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Nirek On June - 17 - 2014

MIC Eisenhower

Our military is the strongest and largest in the world. We have enough weapons to destroy the entire world as we know it.

With wars ending the military will have to downsize. People who have an interest in the military industry (that is corporations that make the tools of war) are going to want to get the US involved in some other war somewhere else, or back in Iraq. These people profit from the wars. They don’t care about the people in the military. The soldiers are pawns, expendable just like in a chess game. Lets call them the profiteers. They make money by investing in the business that make guns ammo ,bombs, armor, helmets, aircraft, ships, missiles, drones, even uniforms. 

During war time soldiers can advance in rank faster than they can during peace time. So many soldiers want us to be engaged in some war or conflict for their personal gain. We don’t use the Draft like when I was in the army. So our soldiers are professional and want to advance their careers. Especially those in the officer ranks. Those who join to defend their country may not think about their own advancement.

When an officer is in a war he is more likely to advance in rank faster due to attrition (his predecessor got wounded or killed so he moves up the ranks). The same is true with enlisted men/women.  Without a draft we have people who want to be soldiers and fight. They will follow orders whether they are righteous or not.

In war there are going to be atrocities , in Vietnam there was My Lai   http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/My_Lai_Massacre. In Iraq we has the friendly fire, and Abu Ghriab prisoners mistreated. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abu_Ghraib_torture_and_prisoner_abuse        War is a dirty business.

Next we have politicians who are  lobbied  beyond belief by the military industrial complex. When they are with a lobbyist from a big corporation wanting to get a piece of legislation passed that will benefit them and their corporation, I feel it is bribery. They receive gifts and other valuable considerations (like money) for the promise of their vote on said  Bill.

When you put it all together it makes the strongest military in all of history. This should make us feel safe and secure, right? Then why are we so paranoid ? Why are we afraid of men with beards? Full disclosure here, I wear a beard, have ever since I got out of the army. Why do we fear men who wear robes and turbans?

Why do those bearded men with turbans hate us? Could it be that we invaded their homeland?  Could it be because we were lied to by the worst possible person who was VP and had ties to Halliburton.

President Eisenhower (Ike) warned us about the military industrial complex. To me Ike was the last good Republican President.

So it all comes down to profits for those who have more to gain from war than peace. We have McCain in the Senate who never met a war he didn’t like. Why, because he can line his pockets with considerations.

It is all about PROFITS. 

Lets talk about this in a civil way. You may disagree or maybe you agree with me. Either way lets have a discussion.

Dwight D. Eisenhower photo portrait.

Written by Nirek

Proud progressive Vietnam Vet against WAR! Can't stomach chickenhawks.

229 Responses so far.

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  1. Murph, our conversation is lost in the back pages. Please respond to me anew, if you choose, at the top of this page.

  2. SearingTruth says:

    “Humanity always eventually works together, whether we want it to or not. The only difference is whether we work together before, or after, massive death and destruction.”
    SearingTruth

    A Future of the Brave

  3. SearingTruth says:

    “My saunter began in the garden, just a few misplaced parts there. I couldn’t really tell what they were, so I just walked through the broken door to the front room.

    And there it was. That head. As a misplaced ornament upon the armchair. And then looking down I saw the infants body and my knees slightly buckled. I had seen much horror, the body parts of children were a daily chore, but these bodies were just a little too intact. I could tell where the neck used to attach both.

    And since then I cannot be human.

    For I had fired the rocket that destroyed them.

    For the good of all humankind.”
    SearingTruth

    A Future of the Brave

    • EXFANOFARIANA says:

      Admirable but unfortunately not applicable to this stained mankind.

      In a good way, I envy your heart so filled with promises and hope. But as I’ve said before, we STINK. Mankind should disappear for good and let animals live their perfect nature.
      And I really love you as a brother or sister would love his/hers.PEACE.

      • SearingTruth says:

        Gentle friend EXFANOFARIANA, I wish I could alleviate your anger and pain. I can almost feel it, and it genuinely hurts.

        But it seems you are slowly being consumed by it, and despite the many observations you’ve read I’ve been unable to sway your beliefs.

        I can only once again ask you to reconsider, and hope that your pain subsides.

        I am sorry gentle friend.
        ST

        “If evil were the seed of our society then we would have extinguished ourselves long ago.

        But despite all probability and expectation it indeed appears that nothing is certain, except that humanity is good.”
        SearingTruth

        A Future of the Brave

        • EXFANOFARIANA says:

          I thank you with all my heart.Perhaps I should take yoga…….Peace always.BEAUTIFUL !

          • SearingTruth says:

            Gentle friend, you are a treasure of humanity.

            You need only release your soul.

            It has suffered enough.

            And it needs you, to be saved by compassion, instead of drowned in the dark.

            Gentle friend EXFANOFARIANA, I have great faith in you.
            ST

            “Compassion engenders loyalty, and trust, and thanks.”
            SearingTruth

            A Future of the Brave

    • Nirek says:

      ST, when you are in a war and you kill, you can’t forget it. I still think about the guy and wonder who is taking care of his family? Or did he have a family?
      I wish I had not been drafted.
      Peace

      • SearingTruth says:

        I am so sorry gentle friend Nirek.

        But it is not your conscience that should be plagued, it is those who placed you at that spot, at that moment, with that mission.

        Few want to kill, and almost all are haunted by it. But that, painful as it is, is the spark of your humanity that will not die.
        ST

        “The rich send the poor to war for profit, instead of defense.”
        SearingTruth

        A Future of the Brave

  4. Kalima says:

    JumpingJackFlash says:
    06/17/2014 at 8:54 PM (Edit)
    @Kalima, are you looking for a place to post where there’s no dissention or different views? I used to be a liberal, even voted for Clinton twice, but I saw the light! Liberalism is a false promise and Conservatism (not the Republican party) is the real deal.

    —-
    I’ve answered your first question at least three times when you asked it before.

    The word “liberal” is a state of mind and your conscience, and not just a political party that you can accuse of being false. A mind can be changed but a social conscience cannot. Therefore I’m sorry to say that I very much doubt that you ever were one.

    My sincere apologies to Nirek for turning his fine article into a totally unnecessary “learning?” forum. It’s just a simple matter of reading our Terms of Use found under FAQ at the top of the page under the PlanetPOV logo. Which is the advice both AdLib and I gave this member at least six times. Hopefully, it won’t happen again.

  5. SearingTruth says:

    “We were outnumbered.

    A billion dollars to none.”
    SearingTruth

    A Future of the Brave

  6. Hey Cl, I ran out of boxes below, but just wanted to say, at least the mob let’s you have some fun. They always strike a Faustian bargain with their customers.

  7. SearingTruth says:

    “Our masters profit, whether we laugh or cry.”
    SearingTruth

    A Future of the Brave

    • Nirek says:

      ST,I take issue with the word “masters”, They are simply rich. Not my master at all. Greedy, spoiled, and sometimes foolish, yes but NOT masters.

      • SearingTruth says:

        I understand gentle friend Nirek.

        But while they no longer stand over us with whip in hand, unbalanced distribution of wealth always produces masters and slaves.

        The masters are indeed the rich, and the working and poor their slaves.
        ST

        “Nothing for the poor, because they have been negligent and irresponsible.

        Everything for the rich, because they have been negligent and irresponsible.”
        SearingTruth

        A Future of the Brave

  8. Beatlex says:

    The predictions in the early 90s about how the world would fall apart without the cold war keeping the world at relative peace are coming true.Man is not proving to be to good at this “civilization” thing.Endless wars

    • MurphTheSurf3 says:

      The Cold War provided two major poles by which the allegiances of nations one pole or the other kept things in some order…add in a UN that both of those poles made regular use of….and an international economic order that managed to orchestrate a dance between capitalism and communism (both only near approximations of their actual definitions).

      So…all in all…your comment is well placed.

      • RSGmusic says:

        Agreed MurphThesurf3

        working on that thing we discussed by e mail. close now!!

        In all life there comes a time or urge to return to the place of birth to face yourself in a different form.

        Sayings from the child of nature!

    • Nirek says:

      Beatlex, there have been wars going on in other parts of the world even though US and USSR were in cold war mode.

    • SearingTruth says:

      Do not surrender yet gentle friend Beatlex.

      Good has a long history of defeating evil, or we could not even debate it.
      ST

      “If evil were the seed of our society then we would have extinguished ourselves long ago.

      But despite all probability and expectation it indeed appears that nothing is certain, except that humanity is good.”
      SearingTruth

      A Future of the Brave

      • EXFANOFARIANA says:

        Dear St, evil has conquered this planet since it’s foundation. Look at us Romans and the Greeks. All evil on earth were brought by religion bull……You study Greek philosophers and they, some, were also maniac about myths….Shall we bring in the Viking gods?Or the Zoroastrians?Peace.Or the pagans?

      • Beatlex says:

        Of course my friend the majority of the world are good people trying to lead good and productive lives.It is the Governments that are the cause of the inequality around the world.Just look at climate change to name one,but important example.

  9. SearingTruth says:

    “History records that the rich and powerful, when allowed, make lampshades of the working and poor’s skin.”
    SearingTruth

    A Future of the Brave

    • Nirek says:

      Truth becomes you.

      • SearingTruth says:

        Thank you gentle friend Nirek.
        ST

        “It’s odd the people we choose to suffer.

        For they are the gentlest, most compassionate, and most powerless among us.

        The greatest contributors to humanity, in place of the greatest contributors to greed.”
        SearingTruth

        A Future of the Brave

    • Here’s one I think you may really appreciate ST:

      “I sit on a man’s back, choking him and making him carry me, and yet assure myself and others that I am very sorry for him and wish to lighten his load by all possible means-except by getting off his back.” Leo Tolstoi

      Or maybe it was Romney! 😉

  10. While this is very smart parody, it’s not all that far from the truth:


  11. SearingTruth says:

    “An ocean of bullets.

    They had to wash up somewhere.”
    SearingTruth

    A Future of the Brave

    • Beatlex says:

      Hi Searing Truth! Finally give up on HP? I was x27 there.I left in December

      • SearingTruth says:

        Gentle friend Beatlex,

        I indeed gave up on HP, deleted my account, and only post on PlanetPOV now.

        I’m very glad you found your way here. It is a unique community driven site, with a lot of differing voices and opinions. As well as many tools, such as posting your own articles, that make it function like a good old fashioned 18th century soapbox.

        But be prepared to be surprised, no matter your political/humanitarian position.

        Citizens are fairly civil here, but some are very aggressive in disagreement, and do not back from an argument easily.

        But that is a good sign. It shows they are intelligent, have well informed opinions, and are passionate about them.

        For example, I’m a liberal and have mostly been pummeled by liberals since joining PlanetPOV.

        But it has been engaging and educational for all of us.

        And that is goal of free debate.

        Welcome again gentle friend.
        ST

        “We have much less to fear from each other than those who would make us afraid.”
        SearingTruth

        A Future of the Brave

        • Nirek says:

          ST, I too gave up on HP. I only post here it is my home. I truly love it here at the Planet and the people here are wonderful. I even like to trade barbs with JJF. He doesn’t seem to understand that he has bought into the lies.

          • NoManIsAnIsland says:

            I couldn’t agree with you more,
            Nirek.

            And, not to mention any names or
            even initials, those who delude
            themselves never seem to
            understand they’ve bought into
            lies.

          • SearingTruth says:

            Gentle friend Nirek, civil debate, even when passionate, is what will save us.

            Arguing will get us nowhere.

            I am glad we have both found the same home.
            ST

            “We can take life.

            But we cannot bring it back.”
            SearingTruth

            A Future of the Brave

        • MurphTheSurf3 says:

          Oh,ST we do not pummel….

          pound
          pummel
          pinch
          pierce

          but never pummel….

          Just kidding.

          This is a place of honest discussion and truth and that is the gift we give each other.

          Civil discourse means that we can disagree without being disagreeable.

          So, soldier on friend ST….a future for the brave indeed.

          BTW- your writing in this post was CRYSTAL CLEAR. more of the same, please. I really heard you here.

          • SearingTruth says:

            Ha!, that’s what they all say gentle friend MurphTheSurf3 … :)

            But I understand my friend, and I am trying to engage my friends and fellow citizens more here on PlanetPOV.

            On other websites there was rarely enough time to look through “Wisdom, Warning, and Tyranny” (232 pages now) for an appropriate observation, and post a personal message.

            And I thought history was more important.

            But I’m trying, I wish we could all meet for at last one grog of really good ale.
            ST

            “Until the last voice of freedom was silenced.

            That’s how long they had to wait.”
            SearingTruth

            A Future of the Brave

            • SearingTruth says:

              That was very sweet gentle friend MurphTheSurf3. Thank you.
              ST

              “Together. That’s how humanity will win.”
              SearingTruth

              A Future of the Brave

            • MurphTheSurf3 says:

              Life at the Planet is one of process and people here tend to walk with each other. It is different and you seem to be adapting. You have a truth to share and I think you are finding ways to do it in this oh so practical place.

          • SearingTruth says:

            Gentle friend KillgoreTrout, I meant it in an intellectual/ideological context, and positive way.

            The community here doesn’t just listen and agree, even if they are your friend. They listen and let you know exactly what they think, and challenge you, often many times, to defend your position.

            Like you’re doing now … :)
            ST

            “Humanity was not on sale.”
            SearingTruth

            A Future of the Brave

            • SearingTruth says:

              I understand gentle friend KillgoreTrout, I tend to speak and write in metaphors.

              And have often been misunderstood.
              ST

              “We are all, in fact, most like each other.”
              SearingTruth

              A Future of the Brave

            • ST, I thought that might be what you were saying, but I wasn’t quite sure.

              I like to think that as applied to members here, “pummeled,” may be too strong a word. No biggie, I just didn’t quite understand the use of the word at first.

              I like to think of the discourse here as being, urging, or compelling.

            • MurphTheSurf3 says:

              Write with this level of clarity and you will discover that your message will get clearer and clearer.

  12. Beatlex says:

    Chuck Todd interviewed Paul Wolfowitz to get his take on the goings on in Iraq and to ask what he would do…..WHY??? He even called him “sir” at the end of the interview.The man should be in a jail cell

    • MurphTheSurf3 says:

      Wolfowitz- warmongering lying piece of crap…and those are my kind words for him….and frankly I don’t think much of Todd or the pandering at MSNBC.

      • NoManIsAnIsland says:

        Well said, Murph. I can’t speak to the “pandering
        at MSNBC” as I’ve never watched the channel, but
        I don’t think much of Todd either, and don’t even
        get me started on war criminal Wolfowitz @#%!!!

        • MurphTheSurf3 says:

          I watched Joe Scarborough and Chuck Todd today focus like lasers on what the WSJ ABC Poll finding that the Pres. only had 41 percent support and that most did not think he could govern any longer.

          They acted as if those who responded to the poll actually, as a whole, understood what they were saying and had any claim to knowing of what they spoke.

          Our public is generally ignorant of of how the government works. MOST of what the poll cited as Obama failures are, in fact, Congressional (ie GOP) failures.

          Ignorance is not bliss. It is a blight.

          • NoManIsAnIsland says:

            …And a very dangerous blight, at
            that.

            Only a very malignant ignorance
            would lead one to believe Obama’s
            to blame for the GOP’s determined
            efforts to destroy his presidency
            and his struggle to rebuilt our society after 8 years of devastation wrought by “Tornado George” Bush and his gang!

  13. Beatlex says:

    Really good post Nirek.The “bearded men” of the middle east hate the west because we have been meddling in their affairs for a century,redrawing maps,taking their resources.How would we in the west feel if people from the other side of the world did the same to us?

    • Nirek says:

      Beatlex, thanks. I have always wondered what we Americans would do if another country invaded our country. I for one would not “give them my heart or mind”. I would resist and fight any way possible.

    • JumpingJackFlash says:

      What resources did we “take” from them? They sold us oil and they got rich in the process.

      • Nirek says:

        Jack, who got rich in the process? Certainly not the majority of the indigenous people. They are just pawns used by the ultra rich, kinda like our 1%ers want to make us. Pawns for their benefit.

      • MurphTheSurf3 says:

        This is a site for serious, substantive discussion. Yes, if you put forth a thesis as you have done you need to build an evidence based case in a narrative that others can examine and enter in to. We can disagree without being disagreeable but the essence of any real public discourse is data, the facts and the logic that interprets them.

        Take my post or Choice Lady’s and take apart our case, our narrative. Show how yours make more sense.

        If you do not, expect that folks here will dismiss simple declarations like the one you put forth here at the start of this comment thread.

      • choicelady says:

        When we see only what is close, we miss the long, long story. At the Alhambra in Granada, there is a room on the second level where Isabella and Ferdinand forced the Muslims -- the people in charge of southern Spain for centuries -- to hand over the entire nation to them. That was the same room where Columbus got his commission and the Inquisition -- aimed at Muslims and Jews -- got its start.

        From the Crusades to Bush’s desire to bring End Times via the ‘fall of Babylon’ (Iraq) the West has invaded, controlled, shaped the national lines, imposed its colonial rule, and basically reduced Arabic nations to mere fields to be plowed for western wealth.

        So a few sheiks got rich from oil. It never once offset the imperialism, the rape of nations, the attempt to obliterate cultures. See “Battle of Algiers” about the French torture and mandates that prohibited even Islamic MARRIAGE ceremonies to put France in control of Algeria by exterminating Algeria culture.

        The USA, Britain, France, Spain -- it is endless. We pillaged the mid East as if it were ours to strip of resources, and when we could, we replaced real leaders with those the CIA hand picked. Remember Iran and Jimmy Carter’s support for the Shah? He was a CIA plant, a massive tyrant, and while I detest religious autocracy, I perfectly well understand the 1979 coup as a reaction to the brutality the US supported and ignored.

        A handful of rich sheiks does not a fondness for the western imperialists obtain.

        • NoManIsAnIsland says:

          Choicelady, I commend you for your very telling exposition of the centuries-long depredations of the Western powers in the Mid-East. And as counterproductive as the 1979 overthrow of the Shah has proven to the inherent rights and freedom of the Iranian people and international relations, no objective observer can say it wasn’t a revolution just waiting to happen.

          Jimmy Carter’s support of the Shah and his admission, on “humanitarian grounds”, to the U.S. for medical treatment in his final illness were the last straws to the Iranians, but the fanatical crusaders, kings, queens, and popes had lit the first match to the impending conflagration hundreds of years before Carter’s tragic mistakes.

          And Carter was merely following in the footsteps of several of his predecessors. For anyone interested in a well-sourced account of the events — starting in then Persia in 1901 — Wikipedia is a good place to start.*

          I just want to say the die of the 1979 Iranian Revolution was cast in the 1953 Iranian coup d’état, which was planned and executed by the U.S. CIA and UK M16. The coup was pushed by then President Eisenhower’s Secretary of State,
          John Foster Dulles, and led by his brother, CIA Director Allen Dulles. The nefarious operation itself was devised by CIA agent Donald Wilber and carried out by former President Theodore Roosevelt’s grandson, Kermit Roosevelt, Jr.

          Years later when forced to respond to a Freedom of Information request, the CIA admitted that President Eisenhower himself had authorized the operation — although he was careful to keep his fingerprints off it to try to hide his complicity in it — and was secretly briefed on it by John Foster Dulles. Further, Eisenhower kept very tight control over the CIA’s actions. I’m sad to say, and speaking only for myself, Eisenhower’s decision to help overthrow the legal government of Iran did not add luster to his reputation.

          * Wikipedia:
          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1953_Iranian_coup_d%27%C3%A9tat

          • Nirek says:

            NoManIsAnIsland,
            You should write an article. You have a way with words. You also make sense. That is what is most important.

            • NoManIsAnIsland says:

              I have written articles for
              different print media, Nirek,
              and thank you for the great
              compliments!

              With your encouragement, if I
              can come up with something that I think may pass the scrutiny of discerning PlanetPOV readers, I’ll submit it.

          • MurphTheSurf3 says:

            Very well put together. I see your reference to MI16- I will note that for the future.

            What I like is how you manage to draw a line across several administrations showing how they all enter into a worldview that traps them and limits responses.

            One of the intriguing “what ifs” of the history of the mideast is the what if Prime Minister Mohammad Mosaddegh and his cabinet had not been overthrown on 19 August 1953. Many of the most destructive seeds of our current hot mess would likely have never found fertile ground.

            what Jim Carter never understood was that harboring the Shah was seen as the bookend with the removal of Mosaddegh on one end and the asylum of the Shah on the other with a long history of U.S. sponsored repression in between.

            • NoManIsAnIsland says:

              Thank you very much, Murph. One of the greatest disappointments in following my lifelong interest in American history and our actions on the world stage is how often we’ve done the wrong things for the wrong reasons.

              And an inescapable conclusion I reached long ago is the penchant for making mischief in other countries — without even considering possible negative consequences on all sides — is a trait which so far has afflicted Democratic presidents, administrations, and Congresses nearly as much as it has Republican ones.

              The propensity to trumpet the virtues and joys of small “d” democracy has been belied too often by a hypocritical embrace of foreign dictators and carrying out all sorts of illegal operations abroad. And I won’t waste time mentioning how often American politicians and so-called leaders, including
              presidents, “honor” democracy more in the breach than the observance.

              I’ve often thought and talked about how different our world might be today had not Iranian
              PM Mosaddegh and his cabinet not been overthrown on 19 August 1953. And I know someone, trapped in Iran that very day, whose life was changed forever — and not for the better — by the blowback, which hasn’t settled yet.

              ” Oh, what a tangled web we weave, When first we practise to deceive!”

              When Sir Walter Scott wrote this in 1808, he couldn’t have known but might well have imagined that 206 years later it would be as fresh — and ring just as true — as the day he wrote it.

        • MurphTheSurf3 says:

          Could not have said it better and I didn’t. My contribution to this was a bit more immediate but you, as always widen the conversation.

      • MurphTheSurf3 says:

        Prior to WWII virtually every drop of oil was taken at a bargain price by foreign companies with leases that were little more than payoffs to local potentates. It was a bit better after WWII with pricing adjusted to a broader market but it was still a top ten percenter game start to finish.

        In Iran, when the populace chose a socialist prime minister, our CIA along with the British MI5 engineered a coup because he was going to natonalize their own oil fields.

        I have dozens more examples.

        • NoManIsAnIsland says:

          You’re absolutely right, Murph.

          You may want to read my comment to CL,
          at this writing, about three posts above.

          And if I may say it, it was British M16 and
          not M15. As Wikipedia notes: “The Security Service, commonly known as MI5 (Military Intelligence, Section 5),[2] is the United Kingdom’s domestic counter-intelligence and security agency and is part of its intelligence machinery alongside the Secret Intelligence Service (SIS; also known as MI6) focused on foreign threats, Government Communications Headquarters (GCHQ) and Defence Intelligence (DI).”*

          * M15:
          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UK_Security_Service

        • Beatlex says:

          Thanks for the assist there Murph!

          • MurphTheSurf3 says:

            I wish that JumpingJackFlash would really engage us. These hit and run one or two liners are of little value. They will be substantively challenged here by folks like yourself and myself.

            • JJF, I think you are really denying yourself a unique opportunity here.

              Instead of approaching this site from a left/right, right/left perspective, maybe you would benefit more by opening your mind, paying attention to facts, supply some facts of your own and don’t let your ego get in the way.

              There is a great fallacy in the western character, especially in America, that one always has to “win,” to be “first,” and “ahead of the pack.” That instilled believe, and all Americans have had that years long indoctrination, but very often in life, it is the ones who choose to stay behind and thus move forward.
              Give yourself a little time to think, ponder and get to know some of the folks you are “debating,” with. It doesn’t hurt and can only enable you to learn and grow.

              Give what I’ve said some thought. No need to respond in hasty manner. This “unlearning,” if I may call it that applies to all areas of our lives, not just politics.

              It’s the trees that bend in a strong wind that survive and continue to grow. The older, stiffer ones snap like toothpicks and cease to grow.

            • Kalima says:

              You are mistaken, I’m not looking for a place to post, I already have one right here, and as a co-founder I can tell you that we welcome different opinions here but expect to be told why you hold that opinion which so far you have not done. You have just criticised others for having theirs.

            • Kalima says:

              How about admitting when you are wrong and replying to those who gave you the proof that you were wrong?

              Engaging in conversation to prove your point, has nothing in the least to do with writing an essay.

              You have been asked many questions here on this site, a chance to explain your point of view, yet you choose not to answer. For instance this one by AdLib yesterday.

              “JJF, is there anything negative that you attribute to the Bush Presidency due to any of the decisions Bush made?”

              Choicelady gave you a wonderful explanation in her reply to your one comment here, did you even read it?

              Or when I gave you the links that clearly stated that the release of what you claimed to be a dangerous terrorist five years ago by the President, was in fact at the time a man considered from his history so far, as minimum risk, and not the dangerous terrorist you continuously claimed him to be. Hardly a platform for engaging in a conversation.

            • JumpingJackFlash says:

              @Kalima, are you looking for a place to post where there’s no dissention or different views? I used to be a liberal, even voted for Clinton twice, but I saw the light! Liberalism is a false promise and Conservatism (not the Republican party) is the real deal.

            • JumpingJackFlash says:

              What have I not done to engage? I shouldn’t have to write an essay for every post.

            • Kalima says:

              Murph, you have to actually be engaged in a conversation to accept a challenge, so far I see no sign of that from said poster, but I do see disruptive behaviour, and yes, “hit and run one liners” is what I used in a conversation with a friend just now.

              If you don’t have a substantial argument, refuse to open offered Iinks from members, and are proven wrong every time, then why are you here if not to disrupt? I have a name for that behaviour.

              We are not amused, and our patience is wearing thin.

            • Beatlex says:

              He is pissing in the wind my friend

    • MurphTheSurf3 says:

      The map of “Iraq” that is likely to emerge from this (with a Shia region, a Sunni region, and Kurdistan) will likely look very much like the one that the British first intervened with in the 19th century.

  14. funksands says:

    It’ll be a good problem to have, but what do we do with all of the peacetime military folks? If we brought them all home, we’d need to find jobs for 250K or so ex-military. (These are just military stationed overseas, let alone at home)

    Right now, the military is at best an expensive public jobs program, at worst a slush fund rathole that we’re dropping undisclosed amounts of cash into, so what do we do with the people we “lay off”?

    Do we have the political will to have another real GI Bill?

    Like I said, a good problem to have.

    • Nirek says:

      Funk, the military is supposed to be a defense. Why not give them the chance to actually defend our border especially our leaky southern border. I’m not talking about immigrants as much as drugs. Have them defend this country from the cartels that are killing people and hurting our youth.

      Maybe we don’t have to lay them off. Just reassign them and their mission.

    • MurphTheSurf3 says:

      And with this comment you take us back into the land of MMT…do you not?


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