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AdLib On November - 1 - 2013

 

  • AdLib : As long as it’s not an Error 404 page! Night pal!

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Well good night….

  • MurphTheSurf3 : We are on the same page.

  • AdLib : Got it! I do think that by the end of this month, let alone by March, the site will be working fine and the only distraction and argument the Repubs have for their re-election will be gone.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Ad…the enrollers are using a direct access portal which has worked from the start. Once enrolled, folks are getting info packets via the USPS. Originally the idea was that the vast majority would use the on line system and only those without computer access (or fear of it) would use the phone banks. But the phone has proven the most reliable.

  • AdLib : The folks on the phone lines though still need to use the system that’s online to enter the info they gather. So folks should be getting some confirmation that they’re signed up once that’s done.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Ad- I am directing people to the phone lines. I do not trust the website yet.

  • AdLib : Good game plan to have a local hero on the team.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : I have teamed up with a local woman who is a nurse and a bit of a local hero. That plus the technology is the key.

  • AdLib : CL said she’s hearing more people are successfully signing up, are you hearing the same?

  • AdLib : Very cool, Murph! Thanks for doing all that you are! You’re making a big impact in people’s lives, even if they may give you a hard time about it along the way. Glad it’s getting smoother though.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Ad….the midnight hour approaches….I am doing a session with another ACA adviser at a local library tomorrow. There are 22 preregistered for it. 11 are under 35. The rest are scattered in age. I have a feeling that there will be some hostility. We did another program earlier in the week with an older crowd and it has a few bumps but it was fully interactive with everyone at a computer using our on line calculators. Same tomorrow. It works.

  • AdLib : Well Murph, looks like we’re closing the Vox bar again. You can take the peanuts, I’ll take pretzels. And don’t forget, one for the road!

  • AdLib : Heh, great theme indeed for the music thread, KT. I know how you feel, it does get a bit much but at times like that, don’t forget you’re not alone on this Planet.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Take Care KT

  • KillgoreTrout : I too will say goodnight. I just wanted to pop in and say hi. Thanks folks for your kind words. I’m fine, really. Just a bit of disgust with recent shootings and all. Will mankind ever learn? It’s a do it yourself music thread, so have fun and post your faves.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Good night CL…keep up the good fight.

  • AdLib : I do imagine what red states will be like in the near future as they become festering havens for poverty and illness and I don’t see it working out well for the Red state pols.

  • KillgoreTrout : Have a great weekend CL. Thank you for your kind words. The feelings are mutual.

  • AdLib : See you CL! Any news on HOPE???

  • AdLib : CL – I think there will be big blowback from the Red states cutting off the poor from Medicaid and health insurance. When all the states around them are prospering and have people moving out of poverty and up the economic scale while they ghettoize their states, it will come back to bite them. And cutting food stamps as well as forcing the poor to go without health care, that all seems to be pouring a lot of gasoline on a simmering fire.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Choice and KT- The power of the great poets to capture our experience is astounding. Glad my two choices touched you.

  • KillgoreTrout : Ad, I wish I could remember it verbatim. Emerson is one of my favorite writers. He had an excellent talent with language. Brilliant, actually.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Choice- here in Mo. I am speaking to many who are falling into the chasm you describe….and they are loyal GOP.

  • choicelady : Everyone – hubby just came home so I need to go. See you next week? Be well everyone. Murph – thank you so much for those two amazing poems. They are so important!

  • AdLib : Murph – That classic poem always puts me in awe.

  • KillgoreTrout : Murph, that is one of my favorite poems, of all time.

  • choicelady : KT – we care about you and your homie a whole lot!

  • choicelady : MURPH _ MY SECOND FAVE!!! The centre cannot hold. That scares the crap out of me, and I am determined NOT to let that come true!

  • AdLib : Murph, great quote. And KT, your reference below to Emerson was very appreciated too.

  • choicelady : Murph – it is the failure of Medicaid that has me so fearful. NYT did a feature on the rural south and all the Black and Latino people now dumped from ANY kind of health care! They are too poor for the Exchange, too “rich” for Medicaid. That is the Red Governors’ “gotcha” for POC.

  • KillgoreTrout : Thank you CL. I care about my fellow planeteers as well. My homie gave us all a scare not long ago.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Choice- How about….William Butler Yeats (1865-1939) THE SECOND COMING Turning and turning in the widening gyre The falcon cannot hear the falconer; Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold; Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world, The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere The ceremony of innocence is drowned; The best lack all conviction, while the worst Are full of passionate intensity. Surely some revelation is at hand; Surely the Second Coming is at hand. The Second Coming! Hardly are those words out When a vast image out of Spiritus Mundi Troubles my sight: a waste of desert sand; A shape with lion body and the head of a man, A gaze blank and pitiless as the sun, Is moving its slow thighs, while all about it Wind shadows of the indignant desert birds. The darkness drops again but now I know That twenty centuries of stony sleep Were vexed to nightmare by a rocking cradle, And what rough beast, its hour come round at last, Slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?

  • AdLib : KT – Sometimes it does all get to be a bit much. That’s when you turn the tv off for a week, spend time outdoors, with friends and other human beings you know and connect with the life that’s going on all around you, not infected by the constant nastiness and conflict on the tv.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Ad Lib…Mo. is in the federal exchange, and has no medicaid expansion.

  • KillgoreTrout : Pretty wise that Wordsworth. And such a wonderful name!

  • choicelady : AdLib – that and the fact that Red states have lower populations, less money per capita, tend to be more rural – all helps on costs a lot.

  • choicelady : Murph – that is my Number One favorite poem.

  • AdLib : CL – That was a theory I was pursuing, the Federal program has many more people in it and thus could negotiate lower rates. I’d assume that’s a big factor in the discrepancy.

  • choicelady : KT – I hope our constant love and care for you helps a little. It’s hard when you’ve never seen us and haven’t a clue what we look like (I of course DO resemble a chess pawn) but we do care about you so much!

  • KillgoreTrout : I wonder what my daughter in Oregon will have to pay. Her employer does not provide insurance. I told her she does need to be insured and she agreed.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : KT-+- from Wordsworth….TH E world is too much with us; late and soon, Getting and spending, we lay waste our powers:

  • choicelady : Everyone – I got about 15 Tweets tonight from people who are ENROLLING on the federal site! Apparently a lot of the problems are already fixed. Wheeee!

  • AdLib : Murph – Saw it, that makes sense indeed. Hmm…wonder if there will be a phenomena of people moving farther away from big cities to be able to afford healthcare?

  • KillgoreTrout : You already have CL! My dear friend.

  • choicelady : AdLib – actually MO is the federal system, and it IS cheaper than the STATE ones, website glitches and all!

  • choicelady : KT – I think we’ve all shared your experience and I wish there were something amazing we could offer to make you feel better!

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Ad Lib- Choice has a good answer to my question.

  • KillgoreTrout : Yeah CL, there is much to be mourned, but I know there is always light, as well. It’s just the roller coaster I ride from time to time.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Choice- excellent explanation.

  • choicelady : KT – there is much to be weary of, no doubt.

  • AdLib : Murph – That is an excellent question and I have no idea what the answer is. Why would MO’s exchange provide a far better premium than CA? Is MO’s state run?

  • choicelady : Murph – cost of service provisions. The more you have a large scale pricey university based system, the higher the costs are likely to be. Doctors want more to live in LA and SF. All costs are higher – so in MO where a CEO can earn $50K vs $150K in CA, it all just rolls into higher costs in coastal areas and major metropolitan ones, lower in rural, less populated places.

  • KillgoreTrout : Thank you CL. Just a little world weary. This too shall pass.

  • choicelady : AdLib – that IS a huge problem. We in the Outreach program have wrestled with that. The folks in the northern counties are doing MUCH better on costs than in LA and SF. Policies there are just cheaper. It’s very unfair.

  • AdLib : Murph – That’s what I said to my friend, we could have been working on making the ACA really smart for everyone, we had 2 years with this Repub Congress throwing bombs and nothing more.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Ad Lib and CL – how does your discussion re. “real income” tie into the question of medical costs? Why is my insurance quote so much better from Mo. than in Ca.?

  • KillgoreTrout : Ralph w. Emerson put that thought in a lovely way. Not verbatim, but we keep on trudging and as if all of a sudden, we find ourselves in a better place. I paraphrase, to say the least. Good things happen when we are unaware, at times.

  • choicelady : KT – I remember feeling horrified back in the 50s with McCarthy and 60s with the war and racial violence. I thought we were done for as a nation and a people. It got better. I see this as another period like that – but I also see HOPE I never saw in those earlier days. The work I’m doing on employee ownership (most of the impetus is there in Ohio out of Kent State and in Cleveland and Cincinnati) is SO WONDERFUL I think it is going to be world shaking in what it produces. But I can also see the ick of the court decisions today, the GOP’s amazing awfulness, the stupid of too much of the Left – and it is demoralizing indeed.

  • AdLib : CL – Exactly, I think there needs to be that very kind of regional economic scale that doesn’t lock in a set number as a ceiling for earnings when it comes to subsidies. A $100k income in LA for a family of 5 might be equivalent to a $60k income for a family of 5 in MO. Yet, the same scale for subsidies is applied.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : KT- glad to here there is nothing particular but a global malaise can be paralyzing as well.

  • KillgoreTrout : No Murph, just a little world weary. It happens from time to time.

  • KillgoreTrout : It certainly is CL. No doubt about it. I just get a little weary from all the bad news. I have seen much of the world’s lovelyness. And still do. I just despair of our species sometimes.

  • choicelady : Yeah KT – what’s going on with you? We’re here for you.

  • AdLib : KT – Sometimes, that’s the best philosophy to focus on, one foot in front of the other…and eventually, you’re somewhere that’s better.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : KT…what is going on? Is their trouble in KTland?

  • choicelady : Murph – if the GOP ever had this discussion it would reflect compassion. That is a word NOT in their lexicon!

  • choicelady : KT – but a LOT of the world is still lovely and beautiful!

  • AdLib : Murph – He is a Repub but as I say, a CA Repub so he would probably come off as liberal to them…though he is originally from the South.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Ad Lib and Choice- your discussion is the kind that Should and Needs To take place AND is not because of GOP unwillingness to really engage….

  • choicelady : AdLib – we knew it would be a problem for some families in the upper incomes. Don’t know what to do about it – we need a different standard, the Economic Self Sufficiency Index would help a LOT because it compares cost of living not the flat Federal Poverty Level. What is survivable and useable in Alabama is NOT the same in LA or SF. There are poverty programs that do not exist in SF because anyone poor enough to qualify cannot afford to LIVE in San Francisco! That would be a big help using the Self Sufficiency Calculator not FPL.

  • KillgoreTrout : Thanks Ad. I too keep on spinning. One foot in front of the other, always.

  • AdLib : KT – Hang in there, pal. The world does keep spinning and what was dark can become brighter with time.

  • KillgoreTrout : Pretty good Ad. A little blue. This wicked world keeps on spinning.

  • AdLib : CL – I’m not sure, I’ll double check with him on Kaiser.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Choice…BUT he is to live in Misery….er…I mean Missouri.

  • choicelady : Murph – yours is the best suggestion: AdLib’s friend has to move there. Simple solution, yes?

  • AdLib : My point in bringing this up is to spotlight areas that need to be fixed in the ACA. That exchange premium seems no different than what a good private policy would have been so it’s not making HC more affordable for my friend.

  • KillgoreTrout : Thanks Murph. I’ll have to catch up tomorrow.

  • choicelady : AdLib – has your friend checked on all different providers including Kaiser? Kaiser is beating the pants off most of the plans here.

  • KillgoreTrout : Good to “see” ya CL.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : KT- we have a great discussion going on between Choice and Ad Lib. I am on the sidelines in awe!

  • AdLib : Hey Killgore! All is well here, how are things with you?

  • choicelady : Hey KT! Lovely to see you!

  • choicelady : AdLib – these are problems we knew would occur, but at $1000 for a family, he’s below the market and has free stuff he is not getting now.

  • KillgoreTrout : Hey folks! Just popped in to say hi. Hope all is well with everyone.

  • choicelady : AdLib – I suspect yes, he will not find satisfaction in the privet market since $1000-1500 is the usual hit.

  • AdLib : CL – I know, it’s short term decision making. One accident and the amount they’ll have to pay will dwarf the “savings” on not paying for a policy. But if you don’t have the money to pay each month, what do you do? That’s the problem with living in cities like LA and NY, the income level is too high for many to qualify for subsidies but the cost of living is so high that making $100,000 in LA with a family of 5 can make for a very tight budget.

  • choicelady : AdLib – at $1000 with all preventive care FREE he may come out the same or better. He has been ignoring the out of pocket costs I’ll bet. Most people think of only the premium and not what you shell out at the doc, pharmacy, etc. He seriously needs to aggregate it and the see if the Bronze does not do much better. If someone in his home has med issues, he cannot go without. He will face ruinous bankruptcy costs!

  • choicelady : AdLib – I find it odd that he can’t use the Bronze plan because he would find all his preventive care is FREE. He needs to calculate the overall out of pocket he’s BEEN paying and amortize it across a year to see what it’s added up to. So far we’ve heard NO stories about this that don’t at least pencil out. He’d be a first. But he CAN get way lower monthly premiums and NO FIGHTING. That has to be worth something!

  • AdLib : CL – The Bronze plans were over $1,000/mo to start. I’ll suggest to him that he should investigate the private market but hard to believe their prices would be better than the exchange.

  • AdLib : CL – This seems to be a very marginal situation but others are no doubt in it. His plan was not crappy, it was okay but…he did say that most claims would be initially denied and he’d have to fight with them but would mostly prevail. So, he had a crappy insurance company that was unethical and apparently could offer the lower premium because they could intimidate many people out of getting paid on their claims and my friend preferred to invest his time in fighting for payment than paying a higher premium. So yes, this was not an ideal situation, a stressful one to be sure but that was the situation he could afford. Now, he looks at premiums that are outside of what he can afford and though he would get good claim payment, he can’t afford the monthly premium.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Choice- my question is….is the issue CA?

  • choicelady : OK – have him move to Missouri!

  • MurphTheSurf3 : I did the calculations based on Missouri and got him a gold plan for $911. They would get a $159 a month subsidy based on $100,000 of income.

  • choicelady : AdLib – if he takes the fine – he has NO insurance and everything is out of pocket. EVERYTHING. NOT a good idea esp. for someone in his income level. He should check the Bronze plan.

  • choicelady : AdLib – he may be PAYING the extra per month. He can also look in the private market to see if he can find something closer to his level now. Have him check the Bronze plan with higher deductibles and out of pocket and much lower monthly payments.

  • AdLib : He said he’s going to have to take the fine, he simply can’t afford that additional $600 a month.

  • choicelady : AdLib – OK – then he needs to figure his copays, caps, out of pocket, free stuff v NO free stuff – because it adds up and he may find he pays more per month but less per YEAR. He should call a Navigator or Certified Enroller to get really detailed help. That’s not always as clear on the web site.

  • AdLib : CL – I believe you, just sharing with you what I selected when I got the quote.

  • choicelady : AdLib – it does NOT change the rate if you have sick people. We walked through the rates – it’s the same.

  • AdLib : CL – He can’t keep his plan, the insurance company is cancelling it because it doesn’t conform to the ACA.

  • choicelady : AdLib – if his plan truly is consistent in coverage, he can hang onto it.

  • AdLib : CL – That’s part of the questioning though, Covered CA asks about each family member, whether they need little, moderate or heavy care.

  • choicelady : So advise him to keep what he has. That’s a GREAT rate!

  • AdLib : His deductible was $3,000, in the Silver plans it would be $4k-$6k.

  • choicelady : AdLib – there would be NO difference for anyone needing care. It is entirely about INCOME.

  • AdLib : CL – I got an estimate for a family of 5 with income above $100k, one adult with moderate doctor visits and medication. I looked for a silver plan and the range was between the $1,200s and $1,400s.

  • choicelady : AdLib – I don’t disagree but did you check all the silver gradations, compare his deductibles and copays etc.? The overall cost might be the same. Can’t he KEEP his policy?

  • choicelady : AdLib – I would also agree with him. There are definitely not the ‘fixes’ for upper income earners. But his rate is market – so if he has one less than that, I’d hang onto it IF it is not being recalled as “junk”. That’s what is being cancelled.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : AD – what do you think of Choice’s analysis of your friend’s situation.

  • AdLib : CL – Just go on CA Covered like I did and submit for a family of 5 with parents in their 50’s and one member needing moderate care. It comes out to around $1,300. I just did it before Vox and got that same quote.

  • choicelady : AdLib – can’t he just keep what he has?

  • AdLib : Murph – My friend said though that he understands that such a big overhaul isn’t going to get everything right the first time, he is one of those CA Repubs who is reasonable and understands the real world. He was glad to see the ACA was addressing this broken system but justifiably feels screwed by his situation which needs to be addressed. I concurred, I think that’s messed up and added that if the Repubs in DC were like him, the last 2 years could have been about fixing the issues in it to make it a better plan for all.

  • choicelady : AdLib – I also have to say that if they have a $1300 policy, that’s a surprise to me since I’ve yet to see ANY that expensive. He HAS to be over 400% FPL, and yet even there I don’t see how it could be that expensive unless they have Platinum.

  • choicelady : AdLib – if Christie rides to a win on Obama’s coattails, wow.

  • choicelady : Murph – ACA was made for YOUR story. I’d like a serious comparison of AdLib’s friend’s policy counting up all the costs not just the premium. I’m not clear why he’s looking IF he has insurance that is not “junk”.

  • AdLib : Murph – Christie got lucky when Sandy hit, up until then, he was not seen in a positive light but when he was friendly with Obama, he earned a lot of goodwill…for a pandering reason. Look, I’m glad he was respectful and openly grateful to Obama, that was the right thing to do and it really hammered Romney at the time. I don’t think he did it though for any other reason than because it was to his own benefit.

  • choicelady : AdLib – making excuses for being mobbed up? Wow. That’s so…Mayor Daley of them. You’d think they’d be embarrassed to admit or defend that!

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Choice- what do you think of Ad’s example re. the family of five. I recounted a story at the start of the thread…”Yeste rday…a man whose farm is in hock up to his ears because he and his wife got talked into a bargain policy “more fitting to their midlife years when the kids are gone and their health is so good.” 40 percent Actuarial Benefit. And then his wife was diagnosed with breast cancer which then became both breast and breast bone cancer. The insurer covered pennies on the dollar and after a year dropped them. They have been without insurance for three years. He got insurance for himself last year. Expensive…..in my time with them we identified that THEY will have full coverage on January 1 for a little less than the policy they originally dropped.” BUT AD LIB’S IS THE OTHER SIDE OF THE STORY.

  • AdLib : glenn – What fun and thank goodness you get to sleep in. How lucky your granddaughter is to have you at her games like this!

  • choicelady : Murph – the fail then may be on the party. Not taking advantage of Christie’s rotten behavior is not good.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Night Glenn- great discussion.

  • choicelady : glenn – ahhh the joys of getting older! Free at last!

  • AdLib : CL – Christie has the mobbed up swagger but comes off like a would-be. Maybe he is connected, wouldn’t be surprised but what a bombshell that would be if he ran for President. Though Repubs would probably make excuses for it even though they accused Obama of “pallin’ around with terrorists”.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Ad – I accept your points about crappy Dem govs and candidates but Christie is really so awful that he should be easily defeated. Hell- he is holding billions in relief money for Sandy Relief and his record is, as you pointed out, abysmal on many fronts. His opponent is not the best but she could have, should have weakened him because she is a good debater and a good interview. But, the Dems did not provide her with the resources to increase her name recognition.

  • glenn : CL–No, not me–I’m a grandparent, so I have a good excuse!

  • choicelady : glenn – that sounds like fun! Are you playing, too?

  • glenn : Ad–Yes, the last one, but thank goodness it’s not until noon. Then after the last kids’ game, the kids are going to play the parents–should be fun to watch!

  • AdLib : Thanks glenn, you have a great weekend! Soccer game tomorrow?

  • choicelady : Good night, glenn. Have a lovely weekend!

  • glenn : Alright, folks, I’m just about done in. Time for me to turn in. Take care, Ad, Murph, and CL. I’m sure I’ll see you around the Planet sometime during the weekend or the coming week. G’night!

  • AdLib : CL – His current policy is being ended because it doesn’t conform to the ACA requirements.

  • choicelady : AdLib – scuttlebutt from NJ says that most Governors, regardless of party, are mobbed up, and it leads to overt corruption. Wonder always if that’s what holds Christie back from the run on the White House.

  • AdLib : Murph – Previous Governors NJ has elected included Corzine and McGreevey who both left office in disgrace. They are a unique case, electing poor governors for decades now.

  • glenn : Ad–So is the insurance company raising the rates for your friend?

  • choicelady : AdLib – if he has insurance why is he looking? Has he weighed in the deductibles, out of pocket, copays? If he HAS insurance he does not have to change.

  • choicelady : glenn – LOL!!! My nephew lived in Barnagat for a time. He’d agree!

  • AdLib : CL – I spoke with a Repub friend tonight, he was very upset to learn that the Covered CA options for his family of 5 will go from their current policy of around $750 to $1300 and he just can’t afford it. They make too much to get any subsidies. I went on the site to check it out myself and for a Silver Plan, that’s what it comes to. That’s too much, changes will have to be made. I know he falls into that 4% of the population who have insurance as individuals but that 4% represents millions of people.

  • glenn : CL–As a New Jersey native, the only good thing I can about my home state is, “New Jersey is a good place to be FROM!”

  • choicelady : Murph – I think NJ is different. And voters really distinguish STATE politicos from those in Congress – Christie may be seen as a victim of the Tea Party over their incredible snottiness about Sandy relief funding. But many people are looking at the federal GOP with fear and loathing.

  • choicelady : Hi glenn! I was just reading your concerns and I think AdLib is correct – NJ is just NJ. Too bad people don’t look at what Christie stands for on his abominable policies as opposed to his kind of quirky personality.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Ad Having read your other posts re. the short term memory issue for the electorate…… I think that you may harbor many of the worries I do….NJ is not so different

  • glenn : Hey Choice Lady–good to “see” you!

  • choicelady : AdLib – good to see you, too.

  • glenn : Ad–I’m still trying to figure out which it will be regarding the government shutdown. Cruz and Coulter are going around saying what a good thing the shutdown was, yet when the shutdown began, they were blaming it all on the President. So…will they be heroes for the shutdown because according to Coulter, it was “run magnificently”, or will the shutdown be President Obama’s fault? What to do, what to do?

  • AdLib : Hey CL! You’re never too late here, good to see you!

  • AdLib : Murph – I wouldn’t look at NJ as representative of anything except NJ. Look at many of their former Governors, they don’t really seem to pick the best ones.

  • choicelady : Hi everyone- just dropping in. See I missed kes, and I’m sorry. How is everyone?

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Ad Lib- You do realize that your description of the electorate in NJ, a very, very, very blue state, that is enthralled by the fakester in chief of their state, IS why I am worried about every election everywhere.

  • AdLib : glenn – The short memories and attention spans of Americans nowadays has certainly contributed to why things are as bad as they are. If only Americans could have remembered in 2010 how awful Bush and the Repubs were just two years before, the Dems would have kept the House and Governorships and all the madness we’re going through could have been avoided. It’s almost absurd that it is a valid concern that Americans will forget in less than a year that Repubs shut down their country and threatened to destroy their economy and the world’s…but it is possible (though unlikely in this case I think).

  • glenn : Ad–Unless the baggers have a complete change of heart, all any bagger candidate has to do is run those pictures of Christie with President Obama, and Christie will be toast!

  • AdLib : Night Kes, sleep well!!!

  • glenn : Kes–g’night! sleep well!

  • AdLib : NJ is around 48th in job creation, Christie has devastated the public schools, slashed taxes for the wealthy and hiked them on the 99%. His record stinks something awful. His approval rating comes from people being totally oblivious to what he’s done, personality alone. Thank goodness the Baggers own the Presidential Primaries for the Repubs, Christie will have to swing hard right just to look competitive and that will only piss them off against him more, seeing him as a hypocrite who will pivot to the middle if he won the primary.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : A Good Night to Sabreen and Kesman…..

  • glenn : Kes–well, isn’t that the republican/tpart iers way? You either erase voters’ memories by coming up with lies and innuendoes (or “scandals”), or you just rewrite history…as in “gwb was a great president”. Or, you just don’t acknowledge history, because everyone knows that the history of the United States just began on Jan. 20, 2009 when President Obama took office, except for that St. Reagan presidency, where everything was sunshine and roses.

  • kesmarn : Gosh, kids, I’m starting to wind down a bit myself. Almost midnight here in corn country, so I’ll take my leave too. Have a wonderful weekend, all!

  • kesmarn : Yes, AdLib, Ed Fitzgerald looks like a good Dem candidate to run against Kasich.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Ad Lib- your post illustrates why judicial nominations are a MAJOR deal- lifetime licenses to arbitrarily make or unmake law.

  • AdLib : Night Sabreen!

  • AdLib : Kes – Kasich was mentioned as a possible VP pick for Romney so I’m sure he’s looking at a possible WH run, especially with OH being an important swing state. Just hope voters in OH see him more for who he really is, especially when he has a Dem opponent running against him and making it clear to them.

  • kesmarn : Right, Murph. He seems to be trying to erase voters’ memories of his first couple of years in office. The problem is — it might work!

  • glenn : Murph–And, I should add, “as usual”, to “people won’t dig deep enough…”

  • glenn : Murph–I do agree with you–but I think Christie is going to run on his “bipartisanship ” and people won’t dig deep enough to find out what’s really going on.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Kesman- Kasich is in huge trouble with his record finally catching up to him so he is making a move to the middle.

  • AdLib : glenn – I just don’t understand how they feel it’s a great deal for them to support the delusions and lies of a party while it strips them of rights. Is it like the GOP is the Dallas Cowboys so if you’re Texan, you root for them no matter what, even if they tackle you and break your collarbone?

  • kesmarn : G’night, Sabreen!

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Glenn, but Christie is a wolf in sheep’s clothing and his deals are not good for anyone.

  • glenn : G’night Sabreen. Have a wonderful week!

  • Sabreen60 : Well folks. I’ve gotta go. Good night and have a great week.

  • AdLib : Murph – It should be called the 5th Short Circuit Court, they have some seriously crossed wires in their brains. And the Repubs blocking the filling of the DC Appeals Court??? They know what Bush did with the 5th and don’t want Obama having an impact there but it seems unconstitutional for them to unilaterally declare that the DC court should not have the full number of judges it is specified to have. How can a minority decide to change the court balance of a court? If they can do so, why not let Obama change the SCOTUS to an 11 seat court and appoint two justices?

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Sabreen and Glenn… Christie’s economic record ala Bloomberg. «link»

  • kesmarn : I’m beginning to wonder if Ohio’s Gov. Kasich isn’t lining up for a presidential run. He just pulled quite a stunt with getting the Medicaid expansion passed by doing an end run around the State legislature and letting a committee decide on it. It appears to give him “moderate” cred. In reality he is anything BUT!

  • glenn : Murph–I’m not trying to be snarky, but in regards to Christie, isn’t he the type of republican we are asking for? Someone who WILL make deals?

  • Sabreen60 : Murph, I ran across a site that had Christie’s entire record and it was dismal.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Glenn and Sabreen…Christ ie will win easily BECAUSE he is lying about his record, has made all kinds of deals with Blue DogDems in NJ,his appointment was not supported by the national party, and why? Christie is “reasonable”. BS

  • glenn : Ad–when women can support the talking points that women’s insurance can cost more than men’s, I don’t think they have any problem voting for those regressive men, sadly.

  • Sabreen60 : glenn, The last numbers I saw – Christie 64% and Buono 39%

  • AdLib : glenn – I’m not confident about Texan GOP Women being open to voting against the GOP even thought they’re being treated like 2nd class citizens. Some will crossover but I’m afraid most will be willing to go along with being sublimated.

  • kesmarn : Hard to imagine anyone being “beat down” enough to vote for oppressors like them. Only the Palin and Schlaffly types who are “playing their cards right.”

  • glenn : Sabreen–Don’t know the exact figures regarding Christie in NJ, but I think he is well ahead of his opponent and will probably be re-elected.

  • AdLib : Kes – I know how stubborn Texans can be but all those women who are having their rights and votes taken away, even though they may not even be able to vote, will most Repub women still “want to vote” for these oppressive Republican men???

  • glenn : Murph–While at the same time, the obstructionists in Congress are blocking President Obama’s nominees for the judicial circuit.

  • Sabreen60 : I know the Cuuch in VA is down by 24% among women. I wanna know what’s going on with Dems – men & women in NJ regarding Christie?

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Ad- Rachel Maddow took apart the two judges who were key in that decision as completely unqualified but who got through because of the deal struck with the Dems during the Bush appointment battle.

  • glenn : Speaking of women in TX, anyone know where Alpha Bitch is?

  • glenn : Ad–Sounds like Wendy Davis is going to run for governor of TX. Think she’ll get any republican women’s votes? If they’re anything like Murph’s nurse practitioner who lets her husband bully her into not reading facts, I would guess probably not. However, if only Dems start showing up at the polls, as you said before, I think Davis may have a chance. What do you think?

  • kesmarn : If women in Texas aren’t mad now, I don’t know what it’s gonna take to get their attention, AdLib.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Glenn AND I would have made sure that I had a lot of audience support to shut down her crowd. She backed down very quickly.

  • Sabreen60 : That’s great Murph. I’ll see what’s happening with her when I see her next year for my yearly exam.

  • AdLib : OT but talking about women and OB/GYNs, how about TX getting the 5th Circuit to reverse the lower court on their abortion ban? Add that to their campaign to take away the vote from women and is it possible that things may change in that state when women from both sides get fed up?

  • glenn : Murph–if this woman you offered to debate knows anything about you, then I don’t blame her for not wanting to debate you. As you said, you would “club her with the facts” (BTW, love that phrase), and she would be speechless. Of course that would be a good thing. As always, good on ya for standing up to the bullies.

  • kesmarn : Well, the good side of that is knowing that you have a very capable doc, Sabreen, no? I think a lot of docs are like that. Very knowledgeable in their specialties, but you get them in another area (like politics or economics) and they’re no smarter than the average person. No offense to them. You can’t be expert in everything, I guess, but it would be nice if she were more informed on the ACA.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Sab- a large medical clinic connected to a hospital here has informed its doctors that they do not have the option to not take medicare or medicaid patients and remain in the Mercy system. IF, the doctor can make a case for the harm being done to the practice then the Clinic will provide relief. SO far no signs of anyone leaving.

  • AdLib : Murph – Very cool! And of course everyone who doesn’t agree with her is a bully, that kind of projection is typical for Baggers. I would have enjoyed seeing the video of that!

  • Sabreen60 : kes, she may. Right now it takes a couple of months to get an appointment with her and her office is always full. She’s an ob/gyn and her office is full of expectant mothers. Her reputation as a doctor is stellar.

  • AdLib : Sabreen – That is a bit of a tip off, that she’s not accepting ne Medicare patients. Nice as she may be, she does seem to put money over helping those who are suffering.

  • Sabreen60 : Should have written “goes to show”

  • kesmarn : Sabreen, I’m afraid that may work against your doc down the road. If she’s limiting her practice to only “approved” patients, she may end up with a small practice.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Glenn….I offered to debate one of the school board members on the social studies curriculum three times. She refused saying I would try to bully her…i.e. club her with the facts. Another person, a scientist, offered to do the same re. the biology curriculum. Eventually she resigned from the board. The other lost the election.

  • AdLib : My doctor is so clearly liberal, it would never be an issue for her. But think of the harm that Repub doctors or those who are misinformed will do to the program in the early stages by deterring patients from joining.

  • kesmarn : Murph — that was thinking ahead on the part of the dean. We really will need a lot of people to staff hospitals and clinics.

  • Sabreen60 : Wow Murph! Just goes to know that a string of letters behind ones name doesn’t mean intelligence about all things. My doctor said she doesn’t watch much TV, but I suspect when she does it’s FOX. Oh yeah, and she said the Dems are lying to the people because they are not telling people that premiums may go down by deductibles are skyrocketing. I had saw a sign in the waiting room that said she’s not accepting anymore new Medicare patients.

  • kesmarn : Murph and all — I’ve talked to nurse who had not the slightest idea of what the ACA WAS! I couldn’t believe it. Any decent hospital administrator should be saying to his/her staff what they might expect in the way of changes.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Kes- the influx of patients….I still have a lot of contact with my former university…the y have a brilliant dean of the school of nursing and health professions….t hey have been churning out nurses, nurse practitioners, physician assistants, and health care advisers for four years now in anticipation of this. It is the European model and it works.

  • kesmarn : glenn, to respond to your school board question: yes! isn’t the board supposed to be there FOR the kids?

  • glenn : BRB

  • glenn : Murph–good for you. It’s bad enough for these people to be on city councils, but I think them being on school boards is even worse. They can do a lot more damage, and they are actually proud of it!

  • AdLib : Sabreen – It’s very disappointing to hear that doctors can be so uninformed about their own field but it isn’t rare. I was in my doctor’s waiting room and a different doctor was conversing with a non-patient, ragging on Obama and the ACA, agreeing it is destroying health care. Huh? If that was my doctor, I would have found a different one because he clearly wasn’t equipped to understand his oath, “First do no harm.”

  • kesmarn : The only thing I’ve heard from any of my doctors (and unfortunately I’ve seen about 5 this year) is that they’re worried they won’t be able to handle the sudden influx of patients from all this pent-up demand.

  • Sabreen60 : kes, I didn’t think of that way. But you’re probably right. She’s a very nice person and friendly person. We have good relationship and can talk about most things. I’ll talk politics with anyone. I just didn’t expect her to take the position that she took.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Sabreen- a repeat from earlier but worth noting in light of your comment. “today I had a conversation with the home healthcare nurse who is visiting a “house guest” I have (a neighbor whose family was unable/unwilling to provide basic care/support after knee surgery). She-+– A) Did not know a lot about ACA. B) What she “knows” is mostly crap C) Her source of info (as she admitted) is Fox in the evening and talk radio during the day as she travels around D) And her work is with people for whom ACA is clearly a good idea. She has been to the house five times. The last time I gave her my basic info sheet on ACA (which has all kinds of links). Today she told me she through the sheet away because her husband told her is was “left wing socialist trash.” The woman is an RN with a MSN degree from a good school.”

  • glenn : Kes–glad to hear the parents sued. How can the president of the school board be menacing to a kid? Isn’t the school board supposed to be working to help children, not menace them? Of course, I’m just one of those union, lib teachers, so what do I know? AARGH!

  • glenn : Hey Sabreen–don’t know if I said “hi” or not, so “hi”. That’s incredible about your doctor. Just goes to show you that sometimes people can’t see the forest for the trees.

  • kesmarn : Sabreen, to me that seems somewhat unprofessional on her part, I must say. She shouldn’t be burdening patients with her political opinions.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Glenn and Kes….I was involved with an effort last year to get three school board members removed. One for cause, the other two in a special election. We got two of them out by relentlessly publishing everything they said or did, posting videos, and get person-on-the-st reet reaction to all of it.

  • AdLib : Kes – Not at all, this is important for people to know, just how far these lunatics can and will go.

  • kesmarn : Wow…glenn that’s incredible. This guy’s most recent court appearance was AFTER he was elected president of the school board. He ended up pleading guilty to a menacing charge after he went after a kid with Asperger’s who was helping out with one of the sports teams. He wasn’t familiar with this kid and didn’t like the way he acted so he got mean with him. The parents did sue on that one.

  • AdLib : glenn – That is reaffirming to hear. It is amazing the lack of shame these radicals have, no matter how horrible and unethical…and even criminal they and/or their fellow Baggers are, they show no conscience about what any of them are doing. To these jihadists, the ends justify the means.

  • Sabreen60 : I told this on TPV, but I’m still just flummoxed by the comments from one of my doctors. This woman is top rated and really good. She’s my gyn and is also African American. We had a political conversation and I could not believe the right wing talking points that came out her mouth. She hates “Obamacare”. She has patients tell her they have received the cancellation letters and that Obamacare is rationing healthcare. This woman was clueless. She admitted that she’s an independent, which to me means “clueless”. She also said that she voted for PBO in 2008, but 2012 she wrote-in her son’s name – because she hasn’t agreed with all PBO’s policies. I countered some of her comments but we didn’t have time to talk at length. I really wish I had never had the convo.

  • kesmarn : That is brave of you, AdLib! Something to think about!

  • glenn : Hey Kes–we had a tea party crazy woman try to take over our school board–she has now been censured and the board is deciding whether or not to dismiss her from the board. She wrote to the SACS (School Accreditation organization) to get them to audit the school board right after she was elected. SACS told her an audit was not needed because they had just done one and had found no irregularities. Then she accused the chairman of the school board of trying to run her down with his car–she actually filed a police report. After the police checked the traffic video of the corner where the accident allegedly happened, the police filed charges against her for filing a false report! She was indicted. That’s what got her censured, and may get her dismissed. So as you say, Ad, once these cockroaches are put in the light of day, they get stepped on!

  • kesmarn : The Toledo Blade has covered some of his shenanigans; maybe I can get links to those articles. They didn’t make the religion connection though; just discussed his arrest history and his bad behavior at school board meetings.

  • AdLib : Kes – I would be fine with posting the article under my byline if that would be helpful.

  • kesmarn : No lawsuits that I’m aware of AdLib. I think everyone too scared. This guy is big and loud and threatening. (Has had two arrests in his past for violent offenses like assault.) And yes — maybe an article would be called for!

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Kes..by all means, send it via ad lib…

  • AdLib : BTW Kes, would you consider writing a post about that? I think many people would really appreciate learning about this disgusting situation.

  • kesmarn : Murph, I wonder if I should email it to you. I know that sounds a little paranoid, but these people can be mean and I have a family member in that district.

  • AdLib : Kes – Wow, that is astounding!!! Outrageous! And parents are all just fine with this religious takeover of their schools? No one has filed a suit against him under separation of church and state?

  • MurphTheSurf3 : kes…can you share the name of this dominionist school board member and the district he is from. I would love to plant this story with a couple of people I know.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Glenn- but you have made the commitment to learning – knowledge is the power the GOP fears the most.

  • kesmarn : Great to be here, AdLib!

  • AdLib : Hey Kes! No worries, great to see you!

  • AdLib : glenn – Wise words, the Baggers and their backers schemed to take over from local up, school boards, city councils, etc. Their plan has worked to a degree but upon taking power, it has backfired since they can’t hide in the shadows any longer.

  • glenn : Murph–thanks for the info. I’m pretty new to actually paying attention to the political process, so I’ll take your advice the next election. Haven’t paid attention due to work, family, etc.–also I don’t trust the media any more to report actual facts, so I do a lot of research on my own. I do think that’s part of the problem too–most people don’t have, or take, the time to research the issues thoroughly, so they end up going with the “status quo” or with those who promise the most and deliver the least.

  • kesmarn : glenn, just saw your comment about voting and I so agree. One Dominionist guy near here has pretty much taken over a school board. The kids are now watching bible story vids in “social studies,” boys are no longer allowed to be drum majors (“too gay”), and kids who run out of lunch money get to starve to “teach them a lesson.”

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Hello Kes

  • Sabreen60 : Hi Kes. Just got here, too and will BRB :)

  • kesmarn : Good Friday evening, friends! What’s the topic this evening? Sorry for the late arrival. The Mercy folks were gabbier than usual tonight.

  • glenn : Ad–The one thing the teapartiers have taught me is to never sit out ANY election ever again–not a local election, not a school board election, not a mid-term election–I will vote in every election I can, and I will always vote for a Dem, until the republican party returns to sanity.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Glenn- in the future call the state Democratic Party and ask them for info regarding any Democrat running in your town/city, legislative district etc. Get their recommendations. AND if they can’t do it, call the DNC and complain that the State HQ cannot handle your simple request. You can actually e mail Debbie Wasserman Schultz (and when you do CC the state party)

  • AdLib : Murph – Well…in the red states it is a circle the wagons time for the diehards but many people in more moderate districts throughout the country have turned from Repubs. Again, all we need is 17 House seats from anywhere in the nation. Then, the end of the Baggers will be nigh.

  • AdLib : glenn – Good for you and yes, dedicating that time to getting to know who these councilpeople are is very valuable. For you and for all the other people you can help to inform. Nothing says most of the voters are any better informed about these people.

  • glenn : Hey Sabreen!

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Ad- I know you are. But I watch the trends elsewhere and the lack of a popular uprising against the GOP after the shut down and the gun to the head of the debt ceiling tells me that Stupid IS as Stupid DOES.

  • glenn : Murph–We just had our local city elections today. I tried to do research to find out party affiliations for each one of them, but could not find them for most of the candidates. I refuse to vote for any republican and a teapartier will NEVER get my vote. I found that only one was a Democrat, so I voted for that person, and did not vote in the other ones. The other problem is that out of the five running for election, three were running unopposed. Now, that is not to say I am unhappy with the way our city is run–just that I would like to have more of a voice. After the first of the year, I think I will be attending city council meetings. Gotta start somewhere, right?

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Hello Sabreen.

  • AdLib : Hey Sabreen!

  • AdLib : Murph – Just trying to give you a little respite from that skewed reality. Most of America is moderate.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Glenn- agree with your analysis of the “journalistic ethos” today.

  • Sabreen60 : Hi Folks. Just stopped by for a little while. I hope everyone is well.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Ad- I live in a laboratory of Red minded autovoters….I do not know if MOST Americans applies to them.

  • AdLib : Murph – The thing is, that kind of backfired in most states last year and I think it will this year. Most Americans now see the Repubs and their allies for who they really are, they are no longer a reasonable alternative.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Glenn- the kind of control from the smallest local election to the state wide elections to the national elections are what GOP billionaire club are funding….they know that control of the entire machine is essential – ESPECIALLY IF A DEM HAPPENS TO GET INTO OFFICE- you neutralize them by isolating them and using the Anti Obama Strategy- attack, attack, attack

  • glenn : Murph–I agree 100%. That’s what I call the “hesaid/shesaid ” reporting. They report what some other network said–bring on that person and that person just gets to repeat it. Then they bring on another person who just calls the first person names, and we get nowhere. Makes for great “reality tv”, but it sure as hell ain’t journalism. It’s okay to repeat the first person’s story–but real journalism would then be–“here is why this person is wrong–or even here is why this person is right”. I do admire Rachel Maddow for that kind of reporting, although I think she gets carried away with her own issues sometimes–her reports are always grounded in fact-based reporting.

  • AdLib : Thanks Murph, read the first paragraph wrong, he’s running AGAINST the incumbent, got it!

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Ad…Thigpen is not a member of Congress.

  • AdLib : glenn – Thanks for the link! You know, we only need to win 17 seats and if he’s re-elected, that means we only need 16. That sure is great blowback against the Baggers and a great path for Repubs who are moderate, turn Dem, get rid of the loons and be on the winning side. Since they can’t be moderates as Repubs, they should turn Dem and the DNC should be pitching this hard wherever they don’t have candidates in play.

  • glenn : Murph–Not sure how much Dems will be able to make headway in GA–almost everything here–local, state, school boards, are in republican/tpart iers control. And to read the comments on the AJC blog just reinforces that–everything is the fault of the Dems and/or President Obama. However, there is some pushback, however small. The VP of the GA hospital association, Kevin Bloye, is saying that “we need Medicaid expansion in this state” because three hospitals have already gone broke and a couple more are on the verge of bankruptcy because of people using ERs as healthcare. Hmmm…imagine that–private hospitals–and these are private hospitals–depen dent on the government! IMO, the cycle of GOP lies won’t be broken unless and until businesses start pushing back against their insanity.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Glenn- what do you know of Michelle Nunn. She seems to have lots of money and it is coming from the left and right.

  • AdLib : Murph – I think Alison Grimes will beat McConnell or the Bagger running against him in the primary. She seems to have destiny on her side. And winning GA would be just amazing! Many of the Dem Senate seats that were thought to be vulnerable are looking less vulnerable too.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Glenn…thanks for the link re. Thigpen…I wonder if he has a chance against the Dem’s Party choice?

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Glenn- I am angrier at the laziness of the so called moderating, or even left leaning media. Look at all of the stories re folks being “victimized by Obamacare” because of our of reach premiums for policies they do not want. THE PROBLEM IS THE STORIES ARE UNTRUE. AND VERY FEW ARE DOING THEIR HOMEWORK. At last, the print press is fact checking and finding out the truth but the seeds of discontent are planted and grow quickly.

  • glenn : Ad and Murph–the candidate is an Iraq war veteran running for Congress in eastern NC. His name is Jason R. Thigpen. Here is the link: «link»

  • AdLib : glenn – It is complex, there are many contributing factors but without the MSM’s complicity, the lies wouldn’t stick.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Glenn and Ad Lib…the press is saying that Georgia is now in play for the Dems thanks to Nunn and the GOP civil war. McConnell seems to be in trouble in KY. Is this our hope?

  • AdLib : Murph – I’m less concerned about that now. After the shutdown and looking ahead to the ongoing threats, filibusters and inaction, the Repubs will only be reinforcing their negative appeal. They will lose seats in 2014, I’m pretty sure, it’s just a question of whether it will be enough for Dems to take back the House but they’ll keep the Senate.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Glenn…the words impress me…and the intention….bac kground will help.

  • glenn : Murph–I really hate simplistic answers to complicated questions/issues , but I have to say that cable so-called news stations have certainly made the issues much worse, with misinformation, lies, and propaganda constantly. It’s so insidious the way they phrase things, too, putting the propaganda in the question as if it’s legitimate. Fox is the worst offender, but I find a lot of other cable stations are just fox on the other side, or try so hard to be “balanced” that they end up with “hesaid/shesaid ” and no actual facts presented.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Glenn…who switched? Thigpen? Who is this?

  • AdLib : Very interesting, glenn, and great to hear. I do think this hatred and racism campaign has played out, it’s the downward slope of the Bell Curve now.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Ad….desperatio n…yes….but fear that Senate may go their way. I fear that the anger with government overall will drive town ballot turnout which always hurts the Dems more, 2010 Part II in 2014. I am constantly depressed by the sheer idiocy of folks on both sides but the stupid people on the right VOTE and those on left MIGHT.

  • AdLib : It is the unthinking emotions of hatred, greed and prejudice that seem to override the natural sense of self-protection and self-preservatio n human beings have. Instead, they are like lemmings, more intent on following those they need to follow even if it means running straight off a cliff.

  • glenn : Ad–I am becoming hopeful that more and more people are finally “pushing back” against the propaganda. I read on another website tonight about another republican candidate who is switching to the Dem party because of the hateful rhetoric coming from the r/tps. He is a veteran and he said, “I simply cannot stand with a party where its most extreme element promote hate and division amongst people,” said Thigpen, 36. “Nothing about my platform has, nor will it change. The government shutdown was simply the straw that broke the camel’s back. I guess being an American just isn’t good enough anymore and I refuse to be part of an extremist movement in the GOP that only appears to thrive on fear and hate mongering of anyone and everyone who doesn’t walk their line.” And, there are actually republicans speaking out against creepycanadiancu bancruz, so I am hopeful.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Glenn and Ad….today I had a conversation with the home healthcare nurse who is visiting a “house guest” I have (a neighbor whose family was unable/unwilling to provide basic care/support after knee surgery). She-+– A) Did not know a lot about ACA. B) What she “knows” is mostly crap C) Her source of info (as she admitted) is Fox in the evening and talk radio during the day as she travels around D) And her work is with people for whom ACA is clearly a good idea. She has been to the house five times. The last time I gave her my basic info sheet on ACA (which has all kinds of links). Today she told me she through the sheet away because her husband told her is was “left wing socialist trash.” The woman is an RN with a MSN degree from a good school.

  • AdLib : glenn – What I’ve read that seems to make the most sense is that much of this stems from desperation. Many need to have “the others” to hate and blame for their bad circumstances and hating and attacking them takes precedence even over their own security. They are willing to lose their own benefits as long as they can stop “the others” from getting them.

  • AdLib : Murph – I just don’t understand how one’s brain can be wired to ignore personal experience and instead accept the conflicting words of one’s authority figure.

  • glenn : Murph–I’m beginning to believe that, too. I mean, just racism against the President can’t be the only reason. I believe that’s a huge part of it; but it can’t be the only reason. Greed is another biggie, I think, but many of the people who vote for the gop are not rich people. I just don’t get it; and I keep asking questions on HP to find out what they’re really trying to say, but their answers are always so “pat” and rehearsed that I’ve come to the conclusion that they are just blinded by hatred and can’t even think any more.

  • AdLib : glenn – You beat me to it, I’m as bewildered at how there isn’t at least a 70% majority opposing the GOP and their attack on health care reform.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Ad- I have had a lot of discussion with those continue to support the GOP despite their own experience. This is the power of propaganda.

  • AdLib : Murph – The GOP just ignores the horrible cost that having bad or no insurance ends up putting on the shoulders of Americans. I am still surpiosed they get as much blind support as they do. You’d think there are plenty of folks like this couple who have learned first hand how the Repubs are working against their best interest.

  • glenn : Murph–Once again, people almost bankrupted because of medical costs. It just blows my mind that we, as a country, are so split on this issue.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Glenn- I am convinced that the GOP is as close to amoral as any political organization we have every had in this country.

  • glenn : Ad–Thanks for the plate.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Ad….a completely paid for farm three years ago is now mortgaged pretty heavily.

  • AdLib : glenn – Here’s a mixed plate, home made tortilla chips too.

  • glenn : Murph–Sigh–I just can’t understand how the republican/tpart y congress critters can look themselves in the mirror while denying hope and health care to people like the couple you describe. It truly does blow my mind.

  • AdLib : Wow Murph! What a story. I’m sorry that they had to go through this hell and am pleased that at least moving forward, they will have real health care coverage. But what about all the costs they’ve had to deal with?

  • glenn : Ad–Yum–I’ll have some artichoke spinach dip, please.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : What stands out….in conversation after conversation the need is huge….and the GOP does not care. Yesterday…a man whose farm is in hock up to his ears because he and his wife got talked into a bargain policy “more fitting to their midlife years when the kids are gone and their health is so good.” 40 percent Actuarial Benefit. And then his wife was diagnosed with breast cancer which then became both breast and breast bone cancer. The insurer covered pennies on the dollar and after a year dropped them. They have been without insurance for three years. He got insurance for himself last year. Expensive…..in my time with them we identified that THEY will have full coverage on January 1 for a little less than the policy they originally dropped.

  • AdLib : glenn – Well, we’ve got artichoke spinach dip, nachos, mini pizzas and of course, Vienna Sausages.

  • glenn : Ad–Good one!

  • glenn : Ad–All of this talk about candy has made me want to munch. What’s on the appetizer table tonight?

  • AdLib : I wore a straight jacket with a tie and went as Ted Cruz.

  • AdLib : glenn – That’s pretty funny! Great idea and theme! Though they were probably running from all the kids that wanted to put them in their Halloween bags!

  • glenn : Hey Murph–good to see you here at the beginning. How are you?

  • glenn : Ad–My granddaughter’s BFF’s mom made “candy costumes” for five of the kids in her neighborhood. My granddaughter and her BFF were a twin-pack of nerds; the BFF’s little brother was a blue M&M; another little boy was a Mike and Ike box of candy and his sister was a Skittles pack. It was absolutely too cute!

  • AdLib : Murph, right next to the bar, of course.

  • AdLib : Murph, what stands out to you this week?

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Ad Lib….where is the buffet table?

  • AdLib : Murph, you get your pick of the appetizers, getting here early has its perqs.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Ad…fine….tir ed….lots of ACA work.

  • AdLib : Hey Murph! How are you?

  • AdLib : So, looks like we’re back to Repub filibusters and House witch hunt hearings. Must be Fall.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Ad Lib and Glenn…I am here at the start of the Party…..

  • AdLib : Yep, seemed not to be as many as last year for some reason. Took my daughter out for a while and she had a great time!

  • glenn : Ad–Doing well, how about you? Did you have lots of trick-or-treater s at your house last night?

  • AdLib : How are you this evening?

  • AdLib : Hey or hi work for me!

  • AdLib : Heh! Hi glenn, and I’ll take a Polo Mallet to whack a certain TN Rep. with!

  • glenn : Oops–meant to say “hi” instead of “hey”

  • glenn : Hey AdLib–red solo cup or crystal stem?

  • AdLib : Don’t forget to say “Hi!” or “GOP Hallloweenies!” when you arrive!

  • AdLib : Vox Populi, our live chat about the week’s events begins tonight at 7 pm PDT. We’ll be handing out some leftover treats and leave the leftover tricks to the GOP. Hope to see you then!

Categories: Vox Populi Archives

Written by AdLib

My motto is, "It is better to have blogged and lost hours of your day, than never to have blogged at all."

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