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  • SallyT : Good night!

  • choicelady : Good night!

  • SallyT : You have as much of a relaxing weekend that you can and I will see you when you get to the funnies!

  • choicelady : Well, dear Sally – I have to go back to work tomorrow to fill out more forms for the health care grant people. Tedious but has to be done. So I will bid you adieu, wish you sweet dreams, and will see you in TWO weeks. We’re heading out of town for the weekend, no computers! Be well, dear friend, and I will see you in the funny papers!

  • choicelady : LOL!!! I had the milk carton seed thing though I don’t think it was milk. We got that in bottles. But yes we did that! Taught patience! I also was a Cubs fan. THAT teaches patience, loyalty, and hope. ALL good things to have!

  • SallyT : It is just a new way of thinking and I think other countries that have lived with less will be here longer then we will be because we have been sold a bunch of goods!

  • choicelady : I try to remind younger people that if we had not moved the Civil Rights movement into the legislature, we’d STILL be marching over the Edmund Pettus Bridge in Selma! That’s the part they don’t have patience for, and that’s the part we HAVE to have. Change means the LAW, and the law means legislation. However dull by comparison, it’s essential work.

  • SallyT : But, a garden teaches the young that you have to wait to see results. I don’t think they even plant seeds in milk cartons anymore in school like they did when I was young.

  • choicelady : I agree – but if it doesn’t go beyond demonstrations, it will fail. We have a ‘made for TV movie’ sense of how fast things are supposed to change, and too many get bored if it takes more than a month! It’s unrealistic, and that’s what scares me.

  • SallyT : But, CL, I think the OWS did show that they are more willing to be a community and work as one.

  • choicelady : I’m FINE with the ‘no rooster’ clause! I get up early enough, thanks.

  • choicelady : We got permission in the city to have chickens! I have a friend who had three. Good idea!

  • SallyT : We can have 3 chickens but no roosters in town here in Portland.

  • SallyT : I agree! I have seen more people growing gardens in my neighbor, very city neigborhood with small yards, then I have ever seen before! Even chickens!

  • choicelady : On that score, yes. But I fear they’re not realistic about what it takes to move things. They see OWS as the end – and it’s just the start. I hope they have endurance for the long haul, not just the short and public bursts.

  • SallyT : They are more open to the other guys feelings.

  • SallyT : I also told him that I think the younger generation is way ahead of us because they no longer see color or sexual differences in love.

  • choicelady : I see signs we are realizing we must regain community. Not the Right of course, but many people are finding very creative ways to share resources. Community gardens etc. are beginning to thrive. It’s very heartening.

  • SallyT : My husband told me that in the future we will need guns to keep people out of our gardens and I said no! We just need to teach them the importance of being able to take care of themselves and their community. That is how we were raised and no one cared about all the other guy had because you knew you could care for yourself and your friends. All this high price stuff isn’t necessary when no one around you cares about it either. We have lost the community feel.

  • choicelady : So – what say you? I don’t think anyone else is coming, we’ve drunk all the margaritas and eaten all the popcorn. Should we call it a night? I SO look forward to Sunday funnies!

  • choicelady : Thank you! I will indeed watch it.

  • SallyT : CL, here’s that movie if you care to watch it. «link»

  • choicelady : I live in a 100 year old house with small closets! You’re absolutely right! But we can compliment the reduced consumption with greater human control over production we do need. That is my next (post health care) effort – promoting employee ownership and building sustainable self sufficiency for people, families, communities, our nation.

  • SallyT : I told my husband that with robots going to be even driving taxis in the future, there just aren’t going to be that many jobs! But, the number one job of anyone is to take care of themselves and their family. They can start by learn to grow food and buy less. We live in a house that is 100 years old and has small closets. That is because people didn’t use to think they needed so many clothes! But we have been sold on needing more and more because that is how corps make their money. And, robots doing the work doesn’t make anything cheaper! It all goes to the top!

  • choicelady : Sally – lands I knew as a child are now housing development. My husband’s daughter lives in AZ and said the haboobs, the huge dust storms, are from construction and farming. And no one takes that as a WARNING?

  • choicelady : Sally – that is my theme next week at the Cal Labor Federation conference. We CAN make employing human beings a priority by making capital an instrument to labor rather than the other way around. We do that through cooperatives, ESOPs, union coops – wherever humans can put themselves FIRST and making money second. Who is more important? The people who have the knowledge and skill to make things we need – or Paris Hilton who skims the profits and contributes nothing?

  • SallyT : I know, CL! And, the land has been taken for construction of new houses or buildings that no one can afford to live in!

  • choicelady : Sally – you know the works of Wendell Barry who writes about agriculture and corporatism? He says we MUST go back to the ‘butter and cream’ kinds of farming where you keep yourselves afloat with those things when times are hard. We must reduce farm size, replenish GOOD farm practices (like NOT tearing out CCC planted shelter belts) and revive the idea of self sufficiency AND sufficiency in general. That means stopping the world finance institutions from demanding that poor farmers be forced into export oriented production and away from subsistence. That’s why people are dying. They have land and crops – but nothing to eat. Even in the US the biggest users of food stamps? Farmers.

  • SallyT : I agree on the Gates. And, farmers have been sold on growing cash crops, one thing, for the money. Not a variety of crops that they use to grow for their community. l

  • SallyT : I don’t think the US can ever change its way of thinking but we better. There are not going to be the jobs like there have been with all the robots doing more and more. We will have to do things more for ourselves because we won’t be able to buy as much.

  • choicelady : I have a hard on against Bill and Melinda Gates who “help” farmers in Uganda etc. IF and ONLY IF they plant GMO seeds. Anuradha had one of those farmers at the ‘anti world agricultural conference’ here – he said the cotton he was required to plant was horrid quality. GMO seeds may not be saved, so he’s into the cash supply line to raise something he cannot sell. This is NOT an answer – it’s a disaster. Because of their money, the Gates dictate the way the whole world will operate. Dangerous!!!!

  • SallyT : My husband and I both come from farming families. I told him that in the future the heroes will be the ones that can live with less and grow their own food.

  • choicelady : Exactly! How horrific that people are killing themselves because they cannot sustain their lives with their own land and work!

  • choicelady : Obviously I cannot punctuate, but you get the idea about the url!

  • SallyT : Suicide is very big in India among their farmers because of this!

  • choicelady : I have a very dear friend, Anuradha Mittal, who runs the Oakland Institute that focuses on agricultural crimes against humanity. If you’re interested, her web site is wwwoaklandinstit ute.org (I think) She travels the world keeping an eye on land grabs, environmental degradation to food crops, and – horrible – the rise of famine in places such as India that has not had famine in 60 plus years. All from corporate machinations that are taking away sustainable self sufficiency.

  • SallyT : But even if you don’t use their seeds but your neighbor does and the birds or wind blows some into your crop, Monsanto can sue you! It is terrible!

  • SallyT : Hungary had the farmers plow under all their Monsanto seed crops!

  • SallyT : I watched a great documentary on seeds the other night and how other countries are being effected. It is terrible and many countries have forbidden Monsanto to be in their countries now.

  • choicelady : And then – we’re NOT paying attention to Monsanto!

  • choicelady : I’m right there with you!!! We lose control of our food security, we are doomed. The IRS was doing its job. Period. The RW screamed, and once again EVERYONE rolled over for them.

  • SallyT : I am more concerned about Monsanto and trying to control our food supply than the IRS checking on whether someone should be tax exempt or not!

  • choicelady : The revelation – I did NOT know – that Nixon made a deal with the South Vietnam government NOT to accept the LBJ peace settlement was horrifying to me. It never came out – that IS treason – because they got the dirt via illegal wiretaps. Then Reagan and the “October Surprise” counter by getting Iran to KEEP the hostages – also treason – to get himself elected. The vile quest for political power is nowhere in evidence in any of the three ‘scandals’ that are anything but. Yet the media act as if Obama was selling babies in the Town Square. Disgusting.

  • SallyT : I really think the public is getting tired of it and this is going to hurt the GOP with the Independent voters.

  • choicelady : Absolutely NOT. Why Americans need to find something awful about their nation and their president is just not clear.

  • SallyT : Or Reagan for that matter!

  • SallyT : It’s so funny because none of this even comes close to all the Tricky Dicky did!

  • choicelady : Yeah. Right. Marx wrote that history repeats itself, the first time for tragedy, the second time for farce. That WOULD appear to be happening! We don’t have malfeasance or criminality under this president at all. The search for clay feet is absurd.

  • SallyT : Oh,CL, there are lots of cartoons on Obama and Nixon. Obama turning into Nixon.

  • choicelady : I think if they can ‘prove’ Obama is as bad or worse than Nixon, they finally feel redeemed. They’re simply flailing in the wind, but there was a cartoon in the Sacramento Bee showing Tricky Dick but got up to look like Obama.

  • SallyT : There weren’t any cartoons on that, yet. I think that came out too late for the artist to depict. But, there are some good ones on the TeaParty not being political…..sh owing they are.

  • choicelady : Are you getting anything about the revelations that the GOP LIED about the memos, that they actually rewrote the language of the emails?

  • SallyT : Very true! I don’t get it except that the GOP keep trying to find someone worst than Nixon!

  • choicelady : Sally – that WILL be interesting! I am absolutely dumbfounded at what passes for ‘scandal’ now. We LIVED through so much that was serious. It’s all for TV, nothing for reality. Horrid.

  • SallyT : I won’t leave a drink undrunk!

  • choicelady : Sally – it’s OK, I have the Dust Buster, and no one left too many popcorn bits. But if you want to hang in, there’s more Margarita mix on the bar.

  • SallyT : CL, there are several on all these “scandal” from different parts of the world. They see things so removed from it than we see being involved with it.

  • choicelady : Sally – you offer us so much insight into what people are thinking around the world. It really has enriched my understanding of other people’s views.

  • SallyT : I’ll be there, KT! And, there are so good ones and lots of dumb right sided ones!

  • choicelady : KT – my pleasure.

  • KillgoreTrout : Thanks CL for being our host this evening and Sally, I’ll see you in the funny papers.

  • choicelady : Good night, KT! It’s very late in your neck of the woods, so it’s perfectly understandable! Thank you for being here! Great conversation.

  • SallyT : Okay, KT, you may go. I will help CL clean up.

  • KillgoreTrout : I must get started on the music thingy!

  • SallyT : Well, you are more than welcome!

  • KillgoreTrout : I too must bid you good folks adieu!

  • choicelady : Sally, well, thank you, but it’s because we have such a good group! You did make ALL of us laugh for which we thank you because lord knows we NEEDED that!

  • SallyT : CL, I’d say you have done an excellent job has host here!

  • choicelady : KT – exactly, KT. Exactly.

  • KillgoreTrout : CL, not conservative, just mellower. We deliberate more than we did in our youth. most young folks are pretty cock sure. (if you would excuse the expression) Youth also has a veneer of being indestructable.

  • SallyT : Nite, Murph! See you at the funnies!

  • choicelady : Murph – good night!

  • choicelady : Murph – will do. We’re just sending TO/OT messages – Kalima downloads them to pass on to kes soon. And we just pause and think of kes. As we will do for you. Get better. We miss having you here so often and so strongly.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : CL- I plan to be back in the saddle soon but if I take my “curfew” any further….well, not good. Best.

  • choicelady : Murph – you need to come back. Laughing is seriously the best medicine, and Sally cracks us all up at least once every Vox.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Choice- thanks for the Kes update…add my name to any joint statement of support and concern.

  • SallyT : What can I say, Murph?

  • choicelady : Sally – yours is a practical turn of poetry. Everyone has his or her strengths!

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Sally- your quote! ROTFLMAO….real ly!

  • choicelady : Murph – we don’t know precisely what happened to kes, but Monday she had surgery, and she said she’d be away for some time. It’s worrisome of course, but Kalima said she is beginning her recovery. So we don’t know why, but we do know who – and we direct thoughts to her daily. Hope it helps. Kalima will send on our messages to her when she is better.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : KT- my pleasure…that is all from wikipedia…but I knew it was there….

  • SallyT : Wow, Murph! The only think I can quote from memory is There’s a soldier in the grass with a bullet up his ass, Get it out! Get it out like a good Girl Scout!

  • KillgoreTrout : Excellent Murph! I always wondered where the expression came from! Thanks.

  • choicelady : KT – I agree, but I dispute the notion we always grow more conservative as we age. I think we just grow more wise about when and where to direct our energies. The principles don’t have to change, but surely the actions must?

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Sally…my profound pleasure.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Choice- thanks for the energy transmission. What is up with Kes? Something new?

  • KillgoreTrout : CL, I forget who wisely said once, “revolution is a young man’s game.” I think that’s partly true. I know I am a hell of a lot “mellower,” than I was in my twenties and thirties.

  • choicelady : Murph! Lovely to get it all and get it right! Thank you!

  • MurphTheSurf3 : KT – The words are from William Congreave. Two of Congreve’s turns of phrase from The Mourning Bride (1697) have become famous, albeit frequently in misquotation, and often misattributed to William Shakespeare: “Music has charms to soothe a savage breast,” which is the first line of the play, spoken by Almeria in Act I, Scene 1. (The word “breast” is often misquoted as “beast”, and “has” sometimes appears as “hath”.) “Heaven has no rage like love to hatred turned, Nor hell a fury like a woman scorned,” spoken by Zara in Act III, Scene VIII.[2] (This is usually paraphrased as “Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned”) Congreve coined another famous phrase in Love for Love (1695): “O fie, miss, you must not kiss and tell.”

  • choicelady : KT – I think that’s exactly correct. Life is the mix, and balance is required. Maybe I’m just getting older, but full tilt rage is too draining, debilitating, and corrosive to me. Finding the light is essential, so thank you for that in your music thread!

  • KillgoreTrout : Thanks FC, I look forward to seeing you there.

  • KillgoreTrout : Take care Murph and bless Mama nature while you’re at it.

  • KillgoreTrout : CL, I think it’s my Taoist nature that tends to seek relief from the craziness and dark side of humanity. Music does have the tendency to soothe the savage breast! (what a funny saying, isn’t it)

  • choicelady : Sally – only a woman of real principle could say that! Good for you!

  • SallyT : CL, I am in full agreement with you on the IRS, and I have been audited before!

  • SallyT : Good night, Murph, and thank you for my degree in the studies of cartoons!

  • choicelady : Murph – we all sent energies etc. to kes, and now we will to you. I believe quantum physics will show there’s something to this ‘collective mind energy’. You have it, with love, from us all. Grow stronger every day. Hope you will be here with us soon. Sweet dreams!

  • SallyT : Nite, FC!!

  • foodchain : tsk tsk, you caught me watching…

  • choicelady : food – you SAY good night, but…

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Well…all I am 8 minutes past my promised bed time….so I am off. Hopefully next week will find me more fully “in the game”. This was fun.

  • foodchain : Night all, really, this time

  • foodchain : Hope to be a contributor to your great music weekend

  • choicelady : KT – I think you’re right, and we thank you. This has been a very hard week. My husband and I argued over the IRS crap – I think they did the right thing, and at first he did not. It’s that new evidence that is changing his mind. But still the Right and some EmoProgs are STILL WHINING!

  • foodchain : KT, If these clowns knew how many stop watching just because of the BS, they might stop and start giving real news.

  • KillgoreTrout : Sweet dreams Sue.

  • SallyT : I can crochet an afgan.

  • choicelady : Murph, thank you! We’ll get her in the game indeed!

  • KillgoreTrout : FC, I figure one or two days of cheeriness is due after 5 days of bullshit and darkness.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Choice- Afghan ownership- HAH! Well done….the games afoot!

  • choicelady : Sally – we didn’t like to ask…

  • SallyT : What the hell did I just typed????

  • SallyT : So, I have a docucant

  • KillgoreTrout : FC, Mama Nature WILL have her way, despite how clever mankind may think it is.

  • choicelady : Sally – well, if you haven’t BEEN to afghanistan, do you HAVE an afghan? That’ll do.

  • choicelady : Murph – I believe you’re right about Sally’s Sunday Funnies being equal to keeping a diary.

  • foodchain : you got it Choice. Double time

  • KillgoreTrout : Coming up with new and creative themes is a challenge, for sure.

  • SallyT : CL, I haven’t been anywhere! Not even the store. Hubby has gone the last couple of times!

  • choicelady : food – best to you as well. Say howdy to Sweet Home, Chicago for me please!

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Sally- I think the funnies count as diarist activity.

  • KillgoreTrout : Sue, scandal offers little in selections that are relevant. I think I’ve done “lies,” a few times already.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Sally- good enough! Cheers!

  • foodchain : Well, late enough here; dogs are looking at me and hubby is long gone. What a good crew you all are. Best to everyone and to Kes–and to us all

  • SallyT : KT, you will have to tell Sue that because she says she can’t copy them.

  • choicelady : food – the typo DID make me look twice!!!

  • KillgoreTrout : Sally, yes. I click on the add image link, copy the URL of the cartoon, then right click and click on paste. It almost always works. Just copy the URL from the cartoon and paste it into the comment box.

  • choicelady : Sally – and have you recently been to Afghanistan? All those things Murph noted plus the Afghan journey mean yes, you’d be Watson for sure.

  • SallyT : I like a good shot of Crown Royal, Murph!

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Sally- as I deduced. Sally, as Watson, are you a good shot? ever served the Crown in India? have a degree in regimental medicine? or are a dyed in the wool diarist?

  • foodchain : Choice, oops dogs went out barking, but it might be funnier with the typo

  • SallyT : Sue is Sherlock because she likes to be a detective. I am Watson because, hell, I don’t know. I like to play doctor????

  • choicelady : food – LOL!! sounds like SOME story!

  • foodchain : Murph, barberrry is on my list to protect my arbor vitae

  • MurphTheSurf3 : CL-sounds familiar.

  • choicelady : Sue – I WILL get there, I promise. The book is IN MY CAR. And I just miss you!

  • KillgoreTrout : CL, nope, or truth of any kind. I wonder if the Bachmanns really think that people don’t know that Marcus is a raging queen. I’m not knocking that, but come on, really?

  • foodchain : Choice, god went out barking in the middle of the night. I was in a night gown and boots in the snow. It gets worse after that!

  • choicelady : Murph – my brother, my environmentally hip brother, had a dog he never neutered then got mad at when it ran off looking for love. He’s brilliant at his job. Not so much at life. Oh, well.

  • SueInCa : Stop in after San Jose, CL you are welcome any time

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Sally…is Sue Sherlock? If so, why?

  • SallyT : See you later around here somewhere, Sherlock!

  • choicelady : Sally – lucky for me, no deer, but yeah – other critters. I will look, thank you!

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Choice- the fence, barberry combo has been effective for me. Sounds like the “expert” brother needs the practical experience you offered.

  • choicelady : Sue – sweet dreasm!

  • KillgoreTrout : CL, that’s what I hear. I’m not surprised though. The best climate in the country. I miss it. Oh yeah, I used to live ther too. I was a real free spirit for a number of years.

  • choicelady : Sue – if they EVER let me stop revising data on our grant, I will come see you. Definitely AFTER Memorial Day and the week after. I’m on a panel in San Jose on union cooperatives the following week – THAT will be a real pleasure!

  • foodchain : Nighty Sue, glad I was here for a bit to see you

  • SallyT : CL, there is a website called Hometalk and they have great articles on how to keep pest out of your garden, including deer.

  • SueInCa : Well I am gonna sign off for now. You all have a good week and look for a piece about Libertarians and their control over the GOP soon

  • choicelady : food – you sound like me! I have that kind of luck, too. I’m just NOT good at gardening despite my father’s amazing gardens when I was a kid. Was the possum still alive? Eeeuuuww.

  • foodchain : KT, respite is a chronic need now a days

  • foodchain : Choice, I fed the birds, got rodents. Set up blue bird houses-damn sparrows. Country life is good but can’t control it ever! Dog fetched a possum and brought it in the house!! Ha

  • KillgoreTrout : I’ think I’ll make this weekend’s thread lite. A sort of respite from the darkness.

  • choicelady : Murph – *I* hate barberry! I understand why deer don’t like it either! Very smart. There are some good natural defenses. My brother is a biologist whose specialty is natural predators, but he never got it together on his little 11 acre mini farm in MA and deer pretty much took over. I told him about barberry – he did not believe me. Sisters have low rating with PhD brothers.

  • SallyT : KT has copied them, haven’t you KT?

  • SueInCa : Hey KT how bout “Scandal” or Tell me no lies?

  • SueInCa : I think it is because I cannot edit your wordpress doc

  • KillgoreTrout : glenn, everytime I try to come up with a theme that is relevant to the week’s news, I almost always think of the negative, the lies, the backstabbing, the killing and bombing…etc.

  • SallyT : Sherlock, I just hit copy image when I post them. Nothing else.

  • SueInCa : We have a weekly farmer’s market so I pay them to provide

  • SueInCa : lol and Trader’s Joes

  • choicelady : Sue – gardening is NOT for everyone! That’s why God invented Safeway.

  • SueInCa : No Watson, I tried

  • MurphTheSurf3 : food chain- I fence everything and keep the “leaping” range so small that they do not try to scale the fences. I also use barberry bushes to define the fence lines. Deer HATE barberries…bit ter tasting and throny.

  • SueInCa : I must be strange, I hate to garden. I hate to get my nails dirty, I hate to water everyday, but I love the blooms or the tomatoes or the other veggies

  • choicelady : KT – well see? She has to go with the top grand tinfoil. She doesn’t want REAL ideas, now does she?

  • SallyT : Sherlock, you can’t copy the cartoons? Really?

  • choicelady : food – planting gardens for deer is either an act of love or really not smart. Something tore our little garden apart – either a raccoon or skunk, so I have to regroup.

  • KillgoreTrout : CL, of course. The best brands also block out truth beans and sanity rays.

  • SallyT : Now, that’s an idea, glenn!!

  • foodchain : Murph, garden sounds amazing. We have a lot of deer and I have stayed away from planting nibbles for them. I love the soil though

  • MurphTheSurf3 : KT- hope it continues.

  • choicelady : KT – Southern CA is becoming a nightmare if you don’t have money. No calm oasis anywhere any more.

  • glenn : Sally–I would never think of shooting you! Maybe you just need a couple more shots of tequila for your headache!

  • KillgoreTrout : Hey Murph, glad to see Mother Nature coming together for ya.

  • SueInCa : Absolutely Watson. I am only bummed because I cannot seem to copy individual ones I like. Glenn you are one smart woman

  • choicelady : glenn – you certainly ARE! Wise move, IMHO, to use a pro. Good for you!

  • foodchain : G’night Glenn. This will be fun. We sold our house with lipstick words==good ones== in the closet: KIDS!

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Choice- IF, the shortage becomes critical, yes…but once the “illness” was diagnosed the key is to keep my blood cells metabolizing properly and iron bonding is the key. That requires intensive iron (ferricite) infusion treatments and a mineral cocktail….unti l it gets back into balance I tire easily and am sort of breath and energy.

  • KillgoreTrout : CL, I lived in Vancouver WA for about a year. A very nice, quiet little town I thought. I may still move there in the future. I’m torn between Southern Cal and The Columbia river region.

  • glenn : CL and Sue–The good news is I’m not the one doing the painting. I’ve hired a contractor to do it. HEY! I’m a job creator!

  • choicelady : Sally – we NEVER blame you for stoopid cartoons. It’s a great service you do for us!

  • SallyT : Glenn, I will need hazard pay from this week in cartoonland! But, I got them done. Like I said earlier, don’t shoot the messenger, she has a headache!

  • SueInCa : Have fun painting too Glenn

  • SueInCa : Night Glenn. KT what is existential? I lost the thread

  • choicelady : glenn – be well, happy painting, and have a lovely week ahead. Let us know how all the rooms turn out! Sweet dreams!

  • glenn : Well, good folks, it’s time for this old fossil to turn in. Sally, I’m looking forward to the scandalous Sunday funnies. KT–what’s the theme for this week’s Music Thread? Murph–may all your gardens grow, and your health continue to improve. CL–great job as a “stand-in”. To everyone–good night and have a great weekend!

  • SueInCa : Hell we can pull her fingernails out one by one and laugh like hyenas Watson

  • KillgoreTrout : Sue, I don’t know if that’s a good thing or a bad thing. It’ so existential! ;)

  • SallyT : We’ll gag her, too, Sherlock!

  • choicelady : Murph – yes. Saw those both, too. Where does the GMO protection stand? I cannot believe how we’ve let them dictate natural growth now Frankensteined out of all recognition.

  • SueInCa : I thought so Food, Sally you go girl, call me I will go along for the ride and we can play who is the most ignorant lady in the car with her lol

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Choice- Here is a headline that caught my attention: “Record 400ppm CO2 milestone” and another ” Monsanto Protection Act’ to grant biotech industry total immunity over GM crops”

  • choicelady : KT – and of course, Michelle WOULD use name brand tinfoil. Nothing else would do.

  • foodchain : kSue, a little wine, Fri night, oops and a doze. Going on 11 here. Every day is a big day thank goodness

  • SallyT : Maybe she thinks Oregon won’t expedite her back to Minn when she is convicted of fraud. I got news for her, I will drive her back myself with ear plugs in my ears.

  • KillgoreTrout : Bachmann in Portland ORG would be a laughing stock. The sheer liberal vibrations would cause her to put on a double Reynold’s Wrap Beenie. To keep the lib vibrations and logic rays from entering he pea sized brain.

  • choicelady : Murph – meddling out of ignorance, does it help you to be ON oxygen?

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Hell0 foodchain, hope you are well.

  • SueInCa : Ok that is better Murph

  • choicelady : Murph- I hope this does not turn out to be a real ‘feast or famine’ climate year for you. We are very dry, and now, after all these years, some farmers are thinking of going back to dry farming that is the realistic way to go. We are just entering a long period of dry – normal for us. We have to change – we just don’t have the water.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Sue- The oncology and hematology link is the key. We are talking about how oxygen levels in the blood are maintained and the issues crosses into both fields.

  • glenn : CL–“what idiocy on her part”. Well…no one has ever accused Michelle of being smart.

  • KillgoreTrout : CL, if you have a desk top computer, it should have an outlet that you would need.

  • SueInCa : CL we don’t call her batshitcrazy for no reason

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Hey KT

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Choice- I use raised beds for my specialty gardens and I had help so the flooding did not wipe out the work there. I have a couple of large fields that have yet to be seeded but will be. Our weather pattern has changed and we are now dry- I hope not too dry for too long.

  • choicelady : KT – and Vancouver, WA is a very nice town, too! Married in Vancouver, or partnered in Portland – Michelle has picked the WRONG place. Now it surprises me she thinks she can be accepted there. What idiocy on her part.

  • KillgoreTrout : You can get 50′ cables, but be prepared to spend about a 100 bucks for one.

  • SueInCa : Food? Did you lose the connection? I thought your name disappeared

  • SallyT : It will be here, too, KT along with pot.

  • foodchain : Murph, good tidings and wishes for best health.

  • glenn : Sue–I know. New friends are good, but old friends are the best!

  • KillgoreTrout : Sally, it’s funny, but just across the Columbia it’s perfectly legal, with the word marriage and all!

  • choicelady : Oh Sally – this is just TOO wonderful! She comes to Eugene, runs, loses, is dissed around the district and flounces off somewhere. Could be the salvation of us all!

  • SallyT : Glenn, maybe Marcus won’t move now…….

  • glenn : Murph–my mother-in-law was a gardener, and she always said that her gardens gave her peace; that digging in the dirt always made her feel better. She was such a good person, and I think her gardening kept her “grounded” (pardon the pun). Hope that is true for you, as well.

  • SueInCa : Yes Glenn pray away the gay, his has just failed

  • SallyT : She said, glenn, Eugene Oregon because she thinks she can beat DeFazio but she can’t! Eugene is a college town.

  • SueInCa : I stopped KT. Then switched to Corona Light. It takes alot for me to get drunk

  • choicelady : glenn – you got it right the first time about Marcus and his desires I think!

  • KillgoreTrout : Sally, can you imagine Ms, Crazypants living in Portland? bwaaaaa.

  • glenn : Sally–So, where is batshit crazy Michelle moving to? Oregon? Washington? Is marcus moving too? Maybe that’s why they’re moving to the West Coast–so marcus has more friends to “play” with–oops–I meant to “pray with”.

  • choicelady : Murph dear – always happy to meddle for my friends. I do, however, know my limits.

  • SueInCa : Glenn isn’t it amazing when you realize that? I have a friend I have known for 45 years and never once have we fought.

  • KillgoreTrout : Sue, Whoa! And then? I always used to do shooters! Different time zones all in the same place! ;)

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Choice- thanks for the good vibes and your desire to prescribe.

  • choicelady : Murph – has it dried out enough to let the new plantings get good purchase? I’d hate to see you swamped out again. It must have been so hard dealing with your health AND the flooding. I’m sorry.

  • choicelady : glenn – that IS a good, long friendship!

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Glenn- I am using my time as best I can….the farm is coming along….I have help and it is not large- actually several large specialty gardens…at the center of it all and they are planted….two larger areas are not yet done but soon will be.

  • SueInCa : Where is Funk? Did he go away again?

  • choicelady : Murph – sounds as if you’re in good hands, but it’s got to be horrible when things flare up. Wish we had something more than good words for you. I don’t even push home remedies for serious things such as this – and I practice medicine QUITE freely without a license! Pushy broad that I am. Just want good for you, if that helps.

  • SueInCa : Murph when I hear oncologist I always get scared…..

  • glenn : CL–just an aside–the friend I just visited in Italy, was one of my colleagues in Guatemala. That’s how long we’ve been friends!

  • KillgoreTrout : Did I happen to say WHAT’S UP MURPH? AND FUNK?

  • SueInCa : Our tv is fairly new

  • choicelady : KT – that’s helpful on the cable. Just got a new TV because yes, the old one no longer could hook up to ANYTHING. So I think we’re good. Now – just need a laptop…

  • SallyT : Sherlock, she would shit her pants! The gay scene is very big in Portland!

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Sue- yes, they are. My oncologist and hematologist are clear. The symptoms are known; an effective set of treatments, and a description of likely causes but no real source.

  • SueInCa : thanks Kt

  • choicelady : Sue – See> Michelle has nowhere to run! The gays are gaining on her!

  • KillgoreTrout : Sue, it’s called a VGA or SVGA cable. It has a multi-pronged recepticle on either end. You have an outlet on your computer and one on your flat screenTV. They won’t work with older TVs. No connection on the older ones. Just plug one end into your computer and the other into your TV. You can check them out at any retailer like Best Buy or Circuit City, Radioshack….et c.

  • SueInCa : Sally can you imagine Batshitcrazy Bachman coming to Portland? She would find it very hard to fit in

  • SallyT : Oregon has recognized domestic partnerships for years, even before Washington. They will pass the marriage right soon.

  • choicelady : Murph – still. It’s just hard. My closest friend’s mother, when she was about our age, told her doctor, “It’s not the years I mind. It’s the maintenance.” Seems to be true for so many of us, but I’m sorry you’re one.

  • glenn : KT–To kill ya volley ball! Good one!

  • choicelady : glenn – it must have been very scary no matter what. One cannot live in a place that violent and not pick up the fear and worry. Glad you got out OK.

  • SueInCa : No Minnesota voted it in this week, tell our friends congrats

  • glenn : Murph–keep the faith with the treatments and regime. Hope they’re not too difficult for you. How is the farming going? Weren’t you getting a lot of rain?

  • choicelady : Sue – I think that’s WAshington that has marriage equality, and our mutual friends are getting married in September! I won’t let Michelle on the island!

  • SueInCa : Murph that is not good. Blood disorders are scary

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Choice- been on this road for five years now. So, not knew, just is.

  • choicelady : Murph – oh gosh, do put your health first. I’m so sorry this is happening to you.

  • SallyT : If Bachmann moves to Oregon, she won’t like it!

  • SueInCa : KT it was mixed with juice, I never felt it until about the 12th shot

  • glenn : CL–As I said, I wasn’t very political then, and given the fact that Guatemala didn’t have much of a free press–it was hard to know what was going on. I just went to work, and tried to keep my head down. Many of my colleagues, though, had rough times.

  • SueInCa : Yes you know the gays just messed up her state by being able to get married there and now God is gonna come down with lightening, you know that man in the sky we have never seen?

  • KillgoreTrout : To kill ya volley ball? Sounds dangerous! ;) One tequila, two tequellia, three tequila FLOOR!

  • choicelady : KT – that’s what this grant will let us do. We are creating six new jobs with it.

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Thanks for the good words. Appreciated. I have a chronic blood condition which is always a concern but at times, like now, creates real problems for me. So what energy I have has gone into the farming. It will likely pass but in the meantime the doctors counsel patience and faithfulness to me treatments and regime.

  • SallyT : Well, CL, the cord is about 8ft but that won’t help you.

  • choicelady : Sue – how incredibly sensible. Thanks!

  • choicelady : Sue – WHAT? Michelle is going to the Left Coast??? Yikes!

  • SueInCa : Get a laptop CL

  • choicelady : Sally – only prob with the computer-TV cable is that the computer is in one room, and TV about 50 feet away in another. Messy.

  • SueInCa : Ok thanks Watson. I have to go buy a printer, will do it at that time

  • KillgoreTrout : CL, you really need to recruit a few helpers. I’m sure your natural persuasiveness could accomplish that!

  • SallyT : Sue, I don’t remember what it is called. I just went into Office Depot and asked them and they got it for me. Works great.

  • SueInCa : Murph I have not missed you but only because I have not been around much, otherwise I would have

  • choicelady : MURPH!!! So glad to see you! I’m so sorry you were so sick! Are you on the mend? I’m subbing for AdLib tonight, so I feel doubly honored to have you here.

  • choicelady : glenn! OMG – you LIVED there then??? You should write about it, especially now with Rios Montt’s conviciton.

  • glenn : Murph–welcome– you have been missed. Hope you’re better!

  • SueInCa : Michelle Bachman is threatening to become neighbors with Sally Hi MTS

  • choicelady : KT – good point about conspiracy theorists being too young to know.

  • KillgoreTrout : Hey Sally. How are things in the Great Northwest?

  • choicelady : glenn – I LOVE that – whack-a-mole conspiracy! That is JUST RIGHT as an image. But polls show that it’s not working – people are NOT falling for it or caring about it, not even the IRS issue. There is such a thing of crying wolf once too often.

  • SueInCa : Kt or Sally what is the cable I need to hook my pc up to my tv?

  • MurphTheSurf3 : Hello everyone…I have been under the weather (well, more than that) and out of commission for several weeks. I just thought I would look in and see what was happening here.

  • glenn : CL–saw that about Rios Montt. I lived in Guatemala during the 80’s, and never thought I’d see the day when a rich Guatemalan, let alone a Guatemalan leader, was convicted. Go Guate!

  • KillgoreTrout : CL, I think the “believers,” of the GOP propaganda weren’t even alive during the Watergate years. Easily duped.

  • choicelady : KT – this week a MAJOR historical change occurred when Guatamala convicted Rios Montt, darling of Reagan and the religious right. Never in history has a nation convicted its own. I hope this sets a precedent.

  • SallyT : CL, I typed scout when it should have been scouts. There were 4 if I remember right.

  • choicelady : Sally – I did NOT know that about the scout!

  • glenn : CL–I know it’s not that simple–that’s what so insidious about the r/tp’s. They try to make everything simple for the base. And, just when progressives, Democrats, or Independents start getting some forward momentum, another whack-a-mole conspiracy theory pops up so the base is distracted again. I think there really are people who believe that r/tp’s have good intentions. I just haven’t seen the evidence of it lately.

  • choicelady : KT – have not seen the film, but I learned about Black slave owners in Charleston SC.All that gorgeous architecture and furniture etc. was made by slaves. ALL of it. They could work, after hours, for money from other merchants or slave holders and with it buy their freedom. They then set up shop – and bought slaves. SOMETIMES it was despicable. But sometimes it was a route to freedom they consciously made for others. We know way too little here. But the slave catchers in AFrica were other Black people. Hands down – something we have to deal with.

  • KillgoreTrout : Sue, that does not surprise me. The calls for impeachment are just ludicrous. Bush was a friggen WAR CRIMINAL, and not a peep about that from these scumbags.

  • SallyT : There were Indian scout for Custer, KT.

  • SueInCa : brb

  • KillgoreTrout : CL, funny, I just watched Django Unchained, where Django is a freed slave who has to portray a black slaver. I had never realized that there was such a thing as a black slaver. The lowest of the low!

  • choicelady : Sue – thank you!

  • SueInCa : WTF and WTH is appropriate CL

  • choicelady : glenn – I know George Lakoff a little, and I love his books about values and that sort of right/left brain, authoritarian figure v nurturing one. But my liberal mother was a tyrant about personal behavior, AND we’ve just seen Pat Robertson blow off adultery as a nurturing thing for the guy. So I have to think it’s not that simple.

  • glenn : CL–You probably hit the nail on the head with NO education, and NO choices. That’s why he is that stupid. And..the r/tp’s are working overtime to cut education funding and keep our young people THAT stupid.

  • SueInCa : Thart is true too Glen, especially the evangelicals. Sally they thought that Jack guy on 24 was real

  • glenn : Sue–I think it has more to do with looking for someone to “lead” them–the authoratarian (sp.?)figure. I guess that is right brain-left brain, when it comes down to it.

  • choicelady : glenn and Sue – a friend’s son went to prison for armed robbery. While in the County jail he asked me if I did not just LOVE Meg Whitman. Here he is – headed for prison admiring a woman who’d cheerfully keep him their forever, give NO education or other opportunities. WTF??? Who is THAT stupid?

  • SallyT : Personally I think the right goes for the Kochs just the same as they believe Reality TV is real!

  • SueInCa : I think it is closer to reality than even we want to believe KT

  • SueInCa : We played in Cabo, I missed a lot of shots lol. KT I love it, dang Sally got me hooked. I watched the first season in three days. Last weekend I watched season 2 of Homeland

  • glenn : CL–you and me both! I just don’t get it, either.

  • SueInCa : Nor do I CL it has something to do with right brain, left brain

  • choicelady : Sue – great game idea. Let’s roll!

  • KillgoreTrout : Sue, isn’t House of Cards great? It is so well written, acted and filmed. I love Spacey’s asides to the audience. A real bad man working for good causes. Or so it seems. I wonder how close to reality the show is. I wouldn’t be surprised if it were very close to the goings on in DC.

  • choicelady : Sue – who in their right mind and middle class or working poor would like the Kochs? I do not get the white working class tilt toward the GOP. Just DO. NOT. GET. IT.

  • SueInCa : First you gotta play tequila volleyball Watson. If you miss a shot, you get a shot

  • choicelady : KT – thank you, but there IS no staff! It’s all ME. It’s why I’m glassy eyed and woke up at 4 am today worrying about the revisions!

  • glenn : Hi Sally!

  • choicelady : Sally – booze is on the bar, popcorn on the table. Help yourself and welcome!!!

  • SueInCa : I think they think Kochs are Santa Claus and all the while they have been planning to get rid of SS since the 70’s

  • KillgoreTrout : Outstanding CL. Bless you and your staff for doing so. Absolutely outstanding!

  • choicelady : KT – I did a lot of community development and organizing in a Black neighborhood back east, and it always chilled me to the bone to hear people celebrate the Buffalo Soldiers – who slaughtered indigenous people. To hear it, they soldiers were heroes. They totally eliminated the humanity of the people who were killed. There’s always SOMEONE to kick, and the genius of the power block is they help us find them, kick them, and celebrate what we’ve done.

  • glenn : CL–and the worst part is when you point out the differences, they call you names, and continue on their “merry” way.

  • SallyT : So, I am late to the party and is everybody already drunk? If so double my shots!

  • SueInCa : glenn they don’t even know they are working for bossman, you could not expect them to know anything deeper than that.

  • choicelady : KT – that’s funny! Them damned hybrids…

  • choicelady : glenn – very insightful words. They really do not know those differences, do they?

  • KillgoreTrout : CL, it’s like seeing a Native American with a US Cavalry hat!

  • glenn : KT–I’ve never had time to follow politics as closely as I do now, but following events this closely, it doesn’t surprise me that r/tp’s don’t understand the difference between Nixon and Obama. They don’t understand the difference between a social compact and socialism, so why would they understand any other differences? They only “see” what they want to see, and only talk in sound bites for the base.

  • choicelady : food – we found out Wednesday. It literally saved us. We were living on fumes mostly since we lost another big grant – everyone who applied to them did. But this is fine – we’re happy. Or will be AFTER THIS NEXT REVISIONS OF DATA IS DONE. Honestly – it’s SO stupid!

  • SueInCa : Um hum I will believe it when I see it CL lol

  • SueInCa : KT you should see the recent headline on the Heritage Foundation telling Republicans to delegitamize Obama with scandals and they put it in writing. Kochs – Heritage Foundation, those two men are at the core of all of this

  • choicelady : Sue – I’m in it for three months full time then down to 1/4 time. I need to get everyone up and running then – OUTTA THERE.

  • KillgoreTrout : Yeah, it’s them damn hybrids you know! ;) I apologize for any spray on your keyboard or monitor!

  • choicelady : KT – just remember that the exploited tenant farmers who were white allied with the planters, the exploiters, against the freed slaves when they joined the KKK. People have blinders and are totally stupid sometimes. TOO MANY sometimes!

  • foodchain : Choice, so you just found out? this is live? Very proud

  • SueInCa : So now no Retireeee? I had a feeling you would not CL. Netflix for online is 7.99 a month. You can also get dvd’s

  • KillgoreTrout : It amazes me that the republicants see Bebghazi and the IRS thing as coparable to Watergate and Nixon. Nixon willingly became a part of a BURGLARY into the dem heaquartes in the Watergate hotel. An obvious felony. Nixon didn’t only OK the burglary, but he helped finance it and then tried to cover it up? How in the world can people say Obama is doing the same? Fricken idiot constituency of the right. They’ll believe anything that puts our president in a negative light.

  • choicelady : All – this was THE WORST grant I ever wrote. They kept changing the requirements. I’m doing it AGAIN to redo the work plan. All day today, tomorrow, probably Sunday to get it done. And it’s just trivial changes but they have to be done.

  • choicelady : Sue – depending on what happens with the central valley person, we just might, and we will definitely keep you in mind!

  • SueInCa : You can [plug into your TV KT knows the cable you need

  • glenn : CL–congratulati ons! Thank you for working so hard for the good of the people of our country!

  • foodchain : Choice: WOW!! Grants are a big deal, big effort. Too good

  • choicelady : Sue – how does one get ON Netflix – do you have to sit at the computer? We’d be fighting – we have only one comfy chair!

  • SueInCa : Need any employees CL? lol

  • SueInCa : Sally got me hooked on House of Cards and I am anxiously waiting for season 2. I was only testing Netflix and now I cannot turn it off, I am hooked

  • choicelady : Everyone – can I digress for a moment? WE GOT THE GRANT we applied for! $750,000 for 18 months helping people access ways to sign up for the Affordable Care Act. We are delighted now to be part of implementing what Obama did so well!

  • foodchain : Sue, it’s a great series.

  • SueInCa : I think I am going to do the Libertarian timeline. It is very telling about what is going on now. This has been planned in conjunction with Repukes

  • foodchain : KT, I do kinda know, but was a bit shy yet to say so. He and they deserve all awful descriptions which, by definition, would be true

  • choicelady : Sue – and you write about WW II brilliantly giving us insights we’d never seen or read before.

  • KillgoreTrout : Thanks Sue. I’ll check it out.

  • SueInCa : Food, I made note of it. WWII is a special friend of mine, reading about it anyway

  • choicelady : KT – it is scary to see a Black man that dementedly rightwing.

  • KillgoreTrout : West is a real puke.

  • choicelady : KT – Just about had my drink go up my nose! LOL! That’s undoubtedly true – the Social Compact gets GREAT mileage!

  • foodchain : Sue/KT, re netflix: foyles war. Wondrful WW2 series

  • SueInCa : KT Libertarian party was set up for racists and then taken over by Kochs if their dad was not involved, I would be shocked but I have not gotten that far yet

  • choicelady : Sue – the longterm net result of Watergate is exactly as you describe: Republicans are NEVER ashamed. Look at the list of treason (Nixon, Reagan) selling out to foreign enemies; look at the domestic crimes. What do the Dems have? A few penny ante grifters and one spectacular spousal cheat. Which is WORSE? We know – and the GOP keep pretending the lies they tell ‘prove’ Obama is worse than Nixon and Benghazi is worse than Watergate.

  • KillgoreTrout : FC, I think you are definitely in the right neighborhood for circle jerk!

  • KillgoreTrout : What really irritates me about the TP and Libertarians is their total lack of knowledge or concern for the Social Concept, on which a very large part of our republic was founded. When you mention the Social Compact to TP/RWers they think you’re talking about a Prius!

  • SueInCa : THAT is what the IRS does and besides this all started under a Bush appointee

  • SueInCa : The facts will eventually come out CL but the thing is Republicans are never ashamed. I rec to KT because I know he has Netflix but absolutely everyone should try

  • choicelady : KT – help yourself to the popcorn. Don’t worry – AdLib left me the Dust Buster to clean up.

  • choicelady : Sue – sounds like something we all should watch. Thank you.

  • choicelady : glenn – glad FOX has West. We can keep an eye on him. I agree about the idiocy of the media. Sacramento Bee jumped on the ‘godaintitawful ‘ IRS stuff – and then McClatchy, their wire service wrote a very GOOD story about the facts, and that is where they should have started. But nooooo.

  • KillgoreTrout : MMMMMMM! Popcorn!

  • SueInCa : That link is explosive, in my opinion. Even Rachel did not go back that far and she only got half the story. I watched The Billionaires Tea zParty last night on Netflix and that got me looking. KT I recommend that movie highly to you.

  • foodchain : choice: I was so hoping. Hubby asleep in front of TV so I’m good here

  • KillgoreTrout : Hey Sue! Good to see you here! I hope all is well.

  • glenn : KT–I agree. If the damn media would do their jobs, we would be hearing MUCH more about the improving economy and the shrinking deficit. Let foxso-callednews “cover” the “scandals” in their echo chamber. Which by the way, now includes Allen West.

  • choicelady : food – circle jerk is an adolescent male fantasy more than reality, but it is appropriate under these circumstances!

  • choicelady : Sue – you have JUST confirmed a hunch of mine! That’s all about the time of CA’s Prop. 13 and it’s slavering anti-tax mantra. I’m on a committee with Jon Coupal, one of them, and he’s eerie. He never looks at anyone when he talks. Very unnerving – I don’t know if he’s worried we’ll point out his weaknesses or if he thinks we’re all beneath him.

  • KillgoreTrout : CL, I’ll see if I cn post it in TOOT. In my profile, it’s a a little easier to make out.

  • foodchain : he’s a circle jerker; God I’m not even sure what that means but I believe he deserves something about that crude

  • SueInCa : Hi all. So much happening this week

  • foodchain : Hey Sue, in and out here but a big howdy

  • SueInCa : I am good everyone. I have so much chit to share lol

  • SueInCa : Wanted to share this link with everyone. Check the dates, Koch and tea party was started in 1980 «link»

  • choicelady : Sue! Lovely to see you! AdLib is away tonight, so I’m trying my best to hold the fort. Come on down. Drinks are on the bar. Popcorn is on the table.

  • glenn : Hey Sue, how are you?

  • foodchain : KT no sh-+-t. Very cool.

  • glenn : CL–While I agree with you on one hand, I find it very frustrating that the “outrage” has gotten WORSE since the November elections. I understand that they are frantic with rage and even more hate because they lost–but they don’t seem to be slowing down. If anything, like I said, they seem to amping up the hate and rage.

  • choicelady : food – Newt is such a hypocrite! He leads the charge, fails, then blames everyone else for ‘over reach’??? He is an incredibly evil man.

  • KillgoreTrout : I think nancy Pelosi was dead on. Benghazi, the IRS and AP scandals are just a mere distraction by the GOP. They don’t want people to think about an imporoving economy and the sheer lack of getting anything done to to Congressional gridlock.

  • SueInCa : Hello

  • foodchain : Odd that Newt called them to hold up; they “over reached in “98”

  • choicelady : KT – wow. I hope to see it larger soon. He drew that? Very cool.

  • choicelady : glenn – we can always hope it’s the middle right who are getting burned out. How though can anyone sustain the hype these days? There is no REAL threat from Obama, and deep down they freaking know it. All that energy expended on fear – not healthy for the individual expending it.

  • glenn : Correction–“th at’s the only WAY they can win.”

  • glenn : CL–That worries me, too–that people will tune out entirely. Which IMO, is what the r/tp’s want. That’s how they came to power in 2010–too many Democrats/Indepe ndents got complacent, and the rabid r/tp base sprung into action. But it’s always better for the r/tp’s if Democrats/Indepe ndents are turned off or turned out–that’s the only they can win.

  • choicelady : food – come back if you can. Lovely having you here!

  • KillgoreTrout : CL, that’s a surrealist drawing by Kurt Vonnegut. You can’t tell, due to the size of the avatar, but it’s Vonnegut with five eyes on either side of his head. I think I get what he was going for.

  • foodchain : oh shoot, I’m on a Fri night hold here. Good, but wish I was with you. Hope to be back soon

  • choicelady : KT – I agree. I become exhausted with ideologues left or right who just cannot see you have to get from A to Z by going through a lot of other letters. At least tonight Rachel NOTED that Obama was forbidden by Congress from closing Gitmo. FINALLY someone SAID that.

  • choicelady : glenn – I keep wondering if all the yadayada OBAMA yadayada BENGHAZI! yadayada isn’t all going to turn people SO FAR OFF that they finally just start listening to quieter voices giving good information. What scares me is having people tune out entirely. THAT is not good.

  • KillgoreTrout : The world only spins forward.

  • KillgoreTrout : CL, that’s the real negative aspect of sheer idealism. Great ideas are one thing, but ideas that when put into practice don’t work, it’s best to abandon them.

  • choicelady : food – honestly, I detect NO problem! You’re doing fine!

  • foodchain : Choice, you think you’re typing –the key board lights the keys but if you don’t read–oh oh. I’m sure others don’t have my problem

  • glenn : KT–I hope it continues to be their downfall. I also hope that the downfall comes soon. I don’t know how much more of their fake outrage I can take.

  • choicelady : KT – not to divert, but who’s your new avatar? Hard to see it on this medium.

  • KillgoreTrout : glenn I think you are absolutely correct. The GOP/TP is so used to their very pliable base, that they think all Americans are that naive and ignorant. It’s been their downfall and I find it somewhat amusing that they just don’t understand this.

  • choicelady : food – are the keys on the pad too small? That’s my worry about getting one.

  • glenn : Food–now you “know” the MSM doesn’t listen to the gop. After all, where have you been? The MSM is in President Obama’s pocket–the MSM carries his water. Don’t you “know” this? Just ask the palindora box of lunacy.

  • choicelady : food – I get FAIR which is supposed to monitor the media. They capitulate,too! So where do we go for good journalism? For accuracy? It’s getting very lonely here!

  • choicelady : KT – A very fine friend brought up the ‘brand/rebrand ‘ thing among progressives. It curdles my blood because it takes Marx’s ‘fetishism of commodities’ – the ultimate in alientation in capitalism – and turns it on self. They make themselves into commodities having to ‘get my brand of social acitivsm out there.’ Creepy and disgusting as it is on the Right, it’s jaw dropping to see the Left do it, too.

  • foodchain : apologies for my typing on the ipad: argghh

  • glenn : KT–this whole rebranding thing is definitely a bag of manure. I think r/tp’s think that all Americans are as stupid as their base, and keep getting surprised when we aren’t!

  • foodchain : choice, the disparity is astounding. The news could do some very nice research on how awfully they dispense truth and balance

  • KillgoreTrout : Cl, with the GOP, especially, things don’t really change. I guess that’s the main theme of conservatism. Protect the status quo at all costs.

  • choicelady : glenn – BINGO. That is EXACTLY the issue of victimization. It’s always the victim’s fault. I knew a guy who blamed his wife for everything that happened – even when he was viciously tickling her and she knocked over a lamp trying to get away. That is taking narcissistic displacement about as far as you can, but that IS what the GOP do.

  • choicelady : food – that MAY be the thing that drives my most nuts. The idea that ‘both side do it’ when it’s not remotely true. Thanks for calling the out!

  • KillgoreTrout : CL, this whole “rebranding,” thing is soooo transparent.” As I’ve said before, a bad of manure is still a bag of manure, no matter how pretty the packaging.

  • glenn : CL–I read an article on TimWise.org where he said that blaming a woman for her own rape, no matter how she is dressed, was like blaming a luxury car owner for having her car stolen. After all, wasn’t that luxury car owner just “flaunting” her wealth (or her car body)? That was the seed in my mind that grew to the robber/shopping analogy.

  • choicelady : KT – I really believe for many people, insight and honesty are cellular. It is interesting to see how one’s ideas DO hold up over time. And it’s honorable if they don’t – if new info comes along – that they change. That’s good, too.

  • foodchain : and sorry for typos; my ipad and I have issues

  • KillgoreTrout : It’s funny CL, this was in the mid 80s, before I really became politically minded. I was more into the whole Beat thing then. It is gratifying to see my thoughts stand the test of time, though!

  • foodchain : Basically, the GOP talks, the MSM listens. The false equivalency makes my head spin

  • choicelady : KT – they are so frantic they have lost every sense of both propriety and good judgement. No, they don’t see what they have done.

  • choicelady : KT – that would be the GOP all right. Bothersome and feed off misery.

  • KillgoreTrout : glenn I often wonder if they even recognize shit when they see it. They seem so oblivious to the truth.

  • choicelady : glenn – I was whomperjawed to discover they had ALTERED the emails! Did they honestly think NO ONE WOULD NOTICE??? Now they look like thugs, and the focus is all on their conduct, criminal or otherwise, that is so despicable.

  • KillgoreTrout : If I remember right, the gist was that they are bothersome and feed off the misery of others.

  • glenn : Speaking of shit, I think the r/tp’s have stepped into it with the altered Benghazi emails. Priceless–they throw so much shit around, they have to step in it sometime!

  • choicelady : glenn – it’s an excellent and vivid way to describe it. I was a rape victim advocate some years ago. I used to say – if a guy walks into a bar with a roll of cash and spends liberally, then he tires of it and puts the rest in his pocket to go home, do those for whom he bought drinks have the right to roll him in the alley for his money? That is the equivalent of “she was flirting so she deserved to be raped” or whatever. We would defend the guy’s MONEY but not her BODY. So yeah – it is equating shopping with robbery.

  • KillgoreTrout : CL, no haha. I didn’t take it that way at all.

  • KillgoreTrout : CL, it was a long time ago, but I may still have a copy. If I can find it. I’ll definitely publish it.

  • choicelady : OOPS – did NOT mean your POEM was shit!! Sorry – I want to see what your comparison makes is all! Realized I’d not made myself clear!

  • glenn : CL–been thinking about that analogy for a while. Tonight, here on the Planet, is it’s “debut appearance.”

  • choicelady : KT – sometime, please publish that poem? Flies, after all, are drawn to….

  • KillgoreTrout : I once wrote a poem about TV evangelists, comparing them to flies.

  • choicelady : KT – yup. That’s absolute truth. He is a hideous man.

  • glenn : Food chain–good to know. I really think I’m going to like the bright colors. Everyone needs to walk into a room and feel like it’s a happy room!

  • choicelady : food – it takes THREE coats to cover PINK? Whoda thunk that? Wow.

  • KillgoreTrout : Woah CL. I didn’t know he owned a blood diamond mine. It somehow doesn’t surprise me though.

  • choicelady : glenn – GREAT analogy!

  • foodchain : ange that

  • foodchain : glen, painted our daughter’s bedroom strwberry pink–her pick. three coats of paint to cover it! Never ch

  • glenn : KT–Because in roberston’s “world”, only women have to follow the spiritual world, not the men. And, yes, legitimate rape does come to mind. Also that rape is about sex. Equating rape to sex is like equating robbery to shopping.

  • choicelady : glenn and KT – Pat long ago gave up any claim on spirituality. He’s a materialist through and through. He owns a diamond mine in Sierra Leone and trafficks in blood diamonds without a care in the world for the evil he bestows on his workers.

  • KillgoreTrout : glenn, brainwashing and money. Lots and lots of money! That is also antithetical to genuine spirituality.

  • KillgoreTrout : What really gets me about Robertson’s remarks were that he completely ignored a spiritual union to bolster a physical one. And he is supposedly god’s right hand man? What a creep.

  • glenn : CL– I have no sympathy whatsoever for MRS. Robertson. If she stays with him, then she doesn’t deserve any sympathy. Kind of harsh, I know, but that’s my opinion.

  • choicelady : food – how can one take seriously a man who writes in all earnestness that the Federal Reserve is run by demons? And it’s not a metaphor – he MEANS it!

  • KillgoreTrout : My pleasure glenn!

  • choicelady : KT – that’s the serious scary problem with “Promise Keepers” that first (for five minutes) sought to restore responsible behavior to men as husbands and fathers but quickly became a “ME THE MAN” kind of value structure. It’s not about being responsible to your family – it’s about controlling them and being free to “follow your heart”. Or some part of your anatomy.

  • KillgoreTrout : Great point glenn. I think you hit the nail on the head. The phrase Legitimate rape comes to mind

  • glenn : KT–thank you for the kind words.

  • foodchain : chice, long is a very good word

  • KillgoreTrout : CL, he really, intentionally or not, showed the true face of the religious right. I have no doubt that all the RW men agreed with him!.

  • choicelady : glenn – LOL!! wouldn’t it be marriage is only about the WOMAN and free wheelin’ is for the MAN? Wow did Robertson show his true self in this! Feel sorry for MRS. Robertson!

  • KillgoreTrout : glenn, kes, like yourself, is a sweetheart. A very nice human being.

  • glenn : KT–To me, it’s one step away from blaming women for being raped. These “poor” men, who have no self-control, no use for their marriage vows, and who have no “resistance” when it comes to temptation. Because after all, marriage is only about the man, right?

  • choicelady : KT – Grrrrrr. How this man claims to be Christian and then disses the 7th commandment is beyond me. Nowhere in the Bible is adultery condoned for one sex and forbidden to the other – it is simply NOT acceptable, period. He’s a loon.

  • choicelady : glenn – I do indeed work for a nonprofit divided into two separate groups, a c-3 and c-4. We do advocacy, lobbying and non partisan ballot work, which is what the c-4 USED to be exclusively for. That is determined to ‘further your public mission’. The uses of a c-4 for partisan crap drives me nuts, and the Baggers should be ashamed of trying to get tax deductible cover for POLITICAL work. The IRS targeted anyone – including the word “PROGRESSIVE” for extra review precisely for these reasons. The Tea Party folks were NOT singled out. It’s pitiful the IRS apologized instead of pointing out that rigorous review of tax exemptions IS THEIR JOB.

  • glenn : CL–I like the message for kes. There’s no one like kes, no one like kes…

  • KillgoreTrout : Hey CL, I’d like to see a few comments about Pat Robertson’s recent comments, in trying to justify men cheating on their wives! He basically said it was OK and natural!

  • choicelady : food – I know MOntrose – but PRE dogs. How cool!

  • glenn : CL–So…don’t you work for a non-profit? How do you see the IRS “scandal”?

  • foodchain : choice, northsider here. our daughter is a city girl. so we have the best of both. take thenpups to montrose dog beach :-)

  • choicelady : So everyone – glenn, first here, was trying to pick a hot topic: Benghazi, AP, IRS. Anyone open to any of these or have other ideas?

  • choicelady : glenn – what a lovely thing. It IS only pain!

  • choicelady : food – my very first ‘grown up’ job was counting people in and out at the Museum of Science & Industry where I also got to demonstrate the world’s first picturephone. Cough – the WAS a long time ago…

  • glenn : Correction–“tr ying to help HER learn to make decisions.”

  • glenn : CL–I’m trying to help to learn to make decisions. And, if I really can’t stand it, I can re-paint.

  • choicelady : glenn, KT, food – all together now – click your heels and think of kes. There’s no one like kes, no one like kes…

  • glenn : KT–I’m with you on that positive energy for kes. Should we all click our heels together? Think kes would like that?

  • choicelady : glenn – sounds GREAT. How nice to give her some say in colors even if they’re not YOUR faves!

  • choicelady : food – I will, I will. I LOVE that city, and it’s grand knowing you’re there. What part? I was a suburbanite but all my folks’ friends were north side people. My happiest memories are of weekends there.

  • glenn : CL–a little of both. Soft colors in all of the rooms except my spare bedroom and bathroom–which we call my granddaughter’s rooms. Then it’s wild greens and pinks!

  • choicelady : Hey KT – lovely to see you, and yes everyone – think great thoughts aimed at kes in Toledo!

  • KillgoreTrout : CL. glad to see you at the helm!

  • foodchain : choice, any time you visit Chicago, let me knoe!

  • choicelady : glenn – that’s perfect. Are you going wild with colors or keeping a quiet palette?

  • glenn : Hey food–good to “see” you.

  • KillgoreTrout : Hey Planeteers. let’s give my homie kes some positive energy!

  • glenn : Yup–humidity is up, and the paint will probably take longer to dry, but I can stay at my daughter’s house, only 10 minutes away, until it’s dry.

  • choicelady : Hey food! How are you?

  • choicelady : YOU pick, glenn – you’re the first, seize the day!

  • foodchain : Hey to you all! I’m in and ut but glad to be here

  • glenn : So CL–what are with “scandalmongeri ng” with this week? Benghazi? IRS? AP?

  • choicelady : glenn – that is a daunting task! But it will be wonderful when you’re done. Is the humidity up though? I think that makes paint take longer to dry?

  • glenn : CL–I’m fine, how are you? Weather is heating up here in GA, and I’m literally emptying my closets in anticipation of getting my entire house painted!

  • choicelady : Hi glenn – stepped away for a moment, and voila! YOU were here. How are you?

  • choicelady : Thank you, AdLib – hope everyone feels up to a vigorous conversation or a good, stiff drink. See you all at 7 or whenever you can log on.

  • AdLib : Vox Populi, our live chat about the week’s events begins tonight at 7 pm PST. Filling in tonight for me as Guest Host will be the brilliant and lovely, Choicelady! Please join her and your fellow Planeteers for a fun and lively chat tonight!

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