Comments on: The IQs of Texas Are Upon You http://planetpov.com/2010/03/13/the-iqs-of-texas-are-upon-you/ Real People Real Opinions | Politics News Social Issues Humor Wed, 23 May 2012 09:06:22 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.2 By: choicelady http://planetpov.com/2010/03/13/the-iqs-of-texas-are-upon-you/comment-page-2/#comment-46327 choicelady Mon, 15 Mar 2010 22:32:14 +0000 http://planetpov.com/?p=11375#comment-46327 We monitored this closely after 2004 because one of our member congregations came under IRS fire since the vicar emeritus had given a sermon saying people of faith should review ALL candidates' positions on war. He excoriated both Bush AND Kerry for supporting the Iraq war and took NO sides. Well, some turkey who wasn't there told the IRS about it, claiming "peace" was partisan, and they got investigated. Now, mind you, the churches that told their members they HAD to vote for Bush or die, were NOT investigated. We are non-partisan, and we are careful to tell our congregations that they may do non-partisan advocacy only up to 5% of their budgets (as if they could spend that much!) so we do it FOR them. Our c-4 is NOT tax exempt nor are donations deductible. We believe utterly in the separation of church and state though not the right of people to speak from a faith point of view. BIG difference. But man oh man do we opposed this Texas style infusion of religion INTO curriculum!!! That is just plain wrong. And whose religion, by the way? I'd like to see how these bozos would do if it were CATHOLICS doing this!!! We monitored this closely after 2004 because one of our member congregations came under IRS fire since the vicar emeritus had given a sermon saying people of faith should review ALL candidates’ positions on war. He excoriated both Bush AND Kerry for supporting the Iraq war and took NO sides. Well, some turkey who wasn’t there told the IRS about it, claiming “peace” was partisan, and they got investigated. Now, mind you, the churches that told their members they HAD to vote for Bush or die, were NOT investigated.

We are non-partisan, and we are careful to tell our congregations that they may do non-partisan advocacy only up to 5% of their budgets (as if they could spend that much!) so we do it FOR them. Our c-4 is NOT tax exempt nor are donations deductible.

We believe utterly in the separation of church and state though not the right of people to speak from a faith point of view. BIG difference. But man oh man do we opposed this Texas style infusion of religion INTO curriculum!!! That is just plain wrong.

And whose religion, by the way? I’d like to see how these bozos would do if it were CATHOLICS doing this!!!

]]> By: KQuark http://planetpov.com/2010/03/13/the-iqs-of-texas-are-upon-you/comment-page-2/#comment-46316 KQuark Mon, 15 Mar 2010 21:54:48 +0000 http://planetpov.com/?p=11375#comment-46316 Photoshop or some kind of setup I hope as well. Photoshop or some kind of setup I hope as well.

]]> By: KQuark http://planetpov.com/2010/03/13/the-iqs-of-texas-are-upon-you/comment-page-2/#comment-46315 KQuark Mon, 15 Mar 2010 21:53:38 +0000 http://planetpov.com/?p=11375#comment-46315 I agree with you choice lady. Churches who follow proper non profit charters should remain tax exempt. They just need to be monitored more closely to make sure they are not partisan politically speaking. Under Bush I've seen instances were some churches have become partisan but they are the exceptions. Of course it's a fine line because we know how the far right has tried to blur the lines between church and state but it would be just as wrong to penalize all churches for the acts of a few. I agree with you choice lady. Churches who follow proper non profit charters should remain tax exempt. They just need to be monitored more closely to make sure they are not partisan politically speaking. Under Bush I’ve seen instances were some churches have become partisan but they are the exceptions. Of course it’s a fine line because we know how the far right has tried to blur the lines between church and state but it would be just as wrong to penalize all churches for the acts of a few.

]]> By: choicelady http://planetpov.com/2010/03/13/the-iqs-of-texas-are-upon-you/comment-page-2/#comment-46305 choicelady Mon, 15 Mar 2010 21:31:40 +0000 http://planetpov.com/?p=11375#comment-46305 Oh someone PLEASE tell me this picture is photo shopped!!!! PLEASE! Oh someone PLEASE tell me this picture is photo shopped!!!!

PLEASE!

]]> By: choicelady http://planetpov.com/2010/03/13/the-iqs-of-texas-are-upon-you/comment-page-2/#comment-46284 choicelady Mon, 15 Mar 2010 21:00:54 +0000 http://planetpov.com/?p=11375#comment-46284 Hang on - they are simply NON profits guided by the same rules as the Red Cross or Common Cause. There are strict guidelines, and when churches cross that line, they should indeed pay taxes. But they get their exempt status for doing the things YOU want them to do - feed the hungry, provide a myriad of services (health ministries are often the ONLY health care communities of color have), offer money to those in need, sometimes provide shelter, counseling, clothing, whatever. If you make churches pay taxes, what about all the other non-profits? United Way got in hot water for paying its national CEO nearly $500,000. Should they NOT be tax exempt? Churches DO pay taxes on any activities such as renting space to other groups, etc. They are forbidden from partisan politics, but ALL churches, progressives, too, can and do get involved in NON partisan action. Perfectly legal and if you tax conservative churches. you have to tax the progressive ones as well. So think this over - it's such a thoughtless reflexive response. No it is NOT the time for churches to pay taxes as a blanket statement. It IS time to make sure churches obey the existing laws and that they are neither partisan nor exceeding the advocacy guidelines of 5% of total income for advocacy. My organization exists as a c-3 (education that is tax deductible) and a c-4 (that DOES pay some taxes and that does advocacy but without donations being tax deductible for the donors.) If churches exceed their allotted limits, fine. But do this on a case by case basis. Churches overall help their communities, and you really would NOT like to do without them. You especially would not like to do without the churches in our organization that are not only fighting for economic and social justice, against racism and for equity, fighting to abolish the death penalty and have criminal justice reform, fighting against poverty and hunger, against torture and governmental abuses of power, fighting FOR civil rights, etc. We are the "Social Gospel" churches Glenn Beck hates - so you REALLY want to end our tax-exempt status????? Don't make me worry about my allies along with Beck, please! Hang on – they are simply NON profits guided by the same rules as the Red Cross or Common Cause. There are strict guidelines, and when churches cross that line, they should indeed pay taxes. But they get their exempt status for doing the things YOU want them to do – feed the hungry, provide a myriad of services (health ministries are often the ONLY health care communities of color have), offer money to those in need, sometimes provide shelter, counseling, clothing, whatever. If you make churches pay taxes, what about all the other non-profits? United Way got in hot water for paying its national CEO nearly $500,000. Should they NOT be tax exempt?

Churches DO pay taxes on any activities such as renting space to other groups, etc.

They are forbidden from partisan politics, but ALL churches, progressives, too, can and do get involved in NON partisan action. Perfectly legal and if you tax conservative churches. you have to tax the progressive ones as well.

So think this over – it’s such a thoughtless reflexive response. No it is NOT the time for churches to pay taxes as a blanket statement. It IS time to make sure churches obey the existing laws and that they are neither partisan nor exceeding the advocacy guidelines of 5% of total income for advocacy.

My organization exists as a c-3 (education that is tax deductible) and a c-4 (that DOES pay some taxes and that does advocacy but without donations being tax deductible for the donors.) If churches exceed their allotted limits, fine. But do this on a case by case basis.

Churches overall help their communities, and you really would NOT like to do without them. You especially would not like to do without the churches in our organization that are not only fighting for economic and social justice, against racism and for equity, fighting to abolish the death penalty and have criminal justice reform, fighting against poverty and hunger, against torture and governmental abuses of power, fighting FOR civil rights, etc. We are the “Social Gospel” churches Glenn Beck hates – so you REALLY want to end our tax-exempt status?????

Don’t make me worry about my allies along with Beck, please!

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