And many of the people who were worried about the aquifer are ALSO those who’d benefit with jobs, and it’s not a cut and dried thing with them. They WANT clean water in the nation’s largest natural reserve! So Obama’s concern for them is NOT going un-noticed.

MurphTheSurf3 : KQ The job situation in MA was the result of a number of factors not the least of which was the cost of new jobs in the state- at the time enormous….bene fit, pension, requirements were gigantic and businesses were not much interested. Mass has pulled in its horns since. A nod to Mr. Patrick.

KQµårk 死神 : The only thing Romney did well is with Romneycare and it was not really his idea but the Dems in the legislator and he’s running away from that and Obamacare is much much better.

SallyT : Hi Invient.

choicelady : KQ – that PhDs-lack-common -sense theme has been shown true often. Some humility about their lack of practical experience in the world would seem to be in order?

PatsyT : Hey Invient!

KQµårk 死神 : Hi invient.

KQµårk 死神 : Sorry 47th.

invient : Hello everyone

KQµårk 死神 : How is 4th in job growth doing well in MA surf?

PatsyT : AdLib… That is why the powers that be love him… he will do their bidding in style

choicelady : ADLib – indeed! He really is an empty suit. You’re right – he cannot speak the truth because it puts him in a terrible light. As bito posted on (I think) TO/OT, he’s a finacialist, NOT a capitalist, and he has not a shred of solid ground upon which to stand. He’s accomplished nothing but self enrichment.

SallyT : Also, too many people in the midwest did not want that running through their water basen and farm land.

KQµårk 死神 : The problem in the right wing world is they actually believe stuff like Solyndra and Fast and Furious matters to voters.

KQµårk 死神 : Absolutely the Repugs messed up again and overplayed their hand on Keystone.

MurphTheSurf3 : KQ..he did very well as Gov. in Mass. He did, but the Dem resurgence there made another run foolish for his long term hopes.

AdLib : CL – That’s why I made the joke about Romney running on taking out Bin Laden, he might as well because his nonsensical attacks on Obama seem to be disconnected from reality and what has actually happened. He just reads what’s written for him. Does Romney have any beliefs himself? Does he write any of his speeches as Obama does? I say no, I don’t think he writes a single one. He’s a fucking news show anchor reading a teleprompter that says, “This is what I think.”

KQµårk 死神 : Surf I think he is stupid. He reminds me of the dozens of PhDs I’ve worked with that don’t have an ounce of common sense.

MurphTheSurf3 : Ad Lib, China, like India, has a level of desperate poverty among its billions which we cannot imagine and a hyperinflated capitalist class driving the economy relentlessly. It is a tinder box.

choicelady : KQ – did you hear that we are importing less than 50% of our oil now? That’s HUGE in terms of lowering costs and improving our national security! Obama has not put a foot wrong on anything – and Keystone will NOT cost him votes over lost jobs since he’s open to review about protecting the areas where those same people will live as well as work.

SallyT : Adlib, I never said that the Kochs didn’t get a good return. I just said that they have it setup that donations are going through as a tax write off.

KQµårk 死神 : Great point AdLib but the reason I don’t think China will collapse is because right wingers have predicted it. Remember we are suppose to have hyper inflation now. That idiot Mo fell for that shite too.

MurphTheSurf3 : Romney is not stupid. He knows the truth. He cannot speak it. I think this explains a lot of his body language. People in Mass. report that he looks like he is wired up in ways unfamiliar to them.

AdLib : I’ve heard that China may be in for a hard economic landing because of all of the monkey business they’ve used to give themselves an advantage. The US better be on solid ground by then!

KQµårk 死神 : True dat AdLib and we are drilling now more than ever despite what the right wing says.

choicelady : ADLib – we ARE keeping HOPE alive!

choicelady : AdLib – you are assuming Romney actually KNOWS Obama took out bin Laden!!! He might have missed it. He misses quite a good deal, you know! So his attacks on Obama as “ruining our reputation with overseas allies” may well be grounded in TOTAL ignorance! And never EVER forget Santorum was the one who said McCain knew nothing about torture. These guys are clueless!

KQµårk 死神 : I love that planned and installed windmills and solar farms quadrupled under Obama.

AdLib : Sally – Truth is that the Kochs have gotten a great return on their investments in government. When you see the figures for how much wealth the wealthy now have, it’s a great investment.

KQµårk 死神 : Exactly they made it off of inflated housing values.

SallyT : China loves Cadillacs

AdLib : CL – Yep, we do indeed! Keep HOPE alive!

KQµårk 死神 : I couldn’t believe that GM sold 2.3 million cars to China last year.

SallyT : But they aren’t making their money from Product.

choicelady : ADLib – yup. The Planet not only was there but has made firm allies with other groups around that experience. We need to keep those enduring relationships – we ROCK!

AdLib : If the economy continues to improve and economic inequity remains, what can Romney run on? That Obama is a failure in foreign policy and that Romney will hunt down Bin Laden?

KQµårk 死神 : Well for a while magical thinking did work and the finance sector over doubled in size creating nothing but money.

AdLib : Patsy – Cool of you to say! And we’ve got more in the pipeline!

choicelady : KQ – I totally agree! But since the mid-1970s the corporate shills have shown repeatedly that they believe in magical thinking and endless riches for themselves. They could all use a good dose of Econ. 101.

KQµårk 死神 : It was like asking Paul what he would do for creating jobs and his answer was basically nothing.

AdLib : CL – It was and all those people who came together, made a difference and started something.

PatsyT : AdLib… The Planet was WAAAYYY ahead of its time!

KQµårk 死神 : Policies they don’t care about no stinkin’ policies.

choicelady : AdLib – last Jan. was one very cool day!

SallyT : YEAAAAAHHHHHH, CL!!!!!!!

KQµårk 死神 : CL like you I think it’s malicious intent on their part. Because even outsourcing is stupid in the long run. All you are doing is killing your customer base of the future.

AdLib : CL – Who woulda thunk it, how the ball got rolling against the Kochs and the 1% in Palm Springs just one year ago! And The Planet was there!

choicelady : ADLib – yes, I really want that amendment. That’s why I’m going to speak at a rally at the Capitol tomorrow, wind and rain be damned.

MurphTheSurf3 : Did you all see Obama at the Apollo…talk about someone comfortable in his skin….more of that…such a contrast to Mitt or Newt.

choicelady : KQ – the repugs thinking of Walker for VP are ignoring today’s signature drive for his recall. It’s HALF the eligible voters in WI! HALF!!!! That does not make Walker’s future political fortunes look too hot.

SallyT : They would never put Walker on the ticket, tho.

AdLib : CL – The only real undoing of the Kochs would be a Constitutional amendment that says corps aren’t people, money isn’t speech and creates a public financing system for elections. Then The Kochs would be undone.

SallyT : I think it is all talk about Walker as VP. They don’t want anyone to think their guy was a loser.

PatsyT : I think it boils down to hatred for a black President

choicelady : ADLib – indeed. And it really did start with Jan. 30 last year in Palm Springs!!!

KQµårk 死神 : I can’t believe some repugs are still talking about Walker as VP but he’s a hero to them I guess.

choicelady : Patsy – that makes waaay too much sense! Their slavering need to have total control over the economy and the politics supporting their avarice makes them foolish. That, I hope, is their undoing!

AdLib : CL – And that exposure preceded the outing of their puppet Walker in WI and all that has followed, including OWS.

SallyT : Its a tax write off for the Kochs.

KQµårk 死神 : Patsy I don’t get that either. The same with regulations in the long run it makes MORE money for industry.

choicelady : AdLib – sunshine is a powerful way to heal pustulating rot. The Kochs are EXPOSED!

PatsyT : Nighty Night AB !!

PatsyT : Choice… When will they decide to leave their cash in the bank and not throw it away on these campaign adventures… they would save so much $$$$ if they just paid a bit more in taxes..

AdLib : Night Sabreen! Sleep well!

SallyT : See you later Kes. Stay warm and safe.

AdLib : Night AB, great to see you, have a wonderful weekend!

KQµårk 死神 : Night you two sweet dreams

choicelady : kes – stay warm and dry yourself! Good night AB – sweet dreams!

AdLib : Night Kes!

SallyT : Goodnight AB.

AdLib : CL – Thanks to all the work many have done to expose the Kochs and their game!

Sabreen60 : Me too y’all. Nighty night and have a safe and fruitful week.

choicelady : I was telling a younger friend today that I’ve not seen a crop of candidates this awful since the HUAC/McCarthy days. This is the most venal, ignorant, pernicious group of candidates since then, and I think the lack of energy for any one of them is well to our advantage.

AlphaBitch : Bye and night night all. Toothpicks failing to keep eyes open. Ttill then..adios

kesmarn : I will, AB, but there’s a lotta snow blowing in here…!

KQµårk 死神 : Remember as much as the MSM and Faux News lies the number of registered Dems is still several points higher than registered Repugs. So if the GOP does not “over vote” they lose.

AdLib : Whereas, Obama supporters are passionate and will trudge through rain, sleet and snow for him. Yes, many Repubs hate the black man in the WH but when you hate your nominee too, it cancels out a bit of enthusiasm.

MurphTheSurf3 : CL…friends in WI say the BIG MONEY buys are a huge turnoff to most who regard them as the work of puppeteers. The moment they show up, folks turn them off.

AlphaBitch : Kes – hold the door for me too, will ya!

SallyT : Than we pray for snow in November!

kesmarn : From your lips to God’s ear, c’lady.Midnight here, kids. This is fascinating but I’d better head off to bed. Have a warm, cozy weekend.

choicelady : All – I think the abject failure of the Koch machine in WI and OH is GREAT. They threw hundreds of millions into ads, and nothing worked. WI is turning around, and even the awful redistricting in OH may not produce the wins desired.

AdLib : KQ – Right, I mentioned the same. It should be kept in mind that Repubs repeatedly said in polls that they don’t like ANY of the candidates they have to choose from. They are not going to ever fall in love with Romney, they will vote for him begrudgingly but won’t walk through 8 inches of snow for him.

KQµårk 死神 : CL exactly and for Obama the campaign really does not start before the SOTU not counting the ground organizing OFA has done all the way through.

PatsyT : KQ if only they would listen to him on that point!

choicelady : KQ – that IS a critical point. Why should independents vote for someone whose entire policy philosophy is NOT embraced by their own party?

KQµårk 死神 : Bingo Patsy.

PatsyT : Oh Yeah !! Walker Fail!

Sabreen60 : I understand now.

AdLib : Murph, thanks for the info, very interesting. I think it also reflects a growing disappointment in having to choose between candidates that most Repubs didn’t want anyway.

KQµårk 死神 : And in the general Independents are gonna think. Why is the GOP not even thrilled about their candidate.

choicelady : Murph – that’s freaking amazing! Thanks for the update.

PatsyT : Faux news hates Paul because he calls out for the end of such endless spending by the MIC Not that I like Paul but on that point I am glad he is saying that to that audience

kesmarn : Despair? Disarray? Confusion? Indifference?

choicelady : Patsy – I think the overall improvement in the economy plus good messaging in the campaigns will help. The midwest looks poised to go Dem thanks to Walker et al., though it’s not clear about Ohio. Some said today’s SCOTUS decision about using the leg. drawn maps to do over the Texas redistricting to make it more fair was a set back for Dems, but I do not agree since judges are the ones doing it. Could go either way – the Latino vote HAS to be taken into account.

KQµårk 死神 : Especially with Beck gone and Limbaugh on radio, Faux News is seen as the establishment and Hannity is a shill for Romney.

MurphTheSurf3 : The Word from SC. Just called a friend down there. Says it is REALLY QUIET tonight. No big phone banks, no door knocks, no car pool organizing…her guess is the GOP SC is letting the chips fall where they will.

AdLib : Sally – I do think there will be some enthusiasm for TPs to win the Senate and keep The House but in a Presidential election year, it is the top of the ticket that chiefly motivates people. And if the TP feel that they were used by The GOP elite and spurned in the Presidential nomination, I think they might very well be disappointed and de-energized. After all, why help the GOP Elite elect more of their brethren so that they can have power and TPs won’t?

KQµårk 死神 : Yup that’s it Kes.

kesmarn : I think KQ was saying that the Libertarians hate FOX News because FOX hates Paul…which they admittedly do.

KQµårk 死神 : Sabreen I might have messed it up but it’s Faux News that hates Paul.

PatsyT : Oh Sally I hope you are right… I want to see Dem gains in the senate and house.

KQµårk 死神 : Don’t forget the first time Bush ran he lost the popular vote because some of the base stayed home because of the last minute DUI revelations

choicelady : Patsy – I think it’s the internal divisions among the GOP that will be useful to the Dems and Obama. One SC woman said she would NEVER back down on her principles in the primaries, but she might – MIGHT – hold her nose and vote in the general. Lots of people won’t do either.

Sabreen60 : KQ, I don’t understand. Why do you say the libertarians hate Paul. I thought he was their god?

SallyT : But, you don’t think the TPs will get out the vote on the Senate and the House.

PatsyT : Wow KQ those GOP ers are conflicted!

AlphaBitch : Kes – I think that’s it. But someone needs to jump the shark there.

SallyT : Okay, AdLib, I can see that.

KQµårk 死神 : EXACTLY AdLib!

MurphTheSurf3 : Ad Lib…if the GOP Lords want Romney are they pushing him in SC or are they just letting the chips fall where they will and look to Florida and the other Southern states (but Paul is stronger the further West you go)

kesmarn : AB…or do they see that as a Bush failure, but not a Rove failure?

AdLib : Sally – You’re right, the Baggers hate Obama the most so most will vote against him whoever the nominee is but their enthusiasm to knock on doors, get on the phones and donate to Mitt Romney will be far less than in 2010.

KQµårk 死神 : Bad for Romney then.

choicelady : AB – are they beginning to look on the past 8 years with nostalgia? The upper income folks did GREAT, and they’re the ones likely to vote.

KQµårk 死神 : There are three parts of the GOP now, establishment, tea baggers and the libertarians. Libertarians hate Faux news because they hate Paul. Tea baggers hate Faux News because they feel they are shoving Romney down their throats.

AlphaBitch : Guys, I get it that Rove HAS the power. But why give the wheel back to him, regardless of power, if what he sold you last time (Bush) was rotten to the core and sold out your cause.

AdLib : Murph – They may not have distance but the GOP Elite aren’t controlling the Tea Party, if anything, as the debate audiences reflect, it’s the other way around.

choicelady : AB – do the base KNOW about Rove? Or care?

MurphTheSurf3 : KQ raining in SC tomorrow.

AlphaBitch : I agree, CL, but my point is: why go with the guy (Rove) who brought you such grief?

KQµårk 死神 : Put it this way Sally if it’s bad weather many parts of the US election day the base will stay home.

choicelady : KQ – the base hates FOX???? Why? I thought they loved FOX!

kesmarn : They hate Faux News? Why?

AdLib : AB – The power center of the GOP still lies in the same hands that had control of it in the past. Rove, the Kochs, etc. They are the “Lords” of the GOP and the path to the Presidency goes through them. They’re like the Mafia, you can hate them but if you don’t pay them protection, they will break your legs.

MurphTheSurf3 : KQ Why do you say the Base GOP hates Faux?

KQµårk 死神 : That’s my take AdLib. If it was close like IA sure but if it’s a few percentage points they can’t do anything. BTW the other thing the base conservatives hate is Faux News.

choicelady : AB – I think to the one who embraces the corporatists the most will go the spoils. The “values voters” don’t matter, but offering major tax breaks to corporations will.

SallyT : ADLib you don’t think the TP hates Obama so much that they will vote for anyone?

MurphTheSurf3 : Ad LIb…the TP and GOP Organization are very connected in SC…home of the TP in many ways and the HQ of several of the national political TP icons. So they don’t have the distance.

AlphaBitch : But why would the powers that be then throw in again with Rove? He is still tight w/ W.

KQµårk 死神 : It was not like a majority of conservatives but the first time I remember the base grumbling was with Medicare Part D and Harriet Miers.

choicelady : kes – yes, in Sacramento. We have big sycamores along the street, and they shed HUGE branches in windstorms!

AdLib : Murph – The Tea Party is the engine of the GOP today, unlike in 2008. They aren’t controlled by the GOP Elite. Yes, they can throw a lot of weight around in SC but the Tea Party doesn’t like Romney much and a majority won’t vote for him.

kesmarn : Are you in CA,c’lady?

PatsyT : Thanks AB … sounds like one of those things that my kids like … they love that John McCain thing of him wandering in front of the camera

SallyT : I think the GOP is nervous that the monster they created is about to eat without looking closely to see if it is one of them?

MurphTheSurf3 : KQ….Newt has no ground game in SC and the GOP Organization has a huge one…again I fought it in 2008…very tough and very prone to cheating.

choicelady : Yikes – tree branches crashing outside. So far we still have power, but…

kesmarn : I feel like a hick, but honestly KQ, I never knew/heard that there was a significant % of conservatives who were really unhappy with Bush. They certainly kept their opinions under wraps…

KQµårk 死神 : Good question surf but I’m not sure what control the establishment has. In this case momentum may trump organization.

choicelady : AdLib- I worry that trickle down is baaaack. That’s the package the GOP is selling, and with the true believers, they already have forgotten what CAUSED their misery!

AdLib : AB – Rove wants the power of the WH again and Romney has no doubt thrown in with him.

KQµårk 死神 : We did not hear about it AdLib because at the time conservatives stayed quiet for the most part so the anger was pent up and would have come out but true the bailout was the last straw.

AlphaBitch : It would seem that “Bush’s Brain” picking the next pres would sit sour with some repubs who feel burnt by Bush.

MurphTheSurf3 : The key question re. tomorrow is….does the national party organization and its backers really want Mitt bad enough to pressure the state GOP to create a crowd to vote for Mitt OR are they having second thoughts OR is the GOP SC wanting to sent a message…we do not want Mitt. No one wants Newt, he screwed SC as Speaker.

AlphaBitch : Why then AdLib is Rove driving Mitt?

AlphaBitch : Patsy – I don’t remember where it came from, but iffn I find it, I will

AdLib : KQ – They only turned on Bush when the economy collapsed and because it helped Obama and proved the GOP and Trickle Down were frauds. They weren’t upset at what he did, just that he got caught doing it. And now, in the GOP, Bush is Lord Voldemort, he who can not be named.

KQµårk 死神 : And don’t forget Bush tried immigration reform another thing the right wing hated.

AlphaBitch : I think all the crowds rate high on “codger factor” – a term we used at bluegrass festivals.

PatsyT : Oh AB do Share

SallyT : Sabreen there was another shot of Romeny with people all around until they pulled back the camera and it was like 10 people.

AlphaBitch : Remember the video of the woman in red pants dancing at a tea party rally? So sad.

KQµårk 死神 : Think about it they had 6 years in power and what did Bush do INCREASE entitlements and not touch SS, Medicare or Medicaid.

Sabreen60 : Over at The Obama Diary there’s a picture of one lonely person sitting outside at a Romney rally. Pretty funny.

PatsyT : Newt should be booked

SallyT : I dont know Patsy. but it was a big autorium and only 25 showed. He canceled. If I was one of the 25 that would piss me off.

AlphaBitch : Patsy! Newt Book just sounds nasty, now

AdLib : I think Romney needs a hard core conservative on his ticket, that would remove Daniels and Pawlenty from his list. And Rubio is damaged goods. Not sure who he would pick.

PatsyT : Oh Sally what was wrong? Everyone does not want a Newt Book?

MurphTheSurf3 : Sally…that is what I am talking about. Newt had one big crowd today and friends down there say that took a lot of doing. Mitt has had small crowds. The key….who do the party bosses back. Mitt or just anyone else.

AlphaBitch : Good summation KQ.

AlphaBitch : BIGGEST crowd, shouting “Stephen, Stephen”

KQµårk 死神 : Bush is the one that blew the whole in the budget with not only tax cuts but wars and the Rx drug program. The right think Bush is a big government conservative who betrayed their cause.

SallyT : Yes, Kes. There was a big turnout today. Cain was with him.

kesmarn : Seriously? Are crowds turning out for Colbert?

SallyT : Colbert had the biggest turnout today. In fact Newt cancel one because only 25 people showed.

KQµårk 死神 : Cheers AB should have it out next week.

AlphaBitch : Daniels does look strong, KQ – as in candidate, that is.

kesmarn : KQ,can you explain a bit… The right angry at Bush?

AlphaBitch : Love the it about KQ’s new table.

KQµårk 死神 : My pick is Daniels or Pawlenty AdLib.

AlphaBitch : Hola Sabreen, AdLib et al

MurphTheSurf3 : kes…depends on whether the GOP organization wants him to. There really is not a lot of authentic energy on the ground there for anyone.

choicelady : Hi AB – great to see you!

AlphaBitch : Rick thinks he flies wid angel wings over all, kes

Sabreen60 : Hi AB!

SallyT : I think you will see a big number for Cain/Colbert. That is getting a lot of attention.

AdLib : Hey AB!

KQµårk 死神 : The worst part Kes the anger the right had was all penned up during the Bush years. He’s the one that they hated but they could not say that so they took it out on Obama.

kesmarn : HEY! AB! Ya think Ricky Santorum might fly in Florida?

AdLib : And if Mitt’s the nominee, who would his VP be? Christie? That would be two East Coasties.

PatsyT : CL Stranger things have happened

choicelady : Hey Murph – we gotcha! Welcome!

kesmarn : Interesting perspective, Murph. So you think SC will go for Romney tomorrow?

AlphaBitch : Hey hey there – just checking in and amusing myself. Newt wins, of course. But what about remaining Rick? Any chance for him?

AdLib : Murph, if you’re having issues with the live chat, try clearing your cache and restarting your browser.

PatsyT : Ewww Ick make it stop …

MurphTheSurf3 : I worked for Obama in NC, SC, GA. I know SC rather well. The GOP is very well organized down there when they want to be. They can deliver a big vote for Mitt if they want to. Do they? Will the national big boys backing Mitt as the most credible nominee push it so he can go into Obama Mode OR will they want to send a message to the national folks that Mitt is not going to cut it? By the way, none want Gingrich….for many reasons, but the big one was the way he treated the GOP sC reps when he was Speaker.

choicelady : patsy – You think Arianna has the hots for Newt? Well Calista better watch out – wonder if he’s boffing AH on the side? Marianne said Newt told her Calista doesn’t care what he does, so she might not mind an open marriage. Wonder whom SHE is boffing?

KQµårk 死神 : Yeah CL I missed the actually point Evangelicals accepted Catholics.

SallyT : Patsy, I think all you would see is a one eyed stomach. Everything else will be under a big fold.

kesmarn : I wonder if Palin was a cause or a symptom, though, KQ… Either way she’s a disaster.

MurphTheSurf3 : Having a bit of trouble posting…test

AdLib : Polls about Obama vs. Romney at this point are of nominal value. There is only a GOP campaign going on right now to trash Obama. Once Obama’s campaign jumps in fully and Romney is being equally slammed, watch the numbers strengthen for Obama. This is as good as Romney can do and it’s the floor of what Obama can do…and in most polls, he’s beating Romney.

PatsyT : Newt Nude Never! Oh My!

SallyT : There you have it, Pats.

PatsyT : Oh Sally that fits… That is why he went Catholic

KQµårk 死神 : I’ll never forgive McCain for picking Palin and running the campaign he did. He knew he was going to lose and what he did was bad for the country.

choicelady : Patsy – I’m right there with you, Sister. Nude Newt? Euuuuwwwwww.

SallyT : Well, Patsy he is caholic so a nun might see him that way.

choicelady : SAbreen – why is he using evangelical talk when he’s now Catholic? Catholics don’t talk like that. He’s playing both sides of the fence, isn’t he?

KQµårk 死神 : It probably won’t happen but I think Newt going up against Obama is worse, not that he would have a better chance to win but he would make Obama’s second term even harder with the vitriol he would raise up with the right wing.

kesmarn : I hope we make ‘em regret Citizens United, Sabreen.

PatsyT : Yep CL I would rather be a nun the see that Newt in the Newtude.

Sabreen60 : We may not like the Super Pacs, but the Dems have a few and they’re going to hit the Rethug candidates where it hurts.

SallyT : Obviously KQ, they aren’t thinking.

AdLib : KQ – That poll is an outlier. I saw another poll showing Obama beating Romney by that margin with indies.

KQµårk 死神 : WTF are these people thinking?

choicelady : Patsy – would ANYONE love Newt if he did not have a $500K credit line at Tiffany’s? And he used to be fatter than he is now. The contemplation of him naked and in the throes of passion is a real ‘GAG ME’ moment. He’s one of the most unattractive people maybe EVER.

PatsyT : KQ She love that Newt.. but maybe very jealous of Calista.. that was supposed to be her

Sabreen60 : Oh CL, haven’t you heard. Newt has been saved and washed of all his past sins. That’s what he is selling in SC.

kesmarn : Ugh, bummer.

KQµårk 死神 : I about threw up when I saw 50-38 independents going for Romney in a poll over Obama.

choicelady : Patsy – Ron Paul is icky-er than Newt and Mitt. He is to the bone despicable. The other two have a faint glimmer of humanity. He has none.

KQµårk 死神 : Ya gotta wonder Pasty she sure is trying to take down Romney and I don’t think it’s to help Obama.

AdLib : The key thing about both Newt and Mitt is that they both have high unlikeability numbers and Obama’s are relatively high.

SallyT : The corruption of Newt as House leader will be made more of soon.

kesmarn : They’re only right on one thing. This IS the election of our lifetimes. We have GOT to win this one.

choicelady : Sally – way too little has been made of Newt dumping Wife No. Two when she got MS. Calista better pray for good health. Newt does not seem to be fully engaged with that “in sickness and in health” thingy.

PatsyT : Dose A Huff still love Newt?

KQµårk 死神 : Oh I hear you CL.

choicelady : KQ – I agree. ANY of this crop of candidates is a disaster!

SallyT : How can you have a soul and divorce two wives when they become ill.

choicelady : Sabreen – my only reservation about Newt’s dirty laundry is that we already elected a president who draft dodged, went AWOL, and did other totally illegal things BEFORE he ran, and nobody cared. He spouted the morality lingo, and people bought it. They ALL care more for ideology than substance, and I think unless you found Newt in bed with a young BOY, he can get past that. Now the corruption and lobbying and all that – this MIGHT matter more than his sexual depravity. No one seems to care when GOP candidates screw up though.

PatsyT : CL I don’t how you get any icky-er then Newt or Mitt

KQµårk 死神 : It’s either a blighted soul with Gingrich or no soul with Romney.

Sabreen60 : Hi Patsy and all others that I missed

kesmarn : The soulless millionaire vs. the angry racist. There’s no up side.

KQµårk 死神 : I just don’t see a lesser evil between Gingrich or Romney CL.

SallyT : Cl, I am scared of that too.

KQµårk 死神 : Despite Newt’s many infidelities, E.D. Kain prefers Gingrich to Romney: Romney, I’m quite certain now, has no soul. Gingrich may have made bad choices – his soul may be black in a few spots – but he has one. He’s a human being at the very least, warts and all. Romney is a machine at best, a blank slate willing to say and do anything to get elected.

KQµårk 死神 : I bookmarked a good quote for this discussion.

Sabreen60 : I think Newt will win SC. Actually, I hope he wins the nomination. The dude has so much dirty laundry, the Obama campaign won’t be able to use it all.

choicelady : Topic #1 – Yes, Romney will lose to Newt. It will slightly affect his candidacy until they get to a state that hates creepy little lying, whoring, cheating bastards. Then the lying, cheating, sniveling candidate will regain some ground. I think it might well be possible that they will get to the convention with no front runner. That’s fun in a way and scary because that’s when Jeb or someone icky might come to the fore…

PatsyT : Newt – Serial Divorcee

MurphTheSurf3 : Sabreen. Kes…greetings

SallyT : Oh, I shouldn’t say that. I wasn’t one of those married to him.

kesmarn : Based on the blood-thirsty crowd at the debate, I think Newtie might pull it off.

SallyT : I hate Newt.

PatsyT : I hate to see Mittens lose to Newt

SallyT : I second KQ!

kesmarn : Hey, Murph! Trying to decide whether it’s going to be Newt or Mitt tomorrow.

Sabreen60 : Hi Murph!

MurphTheSurf3 : Patsy…howdy

KQµårk 死神 : It looks like there’s Newtmentum so he will win. I think it makes it very uncomfortable for Romney up to Super Tuesday.

PatsyT : Hey Murph!

SallyT : I think Newt will win but not a landslide.

MurphTheSurf3 : Well what is going on?

Sabreen60 : CL, it’s not usually a one-shot deal. Research suggested that if you haven’t acquired relief after 10 treatments, stop. It’s not working.

kesmarn : Good! I didn’t know that. I hope they seriously consider that as the campaign theme.

AdLib : OFFICIAL TOPIC #1: WHAT DO YOU THINK WILL HAPPEN IN THE SC ELECTION TOMORROW? WILL ROMNEY LOSE TO NEWT AND IF SO, HOW WILL IT AFFECT HIS CANDIDACY?

SallyT : Hello to all of you here.

choicelady : Hey Sally!

AdLib : Sabreen, glad to hear you’re feeling better!

PatsyT : I have been standing in the sun all day

Sabreen60 : Hi Sally!

KQµårk 死神 : Ain’t that the truth AdLib.

SallyT : I know, you are all fried tonight.

PatsyT : Hey Sally

Sabreen60 : I agree Kes. A couple of people tweeted Axe and asked him to consider “Lets Stay Together”.

AdLib : Nice to see you Sally! I’ve got my Tivo set to record Maher, very pleased to hear Moyers and Sanders are on! Now, if only we could replace Maher…

choicelady : Sabreen – that’s GREAT news! I knew you were contemplating it, but it’s super you went. Did it help? That’s next on my agenda.

kesmarn : Sally! I don’t think i said hi when you came in. We were too wrapped up in bacon…

KQµårk 死神 : TC Sally.

SallyT : Good evening AdLib. I am joining late because I watched Bill Maher and he had Bill Moyer as a special quest and then Bernie Sanders. Was a good debate.

KQµårk 死神 : You know what I like AdLib.

AdLib : Thanks Patsy, listening to it right now!

Sabreen60 : CL, et al I went for my first acupuncture treatment today. It wasn’t bad at all. Hopefully, it’ll help my back. I’ve just about healed from my fall. Thanks for asking.

choicelady : Patsy – aren’t you nice! I’ll be right over!

PatsyT : Mmm Mmmm «link»

KQµårk 死神 : I think she’s gonna come back and get them if she can. He’s about an hour away. She is cooking him is last meal so to speak because he’s getting his stomach operated on to reduce it’s size.

kesmarn : Isn’t the official title of the Al Green song “Let’s Stay Together.” I say that should be his re-election theme song.

AdLib : Thanks Kes and Sally for your votes! If you can pull yourselves away from the bacon counter for a few seconds, could you please scroll down to read the options for blogging the SOTU and let me know your preference? And I’ll have bacon with that.

ChrisR266 : What ever you want to do, is alright by meeeeeee…

PatsyT : CL Gluten Free Cookie Dough will be made available by request

choicelady : Sabreen! How are you?

ChrisR266 : I IIIII I’m so in love with you….

KQµårk 死神 : You really just watch it but it takes under about 45 min. As long as you use cookie sheets with about a half inch side it’s not bad. It cooks a bit strange though. It doesn’t seem like it’s cooking but then all of a sudden it cooks fast. Probably when it hits the temp of the bacon fat.

choicelady : KQ – sorry your wife forgot them. But does this mean YOU get more?

choicelady : Patsy – that’s pure decadence: bacon and cookie dough. I can’t eat it (wheat intolerant) but I can drool at the thought!

kesmarn : Ahhh Sabreen! I’m so in love with him! The song did it.

AdLib : Kes – How about a franchise called “Heart Attack Heaven”. Where you serve Paula Dean recipes and have 31 varieties of bacon?

PatsyT : Sabreen! I loved that sooo much! Why is hiding that?

kesmarn : Uh-oh…you had no choice but to eat them then, KQ. It was your duty.

ChrisR266 : Choice: LMFAO! Ok. Cripes! I give.

Sabreen60 : Hello Everyone! IIII-mmm so-oh in love with you…..

choicelady : KQ – how long in the oven? And what about the splatter? I bought some (2-for-1 sale) for visitors, Hormel which for years I boycotted for lousy labor standards (I backed the P9 strikers) BUT the Hormel heir is gay and gives money for good causes, so I broke down and bought some. It purely sucked. Doesn’t taste like bacon but kind of like old shoes slightly smoked. Never again.

SallyT : 3

KQµårk 死神 : kes after all that my wife forgot the cupcakes when she went to visit her friend.

PatsyT : Lets live a little

kesmarn : 3!

SallyT : What the hell, you guys all fried on bacon tonight?

kesmarn : And KQ’s wife can make bacon cupcakes for the Drive-Thru…

PatsyT : How about Bacon with a side order of Raw Cookie Dough!

AdLib : Ok, so just to sum up, could you vote for one of the three options below for the SOTU: 1: Live blog comments on a post. 2: Live chat. 3: Live chat during the SOTU then go to comments on a post afterwards.

AlphaBitch : Trying to catch up – what is this you are talking about KQ’s asticles?????

PatsyT : Oh Geez just imagine the menu of the local drive thru Bacon Enterprise

KQµårk 死神 : You forget down south bacon is a food group.

KQµårk 死神 : CL cook it in the oven on a cookie sheet at 325 much easier than frying in a pan.

choicelady : Well, Chris – I honest to God never thought your avatar was a self portrait! I just happen to resemble a chess pawn in some ways, so it’s kind of funny.

kesmarn : Who was it that posted bacon recipes and one of them started with: “Weave a mat of bacon…” Gotta love the chootspa there.

PatsyT : Lets face it Kes… everyone wants it… so lets give it to them … Bacon Castle

AdLib : Instabacon!

ChrisR266 : AdLib: agreed. 100%.

choicelady : Patsy – that’d be great! I HATE cooking bacon but love eating it! Carry-out Bacon – whoooeeeee.

AdLib : Hey, we’re a public blog, we’re on the internet and we have a bit of popularity out there. If we didn’t have people reading us, then we can worry.

ChrisR266 : Choice: look at my Avatar. You can be and yet not look like you.

PatsyT : I’ll say anything to their face if they like… but they may not like my dog.

KQµårk 死神 : Patsy I would be your #1 customer but for my wife watching over me.

kesmarn : Brilliant, Patsy! What would be the “speciality” as the Brits say?

choicelady : It’s that “being watched” thingy that keeps my avatar looking like a chess pawn. It would be better if that weren’t the way I really look! Better hair though…

PatsyT : Kes that makes me feel the need to create a drive thru Bacon Franchise … What do you think?

AdLib : But who watches the watchers? I know, News Corp!

KQµårk 死神 : AdLib I was thinking the opposite just because chat is quick and if people are watching different channels it might get muddled.

ChrisR266 : Patsy: do people have a problem with that? Being watched? It is assumed, I assumed…

kesmarn : That’s mildly terrifying.

PatsyT : We are all being watched… in one way or another

AdLib : Kes – We do have a lot of readers, tens of thousands, who may read at the time or may read later on that night or the following day.

kesmarn : Better be careful, KQ. I won’t get on-call, but I will get bacon that way.

KQµårk 死神 : My spanish is so rusty it would sound like pig latin.

PatsyT : Good Question Kes.

kesmarn : Eggsellent.

choicelady : Patsy – Planet Anelysis sounds like a medical procedure…

AdLib : Kes – I will pray for you in Esperanto.

PatsyT : Oppps better spell is first… darn that Perry… Oppps

kesmarn : Do many “lurkers” really read our comments during the debates, AdLib?

KQµårk 死神 : Yeah because after the chat people will be on different pages so to speak.

PatsyT : Planet Anelysis! Love It !

choicelady : KQ and ADLib – bloody brilliant! Best of both worlds!

KQµårk 死神 : Micheal Meyer

AdLib : KQ – That’s an interesting idea. Blog on a post during the SOTU then we adjourn to the live chat for Planet analysis?

kesmarn : Why am drawing a blank on the other Canadian funny guy… Dr. Evil?… Argh! Is it Mike Myers?

choicelady : kes – could the prayer be in English? Good luck in whatever language!

choicelady : ADLib. Oh, I’m SO glad. I never like a person who is redundant, repeating things over and over again.

ChrisR266 : Choice: I’m ok with keeping Shatner. The Shat is himself history.

KQµårk 死神 : I say go for the live chat during the SOTU and blog when the talking heads go on.

choicelady : kes – They might want Michael back. He’s cool.

AdLib : CL – Thanks, a pride myself in never repeating myself or being redundant.

kesmarn : Michael J. Fox

choicelady : Patsy – if Canada invades and wins, they will make us keep Shatner, too.

ChrisR266 : Kes: Will send it from the south, too.

PatsyT : William Shatner is Canadian

choicelady : AdLib – my. You do have a way with words…

kesmarn : Say a little prayer for on-call on Tues, c’lady. It can be in Hebrew, Arabic or Latin.

AdLib : The benefit of using a thread for the SOTU is that the comments are more accessible for people to read after the fact. The benefit of the live chat is…the live chat aspect of live chats!

KQµårk 死神 : We should blog SC primary tomorrow.

choicelady : kes – I’m sorry you have to work!

KQµårk 死神 : I was thinking about chats for a debate or two as well.

kesmarn : If it could be worked out, this kind of chat doesn’t require as much refreshing and stuff. What am I saying? I’m scheduled to work!

choicelady : ADLib – I vote for chat, but I’m fine with blog.

KQµårk 死神 : I really like the live chat format now.

choicelady : AdLib – threatening to return Justin would make them promise ANYTHING to avoid that!

AdLib : A mini-poll – For Obama’s SOTU speech this upcoming week, would you prefer a live blog on a thread or using this kind of live chat?

kesmarn : LOVE John Candy. Whatta guy.

kesmarn : We suspect they’re too wily to fall for our plans, though.

KQµårk 死神 : Yum Canadian Bacon great movie.

choicelady : ADLib – I can’t see them wanting ANYTHING from us – they have U.S. TV and know how incredibly screwed up we are. I lived in Sidney, NS one summer, and they got Detroit cable news – it RUINED the city. Everyone got scared of crime despite the fact they actually have almost NONE. Taught a huge lesson – the US is great to visit. They don’t want to be responsible for it!

ChrisR266 : Kes: Bwaaaahnahaha! Now that’s funny, and of course, worth considering.

AdLib : Chris – Of course! Canadian invasions of the US to solve the HC crisis was this weeks top issue!

kesmarn : We’re trying to find a way to annex ourselves to Canada, Chris.

PatsyT : Well KQ I took care of my husband parents …. Wow all I have to Say is Wow It is amazing what they can bring you back from.

ChrisR266 : I slipped out for a moment, but I see all of you have covered just about everything worth covering this last week., LOL.

KQµårk 死神 : The sad part pain medication wise I could get it all over the counter in Canada and Europe

kesmarn : That’s what I was afraid of,c’lady. They’re just too darned smart to invade us

AdLib : CL – What if we offered to keep Justin Bieber in the US…or threaten to return him?

choicelady : AdLib – but remember: they have to invade us, not the other way around!

AdLib : CL – I’m signing on to your idea of a Canadian invasion!

choicelady : kes, AdLib – there is not enough money in the world to get Canada to invade and then be responsible for us.

KQµårk 死神 : You have no idea Patsy

choicelady : ADLib – it’s the only way we’ll get it given how incredibly dysfunctional the advocates for it here in CA are. I say let them invade, and we’ll pull a “mouse that roared” reparations and settlement on them and demand health care.

PatsyT : Geez KQ they really ran you thru the ringer…

KQµårk 死神 : I really have to watch my amounts of acetaminophen too because of my Kidneys.

kesmarn : I wonder how big a bribe it would take to get Canada to invade this place…

choicelady : AdLib – No. Even Romney will not make Bush look good. No.

AdLib : CL – You just solved our health care crisis! We encourage Canada to invade us then we surrender and the US becomes Canadian territory and we all get single payer health care! Brilliant!

KQµårk 死神 : So we get all our pain meds from Cypress of all places.

choicelady : KQ – well, scratch the Percocet! I tolerated it quite well, but for about a week I took two at night, and I had withdrawal cramps when I stopped. That’s scary after only a WEEK!

PatsyT : OxyRotten

kesmarn : Oxycontin, Patsy.

KQµårk 死神 : Time release codeine is really not that bad less withdrawal and it lasts long. The big thing about the designer opiates is they get you high. Studies in Europe shows 30mg Codeine is just as effected as 5-15 mg of the designer crap the US pushes.

PatsyT : What was that stuff the Rush was on?

choicelady : AdLib – if the Canadians invade, we sign up for health care and demand access to the cod fishing. That’ll show ‘em! Eh?

AdLib : So, will Newt win tomorrow in SC? If so, will he win in FL? Then what?

kesmarn : “Government of the wealthy, by the wealthy and for the wealthy.”

AdLib : Can anyone really imagine a Romney Presidency? It would make Bush look like Lincoln.

KQµårk 死神 : CL percocet makes me nauseated and hydrocodone does not last long enough.

choicelady : AdLib – you have to shake your head when Romney thinks battleships would deter 9/11 type actions. What a maroon.

kesmarn : If we’re invaded by Canada during a Romney presidency,we’l l greet them with flowers and kisses.

PatsyT : Choice accurate point ..

KQµårk 死神 : I’m not gonna say you get use to it but you learn how to live with it.

choicelady : KQ – when I had the burning nerve pain, peripheral neuropathy, they gave me Percocet, and one generally did the trick. It’s oxycoton and acetominphen, and it’s not terribly strong but IS effective. If you don’t like what you’re on, that might be better? It is a Class 2 controlled substance.

AdLib : KQ – But what if we’re invaded by Canada? What will we do?

kesmarn : Ouch, KQ! That sounds like it would be tough to deal with day in and day out. I take it Neurontin didn’t do the job… It’s not terribly effective although we give it a lot.

KQµårk 死神 : AL we know it’s just plain stupid. We are not going to do any more occupations so we don’t need that many troops or ships.

AdLib : KQ – Damn, that is tough to live with but you are one tough customer!

PatsyT : So the repubs could win big if they could just enough Roofies (Romnies) into the public bloodstream

KQµårk 死神 : Slow release codeine or morphine is the only thing I can take for my nerve damage in my feet or they constantly feel like they are on fire.

choicelady : Patsy – one generally doesn’t TAKE it, it is thrust upon one. Generally female by male. DAte rape drug. Or, in one case I know, stranger rape drug. But it’s not something you take on your own.

AdLib : KQ – I love the very fragile and flawed line, “I want to build a military that will scare off anyone from ever attacking us!” What nation has tried to attack the United States since WWII? Al Qaeda wouldn’t have done 9/11 if only we had more battleships? What an idiot!

kesmarn : KQ, really? Was the withdrawal bad? We don’t use a lot of that.

KQµårk 死神 : Love it kes I might put a couple Romney’s on especially if he is the nominee.

choicelady : kes – applies well to Romney, too!

PatsyT : Ahhh Yes Choice The pill you take when you don’t want to remember anything

kesmarn : That could be Romney on the Periodic Table: Romhypnol

KQµårk 死神 : kes I was doing Kadian for a while but you talk about withdrawal when I stopped taking it.

choicelady : Patsy – roofies? Rohypnol. I think the GOP invented it, or at least Newt. Who’d boff him without it?

kesmarn : Rohypnol!

KQµårk 死神 : You hear Romney wants to add 100,000 troops and dozens of ships to the navy. FFS how is he gonna pay for that with his tax cuts too.

PatsyT : Hey what is that drug they use for date rape?

choicelady : kes! You mean trivia is NOT important!!! Oh the disillusionment!

AdLib : Patsy – I have been making it okay through the GOP debates for the most part, it’s been more of a demolition derby with little if anything sticking to Obama (Romney calls him a failure in foreign policy…what a fool). The only debates that were hard to get through were when they all just echoed the same BS and were too timid to confront each other.

kesmarn : Plus Morphine in this case, Patsy.

choicelady : AdLib – yes – Cabaret. About Weimar Germany which,if the GOP get control, we will closely resemble.

kesmarn : I can remember trivia. Just nothing important.

KQµårk 死神 : Oh CL take care of yourself.

PatsyT : Do they make Ambien Plus? What is the Plus?

choicelady : kes – thank you. Today I was down to Berkeley in rain and wind, a 3 hour training for a new staff person, and 2 hours back in rain and wind. I have a certified case of CRS.

kesmarn : Patsy, the Repub debates ARE heavy meds. Ambien Plus.

KQµårk 死神 : Newticritium ?

AdLib : CL – That’s a better pick! As is Kes’ “Money Makes the World Go ROund”. Then again, there’s the Beatles, “That’s What I want! (Money)”

choicelady : kes – YES! CAbaret!

kesmarn : Oh…gotcha!

choicelady : kes – that IS my one concern. The rally is 2 hours long, and the back is good for about 30 minutes before it starts to ache. Lucky for me, I’m fourth speaker. Then – I’m OUTTA there!

KQµårk 死神 : Oh I know I was just talking about the register Obama was singing in.

PatsyT : How are you all surviving the GOP Debates… do you have to take heavy meds to watch? I have not been able to look..

kesmarn : “Money Makes the World Go Round”

KQµårk 死神 : Then again when Obama gets irritated I think that’s his true register or at least falsetto (sp)

kesmarn : Cabaret!

kesmarn : Take care of your back, c’lady.

choicelady : ADLib – but if it’s Newt he could sing “Money, money, money, money” from whatever it’s from. That thing with Joel Gray…sigh.

AdLib : KQ – I’m with CL on Haguebound, nice one!

PatsyT : I was blown away by Pres Obamas voice! He Rocks!

kesmarn : That was Al Green, KQ!

AdLib : CL – That would be very cool! And cold so dress warmly and don’t forget that umbrella!

KQµårk 死神 : I’ll tell you though I was expecting something more like Lou Rawls not Marvin Gaye.

choicelady : KQ – Oh excellent for Mubarak! EXCELLENT!

AdLib : Obama has a damn good voice…hey, why not have a debate moderated by America Idol! Then we could get a bigger number of Americans watching a debate and there could be a sing-off! Obama would crush Romney’s rendition of “Fool On The Hill”.

KQµårk 死神 : Mubarack is Haguebound

choicelady : Hey Patsy – I’m doing that tomorrow, wind and rain notwithstanding! PlantePOVers Strike a Blow for Freedom!

kesmarn : Or there’s the French/German version Merd!-ach!

KQµårk 死神 : I think I can work with the ispy theme

choicelady : ADLib – oh, THAT is GREAT: Ispyonu. Fantastic! Now we know why we pay you the big bucks!

AdLib : Murdoch: Ispyonu

PatsyT : I worked at a event today in Santa Ana… It was Great! «link»

choicelady : kes – I LIKE Oatsy – it’s very down home!

ChrisR266 : AdLib: I couldn’t agree more. I was awestruck by it all when I pulled up the President’s little tune on video.

KQµårk 死神 : That’s good adlib but I don’t think it will fit.

choicelady : ADLib – and what about your toes? I may see the Big Enchilada tomorrow – Citizens United rally (in favor of the Constitutional Amendment, NOT the decision!) so he might be there. If I get to talk to him, I will let you know.

kesmarn : I have fallen in love with the Prez’s crooning, AdLib.

AdLib : Peepingtomium.

AdLib : Murdoch could be Pepingtomium.

kesmarn : C’lady, that “Oatsy” moniker is the result of a typo a few weeks ago.

AdLib : Hey Patsy! Hey Kes! Wassup?!

KQµårk 死神 : Hmmm… I do need to fit in Murdoch this time

choicelady : ADLib – I have NO doubt that the story was Rovian timing. But Newt is scum, and I never mind TRUE stories emerging.

AdLib : CL – I will check my email for it but it’s hard to type with all my fingers crossed!

kesmarn : Or the Murdoch crew…

choicelady : kes – a new name for our friend? Makes her sound like a hayseed!

AdLib : CL – We all know Newt is nasty and I don’t doubt the story but coming out 2 days before the primary? That was a secret op by Romney’s camp or supporters.

kesmarn : Oatsy! How are ya?

choicelady : Hey Patsy! Great to see you!

PatsyT : Hey Folks! How is everyone?

kesmarn : Hola! Windy, snowy, wind chill about zero. Lovely!

choicelady : kes – oh THAT’s what it is! I’d wondered. And here I thought it was just Youngstown.

AdLib : Chris – I do think that night was the most surreal and yet poignant yet. The hateful and hollow old white men getting nasty with each other and Obama crooning perfectly on key at a dignified presentation. Perfect!

KQµårk 死神 : Heya Kes

ChrisR266 : Don’t you know it, Kes. How are things on the lake?

kesmarn : Here in Kasich’s Ohio, hell has frozen over. Hiyall!

choicelady : Chris – in Ohio “fine” means you still have power!

choicelady : AdLib – stay dry! And check your email for a cartoon I sent you!

KQµårk 死神 : Romney is a fecking gaffe machine. I’m really surprised how bad he is on his feet.

ChrisR266 : Evening, Choice, good to read you here this FINE evening in Ohio. Har har.

choicelady : AdLib – my ex knows Newt’s second ex slightly. Knows her uncle actually. She said some of this about 4 years ago, so I think it’s true. That’s not to say Rove was not behind it, but it doesn’t make it NOT true.

KQµårk 死神 : shhh… just talk about it in “quiet rooms”

AdLib : Hey CL! Yep, that wind and rain is headed down here shortly.

AdLib : KQ – I will take your $10,000 bet because I am just a guy on the street.

ChrisR266 : All: I think this has been nothing short of a grand week in politics, and the President slam dunked it with a pitch perfect rendition of “Let’s stay together.” What a thoroughly human and wonderful moment.

KQµårk 死神 : Hey CL great to have you.

AdLib : Chris, glad you’re well but sorry to hear about that terrible weather. Has been a pretty warm summer in LA but like everywhere, Climate Change has made it crazy from time to time.

choicelady : Hey everyone! Great to see you. Chris – so sorry about the sleet! It’s only rain and wind here.

KQµårk 死神 : You also heard the whisper campaign that Newt forced his wife to have an abortion or something like that. Remember Romney has allot of the Rove disciples.

KQµårk 死神 : Dude I bet you $10,000 you are right.

KQµårk 死神 : Yikes sounds nasty Chris

AdLib : KQ – I will bet that the Romney/Rove machine was behind getting Newt’s ex-wife to come out and do an interview 2 days before the primary. It’s the classic SC dirty trick.

ChrisR266 : I’m Well, AL, I hope you are the same. We have some serious sleet coming down up here, the roads ought to be a cluster f#$k in about an hour or so, 4 inches of snow coming after that.

KQµårk 死神 : Trinewtium

KQµårk 死神 : Yeah I’m not crazy of the Cheat meme.

AdLib : Or for Newt: Trithreesome

ChrisR266 : For Gingrich: Gadolinium. It’s a real element, too. seems to fit.

AdLib : How are you doing tonight, Chris?

AdLib : Heh! That’s it KQ!

KQµårk 死神 : Hermium 999

AdLib : Herman Cain – Nineum?

KQµårk 死神 : Gotcha I always forget he’s an old wanker

AdLib : KQ – You’re welcome for the set up, my friend!

KQµårk 死神 : Definitely an isotope of 999.

AdLib : Ron Paul is so old, he lives in a crypt.

ChrisR266 : AdLib: Oh, ok. In that case, I can be a little more flexible. Some of these things you have to be a stickler about normally, you know? :=)

AdLib : How about Herman Cain? What element would he be?

KQµårk 死神 : Cryptonite is going over my head for some reason.

KQµårk 死神 : I think I will use that or a derivation. The picture I used his wig is all over the place.

AdLib : Chris – Hey! Yes, we were thinking up new element names for people, Crypt-onite was for Ron Paul.

KQµårk 死神 : Coastal states in the west and NE are gonna be tough for Newt with the Midwest.

AdLib : Trump: Egowig\

ChrisR266 : Hi all: only read back a bit, but kryptonite is spelled with a K. Got that? Happy friday to everyone.

KQµårk 死神 : Yeah that’s why he need VA so much because GA and a couple other Southern states would help.

AdLib : Newt will fall apart during Super Tuesday though because of the lack of resources and organization. It’s manageable for him to compete in one state at a time but otherwise, he won’t have what it takes.

KQµårk 死神 : Hey can you think of a name for trump?

KQµårk 死神 : Sodomized but I might have to change that one.

AdLib : I guess Gaddafi is an element in that group too.

KQµårk 死神 : Nope you are right about VA though that will help Romney stem the tide in southern states because Gingrich could run the table.

AdLib :

AdLib : And ROmney being Mormon doesn’t sit too well with Jews and RW Christians there.

KQµårk 死神 : OBL is Okilldum

KQµårk 死神 : Yeah and I think he has a hell of a shot with FL because of the seniors. They don’t trust Romney.

KQµårk 死神 : I added the a despots and terrorist group with OBL and Qaddafi

AdLib : And Newt could win FL too! Too bad he’s not on the ballot in VA, he could’ve done well there too.

AdLib : This is just too funny, KQ, can’t wait!

KQµårk 死神 : Sanctimony under the xenophobe group.

AdLib : What element, that is, is Santorum?

KQµårk 死神 : Yup and Real Clear Politics have him up by an average of three which is higher than what Santorum was up by in IA.

AdLib : What is Rick Santorum?

AdLib : Flipflopium works for me!

KQµårk 死神 : I could probably do a half dozen on Romney but I got a great two faced graphic for Flipflopium

AdLib : The latest poll I saw from PPP had Newt ahead by 6.

KQµårk 死神 : Oh I’m crossing my fingers that would be a great ending.

AdLib :

KQµårk 死神 : Walker is Recallum

AdLib : Heh!

AdLib : So, looks like Mitt may indeed lose SC. If so, can’t wait to see his concession smile.

KQµårk 死神 : Not yet Boehner is the new Kryon though.

AdLib : Cryptonite?

AdLib : Love them all!

KQµårk 死神 : You mean Newsletteron

AdLib : Right!

KQµårk 死神 : The antilaboride series has Walker, Kasich and the Kock bros.

AdLib : Or in the case of ROn Paul, Bore-on.

KQµårk 死神 : Yeah Newt derivatives write themselves.

KQµårk 死神 : LOL he’s one there as Cheatogen and so is Flipflopium

AdLib : Or Rom-moanium?

AdLib : What about Newtrons?

AdLib : That would be fantastic and no doubt, hilarious.

KQµårk 死神 : Adding the Antilaboride and Destroid series.

KQµårk 死神 : Yeah I remember I thought an update for the 2012 election was due.

AdLib : articles

AdLib : I don’t know if I told you but your original is and remains one of our most popular asticles!

AdLib : Hey KQ!

KQµårk 死神 : He y’all working on the new Periodic Table of Dangerous Elements

AdLib : Don’t forget to say “Hi!” when you arrive!

AdLib : See you then CL!

choicelady : Off to dinner after a hair-raising drive in rain and wind. Be back a little after 7. “See” you all then!

AdLib : Vox Populi, our live chat about the week’s events begins tonight at 7 pm PST. Hope to see you then!

KQµårk 死神 : Take Care AdLib

KQµårk 死神 : Yeah that fizzled out quick

AdLib : Looks like time to call this edition of Vox Populi to a close. Have a great weekend KQuark and thanks to all who made it such a fun discussion tonight. See you next week!

KQµårk 死神 : Absolutely CL but I have confidence Obama and his team have every contingency covered. Just take care of yourself and you hubby and have as good a weekend as you all can.

choicelady : KQ – shhhh, don’t let him hear. He’ll be over…

choicelady : ‘Night all!

KQµårk 死神 : Oh CL I wish I could transport some of my wife’s stew to your hubby.

AdLib : Night CL!

choicelady : KQ – quickly – I think you may well be right, but it’s always worrisome.

KQµårk 死神 : CL I think it was hurting but then the financial crisis hit at the right time and it was obviously no longer an issue.

choicelady : Well now I am flaking out. Hubby is up looking for sustenance, and he can’t find anything. Have to go help him hunt down where I “hid” the cereal. As if it’s a big secret… Be well all, and for those who have Monday off – have a lovely 3-day weekend! See you next week!

KQµårk 死神 : CL I think our deflationary pressures are so great right now that even if there is more investment with the dollar it will not bring up the dollar. Especially since the Fed is freezing rates for two years at all time lows.

choicelady : KQ – yes, I will be watching the pump prices. But it did not hurt Obama in 2008, and with good PR about greed, it won’t hurt HIM but those who want to deregulate oil – aka Mittens.

choicelady : KQ – now you and I are cross typing! I’m with AB – watch out fingers!

KQµårk 死神 : But watch their will be another manufactured gas price hike to try and help the GOP like in 2008.

choicelady : AdLib – yes, the dollar is likely to be popular again. Down side? If it goes up, our exports are at risk. That could slow domestic production. WORST move EVER was the ’73 decision to let national media of exchange become tradable commodities – that has done SO much damage to our ability to export, our stability – that’s gotta get re-regulated next, and the EU crisis and other factors are pushing that toward reality. Obama gets it and has the capacity to make greater currency value stability a reality.

KQµårk 死神 : It all depends if the Euro inflates. If it does that’s real trouble. If it’s more stable the dollar is so depressed US goods are still cheap in Europe and they invented outsourcing for cheaper goods.

AdLib : Invient – It is something on the horizon that could harm our economy…or it could also make the US a safer place for world money to go and juice up our economy.

choicelady : AdLib – that’s precisely what I mean. Obama can handle it. Bain can be linked to CAUSING a lot of our crises.

KQµårk 死神 : What CL and AdLib said.

AdLib : Invient – EU seems to have a structure in place and austerity measures are continuing. It is a possibility but not a probability. As for BofA, it could be a blessing in disguise if they were to have trouble, Obama would be in a position to require the splitting up of a Too Big To Fail bank…which could help the financial marketplace by removing more risk of another TARP situation.

choicelady : invient – if the EU crisis heats up, ONLY Obama can handle it. I see in the paper though that there is a new meme – the Fed “did not see it coming” – they’re using 2006 info as if that was a time it COULD be seen and Geitner is to blame. Cute. Still and all, Obama has the juice and the chops to deal with whatever happens overseas.

KQµårk 死神 : invient I don’t think it will be like an explosion rather like a balloon being deflated.

choicelady : “Night AB – stay warm!

invient : Nope, eu crisis is going to implode. Then bofa is next. It’s only a matter of time.

KQµårk 死神 : Even if Obama switched out Biden as SOS it would be after the election and I’m not sure Hillary would be the VP.

choicelady : ‘Night Murph – hope you get some rest! “See” you next week!

AdLib : Night Murph!

MurphTheSurf3 : I know I have been quiet tonight…just tuckered out. Enjoyed being a bystander. See y’all next week.

AdLib : So what do you think, will the economy and jobs continue to improve through 2012? If so, what does Romney have to run on?

AdLib : It is an MSM creation, the Biden-Hillary switch. It sounds as absurd as it is. When has such a thing ever been done and why would it happen now, with Obama beating ROmney in poll after poll even before he’s begun to campaign? Silly stuff IMO.

KQµårk 死神 : I agree 100% CL.

KQµårk 死神 : And a half Mwah.

AdLib : AB – No Mwah! for me? Have a great weekend!

KQµårk 死神 : Have a great weekend Kes.

AlphaBitch : KQ: Mwah! and Mwah to you too, kes! Love to all.

choicelady : kes – have a grand weekend. I have to work Monday, so I wish you time off? Be well!

kesmarn : G’night, AB. Snuggle with the Blov to stay warm.

KQµårk 死神 : I kid you AB because you are such a great sport.

invient : I don’t wanna say it, but I think Denver will be creamed.

choicelady : AB – there is nothing unelectable about Biden. He is highly liked and is a good guy who has done a lot that’s very worthwhile. Hillary is the one with baggage, and I don’t trust her. If and ONLY if Biden WANTS to be Secretary of State would I want him to leave – his call. But I do NOT want Hillary! She’d drag Obama down.

AdLib : Thanks Kes! Sleep well!

AlphaBitch : KQ: Don’t you threaten me, young man! Hey! Our heater crapped out. (Too much talk of free enterprise) It’s getting cold, so I’m turning in. Have fun, play nice, and don’t mention Paul you know who again, invient!!

kesmarn : Well kids, I have to work tomorrow, so I’d better say good night. Have a great weekend and a wonderful Martin Luther King day on Monday.

AdLib : The problem with having such a lame candidate as Romney is that neither he nor the GOP want a VP that shows him up or harms the ticket. That’s a tough mission!

KQµårk 死神 : Go Pats!

KQµårk 死神 : Watch it I’ll bring up the replace Biden with Hillary question again AB.

choicelady : kes – kudos to Cher for that description. Mine would be she was rode hard and put away wet. Pretty much the same difference!

invient : I should know. I gotta see the end of Maddow, she picked a team. It better be Denver.

kesmarn : There you go, c’lady. I’ll never forget Cher’s description of Brewer: “too much sun and too much saddle.”

choicelady : kes – I don’t think the accent will carry him. Invient – that’s who I mean – RYAN!

KQµårk 死神 : Face it the GOP has a weak first team and a worse bench. BTW when does NE and Denver play tomorrow?

AlphaBitch : CL: ha ha ha. Not enough ciggies in the world! Geez, she has smoker’s mouth BIG TIME!

invient : AB, sorry :p

choicelady : Jan Brewer!!!!

choicelady : kes – Kasich is too northern and did not screw the Ohio folks well enough. But what about Walker? No – also too northern. What about (damn – mental block) the House guy who wants to kill Medicare. Evangelical, heartless, anti-labor, anti-”entitleme nts” – these all play well.

AlphaBitch : That woman in New Mexico is hard core, and beneath the radar. LOTS of oil money, too.

KQµårk 死神 : I wish it was Ryan so they could bring up the Ryan budget 24/7. Everyone knows it ends Medicare in the real world.

AlphaBitch : Invient: I just threw up in my throat!

KQµårk 死神 : Yeah CL Louisiana is a little bit different than the rest of the deep south.

kesmarn : He’s got the accent nailed pretty well, c’lady. Does that count?

invient : How about Paul Ryan.

AlphaBitch : What about that woman in N Mexico???

choicelady : kes – Jindal? Maybe. He’s evangelical. But he’s foreign, so I’m not sure he’d play in the rest of the Deep South. Louisiana has a real tolerance for odd people the rest of the South does NOT have, and I can’t see him drawing Iowa etc.

AlphaBitch : Or Scott Walker. I hear he might be available soon.

KQµårk 死神 : Don’t forget about Mitch Daniels.

AdLib : It has to be someone who’s more likeable than Romney and neither Rubio nor Haley fill that bill, their constituents don’t like them.

invient : Don’t be surprised if hate wins out in the gop

AlphaBitch : In the words of Jimmy Lafave, KQ: “desperate men do desperate things”.

KQµårk 死神 : CL I agree they need on protestant at least.

invient : Ahhh the delicate balance between hate for Obama and values

kesmarn : And there’s always JOHN KASICH…. {{scary music}}}

choicelady : Rubio strikes me as the male Palin. Lots and lots of baggage, lies about one’s past, and probably is a Dominionist Christian posing as a Catholic. And because of the latter, he’d be anathema I think to the evangelicals – he does not compensate for Romney’s Mormonism. In fact I think whoever it is will HAVE to be evangelical and a wild eyed one, too.

KQµårk 死神 : Sure a Mormon and an India. We are talking about the GOP folks.

AlphaBitch : Now there’s a thought…

invient : Kes, I was just thinking that.

AdLib : “The (Columbia, S.C.) State newspaper reported Sunday on a Winthrop University poll that revealed only 34 percent of registered voters approve of the job Nikki Haley is doing as governor. Upon reviewing Haley’s first year in office, one is left wondering not why her approval rating is so low but rather why it is so high.” «link»

kesmarn : There’s always Bobby Jindal….

KQµårk 死神 : My money goes back on milquetoast Pawlenty. Romney likes people that suck up to him.

kesmarn : And let’s face it, c’lady. Girls can’t get away with carrying baggage, even in the 21st century!

KQµårk 死神 : After the loses of most of the GOP woman in 2010 I doubt it would be a woman VP.

choicelady : Oh wow – so would I! She’d be wonderful, but I strongly believe she would NOT want the job!

KQµårk 死神 : Yeah Rubio would be the perfect pander and another terrible decision by a GOP candidate.

choicelady : kes – Nikki carries some baggage. It came out, got swept back, but would REALLY get pulled up if she were Veep candidate. She’d make Sarah look demure!

AlphaBitch : KQ: Yo tambien!

KQµårk 死神 : Though I would vote for Michelle Obama in 2016 in a second.

AdLib : “Marco Rubio’s approval ratings continue to decline; may not be much help in Florida as VP choice Public Policy Polling: Marco Rubio’s poll numbers have declined every time PPP’s polled Florida this year and voters are now evenly divided on him with 40% approving and 40% disapproving.” «link»

AlphaBitch : But AL, even the rocks know Jeb is way smarter than W. And he DOES have charisma!!! Trust me.

choicelady : ADLib – if Jeb thinks we’ll forget by 2016, he’s stupider than I thought. And by that point he’d be getting on in years though not old – he was born in ’53 so he’d be 63. Still these days, that’s maybe too old to start running. And he has major baggage from a Medicare scam he pulled as I recall. That would not look good, though he got away with it in FL, land of those who’d care.

KQµårk 死神 : Honestly AdLib if there was not Bush II, Hillary probably would have won last time around. People are tired of the US monarchy.

kesmarn : AdLib, I’m so glad you said “champing” and not “chomping” the way so many people do. Just had to toss that in there…

KQµårk 死神 : True AdLib it has not hurt him in FL but I’m sure he would not pass the media vetting as a VP canididate.

AdLib : Yep, America is just champing at the bit to put ANOTHER Bush in the WH. Not.

kesmarn : c’lady, that’s hilarious about Nikki’s “adventures.” And she looks so…Republican. ..

AlphaBitch : By Turdblossom, I mean Rove can “do his thing” with a Bush again.

AdLib : KQ – And Rubio’s been outed as a fraud. You don’t need to add that baggage on your campaign when you’re a fraud, as Romney is.

AlphaBitch : Unless there’s a gentleman’s agreement that Romney will only CHOOSE to run one term! And Turdblossom can bloom once more. This makes sense, team.

KQµårk 死神 : The thing about Rubio is he’s Sarah Palin with less experience. He’s only been US Senator for a little over a year and was in the FL legislator before.

kesmarn : Oh yeah…old man George Romney used to talk about his “family in “Olde Mexico”…serio usly.

invient : I think we a

AdLib : AB – But if Romney won, Jeb wouldn’t be able to run until 2020. Jeb has to instead bet that Romney loses without him on the ticket, which could make him damaged goods.

choicelady : kes – ummmm, Mexican? Not exactly! LOL!!!

AlphaBitch : BINGO, AL. You get southern, Bush, and minority all in one. If only HE had a “mangina”. (For you, kes!)

kesmarn : But AB, the Romney claim to BE Mexican…

choicelady : kes – oh now there’s a possibility. She only has endless affairs hanging around her neck. She’d be good with Mittens. If he could keep her off his bod – one hears things about her rather indelicate tendency to boff anyone who comes her way…

AlphaBitch : What better lead up, AL???

kesmarn : She’d “balance” the ticket, though, AdLib…

AlphaBitch : AND he’s married to a “Mexican”.

AdLib : Jeb is waiting to run in 2016, no way he’d be Romney’s VP.

invient : Jeb*. Err

AdLib : Kes – I think that’s a very good suggestion, Nikki Haley would be a clever pick except she is very disliked in her state, she is a woman and a minority which doesn’t appeal to Baggers generally.

AlphaBitch : Kes: *snicker*

invient : Jen would be the best fit, he’ll if they could get the adopted Reagan.

kesmarn : “Mangina”!

choicelady : COULTER???? Nah – she’d not want to lose her income. She wants to dish it out, but as an elected official, she’d be subject to criticism, and you’ve SEEN how well she deals with THAT.

AlphaBitch : AL: She’s not a witch.

choicelady : AB – I’m not sorry for him. It’s pure self indulgence on his part. He’s a glutton and always has been and sees nothing wrong with it while he criticizes everyone else for loving the “wrong” person. SOB.

AdLib : I know who would be perfect for Romney’s running mate! Christine O’Donnell!

kesmarn : Nikki Haley? (Do I have her name right?)

AlphaBitch : AL: Jeb??????

AlphaBitch : OT, but who was “Ann Coulter’s Mangina” on that other site? I used to crack up at that!

AdLib : AB – Then again, maybe they would be worried about it being a reminder of the Palin disaster, to have Bachmann on. Romney does need an attack dog and a Southerner.

choicelady : AdLib – yeah, but Michelle is geographically undesirable. Mitt has too many ties to MI, and she’s from right next door (sort of.)

invient : Good. Glad maher is back on.

kesmarn : Ann Coulter?

AlphaBitch : AL: But she’s a northener…….

choicelady : AB – oh perish those thoughts! Those two women breed mean!

choicelady : Hi invient! How are you?

AdLib : Hey Invient!

AlphaBitch : Hi back atya, invient!

kesmarn : Hey, invient!

AlphaBitch : AL: I was thinking the same scary thing…

invient : Hi!

kesmarn : I love them too. Pure mirth. No mean.

AlphaBitch : CL: You’re right. He’s porked up quite a bit. Sorry for him.

choicelady : Point about Huckabee – while all the fingers get pointed at GLBT people, they never think about Gluttony as one of the seven deadly sins, do they?

KQµårk 死神 : Dumb and Dumber would be Romney and Perry.

AdLib : Michele Bachmann?

AdLib : Murph – Thanks for the link, will definitely read it later. I still enjoy The Boys!

AlphaBitch : Liz Cheney?? Mrs. Clarence Thomas???

choicelady : Well – always Huckabee, but I’m thinking he’s not interested since he’s regaining all the weight. He’s starting to resemble Christie again.

MurphTheSurf3 : Here is that Laurel and Hardy link again. It did not print correctly. A fine analysis. «link»

AdLib : How about Dumb and Dumber?

AdLib : Murph – I would never denigrate Laurel & Hardy, they have far more integrity than anyone in the GOP.

AlphaBitch : Thanks, kes, queen of the puns!

choicelady : AB – now THAT’s scary! When dirt disses you, you are DUMB!

kesmarn : AB :lol

KQµårk 死神 : How about Abbot and Costello then.

kesmarn : Good point, c’lady. And he’s a poster boy for the RR evangelicals.

AlphaBitch : Rocks realize Perry is stupid, CL.

AdLib : Nope, would never be Paul. The GOP Elite wouldn’t want him to be one heartbeat away from the presidency.

MurphTheSurf3 : Let’s not denigrate Laurel and Hardy. They served a noble purpose. I cannot imagine either Romney or Christie doing as well. A fine mess: the enduring appeal of Laurel and Hardy In the Great Depression, they bypassed the pathos of Charlie Chaplin and went straight for slapstick laughs every time. No wonder Laurel and Hardy can still crack us up «link» ian.co.uk/film/2 009/aug/28/laure l-hardy-slapstic k

KQµårk 死神 : Nah Perry would never do it now anyway.

choicelady : Folks – we are making an assumption the GOP recognize that Perry’s stupid. That may not be accurate.

AdLib : Hey! AB, you beat me!

AlphaBitch : Not enough tinfoil. Remember: Porky Rove has to approve.

KQµårk 死神 : The ironic part is if he picks Rubio it shows how stupid the GOP thinks the hispanic community is. Rubio would not get one more hispanic vote past FL but that may be all he would count on.

choicelady : AB – there’s always Paul. Texas, youth. Twofers.

AlphaBitch : Jinx, AL.

AlphaBitch : CL: No, Perry is too dumb even for TP’ers.

AdLib : CL – Perry would have been ideal if he hadn’t proven himself to be such a moron and loser.

kesmarn : Romney’s veep had better get used to riding in a crate on top of the presidential limo, whoever he is.

AlphaBitch : I think the VP will need to appeal to either 1) women or 2) youth or 3) any ethnic group other than white. That’s their only shot.

choicelady : kes and everyone – I just had a very scary thought: If Willard needs geographic diversity and pandering to the Religious Right, would he be awful enough to pick PERRY????

kesmarn : “Why don’t you DO something to HELP me, Willard?”

KQµårk 死神 : The only other one it could possible be is Pawlenty and that would be because Romney is afraid of being up staged.

AdLib : Beat me Kes!

choicelady : kes – LOL!!!! That’s priceless!

AdLib : Kes – “Well here’s another fine mess you’ve gotten us into, Willard!” “I’m sorry Chrissy! I’ll bet you $10,000 it never happens again!”

KQµårk 死神 : kes you have me in stiches.

kesmarn : “Another fine mess you’ve gotten me into, Mittens!”

choicelady : KQ – Barbour did not realize they WERE criminals. They were no different from his friends.

KQµårk 死神 : kes that’s the image I have in my brain too.

AlphaBitch : Naughty again, kes!

choicelady : kes – there’d never be room on the platform for both. Romney and SuperKeester just cannot co-exist. I think Christie cannot do it, and I believe with ALL my heart he’s mobbed up. Romney will pick someone with few negatives (from HIS point of view). So if you’ve put steel mills out of business, Santorum’s focus on re-indstrializat ion (via ZERO taxes and probably NO unions) would be a lovely counterbalance.

kesmarn : They might have a certain Laurel and Hardy visual going for them, though. Romney and Christie.

KQµårk 死神 : I think it almost has to be Rubio and it fits Romney’s need to pander.

AdLib : Murph – And Glenn Beck advertising on MSNBC??? Huh? For people to pay to watch him? Crazy!

AlphaBitch : Christie is a scary thought. he said he wouldn’t run for PRESIDENT. Nothing about VP. And Mitt could use the charisma help. If you think Christie has charisma….

KQµårk 死神 : Was it a spiteful kick in the nuts to liberals saying you want all these criminals back on the streets here they are.

AdLib : I don’t think Christie, MA and NJ, too East Coast of a ticket and Christie shows up Romney on the charisma factor which would make him look bad.

MurphTheSurf3 : AB…all of those right wing ads on MSNBC…who is listening to them….Huckabee demanding we all sign a petition to repeal OBAMACARE….ooo oooh scarrrreeeeeee.

KQµårk 死神 : So why did Barbour release all those criminals?

AdLib : Barbour is damaged goods now too…maybe Jim DeMint?

kesmarn : Chris Christie?

choicelady : AB – I totally fear Santorum is very probable. People are defending his late term abortion as a natural miscarriage. Well, we have to find the Family Circle article of 1997 (I read it then) where Karen merely defends the TYPE of procedure, not the FACT of doing it.

KQµårk 死神 : CL I’ve done hundreds of tech presentations and even though the material has to be technical to some degree you do just lose people and have to gear any type of presentation you are doing to the target audience if it’s a speech, an ad or debate.

AlphaBitch : So: Ben Nelson? Haley Big Butt Barbour? Who??

kesmarn : Romney-Beck!

AlphaBitch : Naughty, kes!

AdLib : AB – With an East Coaster at the top of the ticket, Romney needs a Southerner or at least a middle America type. Unless he goes for stunt casting like McCain did with Palin.

kesmarn : There’s always Beck’s chalk and blackboard…

choicelady : Murph – I know, but one of Obama’s strengths, not at all unlike Clinton’s, is his ability to connect with real people in immediate ways.

MurphTheSurf3 : CL…see your point…but all those words in a world which is so visual.

AlphaBitch : Can dems even BUY ads on Fox??? In “prime time” like O’Reilley.

choicelady : kes – well, there is that. Cheney kinda lowered the bar, didn’t he? But I agree with AdLib – Rubio is VERY damaged goods.

AdLib : Murph – Perot was really onto something. Just show a simple graphic chart that tells Americans the truth about something and they will get it immediately. Rattle off numbers and their eyes glaze over. It’s so simple and easy, I hope they figure this out.

KQµårk 死神 : Remember campaigns are about touching people’s emotions, especially with the low info voters.

AlphaBitch : AL: Think he’d pick a Santorum or a Huckabee?

choicelady : AB – I KNOW who is talking! And I agree with her!

choicelady : Murph – what you see is usually a person-to-person interchange. I think you see the media stuff in ads, etc. But I found in trainings I do that media diverts attention away from the speaker, and Obama does not want that.

kesmarn : No, AB. Cable all gone. What did she say?

KQµårk 死神 : Completely agree AB but Obama has to use personal accounts with real people too.

AlphaBitch : Kes: see Liz C. today?

AdLib : Rubio is damaged goods, his whole story was a fraud and he’s been outed as a liar. Also, his policies are adversarial towards most Latinos.

kesmarn : c’lady, after Cheney in the heartbeat-away job, you’d think they could handle it.

MurphTheSurf3 : AdLb- speaking of charts. Why don’t folks like Obama use AV aids….huge scrim screems with projected power points and graphs. Why this 19th century reliance on oratory….yaday adayada.

AlphaBitch : KQ: but every damn ad needs a chart. Every stinking one of them. Or a photo of workers losing jobs.

choicelady : AdLib – you’re spot on. Those charts are mindblowing!

KQµårk 死神 : I don’t think they are allowed props unless it’s an ear receiver like Bush had.

AlphaBitch : Ok, CL. then OFF WITH THEIR HEADS! sayeth you-know-who

choicelady : kes – if the GOP goes Rubio, even the birthers will be on his butt. A lying sack of shit – a heartbeat away from the presidency?

choicelady : AB – that’s fine, but I worked with union folks. For me it’s RAGE.

AdLib : CL – I mentioned this on Daily Planet today but all Obama needs to do is hold up a few simple charts at every debate, that show how 99% have lost wealth and the 1% have gained, how the economy and employment have improved under his Presidency and how his tax plan makes rates fair on all and Romney’s taxes the poor and middle class to greatly benefit the wealthy. Simple, indisputable images…picture s that speak thousands of words Romney could never deflect.

AlphaBitch : Kes: my guess too!

choicelady : AB – he may be forgiven his color choice. You’re right. It WAS the 80s!

MurphTheSurf3 : kes..by my count Bain used the Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation six times to cover its raid on funds and then choking off future contributions.

kesmarn : Rubio, AB?

AlphaBitch : CL: I prefer “Righteous indignation”.

choicelady : AdLib – raiding pension funds – the employers’ contribution – is perfectly legal. That’s how they changed and gamed the system. We need to talk about how they changed the rules of the game to benefit the few at the expense of the many. It’s not ‘envy’ we feel – it’s RAGE!

AlphaBitch : So: running mate guesses again? I love this game!

kesmarn : Awww…nemmind about the pensions… the Pension Guarantee Fund’ll cover it. Forget paying loans back … the FDIC will take care of it. (Romney) But he hates big gummint.

KQµårk 死神 : AB I had a boss who was Chinese and he was so proud when he bought his first McMansion. You would have thought he was declared emperor or something.

AlphaBitch : CL: NO! He laughed as loud and long as I did! I was amazed – there was no sense of “losing face”. He recognized and appreciated absurdity so well. We went to bluegrass concerts and went to stock his apartment at Target. The only “sad” thing he did was try and buy one fork, one spoon, one glass, etc. He could not believe he could have a set!! AND he loved the color peach. (It WAS the 80s)

choicelady : KQ – we have to move this discussion away from “income REdistribution” to income justice so that the work you do to build wealth is rewarded decently. Jobs must be able to sustain families. Labor is not a commodity – it is shared responsibility which means the fruits of labor must be shared as well. The ‘race to the bottom’ is not American!

AdLib : AB – Very funny!

MurphTheSurf3 : Kes and KQ….I am just trying to get a leg up in the service to my future Lords and Masters. SO, BOW, NOW.

AdLib : [whisper]Wait until we get info about all of the workers pension funds that were raided by Bain when they chopped up businesses. Stealing from the workers to enrich themselves then destroying the company and tossing thousands out of work. THAT is the kind of background we want in a President!

choicelady : AB – oh, that’s funny! I hope he knew you were not laughing AT him!

KQµårk 死神 : Like someone on the Rachel show said income inequality is just a debate the GOP is afraid to have.

AlphaBitch : My favorite was a wonderful young man, sent to “oversee” us while we handled a very large, EXTREMELY complex maritime case. Seems a shipload of wood from South America, en route on a ship licensed in the Bahamas and captained by a Dutchman, caught fire and had to land in Honolulu en route to China. This amazing man and I had many lunches and conversations. My fave experience was when I asked him: “So, what do you like best about America so far?” and he got a very perplexed look on his face, repeating to me: “What …do….I…lik e…about…Amer ican supper?” We laughed our heads off at that one!

kesmarn : WHAT DID YOU SAY, MURPH? SPEAK UP!!!

choicelady : Murph – here’s my card. Everyone else?

KQµårk 死神 : Shhhhhh…..Murp h

AdLib : In fact, the America that the GOP want is more of a mirror image of what China is today!

choicelady : AB – if the Left capitalists, and there are many, were smart, they’d try again with a progressive station network. But I want people OTHER than Thom Hartmann – he’s peddling lies about Obama, the creep.

MurphTheSurf3 : PLEASE EVERYONE….BEFO RE THIS GOES ON….is this a Romney certified “quiet room” appropriate to such a discussion. Are you all part of the club? Membership cards, please.

KQµårk 死神 : I’ve never been there AdLib but from the Chinese folks I knew they never wanted to go back.

kesmarn : Ooooh, so sorry to hear about the pneumonia, c’lady. Hope he’s better soon!

choicelady : AB – that’s amazing. Clear Channel????

AdLib : AB – I had the great fortune to visit Beijing and the people are, in general, very pleasant. However, there is a velvet oppression hanging in the air and there are different worlds there, the wealthy and some middle class and the dirt poor and horribly exploited.

KQµårk 死神 : It’s just a half notch ahead of Phil Graham’s country of whiners quote.

choicelady : kes – I’m well. Hubby has pneumonia but getting better. It’s cold here, too – not as much as there – frost on the cars every morning.

kesmarn : I have, AB. Can’t remember the source. But I remember the “Yippee!” reaction i had.

KQµårk 死神 : You are spot on with your point AdLib and the whole envious line of defense is as lame as it gets.

AlphaBitch : Anyone else heard that?

choicelady : AB – I knew a young Chinese man back in the 80s, too – he was delightful! He was from Shanghai and it was his first time out as a student at Brown University. He loved America but loved China, too. He was so fun to know.

kesmarn : AB That’s what being owned by Bain will do for ya. Clear Channel, meet the bankruptcy judge!

KQµårk 死神 : Oh believe me I’ve been on the worry side more often but I think Romney could give a rats arse about firing anyone.

kesmarn : Doing well, c’lady. Super cold here. And yourself?

choicelady : kes! Hi – I had to tend hubby a minute and missed your arrival! How are you?

AlphaBitch : Clear Channel is close to bankruptcy themselves, I’ve heard.

AdLib : KQ – I think the point was well made that Romney “likes” firing people and that is not a trait good people will relate to. Most people have never been in the position you were in, just on the other side, worrying about being let go or actually let go. This will haunt Romney as a narrative is built to portray him as a cold and unsympathetic, selfish elitist.

KQµårk 死神 : Absolutely AB being the science field I worked with a good number of Chinese folks and had a similar positive experience. I still keep in touch with a few.

kesmarn : I see that Bain Capital owns Clear Channel which owns Rush and Hannity. Surprise!

KQµårk 死神 : Fortunately I was lucky because I got to hire a couple dozen and obviously most worked out or moved on their own.

kesmarn : Aryana, the world’s richest, most conscience-less mercenary.

AlphaBitch : AL: No she did not. but I worked for the law firm in Seattle that represented the People’s Republic in the early 80s – we were the first after trade opened – and I have to say, I really enjoyed the Chinese. They were much more easy going, open minded, playful than I had expected, after having worked with several other Asian cultures as well. But I agree – she didn’t see the “other side” of sweat shops and having to go work in the city.

MurphTheSurf3 : Kes….good timing….the topic seems to be how to fire Ariaanna Huffington who some here seems to have a few concerns about….or am I being too harsh?

KQµårk 死神 : I’ve had to fire two people in my career and it was the most gut wrenching thing I’ve ever had to do. And believe me these people really really deserved to be fired.

kesmarn : I’m down with those pink slips.

AdLib : Kes – Yes, we were talking about firing Arianna and Romney.

kesmarn : Yay!!! What’s my new job? La-Z-Boy tester?

AlphaBitch : Kes: You’re HIRED!

AdLib : AB – I don’t know that your German friend visited any of the sweat shops or factories in China. Or the desperate rural areas.

AlphaBitch : CL: Another wise woman once told me that fear and love cannot exist within your heart simultaneously, and it’s up to you to choose. But when I watch Repubs, I have to say that I think the fear and greed run fairly high. I love Campbell.

kesmarn : Good Friday evening,folks! Tonight’s topic: “I like being able to fire people.”?

choicelady : ADLib – Ms. H. needs to know you are a mensch!

AdLib : CL – I would make sure guards escorted AH out with a small cardboard box with her desk’s contents and tossed her onto the sidewalk. I would ask that they not re-enact what the soldiers did to the Taliban.

AlphaBitch : CL: Today I had lunch with a friend who is German. She just came back from China. She wants to MOVE to China because of the joyful spirit she found there among the people – true belief of something better. At least that was her take after a few weeks.

choicelady : AB – I really disagree with that. The basic human needs include love and security. Adults can eliminate those but greed and fear as your sole emotions require supressing what is very primitive on the good side. Otherwise we’d have babies born with dagger teeth and the ability to steal within hours of birth. Seriously.

AdLib : AB – Actually, if you go by Joseph Campbell’s work, the only two main emotions in people are fear and desire. Greed is a negative and extreme aspect of desire but love and compassion are positive ones.

choicelady : AL – THAT would be worth it! SEeing the back of Ms. H as she crawls out the door with her box of…WAIT! She’s taking all the MONEY!!!! Catch her!

KQµårk 死神 : Let’s fire Romney and the GOPTEA house first though.

KQµårk 死神 : That would be a person I would joyfully fire AdLib. One of the few.

choicelady : AB – with the US populace as mobile as it is, that kind of fear of the “other” does seem odd. But people have been told for years we have the highest material standard of life. It’s kind of true, but other developed nations have a higher standard of LIFE overall. We are terrified to be “reduced” to European levels. And then, we’re the only free-range gun nation, and that plays a big role. We just cannot tolerate not being No. 1.

AdLib : CL – If I took over HP, Arianna would see her first pink slip.

KQµårk 死神 : Yes and that’s the problem AdLib is that Obama now has a better record of keeping Americans safe than the past few presidents and that includes healthcare now.

AlphaBitch : AL: A very smart man (from Microsoft) once told me that there are only two real emotions in humans: greed and fear. I’ve never forgotten that. I’m afraid he is right – see? There’s fear!

AdLib : Murph – Clear your cache then reload this page and it should solve it.

MurphTheSurf3 : All- I am still experiencing problems with the site. I have had to refresh the page several times because the auto update IM system keeps freezing. So if I miss comments, sorry, doing my best.

AdLib : AB – It’s an innate part of the human brain, fear. And the fear of the unknown is a big one. People who are different trigger that part of the fear response in insecure people.

choicelady : AdLib – well, of course we’d win, but would you REALLY want to own HP? I think it’s loaded with debt thanks to Ms. H’s “fabulous, dahling” business non-acumen.

AlphaBitch : but WHY are people so scared of “different”? Seriously.

AlphaBitch : AL: Great idea!

KQµårk 死神 : tuned=turned

choicelady : KQ – xenophobia plays in Peoria.

AdLib : KQ – Do yuo think I could challenge HP to a Parody-Off and winner takes over the other’s blog?

KQµårk 死神 : Yeah and they don’t even make sense. They say Obama has tuned our allies against us (most of our allies are in Europe) and he wants to be like Europe. It does not pass the sniff test at all.

choicelady : Oh Sabreen – having had something similar I say YES – take care of yourself. Get all of you to equal the little finger. We are sorry you’re hurt – heal fast!

AdLib : Oh Sabreen, so sorry to hear that. Please get some rest and heal up!

KQµårk 死神 : I mean I can usual watch any parody but this was sooooo bad I could not even watch a minute of it.

AdLib : KQ – They’re dragging up insults such as “communist” against people in 2012? Really? And “European” is a bad thing? What year do they think it is?

choicelady : AdLib – when so many people continue to vote for those who have done them harm, to follow a party that caters to everyone BUT them, then I have no choice but to think it goes back to 1964 and the Civil Rights Act and the white refusal to BE equal. Nostalgia for the 50s is partly legit (high unionization, good wages, etc.) and largely because it was the heyday of white privilege and affluence. I can come up with NO other explanation.

KQµårk 死神 : Ouch, take care Sabreen and watch your step, seriously.

AlphaBitch : Sabreen – take care. I’m so sorry, and I’m a queen klutz! I have two bad ankles to prove it.

MurphTheSurf3 : KQ…AOLHP absolutely sucks in the humor department….la me, lamer, lamest

Sabreen60 : Good folks, I can’t hang. Truth be told, I’m a klutz – have been most of my life. Day before yesterday, I missed a step and hit the ground. I don’t think I further damaged my back, but my little finger is the only part of my body that doesn’t hurt. I’m going to lay down. Have a great week.

KQµårk 死神 : I say let them be the incompetents they are AdLib. Every attack that is not related to the job picture is a waste of time.

KQµårk 死神 : Exactly Murph they could nominate Chavez and still turn out 45% using rationalizing.

choicelady : Murph – I know, I know – but it’s so hard to wrap my mind around the horrifying notion that nearly HALF this country would buy that crap.

AlphaBitch : CL: You’re welcome. America was safe again, for a time. Now it’s Newts and Santorums and Romneys and Pauls, oh my!

AdLib : KQ – I think that’s so true. Seriously, in 2012, in the midst of a recession, who out of the 99% are going to cry for the wealthy and corporations who destroyed the economy, took their homes, jobs and retirement savings away? But that’s the only tune they know.

choicelady : AB – that may be more than I wanted to know about The Blov…thank you for retiring them!

KQµårk 死神 : I know what I said AdLib. AOLHP had a horrible attempt at political humor tying together a song from the sound of music and Romney quotes in a video. The only reason I noted it at all was because it was so inferior to your parodies AdLib.

MurphTheSurf3 : Choice….there is a narrative at work in the minds of the 45 percent who will vote against obama no matter what. The GOP Story fits into that narrative. They add to the story providing faux facts, delusional details, and inane info to give the faithful a comfortable base upon which to stand.

choicelady : AB – I know. But honestly – what is the MATTER with these people? It’s right up there with Santorum saying McCain knew nothing about torture. They can’t even deal with their OWN side. I mean it’s good overall for us, but Americans buy that crap. Like Reagan said trees cause pollution – and there are people who STILL believe it!

AlphaBitch : The Blov owned some Angel Flight disco pants once upon a time, too. We had to “retire” them in the early 80s. Not a moment too soon…

KQµårk 死神 : CL that’s what I mean when I say the GOP is stuck in 2004. People don’t buy that Dems are crap stuff anymore with Obama in office.

choicelady : AB – rats. I was gonna say that!

AdLib : CL – It almost seems like a self-conscious BSing, like even they don’t believe it but they know they have to demonize him. Romney says any of this crap in a debate and Obama will crush him.

AlphaBitch : CL: And they had no minds to lose…..

AlphaBitch : CL; Yes.

AlphaBitch : I dibs “free enterprise” as the most used words after the SC election, to be uttered by the “winner”.

choicelady : AB and everyone – all this about Obama freeing us from pirates coupled with EVERYTHING he has accomplished around ending the wars to taking out OBL – and yet the goons in the GOP keep talking about how he has ‘weakened’ the US in the world. HAVE THEY COMPLETELY LOST THEIR MINDS????

AlphaBitch : *Drink*!

AdLib : “Romneyjuice! Romneyjuice! Romneyjuice!” Anything happen?

AlphaBitch : And I said “pee”

AdLib : I did say “Romney” three times…

AlphaBitch : S-A-B-R-E-E-N! (worked for Murph) F-O-O-D!!

choicelady : AB – LOL!!!!

AlphaBitch : Murph: It did. But Obama got the captain and we were freed.

choicelady : Murph – nope. We’re faster.

MurphTheSurf3 : I thought an Iranian fast boat had gotten you all.

choicelady : AB – I will check it out, thanks!

AlphaBitch : M-U-R-P-H!

choicelady : Gosh – I hope Murph comes back. Don’t want him to think we don’t love him!

AlphaBitch : He wrote an incredible book called “The Irresistable Revolution”.

AdLib : Well, thanks all for hanging in there. So, what do we think about SC, might Newt pull out a win and turn the race upside down?

choicelady : AB – no, never heard of him. What has he done?

AlphaBitch : It’s right up my alley, CL. Do you know Shane Claiborne?

choicelady : AB – I think you will like the book. It’s just wonderful! Moore told me that a couple of seminaries are using it, as utterly irreverent as it is. It’s also amazingly insightful!

KQµårk 死神 : Yes CL not much to say about it but that.

AlphaBitch : CL: I hope so! I had no idea a donut could be quite so offensive.

KQµårk 死神 : Me too and I forgot what is was about AdLib.

AlphaBitch : Oh just make sumpin up, AL.

choicelady : AB – KQ means the peeing incident. I feel sure he’s OK with donuts.

AdLib : And I had just written a long comment. Dont ya hate that?

AlphaBitch : I went and ordered Lamb, CL. And Chris Isaaks new CD.

KQµårk 死神 : I blame the Google crawler.

Sabreen60 : I thought everyone went into the “quiet room”.

AdLib : I’m cursing on the inside.

choicelady : AdLib – that’s a polite way to put it.

AdLib : A server burp!

choicelady : What happened? All my friends were rendered immobile!

AlphaBitch : Mea culpa??

AdLib : WHoops!

Sabreen60 : Take care Cher

AlphaBitch : The donut? Or the pee?

KQµårk 死神 : I thought that was despicable AB.

AlphaBitch : She’s sneaking off for a donut after that cleanse….(JK). Bye Cher!

choicelady : KQ – thank you!

AdLib : Seeya Cher!!!

choicelady : Cher – you coming back? Household chores aren’t nearly as much fun as we are!

AdLib : Cher – I agree, Romney would follow the lead of the GOP Elite and though they threaten to bomb Iran for votes, I don’t think the Kochs want a war that could destroy the global economy just when they’re making record profits.

KQµårk 死神 : Boo Hiss Cher, jk jk have fun.

choicelady : My fave book about Jesus is the novel, “Lamb” which is just a howl. Supposedly his boyhood friend, Biff, counseled Jesus to leave OUT “Blessed are the dumbfucks” from his Sermon on the Mount. But lordy – that’s Perry! He coulda used that blessing!

AlphaBitch : Peeing on the Taliban, anyone?

Chernynkaya : Well, dear folks, I have to do some chores. Don’t throw any food, OK?

KQµårk 死神 : Cher you are completely right. He would be a tool. He proved that as Gov of MA the opposite way.

AlphaBitch : Perry would do it because he’s just a dick. Rapture smapture to that ass.

KQµårk 死神 : Here is the article CL «link»

choicelady : KQ – I will go look, thanks.

AdLib : Newt, Santorum or Perry would be willing to go to war with Iran and cause global destruction. Newt would do it because he’s an ass and Santorum and Perry would see it as bringing The Rapture sooner.

AlphaBitch : CL: That’s because you know to pity the poor. Bless his heart.

Sabreen60 : Cher, I heard that. Perry named the Interior Dept as one of the three.

choicelady : Cher – Yes – Perry strikes out again. I’d like to suggest he use a “palm pilot” just like Sarah’s. Even I am embarrassed for him, and I hate him!

Chernynkaya : AL, I think if elected, Ronmey would do whatever Congressional Repubs wanted. And the Kochs.

KQµårk 死神 : Oh CL I posted that on Cher’s post or TO/OT.

AlphaBitch : I hear something stupid from Perry every day. I live in TX

Chernynkaya : Did you hear that Perry forgot again today which Cabinet level agencies he’d cut?

KQµårk 死神 : I think Perry is dumb enough to embrace Bush III

AlphaBitch : Or worse: Santorum?

AlphaBitch : How about Newt, AL?

AdLib : Cher – I know Romney threatens war with Iran but he just seems to be mouthing the words for votes. If he did become President, I don’t think he’d do it because he’s a coward anyway and would be afraid of becoming Bush II.

AlphaBitch : He confuses it with OK, Cher

KQµårk 死神 :

choicelady : KQ – WHAT???? Israelis said they were CIA???? WTF???

Chernynkaya : If he could find it, KQ.

AlphaBitch : CL: But if this were handled differently – that’s what’s so scary.

KQµårk 死神 : Shite Perry would start another war with Iraq.

AlphaBitch : AL: they have Lebanon too – and perhaps Turkey. The Shia Sunni thing fades when it becomes attacks from the outside.

choicelady : Cher – yes, Perry would not declare war on Canada unless it’s a war of secession – Texas vs. the whole of what he thinks is the US. LOL!!!

AlphaBitch : CL: I declared war on Canada already once this decade. Not again!!

KQµårk 死神 : I think the latest thing were Israel operatives said they were CIA made Obama’s cooperation with an operation on Iran almost nil.

Chernynkaya : KQ–Israel is definitely on that course. They just need to figure out where the bombs are.

AdLib : AB – The support for Iran is weakening as the world all moves to the opposite side of the fence. They have CHina and Russia with them but if they threaten China’s oil supplies…

choicelady : AB – that may be true (you have real insight) BUT it so depends on how this is all handled. If Israel makes no sudden moves, Iran closes the Straits, the people CAN see that it was pointless and that the fallout is on the people of Iran.

AlphaBitch : KQ: i agree. I once did a whole research paper on the bombing in 1981 of the Osirak reactor in Iraq.

Chernynkaya : well, CL, Perry wouldn’t consider that a war. he thinks Canada IS the US.

KQµårk 死神 : Though I think the odds of Israel bombing Iran at least in a special ops mission is over 50% too. No matter who wins.

Chernynkaya : Seriously, who ARE these evil morons that got into government? Is America really that disgusting?

choicelady : Cher – if either of them wins, I am thinking war with Canada over tar sands is not beyond the pale…

AlphaBitch : Iran is NOT NK. There is no support from other countries. There is tons of support for Iran. And the Green Revolution kids are turning TOWARDS the mullahs, because of perceived attacks from Israel and outsiders. At least that was the perception of some of the chirrens.

AdLib : AB – I don’t mean to minimize it but there is no gain for Iran in blocking the strait. They’ve got the world moving against them now, they want to stop sanctions and convincing the world that they deserve MORE sanctions makes no sense to me. This threat is like a 5 year old throwing a tantrum and threatening to hold their breath till they die. It doesn’t pass my smell test for being legit.

choicelady : Cher – Oh yes – if Romney wins, or God forbid, Newt, it definitely will go to war. It’s the only foreign policy the GOP has.

KQµårk 死神 : Cher absolutely at least that.

choicelady : AB – I agree with AdLib that anything they do is suicidal for them, and they KNOW it. Posturing, banging the podium, fine. Actually doing something stupid? Not so much. The uprising IN Iran is never far from their minds. Add the general upheavals from before to a population that is hungry and without basics, and it’s recipe for an internal democratic revolution that would probably NOT be thwarted by the military that is as hungry as the populace. Iran needs to be careful, and they know that, too.

Chernynkaya : If Romney wins, I’d say a war with Iran goes to 70%.

AlphaBitch : And watching the Repubs debate, I can’t help but worry myself.

AlphaBitch : All I know is my kids are on alert, and hoping the US isn’t “Stupid enough to try something THAT dumb” in the words of my hard-headed Pashtun boy.

AdLib : Cher – Yep, I’m talking about Iran. I think they are obviously saber-rattling.

Chernynkaya : It’s come to this: we can’t ell the Repubs from the Ayatollahs.

choicelady : AdLib – I agree. I am not terribly worried about Iran as a global threat.

AlphaBitch : I disagree, AL. I think it’s to lure the US into another stupid “war against Islam” maneuver. Hey wait: aren’t you talking about Iran?

Chernynkaya : Oh, wait, no. You are talking about Iran, nit the Repubs.

Chernynkaya : AL HAd to read your comment twice. I thought you were talking about the Iranians.

KQµårk 死神 : Exactly CL but think about the whole party being like that. Well until the recent cracks in the GOP are showing now.

AlphaBitch : Sabreen! Welcome!

Chernynkaya : Hi Sabreen!

AdLib : AB – When negotiating a situation, you need to put yourself in the adversary’s shoes. The whole motivation for the ridiculous threat is to end the sanctions that are crippling their economy. Would such a party then intentionally cripple themselves, possibly to the point of igniting a public uprising? I don’t see it happening. Add to that they don’t want to give the US and Israel justification to bomb their nuclear facilities. I think this is an obvious NK style scare tactic that makes no sense.

choicelady : Hey – SAbreen just checked in – HI!

Sabreen60 : Hello Everyone!

AlphaBitch : Unless they are the bottle blondes.

Chernynkaya : AB–that doesn’t help–they ALL have squinty eyes.

KQµårk 死神 : sorry big head Billo.

KQµårk 死神 : While on the other hand Obama is brave enough to go on with O

choicelady : KQ – well, I deal with Lefties that orthodox, too, and I give thanks every day that none of them is running for public office!

Chernynkaya : The Goopers are still thinking the Tea Baggers are all the rage. They flamed out.

AlphaBitch : I would have said “he’s ugly”, but that would have been mean AND confusing to boot.

KQµårk 死神 : Yup dark hair, kind of hunched over.

AlphaBitch : Cher: He’s got squinty eyes.

KQµårk 死神 : Absolutely CL the GOP just cannot adapt because of their rigid orthodoxy.

Chernynkaya : Id he the one with hardly any forehead, KQ?

choicelady : AB – LOL!!

Chernynkaya : He’s a guy on Fox. A “journalist.”

KQµårk 死神 : A Faux News host that dared ask Romney to explain his flip flops.

AlphaBitch : CL: KUDOS to you! I unfortunately know the answer to that one.

choicelady : KQ – who is Bret Baier?

KQµårk 死神 : Totally agree on the coward thing AdLib. He’s a coward to do a real interview and always wants to please.

Chernynkaya : Even when his says the things the base wants to hear, he says it wrong.

choicelady : KQ – the belief that what flew in 2004 flies now is one of the mystifying weaknesses of the GOP. They just don’t seem to learn from their OWN mistakes!

AlphaBitch : Is there such a thing as Bain envy?

KQµårk 死神 : Did you see the Brett Baier interview AdLib? He was like a petulant child.

choicelady : AdLib – Romney SHOULD be afraid of saying the wrong thing because he always does! At least he sees the pattern.

KQµårk 死神 : And his all his campaign can come up with to defend Bain is to call voters envious. Yes his handlers and speech writers are campaigning like it’s 2008 or even 2004

Chernynkaya : Thanks AB! We gotta keep these fast typists in line.

AdLib : KQ – I don’t know that Romney thinks it’s beneath him to answer questions, he’s just one of The Entitled who thinks that just because he’s Mitt Romney, he should be given the nom. And also, he’s a coward, he’s afraid of saying the wrong thing and he is definitely afraid of how his tax returns would destroy him.

choicelady : AB – Why am I not surprised your alter ego is the Red Queen?

AlphaBitch : Cher: Off with his fingers! (sayeth the Red Queen)

AlphaBitch : AL: thanks for the talk down. I’m not all that confident about it though.

choicelady : AdLib – that’s what the analyst said. Closing the Strait would be suicide for Iran, and Obama is being very judicious in letting them know that we can deal with them. To their detriment.

KQµårk 死神 : Cher I say yes. They are first tried the same inevitability strategy that killed Hillary and now are trying the McCain/Palin anti-American strategy with even more lies to attack Obama. They think the whole electorate is Faux News viewers. And believe it or not allot of conservatives don’t like Faux News.

Chernynkaya : Dammit KQ-stop typing what I’m typing, and stop doing it faster!

Chernynkaya : Murph– $250 mill ONshore and we don’t know how much offshore. I’m pretty sure of that.

AdLib : As for Iran, I am actually not as concerned and agree with the meme that Iran is pulling a North Korea, threatening the absurdly self-destructive as a negotiating chip. I like Obama’s approach to this, just telling them we”re not threatened and will use force if they block it. The whole reason they’re threatening the world is because their economy is crashing under sanctions. If they blocked their ability to make money off of oil, the country would collapse. BTW, I understand that they even have to import gasoline!

KQµårk 死神 : The problem with Romney’s superiority complex is he really thinks it’s beneath him to answer questions.

Chernynkaya : KQ–OK not just him. He can hire the best advisors/strateg ists money can buy. Are they all stupid? No, I think he thinks he’s above the rules.

MurphTheSurf3 : AdLib….Romney tax forms….worth more than 250 million….a lot of it offshoe….effec tive tax ate at 15% o less.

KQµårk 死神 : Cher that’s why Romney is a bad politician you would have thought he would have better answers for allot of things.

Chernynkaya : I know, AB. But seriously–doesn ‘t that show a lack of foresight? He know where his offshore money is–did he honestly think no one would ask? Or is that just his rich guy hubris?

AlphaBitch : Or have a bet as to his effective rate of return??

KQµårk 死神 : Yes taxreturngate continues. Maybe we should start a counter on the number of days Romney has not released his tax returns on the planet.

AlphaBitch : Cher: There you go again, assuming a Repub pol can think!

Chernynkaya : But, he’s running for office, for Pete’s sake! You’d think he’d have thought of that a year ago.

AlphaBitch : I have been too busy to catch up on ANY news – here, there or anywhere – and what little I see frightens or depresses me. Peeing on Taliban corpses? PLEASE. After what they did to my kids, I could poop down their necks. BUT – I would never ever do that. Not only because it is disgusting, but it puts so very many others at risk.

TheBlovicator : you mean “vulture capital”

KQµårk 死神 : CL I agree the fact is Ahmadinejad is a cowboy like Bush without the biggest army on earth

choicelady : ADLib – I think a clear discussion/debat e on predatory venture capital would be excellent. People need to know this stuff!

AdLib : Murph – That’s why I think forcing him to release his tax returns are so important. He makes most of his money as Capital Gains and pays 15%…only on what he has in the US. I bet we’d find him paying an effective tax of less than 15% and with money sheltered in offshore accounts. His tax returns could destroy him and he knows that.

choicelady : AB – I’m hoping one analyst of Iran is correct: shutting the straits of Hormuz means cutting off their income. And given the past unrest,they cannot afford to do that. On the other hand, you do have a crazy person in charge…

Chernynkaya : They’re not going to close down the Straight.

AlphaBitch : Cher: Oh, I hope!

Chernynkaya : Iran is pretty scary right now. But I think it’s a bluff.